Necron release rumours (prices and pics in first post)

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**Sigvatr**

Shooting a Warrior blob off the board? O_o

Back when I still played 6th, I usually ran it with 2 GA and Zahndrekh, making it a huge blob. Giving them Furious Charge for the lulz and actually even winning a melee.

**Ratflinger**

Crazyterran wrote:
col_impact wrote:
changemod wrote:
col_impact wrote:
One thing to remember about attaching Destroyer Lord to things. Not only does he grant PE, but he also grants fearless, which makes a LG unit he attaches to fearless and that is definitely potent. Still it would be nice now if there was some CC oriented jet pack unit he could attach to, to fully maximize his movement capabilities.

You have that upside down: It was the Wraiths who made the D Lord fearless, not the other way around.

Yeah, I had that the other way around.

A bargeLord joining a unit does grant fearless and relentless though. Wondering if the bargeLord can join units.

Can vehicles join units? -_-

Even, assuming, it got an exemption to allow it to join infantry units (and we have seen nothing that would indicate as such), how would it grant relentless without slow and purposeful? I guess if it rolls the warlord trait for it...

Mhm, MSS only really worked wonders against MCs or cheap unit that transported one cc character. Sure, the new MSS sounds awful, but it never was something that made overlord into cc monsters, it worked as a decent deterrent for charging units with them with just about anything or making sure that good cc units just did not effortlessly sweep necron units. However, us getting decent cc units ourselves seem like a good replacement. And one that at the same time is less frustrating to play against.

**Dr. Delorean**

On a slightly related note - Veil of Darkness gives the Cryptek deep strike, as well as allowing the wielder + his unit to deep strike again at some point in the game.

So, take a unit of 20 Flayed Ones and a Cryptek with the Veil and the Solar Staff. Deep strike them somewhere close to the enemy and use the staff for shooting defense. Run amok behind enemy lines, then when you need to maneuver, deep strike again for more shenanigans!

Deep striking 21 models without any way to mitigate mishaps? Crazy! Crazy -like a fox-!

**skoffs**

So without MSS, Necrons have what in the way of defense against CC monsters?
Is it really just going to be a case of "All you can do is avoid getting into CC with them or die" now?

As far as other CC prospects go,
- Previously D.Lord+Wraiths were a staple. Doesn't look to be a thing this time around.
- Wraiths by themselves are okay, I guess (do they still have rending?).
- Scarabs are... mildly threatening? (not really)
- Flayed Ones got everything we were hoping for apart from becoming troops.
- Lychguard in a Ghost Ark appear to be the new cool thing.
- Praetorians might be interesting, too.
- Nightbringer... if we can figure out some way to get some use out of him, perhaps.
- Spyders... we don't actually know that much about Spyders yet.
- BargeLord assumedly will be seeing a lot of action (unless there's something we're missing about him).
- Lords/Overlords, well, if you attach them to Lychguard squads they'll be able to do something useful, but if you run into a dedicated CC unit/HQ, without anything to mitigate the disadvantages now, what chance do they actually stand?

For the most part, it looks like Necrons will remain a shooty army. At least for me, anyway.

**Henker-Kind**

skoffs wrote:
So without MSS, Necrons have what in the way of defense against CC monsters?
Is it really just going to be a case of "All you can do is avoid getting into CC with them or die" now?

As far as other CC prospects go,
- Previously D.Lord+Wraiths were a staple. Doesn't look to be a thing this time around.
- Wraiths by themselves are okay, I guess (do they still have rending?).
- Scarabs are... mildly threatening? (not really)
- Flayed Ones got everything we were hoping for apart from becoming troops.
- Lychguard in a Ghost Ark appear to be the new cool thing.
- Praetorians might be interesting, too.
- Nightbringer... if we can figure out some way to get some use out of him, perhaps.
- Spyders... we don't actually know that much about Spyders yet.
- BargeLord assumedly will be seeing a lot of action (unless there's something we're missing about him).
- Lords/Overlords, well, if you attach them to Lychguard squads they'll be able to do something useful, but if you run into a dedicated CC unit/HQ, without anything to mitigate the disadvantages now, what chance do they actually stand?

For the most part, it looks like Necrons will remain a shooty army. At least for me, anyway.

The changes to destroyers (Jet-Pack-Infantry), lychguard and praetorians combined with the new wargear, maybe even the close combat abilities of the C'tans, take away all fears I would have regarding units wanting to assault me

D
And shooting them off before they can come to me should be a priority with necrons anyway - I remember this back from the oldcron days and I think this should be more of a virtue nowadays - it is just lame to have an ability for everything MSS a gone for good man

now let us shoot those ******* from the board or chop them with pumped up lychguard with a d-lord attached to them!

I think there is nothing to fear anymore!

Automatically Appended Next Post:
The waiting kils me!

**vipoid**

With regard to the new RP, they'll be a buff to MSU Necron armies - since you can no longer prevent RP by wiping out a squad.

Just something that crossed my mind.

**Henker-Kind**

vipoid wrote:
With regard to the new RP, they'll be a buff to MSU Necron armies - since you can no longer prevent RP by wiping out a squad.

Just something that crossed my mind.

well thought! Destroyers benefit from that again....

Even though I really do not like the idea with tiny warrior units

What I noticed is that all the orbs benefit larger groups of warriors wich is very fluffy to me

**changemod**

Henker-Kind wrote:
Even though I really do not like the idea with tiny warrior units

No, but rarely are all 6 troop slots filled, so effectively you can now combat squad your Immortals if you feel like it.

**zerosignal**

Holy crap! That change to RP is a bit good!!!

**Aldaris**

I hope there is some fearless character in the codex, or a way to get it somehow. Because then a 20 warrior foot blob would be really, REALLY annoying. Cryptek for 4+ RP, ResOrb for a reroll to that when it counts and an Ark or two hanging out in the general vicinity to also help keep things going. Would make for an incredibly hard to shift centerpiece unit.

**vipoid**

Henker-Kind wrote:

well thought! Destroyers benefit from that again....

Indeed.

Henker-Kind wrote:

Even though I really do not like the idea with tiny warrior units

I do (though I might use immortals instead).

I just like the idea of having a lot of small Necron squads moving around.

**docdoom77**

I'm thinking, that if the Nightbringer is as rumored, he'll be my Wraithknight killer. Drop a random shot and his LD on 3d6 attack. Then if I get in CC, Fleshbane and a 4++. Nice.

**Akar**

The only time I would think MSS was ever a charge deterrent, especially for MCs, would be if they knew they couldn't wipe out the unit on the turn they charged. MSS simply did not work if the unit got charged unless there was absolutely no way to avoid the model that had them. If the opponent couldn't wipe the unit, which was more often than not with a solo MC, then he deserved to get MSS'd.

Since none of that matters anymore, it is tragic that there are some (not all) Necron players who are complaining that they'll have no defense in CC without it. We already have Res Orbs giving us a re-roll on a potential 4+RP. Keep in mind that we no longer lose attacks back like before, and we get to test before breaking. Assuming we're still LD 10, we have to lose combat by 3 to even make me a little worried.

Even without all the synergy shenanigans that we will be able to do, we were no slouch in CC, just slow. With the new RP alone, I'm even less afraid of having my units in CC (provided they've done their job in the shooting phase).

I've still got my own questions that I want answered, but they can wait. Even if all my tricks are gone, I'm still gonna run a few games of unassisted warriors and throw them into combat just to see what they can do now. Necrons sucking in CC was a myth before that has won me several games, and it's going to become even more of a Myth now.

**Requizen**

The only thing I'm really concerned about right now is our counter to vehicles, especially Knights. Previously it was the obvious - Haywire sticks on Stormteks. But without those, Knights are tough to crack. Our Armorbane Assault units probably won't fare too well against one (weren't great before simply due to I2 and Stomp), and Gauss is of course not super reliable.

Heavy Destroyers, Doomsday Arks, and Doom Scythes are now our anti-armor options, though even they're not 100% counters to Knights (Especially ALF). As much as people complained about Haywire, I would still have been happy if it was just turned into Assault 2, so we could still have a hard anti-armor option. Now I feel inclined to include my own Knight Errant.

**skoffs**

Non-CC Necrons sucked in CC when facing something that was good at CC. YMMV, but for most of us that was very much the case. Often was the time where MSS would help tip the scales and even things out, keeping a squad alive (by removing a few attacks and redirecting them back at their source).
If Non-CC Necrons get assaulted by good CC units now what do we have? Increased survivability? Okay, cool, but apart from not dying so much, is there anything else we can do?

**changemod**

Requizen wrote:
Our Armorbane Assault units probably won't fare too well against one (weren't great before simply due to I2 and Stomp), and Gauss is of course not super reliable.

Sure about that one? Cheap and with both actual transport options and access to one turn of invisibility, Lychguard can spam a considerable amount of Armourbane. Potentially even titan slaying levels.

**skoffs**

Requizen wrote:
Now I feel inclined to include my own Knight Errant.

Meanwhile, at GW sales and marketing...

**Requizen**

changemod wrote:
Requizen wrote:
Our Armorbane Assault units probably won't fare too well against one (weren't great before simply due to I2 and Stomp), and Gauss is of course not super reliable.

Sure about that one? Cheap and with both actual transport options and access to one turn of invisibility, Lychguard can spam a considerable amount of Armourbane. Potentially even titan slaying levels.

First, we don't know if the regular Warscythe still grants Armorbane. I think it's a decent chance that they do, but with the change to AP2 and the fact that we have 2 Artifact Warscythes, the basic ones may have changed considerably.

Second, Solar Pulse is not Invisibility. It is for shooting, but it does nothing for Assault. This alone means that a handful of them will die before they can attack, especially since if you're taking Warscythes there's no Invuln save and against a Knight's weapon you'd be at only a 6+ Reanimation.

**changemod**

Requizen wrote:
changemod wrote:
Requizen wrote:
Our Armorbane Assault units probably won't fare too well against one (weren't great before simply due to I2 and Stomp), and Gauss is of course not super reliable.

Sure about that one? Cheap and with both actual transport options and access to one turn of invisibility, Lychguard can spam a considerable amount of Armourbane. Potentially even titan slaying levels.

First, we don't know if the regular Warscythe still grants Armorbane. I think it's a decent chance that they do, but with the change to AP2 and the fact that we have 2 Artifact Warscythes, the basic ones may have changed considerably.

Second, Solar Pulse is not Invisibility. It is for shooting, but it does nothing for Assault. This alone means that a handful of them will die before they can attack, especially since if you're taking Warscythes there's no Invuln save and against a Knight's weapon you'd be at only a 6+ Reanimation.

Sure, but it means they can live to get there which is the important thing, and a few 25 point deaths are a petty price to down a superheavy.

Oh, and it would be 5+. If you have a Cryptek in there to solar pulse, your base reanimation is 4+ before instant death modification.

**Valek**

tbh, i am really concerned, changes are fine and fun, but the army is completely unplayable tournament wise as the rumours go now.

Admantite lance + ??: autoloss
Wave Serpents & Wraith knights: autoloss
Droppod marines: uphill
Bikes: uphill
Deamons: autoloss
Tyranids Skyblight: doable

on a side note
Apocalypse, THE SUCK, no more C-Tan ( I don't see them nerfing those Gargantuan Deamons...), vault is a joke now and Pylon is unplayable,

**ClassicCarraway**

skoffs wrote:
Non-CC Necrons sucked in CC when facing something that was good at CC. YMMV, but for most of us that was very much the case. Often was the time where MSS would help tip the scales and even things out, keeping a squad alive (by removing a few attacks and redirecting them back at their source).
If Non-CC Necrons get assaulted by good CC units now what do we have? Increased survivability? Okay, cool, but apart from not dying so much, is there anything else we can do?

How is this a unique problem to Necrons? I don't see Eldar, IG/AM, or Tau suddenly having some way to overpower dedicated CC units with their basic troops? Necrons will now have multiple good, relatively cheap, and insanely durable CC units at their disposal. Making their basic rank and file troops also potent at CC would be tipping the balance to much. Right tools for the job and all that.

Basic, non-CC infantry should never hope to be more than a speedbump to a dedicated assault unit. Basic non-CC infantry should strive to tie up the dedicated CC unit as long as possible to allow your own CC units to get into the fray, nothing more, and in that, new Crons excel because with the new RP, they will suffer far fewer wounds and be less likely to break.

**Requizen**

changemod wrote:
Requizen wrote:
changemod wrote:
Requizen wrote:
Our Armorbane Assault units probably won't fare too well against one (weren't great before simply due to I2 and Stomp), and Gauss is of course not super reliable.

Sure about that one? Cheap and with both actual transport options and access to one turn of invisibility, Lychguard can spam a considerable amount of Armourbane. Potentially even titan slaying levels.

First, we don't know if the regular Warscythe still grants Armorbane. I think it's a decent chance that they do, but with the change to AP2 and the fact that we have 2 Artifact Warscythes, the basic ones may have changed considerably.

Second, Solar Pulse is not Invisibility. It is for shooting, but it does nothing for Assault. This alone means that a handful of them will die before they can attack, especially since if you're taking Warscythes there's no Invuln save and against a Knight's weapon you'd be at only a 6+ Reanimation.

Sure, but it means they can live to get there which is the important thing, and a few 25 point deaths are a petty price to down a superheavy.

Oh, and it would be 5+. If you have a Cryptek in there to solar pulse, your base reanimation is 4+ before instant death modification.

Ah, I had forgotten. That is nice, and might be worth bringing a Res Orb if you're going to be using that squad in that manner. 9 Warscythe Lychguard + Cryptek with Solar Staff and Res Orb in a Ghost Ark is a scary assault squad that can possibly take on Knights. Maybe not the best answer to them in the game, but from what I see it might be the best option we have, unless you're spamming craptons of Gauss or Heavy Destroyers.

Valek wrote:
tbh, i am really concerned, changes are fine and fun, but the army is completely unplayable tournament wise as the rumours go now.

Admantite lance + ??: autoloss
Wave Serpents & Wraith knights: autoloss
Droppod marines: uphill
Bikes: uphill
Deamons: autoloss
Tyranids Skyblight: doable

on a side note
Apocalypse, THE SUCK, no more C-Tan ( I don't see them nerfing those Gargantuan Deamons...), vault is a joke now and Pylon is unplayable,

I think that's a little pessimistic. Knights, as I said, I think will be very difficult. But Wave Serpents have always been hard, and now we actually have a decent Ignores Cover unit that can help with that. Getting Tomb Blades to RA of Serpents could do some decent damage.

Daemons I don't know why is an autoloss. Because of Summoning? I guess we don't particularly have a lot of AoE anti-horde to deal with that, sure, but that doesn't mean it's an auto loss.

**Henker-Kind**

The pylon is very playable: deepstrike him and always be the first to hit 3 D shots.

Otherwise: immortals are cheaper arent they 17 Points that is a little difference.
Heavy destroyers cost 10 points less, have one more wound, and better RP.

But how to kill a Knight... you still got night scythes. Maybe Lychguard with warscythes - very cheap.
Warrior blobs with chronometron can survive their shooting!
Scarabs can now hurt them!!!

...

**docdoom77**

Henker-Kind wrote:
The pylon is very playable: deepstrike him and always be the first to hit 3 D shots.

Otherwise: immortals are cheaper arent they 17 Points that is a little difference.
Heavy destroyers cost 10 points less, have one more wound, and better RP.

But how to kill a Knight... you still got night scythes. Maybe Lychguard with warscythes - very cheap.
Warrior blobs with chronometron can survive their shooting!
Scarabs can now hurt them!!!

...

Immortals were 17 pts in the last book too.

**Henker-Kind**

docdoom77 wrote:
Henker-Kind wrote:
The pylon is very playable: deepstrike him and always be the first to hit 3 D shots.

Otherwise: immortals are cheaper arent they 17 Points that is a little difference.
Heavy destroyers cost 10 points less, have one more wound, and better RP.

But how to kill a Knight... you still got night scythes. Maybe Lychguard with warscythes - very cheap.
Warrior blobs with chronometron can survive their shooting!
Scarabs can now hurt them!!!

...

Immortals were 17 pts in the last book too.

I wanted to erase that from the post because I was very unsure

**Valek**

Pylon will shoot at what he has skyfire and interceptor, so he will hope to hit somehting on a 6.

Killing one night is something but the lance formation will be undoable.

Still have my hopes on the things we don't know to reveal some hidden gems...

**Requizen**

Character Stats going up:

Okay, I am gonna try and answer a whole bunch of questions at once. For starters, I am gonna post some stats. Let's start with...

The Necron Characters -

Nemesor Zahndrekh (150 pts)

WS5 BS5 S5 T5 W3 I2 A3 Ld10 Sv.2+

Staff of Light, Phase shifter

IC, Reanimation Protocols (RP), Eternal Madness Trait

Adaptive Tacticcs: May select a different Warlord Trait for him (no D6 roll needed) at start of each friendly turn after the first. May also select traits from the BRB. He cannot choose the same trait more than once per game.

Counter Tactics: When within 24" of enemy units with the following special rules: Counter attack, furious charge, hit & run, split fire, stealth, tank hunters - then Zahndrekh and his unit have the same special rules.

Vargard Obyron (120 points)

WS6 BS4 S5 T5 W2 I2 A3 Ld10 Sv.2+

Warscythe

IC, RP

Vargard's Duty: Auto passes Init. test for glorious intervention

Cleaving Counterblow: When in a challenge, gains a bonus attack for each attack made by enemy character that fails to hit. Attacks are made at Init 1 step and does not grant additional pile in move

Illuminor Szeras (110 points)

WS4 BS4 S4 T4 W2 I2 A4 Ld10 Sv3+

Fear, IC, RP, Immortal Hubris Trait

Eldritch Lance: 36", S8 AP2, Assault 1, Lance

Mechanical Augmentation: At start of game, before deployment, choose one unit of warriors or immortals. Nominated unit receives an upgrade for remainder of game. Roll D6-

1-2: +1 Toughness
3-4: BS set to 5
5-6: Strength set to 5

Lord of Technomancy: This model and all friendly models with RP within 6" get +1 to RP rolls

(To be Continued)

Read more: http://thetyranidhive.proboards.com/thread/48760/new-necrons-codex?page=9&scrollTo=834737#ixzz3Q2YtCavQ

Zahndrekh is AMAZING now imo. Still can steal powers and can change Warlord traits per turn? That's fracking AWESOME.

Obyron is ruined for whatever reason. Like he was OP before?

Szeras much of the same, but now Eldrich Lance has Lance. That's nice. Still kinda meh, at least he's cheap (though 10 points more?).

**changemod**

Well yes, Scarabs aren't entirely useless on a Knight...

Assume you charge 7 into it. That's a quick estimate at base 9 buffed to 12 then gunned back down assuming cover saves and no Thunderfire cannon.

Now, say the Knight hits three times. That's those three bases gone, meaning 20 attacks.

So... About two glances, then they get Stomped out.

...

More optimistically, assume you manage to charge a full 12 in and the Knight only succeeds on two hits, or rolls a 1 on the D table for one of it's three hits.

That would be 50 attacks and therefore about 4 glances.

And then they get stomped out or at least down to trivial size.

Yeah, they're a vehicle solution but not really a Knight solution.

**juanjopotro**

Leaked pics from Codex: Necrons here:
http://forofreakfactory.mforos.com/1035375/11577037-portada-y-lider-del-codex-necron-un-monton-de-fotos-y-reglas-a-dia-27/#106144874

Stats, Warlord traits table, special weapons and more.

Enjoy it!

**DarknessEternal**

Valek wrote:

Admantite lance + ??: autoloss
Wave Serpents & Wraith knights: autoloss
Droppod marines: uphill
Bikes: uphill
Deamons: autoloss
Tyranids Skyblight: doable

Knights - yeah probably. That's what Knights do to every army and the problem is Knights, not other armies.
Wave Serpents/Wraithknights - no way man, this is going to be as close to an auto win as you can get. Their guns are harmless to Necrons and every thing Necrons have can kill them. WKs are easily bogged down with trash that's considerably cheaper.
Marines - yep, everyone loses to bikes and drop pods, not a Necron problem.
Daemons - I don't understand your sentiment. There's nothing especially deadly in Daemons at all.
Flying Tyranids - they aren't dangerous to Necrons on the ground, and in the air they're at best, even with Nightscythes.