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 BlackTalos wrote:

Zimko wrote:
The 'Arriving by Deep Strike' section doesn't care how you rolled for 'them' (the Combined Unit). The rules for Combined Unit allow you to roll for a single part of that unit (via and/or) in order to determine if the Combined Unit can arrive. The Purifiers are part of a Combined Unit (Drop Pod and Purifiers) which are both together in Deep Strike Reserves. RoT allows for a Grey Knight unit to roll for arriving on Turn 1 if they are in Deep Strike Reserve. The Purifiers have permission to roll, and the Combined Unit rule gives them permission to roll on behalf of the entire Combined Unit.

And when you follow the rules for Deep Strike, it demands you deploy the Unit you rolled for (which, as you've just said: "roll for a single part of that unit (via and/or) in order to determine if the Combined Unit can arrive)
Did you roll for the Purifiers, or did you roll for the Combined Unit? Simple question.

I rolled for the Combined Unit. The Purifiers rolled on behalf of the Combined Unit as per the Combined Unit rule. So the answer to your loaded question is 'both'.

 BlackTalos wrote:
The rule on page 135 tells you that "they will arrive together". It does not bypass the "you deploy what you roll for" as clearly explained above. If you roll for the Purifiers, then you deploy the Purifiers. But as you have clearly said yourself "you deploy the transport first and then follow the rules for deep striking in a drop pod".

When you roll for a combined unit they all arrive from reserves at the same time and are then available to be deployed. Since they arrive in a drop pod as their transport, the rules for deploying drop pods then supersede the normal Deep Strike rule. But through it all, one fact that never changes is that you are still deploying the purifiers by deep strike. Thanks to their transport circumstances they follow a different set of rules for deployment, but they're still being deployed. There is no implied "only" as you keep insisting. The rule you are citing is satisfied.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Except that is overridden by the Drop Pod's rules as a deep-striking transport. Unless you think the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike, which they explicitly are by the last sentence just after the bullet point list you started to quote.

Sigh, the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike. Proven many times, i will not do it again.

Then what do you make of this sentence:

BRB wrote:In the movement phase, Deep Striking units may not move any further, other than to Disembark from a Deep Striking transport vehicle.

The units move as normally...they just can't assault because they are coming out of reserves.

And btw, the passengers absolutely are arriving by Deep Strike. Any unit that arrives from Deep Strike Reserves is considered to have arrived by Deep Strike and vice versa. This rule has been covered several times in this thread

 Xenomancers wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
What is obvious is that the drop pod must be deployed first. So "deploy them" must refer to the drop pod in this case - which is not eligible to arrive turn one outside of drop pod assault.

Sure, if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

Which, of course, you shouldn't. But your argument absolutely does.

What am I ignoring? The combined reserve rule does not grant permission to extend special rules to a unit that does not have them. Which is exactly where the flaw in your argument lies.

I'm not extending any special rules. I don't need to.

I'm rolling for the Combined unit of Purifiers plus Drop Pod. The Purifiers allow me to roll for their arrival on turn one. Because it's a combined unit, they must (not optional) arrive together.
Cite the denial for the Purifier's ability that your argument requires.

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Except that is overridden by the Drop Pod's rules as a deep-striking transport. Unless you think the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike, which they explicitly are by the last sentence just after the bullet point list you started to quote.

Sigh, the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike. Proven many times, i will not do it again.

Then what do you make of this sentence:

BRB wrote:In the movement phase, Deep Striking units may not move any further, other than to Disembark from a Deep Striking transport vehicle.

The units move as normally...they just can't assault because they are coming out of reserves.

Right, but the sentence calls a unit disembarking from a Deep Striking transport a Deep Striking unit.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Except that is overridden by the Drop Pod's rules as a deep-striking transport. Unless you think the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike, which they explicitly are by the last sentence just after the bullet point list you started to quote.

Sigh, the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike. Proven many times, i will not do it again.

Then what do you make of this sentence:

BRB wrote:In the movement phase, Deep Striking units may not move any further, other than to Disembark from a Deep Striking transport vehicle.

 BlackTalos wrote:
The Unit (T+Passengers) is Deep Striking, but only the Transport is arriving "by Deep Strike", while the Passengers are arriving "by disembarking", but the entire (combined) Unit is Deep Striking, which leads to:
"In that turn’s Assault phase, however, these units cannot charge. This also applies to units that have disembarked from Transports that arrived by Deep Strike that turn."

by Deep Strike =/= Deep Striking?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Talys wrote:
Does this not mean the embarked unit is arriving by Deep Strike?

I think i get col_impact's point, which would be the exact opposite of the above:

The embarked Unit is never arriving by Deep Strike, but it is still a "Deep Striking" Unit.

Here's the thread that will explain it to you:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/150/627370.page#7440651


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Zimko wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

Zimko wrote:
The 'Arriving by Deep Strike' section doesn't care how you rolled for 'them' (the Combined Unit). The rules for Combined Unit allow you to roll for a single part of that unit (via and/or) in order to determine if the Combined Unit can arrive. The Purifiers are part of a Combined Unit (Drop Pod and Purifiers) which are both together in Deep Strike Reserves. RoT allows for a Grey Knight unit to roll for arriving on Turn 1 if they are in Deep Strike Reserve. The Purifiers have permission to roll, and the Combined Unit rule gives them permission to roll on behalf of the entire Combined Unit.

And when you follow the rules for Deep Strike, it demands you deploy the Unit you rolled for (which, as you've just said: "roll for a single part of that unit (via and/or) in order to determine if the Combined Unit can arrive)
Did you roll for the Purifiers, or did you roll for the Combined Unit? Simple question.

I rolled for the Combined Unit. The Purifiers rolled on behalf of the Combined Unit as per the Combined Unit rule. So the answer to your loaded question is 'both'.

It can't be "both", because the Combined Unit is And/Or. Not And + Or.

when making a Reserve Roll (see below) for a combined unit, roll a single dice for the unit and/or its Independent Character/Transport vehicle.

So who are you rolling for? "the unit or itsTransport vehicle"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

confoo22 wrote:
And btw, the passengers absolutely are arriving by Deep Strike. Any unit that arrives from Deep Strike Reserves is considered to have arrived by Deep Strike and vice versa. This rule has been covered several times in this thread

And that is incorrect, see above.

BlackTalos/quote wrote:It can't be "both", because the Combined Unit is And/Or. Not And + Or.

when making a Reserve Roll (see below) for a combined unit, roll a single dice for the unit and/or its Independent Character/Transport vehicle.

What happens to the Combined Unit when you pass the Roll for the Purifiers?

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Except that is overridden by the Drop Pod's rules as a deep-striking transport. Unless you think the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike, which they explicitly are by the last sentence just after the bullet point list you started to quote.

Sigh, the passengers aren't arriving by Deep Strike. Proven many times, i will not do it again.

Then what do you make of this sentence:

BRB wrote:In the movement phase, Deep Striking units may not move any further, other than to Disembark from a Deep Striking transport vehicle.

The units move as normally...they just can't assault because they are coming out of reserves.

Right, but the sentence calls a unit disembarking from a Deep Striking transport a Deep Striking unit.

Correct! but it is not arriving by Deep Strike.

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
What is obvious is that the drop pod must be deployed first. So "deploy them" must refer to the drop pod in this case - which is not eligible to arrive turn one outside of drop pod assault.

Sure, if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

Which, of course, you shouldn't. But your argument absolutely does.

What am I ignoring? The combined reserve rule does not grant permission to extend special rules to a unit that does not have them. Which is exactly where the flaw in your argument lies.

I'm not extending any special rules. I don't need to.

I'm rolling for the Combined unit of Purifiers plus Drop Pod. The Purifiers allow me to roll for their arrival on turn one. Because it's a combined unit, they must (not optional) arrive together.
Cite the denial for the Purifier's ability that your argument requires.

Its not a denial, its a case of following all rules.

The drop pod can only roll turn 2
The purifiers can only roll turn 1.

WHere it the permission to only consider the roll for one component of the unit?

In order to comply with all rules - that the unit arrive together, the pod can only roll to arrive turn 2 and purifiers turn 1- you must roll turn 2

Secondly if you do roll for the purifiers, you must deploy "them" - the purifiers. Please xplain how you are deploying them va the DS rules, when to do so you must place a model from the unit - the purifiers - first, and how this squares with the requirement to disembark from the pod.

I missed how you are reconciling these. I'm not at all convinced that using the combined unit rule to roll "for" one unit, then deploying the other, is allowed.

 BlackTalos wrote:
Did you roll for the Purifiers, or did you roll for the Combined Unit? Simple question.

And the simple answer is yes, you rolled for the Purifiers and the Combined Unit.

The distinction you are trying to make does not exist. As long as the Purifiers are embarked on the Drop Pod, the Purifirrs are both their own unit and part of the Combined Unit.

SJ

 BlackTalos wrote:

It can't be "both", because the Combined Unit is And/Or. Not And + Or.

when making a Reserve Roll (see below) for a combined unit, roll a single dice for the unit and/or its Independent Character/Transport vehicle.

So who are you rolling for? "the unit or itsTransport vehicle"?

It's still both. I'm rolling for the combined unit by rolling for the Purifier unit. I've underlined the rule where it states this. You make a roll for A by rolling for B. So yes I'm rolling for both A and B.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
What is obvious is that the drop pod must be deployed first. So "deploy them" must refer to the drop pod in this case - which is not eligible to arrive turn one outside of drop pod assault.

Sure, if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

Which, of course, you shouldn't. But your argument absolutely does.

What am I ignoring? The combined reserve rule does not grant permission to extend special rules to a unit that does not have them. Which is exactly where the flaw in your argument lies.

I'm not extending any special rules. I don't need to.

I'm rolling for the Combined unit of Purifiers plus Drop Pod. The Purifiers allow me to roll for their arrival on turn one. Because it's a combined unit, they must (not optional) arrive together.
Cite the denial for the Purifier's ability that your argument requires.

Its not a denial, its a case of following all rules.

The drop pod can only roll turn 2
The purifiers can only roll turn 1.

The underlined is not actually a rule.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

BlackTalos/quote wrote:It can't be "both", because the Combined Unit is And/Or. Not And + Or.

when making a Reserve Roll (see below) for a combined unit, roll a single dice for the unit and/or its Independent Character/Transport vehicle.

What happens to the Combined Unit when you pass the Roll for the Purifiers?

They follow the Rules for Deep Strike: The Unit that rolled "deploy them as follows:" And you passed the roll for the Purifiers, so they deploy:
• First, place one model from the unit anywhere on the table, in the position where you would like it to arrive,

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Right, but the sentence calls a unit disembarking from a Deep Striking transport a Deep Striking unit.

 BlackTalos wrote:
Correct! but it is not arriving by Deep Strike.

It absolutely is. Look under the Deep Strike special rule, there's a sentence that says "When a unit arrives by Deep Strike (sometimes referred to as Deep Strike Reserves)..." (I'm paraphrasing slightly since I don't have the rulebook in hand so that could be reversed). That sentence tells us that anything arriving from Deep Strike reserves is considered to be arriving by Deep Strike, or Deep Striking if you want to make it a verb. So yes, everything that arrives in the combined unit is Deep Striking.

 jeffersonian000 wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:
Did you roll for the Purifiers, or did you roll for the Combined Unit? Simple question.

And the simple answer is yes, you rolled for the Purifiers and the Combined Unit.

The distinction you are trying to make does not exist. As long as the Purifiers are embarked on the Drop Pod, the Purifirrs are both their own unit and part of the Combined Unit.

SJ

Yes they are, but the Rules for Deep Strike ask that you deploy the Unit you rolled for:

"Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves and then deploy them as follows:"

 BlackTalos wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

BlackTalos/quote wrote:It can't be "both", because the Combined Unit is And/Or. Not And + Or.

when making a Reserve Roll (see below) for a combined unit, roll a single dice for the unit and/or its Independent Character/Transport vehicle.

What happens to the Combined Unit when you pass the Roll for the Purifiers?

They follow the Rules for Deep Strike: The Unit that rolled "deploy them as follows:" And you passed the roll for the Purifiers, so they deploy:
• First, place one model from the unit anywhere on the table, in the position where you would like it to arrive,

So you're suggesting I can deploy the Purifiers thru Deep Strike because I rolled for them in the Combined Unit instead of the Drop Pod? Great so I'll Deep Strike my Purifiers in a totally different location from the Drop Pod next time.

rigeld2 wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
What is obvious is that the drop pod must be deployed first. So "deploy them" must refer to the drop pod in this case - which is not eligible to arrive turn one outside of drop pod assault.

Sure, if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

Which, of course, you shouldn't. But your argument absolutely does.

What am I ignoring? The combined reserve rule does not grant permission to extend special rules to a unit that does not have them. Which is exactly where the flaw in your argument lies.

I'm not extending any special rules. I don't need to.

I'm rolling for the Combined unit of Purifiers plus Drop Pod. The Purifiers allow me to roll for their arrival on turn one. Because it's a combined unit, they must (not optional) arrive together.
Cite the denial for the Purifier's ability that your argument requires.

Its not a denial, its a case of following all rules.

The drop pod can only roll turn 2
The purifiers can only roll turn 1.

The underlined is not actually a rule.

Should state turn 2+. only drop pod assualt allows turn 1 arrival and at this point in the reserves phase those have already been taken into account. In any case - has no effect on the argument - the point is the drop pod is not eligible to arrive turn 1...

confoo22 wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Right, but the sentence calls a unit disembarking from a Deep Striking transport a Deep Striking unit.

Correct! but it is not arriving by Deep Strike.

It absolutely is. Look under the Deep Strike special rule, there's a sentence that says "When a unit arrives by Deep Strike (sometimes referred to as Deep Strike Reserves)..." (I'm paraphrasing slightly since I don't have the rulebook in hand so that could be reversed). That sentence tells us that anything arriving from Deep Strike reserves is considered to be arriving by Deep Strike, or Deep Striking if you want to make it a verb. So yes, everything that arrives in the combined unit is Deep Striking.

The rules are quoted in the link i posted.
I'll copy a post if you don't want to read:

 BlackTalos wrote:

col_impact wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

col_impact wrote:
Yes, a unit embarked upon a Deep Striking Transport can be a "Deep Striking unit",

No, it cannot, because it never follows the Rules for Deep Striking.

col_impact wrote:
because the term "Deep Striking unit" can refer to a unit that arrives from Deep Strike reserves.

It can do, but it doesn't have to.

You are getting confused. Calling something "Deep Striking unit" does not necessarily mean that that unit Deep Strikes itself. It can also refer to a unit that arrives from Deep Strike reserves.

Otherwise you can't make sense of this rule!

Spoiler:

In the Movement phase during which they arrive, Deep Striking units may not move any
further, other than to disembark from a Deep Striking Transport vehicle if they are in one.

Problem is, you cannot make that separation. There are 3 terms here it seems:
1) A unit that Deep Strikes.
2) "Deep Striking" Units
3) A Unit in Deep Strike Reserves.

You say 1) =/= 2) and that 2) = 3)?
I will prove 1) = 2), and can assure you that 2) =/= 3):

"Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves and then deploy them as follows:
• First, place one model from the unit anywhere on the table"

Can you "place one model" from the occupants of the Transport? I mean, the occupants ARE "Deep Striking units" right? The are forced by RaW to follow the above.

Q.E.D.: Embarked Units cannot be a Unit that Deep Strike, and as such, cannot be a "Deep Striking unit".

 Xenomancers wrote:
Should state turn 2+. only drop pod assualt allows turn 1 arrival and at this point in the reserves phase those have already been taken into account. In any case - has no effect on the argument - the point is the drop pod is not eligible to arrive turn 1...

Your statement is correct if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

It's like you haven't read that rule at all or something.

 BlackTalos wrote:
[Yes they are, but the Rules for Deep Strike ask that you deploy the Unit you rolled for:

"Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves and then deploy them as follows:"

And in this case the rules for Reserves will refer you to combined units which will tell you that any combined unit must arrive all at once and then will be deployed via deep strike using the modified drop pod rules.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BlackTalos wrote:

confoo22 wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Right, but the sentence calls a unit disembarking from a Deep Striking transport a Deep Striking unit.

Correct! but it is not arriving by Deep Strike.

It absolutely is. Look under the Deep Strike special rule, there's a sentence that says "When a unit arrives by Deep Strike (sometimes referred to as Deep Strike Reserves)..." (I'm paraphrasing slightly since I don't have the rulebook in hand so that could be reversed). That sentence tells us that anything arriving from Deep Strike reserves is considered to be arriving by Deep Strike, or Deep Striking if you want to make it a verb. So yes, everything that arrives in the combined unit is Deep Striking.

The rules are quoted in the link i posted.
I'll copy a post if you don't want to read:

 BlackTalos wrote:

col_impact wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

col_impact wrote:
Yes, a unit embarked upon a Deep Striking Transport can be a "Deep Striking unit",

No, it cannot, because it never follows the Rules for Deep Striking.

col_impact wrote:
because the term "Deep Striking unit" can refer to a unit that arrives from Deep Strike reserves.

It can do, but it doesn't have to.

You are getting confused. Calling something "Deep Striking unit" does not necessarily mean that that unit Deep Strikes itself. It can also refer to a unit that arrives from Deep Strike reserves.

Otherwise you can't make sense of this rule!

Spoiler:

In the Movement phase during which they arrive, Deep Striking units may not move any
further, other than to disembark from a Deep Striking Transport vehicle if they are in one.

Problem is, you cannot make that separation. There are 3 terms here it seems:
1) A unit that Deep Strikes.
2) "Deep Striking" Units
3) A Unit in Deep Strike Reserves.

You say 1) =/= 2) and that 2) = 3)?
I will prove 1) = 2), and can assure you that 2) =/= 3):

"Roll for the arrival of all Deep Striking units as specified in the rules for Reserves and then deploy them as follows:
• First, place one model from the unit anywhere on the table"

Can you "place one model" from the occupants of the Transport? I mean, the occupants ARE "Deep Striking units" right? The are forced by RaW to follow the above.

Q.E.D.: Embarked Units cannot be a Unit that Deep Strike, and as such, cannot be a "Deep Striking unit".

You don't actually quote the rule I reference here. If you can spell it out and show where my statement is incorrect please do.

rigeld2 wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
What is obvious is that the drop pod must be deployed first. So "deploy them" must refer to the drop pod in this case - which is not eligible to arrive turn one outside of drop pod assault.

Sure, if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

Which, of course, you shouldn't. But your argument absolutely does.

What am I ignoring? The combined reserve rule does not grant permission to extend special rules to a unit that does not have them. Which is exactly where the flaw in your argument lies.

I'm not extending any special rules. I don't need to.

I'm rolling for the Combined unit of Purifiers plus Drop Pod. The Purifiers allow me to roll for their arrival on turn one. Because it's a combined unit, they must (not optional) arrive together.
Cite the denial for the Purifier's ability that your argument requires.

Its not a denial, its a case of following all rules.

The drop pod can only roll turn 2
The purifiers can only roll turn 1.

The underlined is not actually a rule.

No, its why it isnt a quote. It is, however, a clear paraphrase of the pertinent bit to this disucssion

To be more precise: the pod only has permission to roll frmo turn 2 onwards
The purifiers have permission to roll from turn 1 onwards

Now, any chance you can answer the questions I asked? Without the pointless nitpicking, that literally adds nothing to the understanding in this thread?

WHen you roll for the purifiers to arrive, how are you then placing "them" (a reference to a rule, indicated by quotes) by folwing the DS deployment rules? You MUST place a purifier model on the table, scatter, and place the rest of the unit. You must also, simultaneously, comply with the DPA rule that the unit disembark frmo the pod.

Given it is impossible to fulfil both rules when rolling "for" the purifiers, you must roll for their Transport Vehicle instead

Which can only roll on turn 2

So, if you disagree, which from your tone throughout you do, please, show how this train of rules is derailed.

It doesn't actually matter whether or not the Purifiers are Deep Striking when they arrive so I dropped that argument.

What triggers RoT is that they are in Deep Strike Reserve.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
It doesn't actually matter whether or not the Purifiers are Deep Striking when they arrive so I dropped that argument.

What triggers RoT is that they are in Deep Strike Reserve.

It does sort of matter for the run and shoot part of NSF, but you are correct that it doesn't matter in the context of whether or not the purifiers can roll on turn one.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
No, its why it isnt a quote. It is, however, a clear paraphrase of the pertinent bit to this disucssion

To be more precise: the pod only has permission to roll frmo turn 2 onwards

This is incorrect. Please, be exactly precise.

Pods that aren't part of DPA have permission to roll "as normal". Turn 2 is never mentioned. At all. You're making this up and confusing the issue by doing so.
What's "as normal" when a unit is allowed to roll on turn one?

rigeld2 wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
No, its why it isnt a quote. It is, however, a clear paraphrase of the pertinent bit to this disucssion

To be more precise: the pod only has permission to roll frmo turn 2 onwards

This is incorrect. Please, be exactly precise.

Pods that aren't part of DPA have permission to roll "as normal". Turn 2 is never mentioned. At all. You're making this up and confusing the issue by doing so.
What's "as normal" when a unit is allowed to roll on turn one?

The DP unit isnt allowed to roll turn one, unless it is part of the half, rounded up. It never can roll under the RoT rule, you have to select the purifiers to do that. I've then explained the problems that causes, however you fail to address that part. Maybe address everything this time?

Is this pod part of the half, rounded up? No
What turn is "normal" for it? 2

Again, be precise yourself.

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
Should state turn 2+. only drop pod assualt allows turn 1 arrival and at this point in the reserves phase those have already been taken into account. In any case - has no effect on the argument - the point is the drop pod is not eligible to arrive turn 1...

Your statement is correct if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

It's like you haven't read that rule at all or something.

The combined units reserve roll rule assumes that the roll you are making is a legal roll. It is not a legal roll if all of the units within the combined unit are eligible to make the roll. That is my interpretation.

 Xenomancers wrote:
It is not a legal roll if all of the units within the combined unit are eligible to make the roll.

Explain how it's not a legal roll and back up with cited rules, please. Others have demonstrated how it is legal, but nobody has found a hard rule that says it's not.

 Xenomancers wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
Should state turn 2+. only drop pod assualt allows turn 1 arrival and at this point in the reserves phase those have already been taken into account. In any case - has no effect on the argument - the point is the drop pod is not eligible to arrive turn 1...

Your statement is correct if you ignore the Combined Reserve Units rule.

It's like you haven't read that rule at all or something.

The combined units reserve roll rule assumes that the roll you are making is a legal roll. It is not a legal roll if all of the units within the combined unit are eligible to make the roll. That is my interpretation.

Out flanking units can never bring ICs then.

confoo22 wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
It is not a legal roll if all of the units within the combined unit are eligible to make the roll.

Explain how it's not a legal roll and back up with cited rules, please. Others have demonstrated how it is legal, but nobody has found a hard rule that says it's not.

Except that it is stll being discussed. Rolling for the purifiers alone causes at least 2 issues, either of which breaks a rule and thus is not a legal roll unless your rule explciitly allows you to break said rule.