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I'd be gone with Imperial Knights... A whole army of Super Heavies is just silly!

By Be-gone i'd want to merge them with something.... Maybe Mechanicum like the OP suggested

 Peregrine wrote:
There, problem solved. Shouldn't take more than 2-3 pages in C:SM, and that's if each unit gets its own page.

But what happens with their unique units?
How about their special weapons? Or fluff?
Did you even read the GK Codex?

Kangodo wrote:
But what happens with their unique units?

Their special snowflakes are gone. They don't need them anyway, those "unique" units only exist to justify GW's decision to charge you $50 for "your tactical squads can take storm bolters".

How about their special weapons?

Not necessary. It's not like anyone ever takes anything besides psycannons, and that option is maintained (through the psychic ammo upgrade I gave them).

Or fluff?

Most of it is stupid anyway. Reducing it to a footnote somewhere in the "other chapters" section of C:SM would be an improvement.

Chaos marines are dumb. Think they should be removed entirely. The fluff for them is terrible. Should just be man vs xenos vs daemons.

Kangodo wrote:But what happens with their unique units?
How about their special weapons? Or fluff?

Didn't you know that you can combine six 120-page books, and the end result is only 30 pages long, and you lose no content?

Amazing, right?

Pyeatt wrote:Chaos marines are dumb. Think they should be removed entirely. The fluff for them is terrible. Should just be man vs xenos vs daemons.

So space marines are well-adjusted human beings that would never have enough stress or brutal discipline to behave badly? Just a bunch of genial blokes who really don't mind that they're not allowed have emotions. Who are pretty cool with totalitarian enslavement of all mankind by a bloated theocracy.

Good thing, too. Otherwise space marines would have flaws, and who wants that?

 Ailaros wrote:
Didn't you know that you can combine six 120-page books, and the end result is only 30 pages long, and you lose no content?

Amazing, right?

Of course you lose content. But you don't lose valuable content. GW codex page counts (especially in current codices) are vastly inflated by things like the same catalog pictures of the same tactical marines GW has been using since 1995, bland fluff that nobody cares about, special snowflake units that only exist to make you pay $50 for their rules, etc. And then there's the unit overlap. If you combine all the marine codices into one book you don't need to repeat multiple copies of the rules and fluff for tactical squads/Rhinos/etc, so the total length of a combined book would be significantly less than the sum of the page counts of the current books.

changemod wrote:

morgoth wrote:

changemod wrote:
Assassins aren't an army, they've just been split out so anyone can use them.

If only that were true. AFAIK their faction means they can only be transported by an IoM vehicle. feth dat.

You'd spend a vehicle on moving a lone model?

For the most part they're fine: Only the Culexus has any real mobility issue getting where he needs to be and even he Infiltrates.

When you have access to the ultimate Deep Strike for 35 points, why would you not, really.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

changemod wrote:
The other two Cerastus models have overkill issues where they only have one gun and have to charge what they shot, and target saturation is pretty much all I want from a Superheavy trying to earn all those points back.

They're Titan hunters, so it makes sense that they're overkill against small stuff.


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 Talizvar wrote:

We have space Vikings so why not space Mongols then? (oh yeah)...

Isn't that already the roughriders in the Astra Militarum ?

morgoth wrote:

changemod wrote:
The other two Cerastus models have overkill issues where they only have one gun and have to charge what they shot, and target saturation is pretty much all I want from a Superheavy trying to earn all those points back.

They're Titan hunters, so it makes sense that they're overkill against small stuff.

"Overkill" as in they can only target one unit and have to dedicate all their force against it, when every other Knight unit can shoot one thing and charge another.

Tau ofc, the race looks like ET before age got him so just pack your bikes and go home. Kroot are pointless too so are vespids. Newer minis are ok ish but Id be ashamed to put a Crysis suit on the table.

Second would be ponytail elves Eldar, though they could just remodel them to look more spacy alienish and less Elrond in spaaace. Their tanks are awfuly proportioned too.

Militarium Tempestus riding the Taurox fit better to sf adaptation of 4 musketeers so I'm happy to see them so high on the list.

changemod wrote:

morgoth wrote:

changemod wrote:
The other two Cerastus models have overkill issues where they only have one gun and have to charge what they shot, and target saturation is pretty much all I want from a Superheavy trying to earn all those points back.

They're Titan hunters, so it makes sense that they're overkill against small stuff.

"Overkill" as in they can only target one unit and have to dedicate all their force against it, when every other Knight unit can shoot one thing and charge another.

Do you even read ?

The Acheron Cerastus works.

His Chainblade has the Heavy Bolter, so surely it will Hit what it shot at? =P

Actually it's the same for lancer: He has to point his Lance at what he's charging, so how can the shot go anywhere else?

Fluff ! !

Every army i struggle with(Jokes aside, i don't think anything needs to be removed.)

 Blitza da warboy wrote:

Maybe sisters of battle just to end their misery.

You shut your whore mouth.

But in all seriousness, I don't think any army should be blapped, rather consolidated. The fluff can still exist, but having so many different flavors of Marines and whatnot just muddy up the waters.

I wouldn't remove any armies completely, but instead merge most of the similar armies together into a single combined book to create less armies overall but by doing so create armies with more internal choice.
One of my biggest gripes with 40k is that there are far too many "armies" that are basically copy-pasted from one another, eg. SM and all other SM chapters; or that there are separate armies for units that would logically operate under the same banner, eg. CSM and Demons.

 Peregrine wrote:
especially if you get rid of all the pointless "look at me I'm a special snowflake buy my $50 kit" units that only exist to fill up space in a separate codex.

bizarrely, GW may actually prefer if you buy their -

you know what, this is a stupid thing to have to reply to.

pelicaniforce wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
especially if you get rid of all the pointless "look at me I'm a special snowflake buy my $50 kit" units that only exist to fill up space in a separate codex.

bizarrely, GW may actually prefer if you buy their -

you know what, this is a stupid thing to have to reply to.

Why?

morgoth wrote:

changemod wrote:

morgoth wrote:

changemod wrote:
The other two Cerastus models have overkill issues where they only have one gun and have to charge what they shot, and target saturation is pretty much all I want from a Superheavy trying to earn all those points back.

They're Titan hunters, so it makes sense that they're overkill against small stuff.

"Overkill" as in they can only target one unit and have to dedicate all their force against it, when every other Knight unit can shoot one thing and charge another.

Do you even read ?

The Lancer I can buy. It only has the one short range weapon, so Lance-zapping is just an extension of it's charge in.

But you're telling me the Castigator Pilot can't rake his Bolt Cannon across a Tactical unit on the way to stabbing something else?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

pelicaniforce wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
especially if you get rid of all the pointless "look at me I'm a special snowflake buy my $50 kit" units that only exist to fill up space in a separate codex.

bizarrely, GW may actually prefer if you buy their -

you know what, this is a stupid thing to have to reply to.

Yeah, two way street there. Games Workshop want to sell fancy elite models to encourage sales, players want their chapter's distinctive Thunderwolf Cavalry, Sanguinary Guard or Ravenwing Black Knights.

Whilst I agree you could fairly easily consolidate the specialist chapters, you'd fairly need to give them each a book chapter half dedicated to fluff, half dedicated to specialist units and pointing out wargear differences on generic units.

Grey Knights would be the hardest in that they'd need stuff like points adjustments for giving units Brotherhood of Psykers and different wargear tables for basically every unit.

Overall, even having the same "Rhino" page for everyone and cutting redundant fluff and picture space, you're probably looking at a double sized tome. It could be done, but it wouldn't necessarily be 100% practical.

 TheDraconicLord wrote:
Remove an army? Never. That's being a scumbag.

Honestly I don't even see why this thread is still open.This thread is inherently hostile, because when you're saying you want to remove a faction you're basically telling everyone who plays that faction to go feth themselves, and/or that all the money and time they spent on the hobby simply doesn't matter, because they like something you don't like. And when you add to the fact that it's mostly all going to be targeted at just a few "unpopular" factions, like Tau, it just feels like bullying in the end. We get enough undeserved hate as it is, and threads like this just give people yet another chance to get their daily Tau-bashing in.

Seriously? Tau have been a part of 40k for about 14 years now. That's more than half of 40k's total lifespan so far, and they've been in 4 out of the game's 7 editions. Tau are here to stay, and there are other games out there you can play if you don't like it.

 The Grumpy Eldar wrote:
Tau would be kicked out of the game by me. Don't need an army of blue fishlike men.

I think we need Tau more than we need five fething Space Marine armies, to be perfectly honest.

 BoomWolf wrote:

Telmenari wrote:
None, but I really wish that Farsight Enclaves was either removed or changed to not be Battle-Brothers with Tau, considering they're actively hostile towards one another constantly....

Your tau fluff knowledge needs to be repaired.

While they are OFFICIALLY hostile, even that is one-sided (empire to enclaves, but not the reverse), they don't actually fight each other, and the enclaves have assisted the empire at defending against outer threats (than packed up and left)
Plus, much of the empire is sympathetic towards the enclaves.

The "hostility" between the two is only the creed of the ethreals, but in reality the two coexist fine.

Not only that but in the FE supplement it even says that some of the sept worlds in the Empire are sending supplies to the Enclaves, and it's strongly hinted that Farsight still has a lot of friends on Vior'la in particular, if I'm not mistaken. It's how they got riptides, a Tau commander defected and brought an entire ship full of supplies with them.

But no, the Empire isn't exactly waging open war against the Enclaves, and the Enclaves likely don't even consider the Empire an enemy.

 Wulfmar wrote:

Imperial Guard - merge with Astra Militarum

Derp

I had meant merge with Militarum Tempestus. Stupid similar faux-Latin names!

I would roll Blood Angels, Space Wolves and Dark Angels into Codex:Space Marines and treat them like any other chapter. Give them unique Chapter Tactics and then give the limited number of chapter specific units the Crusader Squad treatment. In other words, add in Sanguinary Guard, but require them to be taken in a Blood Angels Chapter Tactics detachment.

Why do those three chapters deserve their own codex while the other core chapters don't? Why isn't there a Codex: Salamanders? Why not make 9 different Codexes and turn Codex: Space Marines into Codex: Ultramarines (which is basically what it is now)?

Grey Knights except in specific scenarios where they are called in to fight daemons. You know their primary job and role in life, thus why they are called the Daemon Hunters.

 Kriswall wrote:
Why not make 9 different Codexes and turn Codex: Space Marines into Codex: Ultramarines (which is basically what it is now)?

Why not? Make it thinner supplements that reference most of the material back to the main codex.

After all, there's enough unique units and fluff to bloat the codex if you tried to cram everything in.

 Ailaros wrote:
Actually, the cargo-cult nature of orks fits perfectly with grimdark. It fits along with techpriests and warp-based psychic powers to a tee.

Orks as funny only doesn't make sense when you can't see grimdark as the absurdist humor it is.

I never said anything about Orks being funny. I said they're cartoony. As in they look like they were designed by some 1980s cartoonist. Since I started in 2nd edition, all the other armies have matured and grown to look more convincing... Except Orks, who only got a little bit larger. They just look awful.

The Cargo-cult nature of Orks might fit if only Orks had to work at it. Knowing how to build a complex machine the day after you're born or completely repurposing other races' alien technology with no reverse engineering or technical experience is just abysmally pathetic design.

Orks are great in Fantasy. They should have stayed there.

pelicaniforce wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
especially if you get rid of all the pointless "look at me I'm a special snowflake buy my $50 kit" units that only exist to fill up space in a separate codex.

bizarrely, GW may actually prefer if you buy their -

you know what, this is a stupid thing to have to reply to.

Sorry, I thought this thread was about "what army would you remove if you had the chance", not "GW is never going to remove an army because they'd rather milk the cash cow obsessively with tons of pointless rulebooks".


Automatically Appended Next Post:

changemod wrote:
Yeah, two way street there. Games Workshop want to sell fancy elite models to encourage sales, players want their chapter's distinctive Thunderwolf Cavalry, Sanguinary Guard or Ravenwing Black Knights.

You don't need special rules to sell special models. TWC and Ravenwing are just bike squads with fancy models, sanguinary guard are just vanguard vets with fancy models.

Whilst I agree you could fairly easily consolidate the specialist chapters, you'd fairly need to give them each a book chapter half dedicated to fluff, half dedicated to specialist units and pointing out wargear differences on generic units.

That's only true if you assume that every random special rule and bit of wargear that currently exists needs to continue existing. You could get rid of most of it without really losing anything valuable, so that page count goes down significantly.

 Peregrine wrote:
You don't need special rules to sell special models. TWC and Ravenwing are just bike squads with fancy models, sanguinary guard are just vanguard vets with fancy models.

If you feel like sucking all the joy out of it, sure.

That's only true if you assume that every random special rule and bit of wargear that currently exists needs to continue existing. You could get rid of most of it without really losing anything valuable, so that page count goes down significantly.

Hey, let's just have one book and give every army the same units with different models whilst we're at it. Make it colourful chess with a shooting phase.

changemod wrote:
If you feel like sucking all the joy out of it, sure.

I didn't realize that rules bloat was necessary for joy. How exactly do TWC need their own special rules? The core of their concept is that they're MEQs with +1 toughness and faster movement, which is exactly what bikes have. Is your game really going to be ruined because you have T5 from the bike unit type instead of a special snowflake unit rule?

Hey, let's just have one book and give every army the same units with different models whilst we're at it. Make it colourful chess with a shooting phase.

Congratulations on missing the point. Marine armies are already almost identical, and the few differences are mostly excuses for GW to justify selling an entire $50 rulebook instead of meaningful strategic differences. And this is especially true if you want to do something about the general rules bloat issue in 40k, where there are a million special rules and exceptions to the special rules and exceptions to the exceptions. An un-bloated version of 40k would simplify things to the point where the subtle differences between marine codices aren't really important enough to deserve their own rules, but you'd still have huge differences between orks and tau.

 Peregrine wrote:

changemod wrote:
If you feel like sucking all the joy out of it, sure.

I didn't realize that rules bloat was necessary for joy. How exactly do TWC need their own special rules? The core of their concept is that they're MEQs with +1 toughness and faster movement, which is exactly what bikes have. Is your game really going to be ruined because you have T5 from the bike unit type instead of a special snowflake unit rule?

Hey, let's just have one book and give every army the same units with different models whilst we're at it. Make it colourful chess with a shooting phase.

Congratulations on missing the point. Marine armies are already almost identical, and the few differences are mostly excuses for GW to justify selling an entire $50 rulebook instead of meaningful strategic differences. And this is especially true if you want to do something about the general rules bloat issue in 40k, where there are a million special rules and exceptions to the special rules and exceptions to the exceptions. An un-bloated version of 40k would simplify things to the point where the subtle differences between marine codices aren't really important enough to deserve their own rules, but you'd still have huge differences between orks and tau.

Hey, let's eliminate DKoK. They're basically Imperial Guard. And honestly, throw DE and Eldar into the same book. They're both elves, so it's fiiiine. Then put CSM, Necrons, and Tau into Codex: Emperor-less Heretics. Remember, trimming the rules = better game.

Did you know that Strawmen are made of straw?

I would consolidate the armies and game considerably, cutting the specialist sm armies and consolidating them to one codex, with 1-3 characters per chapter, their special units could be upgrades and grey knights could be an elites choice. The rest of the imperial stuff could be rolled into the other stuff book, sisters, ig, =][=, and maybe mechanicus for good measure. I would cut knights completely, and put an emphasis on smaller games, 1000 to 1500 points, as that is where the game seems to be at its best rules wise for me. The tau would go, and I would keep the orks, tyranids, and eldar, with minor tweaks but I would consolidate the eldar and dark eldar all together. I would consolidate demons and csm to one book and add legion rules. Cypher and assasins would still be separate but would have ti be taken in conjunction with the right circumstances (i.e. no cypher and dark angels)

The resulting list would look like:
Codex: Space Marines
Codex: forces of the imperium of man
Codex: eldar
Codex: orks
Codex: tyranids
Each army would be consolidated or have units added to bring it in line with the other books in terms of choices. Then the books might finally be worth 50 usd.

I wouldn't remove or add anything. The game's factions are fine the way they are. Also, think of all the QQ if factions were suddenly removed or multiple merged into a single codex. I can still remember the five Black Templar players I know QQing when the BT were added to C:SM.