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Melissia wrote: It's a team game, I thought the base assumption is that you're NOT fighting them alone? I find it odd that people are arguing from the position that the base is one on one combat.
It's a team game sure, but that's never stopped anyone in MOBAs, or even something like tabletop RPGs from getting hung up on who wins 1v1. Now there are some characters who you can generally expected to be getting into dueling situations say Tracer or Genji, their primary goal is to zip behind on their own and pick people running back from the spawn or harasses the snipers/healers enough that you bait a peel.
On the whole you're right though, the way to view the game that is going to win you games is through the lens of a team fight. Mei can struggle a bit there as she needs good chokes to split up the enemy team and she's just not going to be bringing a ton of stopping power to the party. Her ultimate is fantastic at grinding an enemy push to halt, but it's kind of slow to charge and demands followup from your teammates. Can't count times I've been playing as Mei frozen 4/6 of the enemy team with no followup because the DPS wanted to run off and duel tracer. I'm certainly not going to be bringing them down with icicles unless they were already on death's door to begin with.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2016/06/18 21:36:47
Chongara wrote: I'm certainly not going to be bringing them down with icicles unless they were already on death's door to begin with.
Dude, her icicle shot does 150 damage on a headshot. That's an instant kill on Zenyatta or Tracer at full health. Her Blizzard special ability does 19.7 damage per second, so anyone frozen by it will be taking at least another 60 damage. That puts every hero with 200 or less health caught in it in one shot range from her. That's 13 of 21 heroes she can 1 shot- from full health- if she catches them. And that's just her. Heaven help you if she's got friends or you're not going in on full health.
What makes Mei so powerful 1v1 though is that if she hits you enough, it's over. She *will* headshot your frozen ass. And if she's not winning she has not one but two escape methods, one of which heals her. You can't run from her either and if you make a dash for a med kit you can almost bet she'll block it off.
I'm now determined to learn how to play Tracer. It's difficult getting in the practice though, either there's already a tracer on the team (or some twit picks it even though I have done so already), or it's a team without a healer.
Mei's only weakness is burst damage (i.e. bastion, parah/junkrat/etc with mercy, reinhardt charge) and lack of mobility (which ice wall can be used as). I could honestly see her HP dropping from 250 to 200, and slow time before freezing from 7 seconds (iirc) to 9 seconds. Might be a bit much, but it would certainly lower her starting power for new players/complaints of OPness.
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bittersashes wrote:One guy down at my gaming club swore he saw an objective flag take out a full unit of Bane Thralls.
Compel wrote: I'm now determined to learn how to play Tracer. It's difficult getting in the practice though, either there's already a tracer on the team (or some twit picks it even though I have done so already), or it's a team without a healer.
Good luck.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/19 01:43:24
Desubot wrote: Why isnt Slut Wars: The Sexpocalypse a real game dammit.
"It's easier to change the rules than to get good at the game."
Chongara wrote: I'm certainly not going to be bringing them down with icicles unless they were already on death's door to begin with.
Dude, her icicle shot does 150 damage on a headshot. That's an instant kill on Zenyatta or Tracer at full health. Her Blizzard special ability does 19.7 damage per second, so anyone frozen by it will be taking at least another 60 damage. That puts every hero with 200 or less health caught in it in one shot range from her. That's 13 of 21 heroes she can 1 shot- from full health- if she catches them. And that's just her. Heaven help you if she's got friends or you're not going in on full health.
There is no way you're catching a tracer who isn't asleep at the wheel in a blizzard. You're going to take out 1, maybe 2 people tops. They don't freeze with their heads sitting all in a row for you to pop like pimples. You catch everyone unaware in most ults you're guaranteed 2-3 kills. You catch everyone in Mei's ult unaware you can head shot 1-2 people assuming the squishes wound up on the right side of the beefcake. Of course her ult is powerful with followup, it's a lot like Zarya's in that respect. It sets up the enemy for a big impact, but it's not going to get you a ton of clean wipes the way you can out of any of the Offense Hero ults or even a good Rip Tire.
What makes Mei so powerful 1v1 though is that if she hits you enough, it's over. She *will* headshot your frozen ass. And if she's not winning she has not one but two escape methods, one of which heals her. You can't run from her either and if you make a dash for a med kit you can almost bet she'll block it off.
You've described literally every hero in the game. Seriously if Mei was the goddess of destruction you're talking about you'd see her in comp. You most certainly can run for her. Unless you choose to duel in her a closed up space where she can ice wall the single exit, Wraith Form, Amp it Up!, Grapple Hook, Charge, a Mine Jump, Leap, Jet Boosters, Blink, Blade Dash or any other escape ability will land you squarely outside her primary fire range. Seriously if Mei is consistently walling you in with her alone, you're probably making positioning mistakes.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/19 02:11:20
Seriously if Mei was the goddess of destruction you're talking about you'd see her in comp.
I didn't call her any such thing. I simply pointed out the maths of what she can do. It was you who said 'I'm certainly not going to be bringing them down with icicles unless they were already on death's door to begin with. All I'm doing is pointing out that icicles+her ultimate can 1 shot over half the roster from full health. No this doesn't make her a 'goddess of destruction' but neither does it mean a competent player can't kill someone 'unless they were already on deaths door'. Don't try to imply I'm overstating her power because you understated it.
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Mei is not seen among elite players because at that level you put your best player/s on Tracer or Genji and have everyone else support and buff that player.
Mei is not too difficult to deal with if you coordinate, but ranked is not even a thing yet and coordination is something I rarely see. She absolutely slaughters people in quick matches as it is easy to isolate opponents.
The sheer ease with which she does it is what turned me off her. I love how she looks and all but even Reaper has to actually aim for moving targets instead of freezing them and headshotting them.
Knight wrote: The barrier blocks 200 HP worth of damage.
It's not that easy. It will completely absorb the first hit towards it, regardless of size (which is why it eats a selfdestruct or rip-tire with no damage to you) and if the first hit dealt less than 200 damage it will also absorb the remaining amount as usual.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/06/19 03:40:12
Seriously if Mei was the goddess of destruction you're talking about you'd see her in comp.
I didn't call her any such thing. I simply pointed out the maths of what she can do. It was you who said 'I'm certainly not going to be bringing them down with icicles unless they were already on death's door to begin with. All I'm doing is pointing out that icicles+her ultimate can 1 shot over half the roster from full health. No this doesn't make her a 'goddess of destruction' but neither does it mean a competent player can't kill someone 'unless they were already on deaths door'. Don't try to imply I'm overstating her power because you understated it.
Yeah you kill someone killing 1 player with your ult and then followup regular shots is not impressive, powerful or noteworthy. I misunderstood you and thought I was addressing the claim that Mei's ult + icicles was enough to consistently get a triple-to-Team Kill. When I was talking about death's door that's what I meant. You're not getting any big multikills like you do off other ults unless they're low enough to kill with punches and icicle body shots. Sorry I misread you there.
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Ashiraya wrote: Mei is not seen among elite players because at that level you put your best player/s on Tracer or Genji and have everyone else support and buff that player.
Mei is not too difficult to deal with if you coordinate, but ranked is not even a thing yet and coordination is something I rarely see. She absolutely slaughters people in quick matches as it is easy to isolate opponents.
The sheer ease with which she does it is what turned me off her. I love how she looks and all but even Reaper has to actually aim for moving targets instead of freezing them and headshotting them.
The real pub stompers are guys like Bastion & Torb. Just look at the stats:
Mei is middle of the pack at best, and has a close to 50/50 winrate. Look to guys like Lucio if you want to find Heroes with Overtuned kits. He's got great mobility, the highest healing of any support, a proactive ult, relatively easy 1-shot environmental kills and the best wipe recovery mechanic. Seriously she's OK to slightly under-tuned.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2016/06/19 04:24:07
Chongara wrote: Yeah you kill someone killing 1 player with your ult and then followup regular shots is not impressive, powerful or noteworthy.
To be fair, I'll consistently kill at least two players. At best I have killed four. If I don't kill them though it's usually because it's a tank and/or someone else kills them.
I misunderstood you and thought I was addressing the claim that Mei's ult + icicles was enough to consistently get a triple-to-Team Kill. When I was talking about death's door that's what I meant. You're not getting any big multikills like you do off other ults unless they're low enough to kill with punches and icicle body shots.
Again, to be fair I can consistently get a triple if I'm alone. The main factor in me not getting a triple is that someone else kills them (or someone else engages me) rather than a lack of damage.
The reason Mei is perceived to be so powerful in 1v1 though is that DPS spike from her icicle. If you engage a Tracer you might get hit for 100 damage from her guns in a certain period of time. The same accuracy from Mei, over the same time, will not only do damage (less admittedly), but it will freeze you. Then the headshot comes and that spike of 150 damage kills virtually every non tank. That's what makes her rough- you only need the skill level of a mediocre Tracer to get a kill, especially if you have armour (which most offense heroes do 50% damage against) which Mei's freeze ignores. In short she has a low skill ceiling (to get a kill) which is great from pugs but means little to pros.
*Edit* I should probably point out I very rarely play alone, if ever. I'm usually in a group of at least 2-4 with voip, so perhaps my view is a bit skewed.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/19 05:37:49
Well I had a good game to make up for that awful one the other day. I played Genji this time, on Bemani, attacking side. I didn't do super good but I did okay for my first real go at it, I think. I got PotG too, which wasn't super impressive because it was just a double kill...killed an ulting Pharah and then deflection killed a Bastion right after. Those deflection kills must be pretty heavily-weighted, I guess.
Desubot wrote: Why isnt Slut Wars: The Sexpocalypse a real game dammit.
"It's easier to change the rules than to get good at the game."
Compel wrote: I'm now determined to learn how to play Tracer. It's difficult getting in the practice though, either there's already a tracer on the team (or some twit picks it even though I have done so already), or it's a team without a healer.
Same here. I also want to get really good with Tracer. But I only get the chance of nobody else has picked her first, or if the team still needs a tank or support. Let's me get more Mercy and Zarya time, though.
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
Is this game set in the same universe as Starcraft series? acting as a prequel to SC1, narrating the rise of a global fascist state known as the United Powers League.
Lone Cat wrote: Is this game set in the same universe as Starcraft series? acting as a prequel to SC1, narrating the rise of a global fascist state known as the United Powers League.
Lone Cat wrote: Is this game set in the same universe as Starcraft series? acting as a prequel to SC1, narrating the rise of a global fascist state known as the United Powers League.
Definitely a separate universe considering that D.VA is a professional Starcraft player.
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Lone Cat wrote: Is this game set in the same universe as Starcraft series? acting as a prequel to SC1, narrating the rise of a global fascist state known as the United Powers League.
No, separate universe
Thank fething god for that.
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
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I managed to get Zarya's soviet army outfit the other day so I've been playing her a lot more now. A couple of times I've been able to hold down or keep an objective contested till all the dead guys get back, lots of fun.. but I rarely do a lot of damage, I usually just get random bronze medals at the end. I don't even know what her achievements are but I doubt I'll ever get em. My favorite move is to get Tracer stuck in my gravity well and melt her with my beam.
I think one of them is catching five enemies into your ultimate ability. It's not that difficult. I'm having harder time to get Mercy's resurrect achievement.
Zarya is really fun. Probably my favourite tank in the game.
Got McCree legendary skin (Riverboat), however he's really not kind to people with bad aim. Saved 2000 coins too, come summer and skins that I'll not be able to resist. Any of the Winston's skins also look magnificent.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/06/20 18:54:38
Yeah every time I get a new epic costume I start playing them, that's what got me into Mercy before. I remember getting her in one of the random hero games at first and I was like "WTF she can't kill anything", then I realized she was a healer later on
I've mostly beens switching between Zarya and Torbjorn lately with a little Soldier 76 mixed in. I don't play mercy as much as I used to unless there's no other healer queued up
I keep wanting to pick up this game, but I'm unsure whether or not it would be worth it for me. Whenever I play a game like this, I typically just want to play whatever Hero strikes my fancy, and I don't like the idea that people might get mad at me for picking a hero that I like and running with it (for example, I really like the look of Tracer)
TheEyeOfNight- I swear, this thread is 70% smack talk, 20% RP organization, and 10% butt jokes
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Space Marine flyers are shaped for the greatest possible air resistance so that the air may never defeat the SPACE MARINES!
Sternguard though, those guys are all about kicking ass. They'd chew bubble gum as well, but bubble gum is heretical. Only tau chew gum
However, there are plenty of awesome characters. For example, Mercy )the healer) is growing on me as an option because even when your team is completely incompetent and get themselves killed miles away from the objective and you're the last one standing, the other team can get a very rude awakening when you switch to your pistol and end up taking out two of them at once...
40IK - PP Conversion Project Files
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