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Played some more tonight. Did really well, Symmetra, 20 kills, 2 deaths averaging, lots of awesomeness.

Felt... bold, went into the event arcade to try to earn some loot boxes. Everything went horribly horribly wrong. Random heroes was terrible, multi team resulted in teams of me, 2 Hanzo's, 2 widowmakers and a Genji.

Being away from my computer for Christmas, no more loot boxes for me. - The only Christmasy thing I got was Zarya's mystery gifts emote

Zarya box is like the best one though.

I got most of what I wanted in terms of holiday skins/emotes/highlight intros (and even some I didn't want), still holding out hope for Santa Torb and Elf Tracer though

Day 23, still crying at night over no PC...

Truly a tragedy General, you're missing the greatest Widowmaker highlight intro ever

Remember people, one Exalt = one prayer for poor G.A

My computer was out of action from July until November. - I missed both the Olympics and the Halloween events :(

Exalt this if you cry every tiem.

One exalt = 1 prayer for G.A's sanity

I've been so lucky this week. It's raining legendaries!

Got Widowmakers POTG animation, Mei's Snowman animation, Winston's Abominable Snowman skin and Tracer's Elf skin. On top of that some of the regular legendary skins like Mercy's Imp skin

If it makes you feel better i think you can buy boxes from bliz shop directly.

not 100% sure but i know they sell digital stuff.

otherwise there is always next year

I'm still holding out hope that I'll get Zarya's emote, Santa Torb, and Elf Tracer

I have what I wanted (Zarya emote, Torbjörn skin, Mei skin) so I am content.


The balance feels out of whack though. Soldier is OP, Symmetra is OP, D.Va is OP... Ironically things felt way more balanced back in the closed beta!

I'm ok with D.VA apart from her ult. They messed that up real bad. They should have left in the chance of dieing yourself. Now it's "All reward, no danger.". On top of that... the range of it is just dumb and it clips through cover... so no safety even if you hide!

Symetra does to much damage for a support. I don't like the rework.

Soldier 76 is pretty much Soldier 76.

I'll have to disagree on the point about D.va's ult. Yes the range is bullgak, but sometimes you can be behind the smallest bit of cover and it doesn't get you.

 The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
Symetra does to much damage for a support. I don't like the rework.

She doesn't feel like a support. She has few support oriented abilities, but she just seems like an odd builder archetype. I'd rather see her gaining another area denial tool and put in defensive category, while a new character would pick a barrier play and fills the niche of a character that supports the team but doesn't heal.

Defence characters are all high damage classes that sacrifice the mobility of the Offence heroes for raw power. Symmetra wouldn't fit into that category since, while she is a lot more dangerous, she still lacks the damage output of a Defence or Offence type hero; her new kit is still certainly revolving around augmenting your team's capabilities rather than causing a lot of damage, which really she has been capable of doing since the Beta.

 General Annoyance wrote:
she still lacks the damage output of a Defence or Offence type hero

Symmetra is absolutely lethal. Up close she is comparable to a Reaper; Symmetra performs better against small and fast targets whereas Reaper counters tanks, and Reaper has more health and sustain in exchange for a larger model. But in damage output they are both extremely threatening.

Symmetra definitely feels like a defense hero. She is not any more support than Torbjörn is.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Symmetra is absolutely lethal. Up close she is comparable to a Reaper

No way - arguably outside of Mei, Reaper is an unrivalled close combat choice in Overwatch's current Roster - Symmetra needs time for her Photon Beam to maximise damage, by which time heroes other than Reindhart, D.VA, Genji and Tracer should have trashed her, at least theoretically; she has no defensive abilities when facing another hero 1v1 - the best tactic to surviving such a fight is to lure your opponent into your Photon Turrets, otherwise the balance is weighted heavily in your opponent's favour.

Reaper can kill pretty much any non Tank character in 1 or 2 hits (depending on whether you hit their head or not). Symmetra can only dream to have that level of DPS.

Symmetra performs better against small and fast targets whereas Reaper counters tanks, and Reaper has more health and sustain in exchange for a larger model. But in damage output they are both extremely threatening.

Symmetra definitely feels like a defense hero. She is not any more support than Torbjörn is.

Symmetra has always had good damage output, but typically poor DPS - that would put her more in the Support category than the Defence category since Defence heroes all have high DPS. Torbjorn is in that category because his Turret has a longer range than Symmetra's Turrets, and more damage per second, and while Torbjorn does have a Support like ability in the Armour Pack, for the most part his kit is focused more around that less mobile DPS that Defence heroes are good for.

Overwatch doesn't exactly have strict limitations when it comes to its class system. Either way, I'd still argue that Symmetra is in the right place, even with a buff to her already formidable damage output.

G.A

EDIT: I realise now that I meant to say DPS rather than Damage Output in my first post. Apologies for the confusion.

I am not sure if you are unfamiliar with those heroes?

 General Annoyance wrote:
No way - arguably outside of Mei, Reaper is an unrivalled close combat choice in Overwatch's current Roster

Hardly. Roadhog, Symmetra and McCree are just as dangerous as he is. Tracer is not a bad choice either due to her tiny model and extreme evasiveness.

Reaper can kill pretty much any non Tank character in 1 or 2 hits (depending on whether you hit their head or not). Symmetra can only dream to have that level of DPS.

Reaper's gun does 140 damage assuming all pellets hit, and against anything else than a non-Zarya tank (or Bastion) they won't outside of model collision range. Symmetra has a slim model and is very evasive too.

Symmetra has always had good damage output, but typically poor DPS

???

his Turret has a longer range than Symmetra's Turrets, and more damage per second,

The turret does 58 DPS. Fully charged, Symmetra's beam weapon does 120 DPS (so over double), and this is not taking into account the energy balls she spams into chokepoints.

Do not deflect the issue by confusing DPS and damage output. Symmetra does higher DPS and typically has more useful damage - Torbjörn often tops damage done, but much of that tends to just be wailing at Reinhardt's shield, which is not at all as useful in practice as Symmetra's close range massacres.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eStkPZH8m4&t=6s

I like to keep this one on hand when people say her damage is fine. Her slim model, automatic aiming (which lets her fully focus on evasion in close combat) and massive DPS lets her slaughter just about anything that comes too close, and this footage is from before her buffs!

 Ashiraya wrote:
I am not sure if you are unfamiliar with those heroes?

Not that it really reinforces any argument I make, but I've followed Overwatch since its first announcement in November 2014 - also played a tiny amount of the Closed Beta, as well as a lot of the Open Beta. Typically whenever I'm not playing (which is a lot) I'm keeping track with videos, official announcements and the hero pages on both Blizzard's Overwatch site and various wikis.

That's kinda pointless gaff though. In short, yes, I know the Overwatch roster very well.

Hardly. Roadhog, Symmetra and McCree are just as dangerous as he is. Tracer is not a bad choice either.

But they hardly parallel with Reaper - Roadhog's hitbox holds him back from being better despite having a weapon that does far more damage (although it fires a lot slower, and has less ammunition), McCree has turned more into a mid ranged hero after the nerfs to Fan the Hammer, and Symmetra needs to hang onto her target to do any substantial damage, all while having a low health pool. Tracer has potential, but her Pulse Pistols typically have too much spread to deal consistent damage - she ends up being more effective as a harasser rather than someone who straight up murders targets like Reaper, although good Tracer players tend to prove me wrong on that one.

No mention of Winston? He's also a very potent close quarters choice, but again, not a parallel to Reaper's DPS or Damage Output face to face.

Reaper's gun does 140 damage assuming all pellets hit, and against anything else than a non-Zarya tank they won't outside of model collision range. Symmetra has a slim model and is very evasive too.

That factoring in headshot damage or not? Typically you'd land a headshot with Reaper, but that obviously depends on positioning. Also how is Symmetra more evasive than any other character? Apart from her slimmer hitbox, she has nothing to defend herself that other heroes can't do (i.e. jumping about).

???

DPS - Average Damage per second; Damage Output - Potential Damage, i.e. how hard they hit. Ana for example has relatively high Damage Output but low DPS.

That's how I've personally defined it at least. Not sure if your definitions differ, or the majority of people for that matter.

The turret does 58 DPS. Fully charged, Symmetra's beam weapon does 120 DPS (so over double), and this is not taking into account the energy balls she spams into chokepoints.

Do not deflect the issue by confusing DPS and damage output. Symmetra does higher DPS and typically has more useful damage - Torbjörn often tops damage done, but much of that tends to just be wailing at Reinhardt's shield, which is not at all as useful in practice as Symmetra's close range massacres.

I'm not interested in damage done in a game - you're assuming that the enemy team has a Reindhart (a well known counter to Torbjorn's Turret). Torbjorn's Turret certainly has more useful damage than Symmetra's main source of damage, the Photon Turrets, which mostly tickle the enemy before they dispose of them (unless you use the alternate tactic of creating focused traps with them). Symmetra only tops in DPS once she's held her target for long enough.

I like to keep this one on hand when people say her damage is fine. Her slim model, automatic aiming (which lets her fully focus on evasion in close combat) and massive DPS lets her slaughter just about anything that comes too close, and this footage is from before her buffs!

You don't need to tell me how powerful Symmetra can be - as someone who's scored plenty of massive killstreaks with her and just as many POTG's, I know her potential. Even so, she stands very little chance against most heroes 1 on 1; at range, she has practically zero chance - her alternate fire travels too slow to catch any but the most dim witted players, and up close you are hinging on your opponent being one of Symmetra's hard counters (i.e. Tracer, Genji, D.VA, Reindhart).

Personally, I figure they ought to get rid of the 'classifications' altogether. They impose false limitations on team roster, stifling creative hero switching as the situation demands.

I don't know if you guys noticed, but Blizzard gave everyone 5 free lootboxes for the holidays

Ooh! Hooray!

Definitely gonna get on a little tomorrow, I think. Deffo doing a lot of playing next week.

 General Annoyance wrote:
Roadhog's hitbox holds him back from being better despite having a weapon that does far more damage (although it fires a lot slower, and has less ammunition)

He can also land his hooks in close range with ease, especially against Reaper's large model, which is a death sentence for him. It's harder against smaller models like Tracer or Symmetra.

McCree has turned more into a mid ranged hero after the nerfs to Fan the Hammer

Flashbang into fan the hammer is still absolute murder and tears apart Reaper with ease. If he dodges it with a well-timed wraith form, McCree simply pulls back as well, doing little more than a reset button. McCree has a tougher time against smaller models, where it is difficult to land many fan the hammer shots (see a trend here?)

and Symmetra needs to hang onto her target to do any substantial damage, all while having a low health pool.

Symmetra's health pool of 200 is perfectly average. Her evasiveness makes her deceptively difficult to get rid of.

No mention of Winston? He's also a very potent close quarters choice, but again, not a parallel to Reaper's DPS or Damage Output face to face.

No mention of Winston because spamming quick melee does more damage than his gun does.

That factoring in headshot damage or not? Typically you'd land a headshot with Reaper

No, you wouldn't. Aiming for the head is risky; you are missing even more of your pellets, and against a target jumping and moving back and forth aiming center mass is often more reliable.

Also how is Symmetra more evasive than any other character?

Her weapon is auto-aim, letting her focus 100% on evasion. No one else other than Winston can do this, and it is obviously less effective for him.

DPS - Average Damage per second; Damage Output - Potential Damage, i.e. how hard they hit. Ana for example has relatively high Damage Output but low DPS.

Ana's rifle does 80 damage with 1.25 rounds per second. That is very decent DPS indeed. I know well what those are, my ??? was more at the fact that the whole 'DPS vs damage output' feels irrelevant as they are effectively one and the same in Overwatch. If you stick to long-range combat as Reaper, it will result in low DPS and damage output, and vice versa.

I'm not interested in damage done in a game - you're assuming that the enemy team has a Reindhart (a well known counter to Torbjorn's Turret).

He is an extremely common pick as he counters Torbjörn (who can otherwise be fairly dominating in low skill matches) and Widowmaker (who can otherwise be fairly dominating in high skill matches).

Even so, she stands very little chance against most heroes 1 on 1

I can die a happy man. I got PotG as Ana and got to see my intro. It was a decent one as well, triple kill and assist in killing two others.

I cannot for the life of me crack Diamond. 299X I can get. I just can't get that last damn game. Up, down, up, down. And every game I do get to be 'the one' that will tick me over the match making seems to find the most lethal people imaginable and roflstomps us.

On the upside, I got the Zarya emote in a lootbox.

Speaking of good news, I got 4 legendaries in the 5 free packs that Blizz gave us!

1 duplicate, 1 widowmaker, 1 bastion, and the tracer one!

I really wish they would implement a resale system. Out of all the winter loot boxes I scored through Arcade, leveling up, and the 5 from blizzard, I pulled 2 Torbjorn Santa skins (was happy to get the one, but would like to sell the other one I have), a second Bastion Legendary skin (the corroded bronze one, and I already have it's sister), MEI Santa and MEI's Abominable (while having the other MEI Abominal skin), and a slew of generic skins I will never use.

I would really like to get the Winston Yeti skin, and could get there if I could sell of some of the Tracer skins I'll never use, two of my MEI legendary skins, a Bastion legendary, and other stuff.

I did buy Pharrah's Frosbite which I really wanted, and debate on the Reaper skin since I'll never amass the 3k for Winston's Yeti skin (it's that or either Commando 76 or one of the Winston Explorer/Safari skins).

I do like the MEI's snowball mini game, and the snowy levels. Merge this with the zomnic level from Halloween and it would be perfect. As is, this and the Halloween one put the Summer Games to shame.

 Ashiraya wrote:

Spoiler:

He can also land his hooks in close range with ease, especially against Reaper's large model, which is a death sentence for him. It's harder against smaller models like Tracer or Symmetra

Flashbang into fan the hammer is still absolute murder and tears apart Reaper with ease. If he dodges it with a well-timed wraith form, McCree simply pulls back as well, doing little more than a reset button. McCree has a tougher time against smaller models, where it is difficult to land many fan the hammer shots (see a trend here?)

This may just be my awful aim talking, but D.va vs Symmetra fights (in my experience) tend to be crap shoots.