Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Doomsday Ark isn't Lance. It is Primary Weapon, though, which is nice.

Obelisk? I just now realized that super heavy vehicles had their own chart for tank shocking and ramming. So not only does an obelisk have tesla spheres and gravity pulse, but it can also potentially destroy units by simply tank shocking. lol

Ferros wrote:
What are our new heavy hitters? The new codex seems to have enhanced our durability significantly, so trying to figure out where our heavy hitters are at.

There are:
C'tan
Nightbringer's Gaze
Doomsday Ark
Mono
Tesseract Ark
Night Shroud
Pylon

Basically what are our models that can do the most damage in low numbers? I think it'd be incredibly useful if everytime my opponent pivots a unit that can actually tarpit my wraiths, I "soften them up" so instead of being tied up the rest of the game, they can mop up and go on to the next bunch just as quickly.

Still Sylos, as with the old codex, as they remain incredibly broken and can spam out S10 hits.

 Sigvatr wrote:

Ferros wrote:
What are our new heavy hitters? The new codex seems to have enhanced our durability significantly, so trying to figure out where our heavy hitters are at.

There are:
C'tan
Nightbringer's Gaze
Doomsday Ark
Mono
Tesseract Ark
Night Shroud
Pylon

Basically what are our models that can do the most damage in low numbers? I think it'd be incredibly useful if everytime my opponent pivots a unit that can actually tarpit my wraiths, I "soften them up" so instead of being tied up the rest of the game, they can mop up and go on to the next bunch just as quickly.

Still Sylos, as with the old codex, as they remain incredibly broken and can spam out S10 hits.

I assume that's supposed to be Sentry Pylons?

Honestly I would love to grab a couple Pylons to work them out and own the air targets in the game. Like seriously own. Plus skimmers. I would love if they got the same "can choose to use skyfire" rule as FMC and flyers have. That would make them top tier anti air and I would GLADLY field three of them. Here's to hoping for an update to that book sooner rather than later

Yeah IA12 is pretty broken, hope they fix it soon.

Comes out to 1855 total. Over 100 Necron wounds spread across 22+ units. I was just throwing it together as a template...but that actually looks...reasonably competitive? It doesn't have super serious fire power, but enough to keep pace, I think.

It would be a damn nightmare to bring down, that's for sure.

I'm not even sure if you can take a Reclamation as a detachment though? I mean, lets say a Tournament allows Primary + 1 detachment. not sure how that would work.

You can take a Reclamation legion as a formation but it is completely pointless. Taking a Decurion only requires one auxiliary so all you need is to add 1 squad of flayed ones and everyone gets +1 RP and improved living metal.

To get the maximum potential out of your list you need to move the Reclamation legion into a Decurion and take all three units of FO as auxiliary formations in the Decurion (so they all get +1RP too). Then take whatever you want in your CAD.

I think Wraithbomb lists will be pretty boss and I think mass Tomb Blades and Flayed Ones w/ Destroyer Lords w/ Come out on top.

Obyron
Orikan

Troops
Immortals w/ Nightscythe
Immortals w/ Nightscythe

Fast Attack
5 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils
5 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils


Formation
Destroyer Cult
Destroyer Lord w/ Phase Shifter, Veil of Darkness, Warscythe
3 Destroyers w/ H. Destroyer
3 Destroyers w/ H. Destyoer
3 Destroyers w/ H. Destroyer
3 H. Destroyers

1820 , have no idea what you'd spend the rest on..

I mean sure, if you want a squad of Hero Immortals running around charging into combat, he makes them good at that. But I can't really think of any time where I would want that over any other Character's ability or even a customizable Overlord. Except maybe in like, Zone Mortalis or Kill Team, but usually they disallow Named Characters.

A resilient Ob Sec unit that can shoot and charge pretty good? It's really not a bad tool to have, honestly. Plus, you want Anraykr in the thick of it anyway, so pairing him with a sturdy unit that can roll with him kind of works.

I did the An + Iluminor Immortal trick in 5th and it worked pretty well, I think.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
@Hollismason

If you were putting Orikan and Oby with one group, I would make it 6 and the other 4, personally.

I agree it's a pretty nifty design, though. Orikan + Wraiths is pretty nasty.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Requizen wrote:
Monolith still kinda sucks, Tesseract Ark only got nerfed with this edition (read the wording on Quantum Shielding), and the Pylon is still a superheavy AA gun that can't hit ground targets.

The one area I'm finding potentially for a Mono is in a Destroyer heavy army if you know your are going into a tournament that is completely bereft of terrain. The Pie Plate actually compliments Heavy Ds reasonably well, and more importantly the mobile LOS it provides could be positively clutch. Heavy Ds jumping back and forth behind a Mono could be pretty deadly. Lets say it was the decision between 6 Heavy D's with a Mono or 10 Heavy Ds. With reasonable terrain, I would take the 10 Heavy Ds, but with shoddy terrain, I would seriously consider slotting in the Mono.

And, of course, it's late game capping abilities can be kind of clutch as well. It's probably one of the Mono's best features and is one, along with it's mobile LOS protection, that gets talked about the least.

It's the only way I see to get Orikan into a group of Wraiths and also negate his whole move 6".

Plus , reroll 1s on a 3++ is pretty amazing.

Hollismason wrote:
I think Wraithbomb lists will be pretty boss and I think mass Tomb Blades and Flayed Ones w/ Destroyer Lords w/ Come out on top.

Obyron
Orikan

Troops
Immortals w/ Nightscythe
Immortals w/ Nightscythe

Fast Attack
5 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils
5 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils


Formation
Destroyer Cult
Destroyer Lord w/ Phase Shifter, Veil of Darkness, Warscythe
3 Destroyers w/ H. Destroyer
3 Destroyers w/ H. Destyoer
3 Destroyers w/ H. Destroyer
3 H. Destroyers

1820 , have no idea what you'd spend the rest on..

I would run a Obyron list more like this with a toolbox of bombs (wraiths or flayed ones), heavy threats (nightbringer, bargeLord) and all Decurion

NewCrons (1850pts)
Decurion Detachment

Core
Reclamation Legion
Catacomb Command Barge Gauss Cannon, Gauntlet of Fire, Phase Shifter, Warscythe (Warlord)

5x Immortal Gauss Blaster

4 x Tomb Blades, Nebuloscope, Shield Vanes, Twin-linked Gauss Blasters

Ghost Ark, 10x Necron Warrior

10x Necron Warrior

Command
Royal Court
Nemesor Zahndrekh, Orikan the Diviner, Vargard Obyron

Auxiliary
Canoptek Harvest
3x Canoptek Scarab
1 x Canoptek Spyder
6 x Canoptek Wraith Whip Coils

10x Flayed Ones

Star-God
C'tan Shard of the Nightbringer

You can make tactical decisions based on opponent of whether Obyron and Orikan and/or Nemesor go with wraiths or flayed ones or hang back with troops. Too many fronts for the opponent to handle. When you have a lot of other threats it gives the bargeLord an opportunity to shine.
You can easily squeeze a Nightmare Shroud on the bargeLord if you like (-1 TB, -1 FO)

The only problem with that is that it doesn't gain the benefit of having the Conclave of the Burning one in it. Nightbringer is way to slow.

Also now that we see what Obyron is capable of...

Obyron
20 Flayed Ones

Kind of the perfect match there.

Hollismason wrote:
The only problem with that is that it doesn't gain the benefit of having the Conclave of the Burning one in it.

I don't like how much the Conclave costs. It sinks too many points into 1 front. I want around 250 points in each front. Adding the conclave boosts resiliency and mobility but it doesn't add damage output.

Obyron w/ 20 Flayed Ones is pretty good as he makes up for the whole no Anti - Av and he's dirt cheap at 120 points.

The Conclave is totally worth that 410 points your going to spend on it with Nightbringer. It's a crapload of shooting, a amazing ability, board control. Also his ability seems to work in CC as well.

Was just thinking about Trazyn, if they had just given him the Warlord Trait Honorable combatant instead he would be a bit better.

But, as is, I just don't see him. If you know HQicide is going to be heavy on a tournaments agenda, then, maybe. You could make him damn near unkillable in the right list. Other then that, bleh. He really should have kept MSS. It's not like it would have made him broken by any stretch, and it still fit what he did, anti horde.

Oh well. Oh, and Ob Sec. They should have given him Ob Sec in place of the old scoring ability. That, alone, would have made him at least considerable in an LG or Wraith bomb. Just didn't work out.

Hollismason wrote:
Obyron w/ 20 Flayed Ones is pretty good as he makes up for the whole no Anti - Av and he's dirt cheap at 120 points.

The Conclave is totally worth that 410 points your going to spend on it with Nightbringer. It's a crapload of shooting, a amazing ability, board control. Also his ability seems to work in CC as well.

I dunno. 410 points of Flayed Ones is better than a conclave.

The Conclave is totally worth that 410 points your going to spend on it with Nightbringer. It's a crapload of shooting, a amazing ability, board control. Also his ability seems to work in CC as well.

I'm kind of leaning towards that too, to be honest. I'd really have to play it to see, but it's really not a bad unit, I don't think. You know, I was just thinking, what about pairing him up with the Doom Scythe formation? Heavy investment, to be sure, but could be cute. Of course the alternative is pairing him with the Deceiver, but with only one Conclave up our sleeve delivering the Deceiver becomes problematic. It's really too bad they can't pop out of the Mono anymore.

ShadarLogoth wrote:

The Conclave is totally worth that 410 points your going to spend on it with Nightbringer. It's a crapload of shooting, a amazing ability, board control. Also his ability seems to work in CC as well.

I'm kind of leaning towards that too, to be honest. I'd really have to play it to see, but it's really not a bad unit, I don't think. You know, I was just thinking, what about pairing him up with the Doom Scythe formation? Heavy investment, to be sure, but could be cute. Of course the alternative is pairing him with the Deceiver, but with only one Conclave up our sleeve delivering the Deceiver becomes problematic. It's really too bad they can't pop out of the Mono anymore.

The problem is when you put that many points into a unit and make it uber resilient, the opponent just ignores it and focuses on the threats it can dispatch. And for that many points wouldn't an IK be a better deal? The IK manages to move 12'' and pound with a D weapon in CC. Or alternatively a riptide and some obsec kroot troops as allies?

I dunno. 410 points of Flayed Ones is better than a conclave.

31 Flayed Ones is very legit, for sure. Or, maybe, 20 Flayed Ones and some HQ love.

However, Flayed Ones have two very specific classes they are very bad at in CC, Walkers and T8. So....the argument for Flayed Ones + Conclave definitely could be made. They are a pretty solid combo.

It's 410 yeah that's a point sink but not as much as you'd think with those abilities. Plus board controls a good thing.

It think we'll see more of it, gonna try it out again previously I didn't buff it with the Staff so I'll do that next time pls didn't really take full advantage of the shooting abilities.

Using Flayed ones as infiltrators w/ the C'tan formation is a really good suggestion.

The problem is when you put that many points into a unit and make it uber resilient, the opponent just ignores it and focuses on the threats it can dispatch.

Of course. That's why you give it DS and make them deal with it, or eat it's firepower every turn. The Conclave will consistently mulch Infantry squads down if you ignore it.

I mean, I guess if you have the mobility to just completely abandon the side of the board he's on, you can ignore him. An 18" bubble around the C'Tan casts a pretty big shadow, though, and he can still tickle you with his Rando with a 30" bubble.

But the key is definitely pairing him with the right tools to provide ample amounts of board control. Flayed Ones I think are on top of that list.

Yeah I could see Conclave , Obyron w/ Wraiths, D- Lord w/ Flayed Ones working. Two units that get delivered on turn 1 and 1 on Turn 2 that deep strikes. Okay that works. Not that expensive either which leaves points left over. D- Lord needs a Scythe and Phase Shifter, maybe Nightmare Shroud to tank wounds for the Flayed ones, Obyron has the ability to teleport the Wraiths.

Oh man, Conclave close combat nightmare ::

Decurion
Zandy for the overlord plus the normal MSU.

Triarch Formation

Conclave (Solar Staff / Veil )

Group of 20 Flayed Ones (will Infiltrate and snake back to Zandy to join first round)

4 Groups of 5 Flayed Ones to DS or Outfank with.

1890, so have a little room to play with there.

That's a serious ass CC force though. Hordes, Knights, MCs, vehicles, you pretty much got all the bases covered there. And even your troops are relentless, so at least in terms of Wave Serpents and the like, they add to your area deniablility quotient.

I'd play that list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Came up with this for an Anraykr list ::


Another list falling in around 1950. One way or another you end up with a pretty nasty squad of Immortals around Anraykr.

In just a normal list 2 units of 15 Flayed Ones, 2 Units of Wraiths , 1 Conclave seems like it'd hit like a brick and be really annoying to play against 2 big units of dangerous infiltrators and a unit thats going to deep strike then when you try and get away the Wraiths just go after you.

Yep pretty much. You could easily swap the TPs for Wraiths in the Decurion I threw together, I just felt the TPs would be a better fit for anti Knight (VB/PC). Wraiths are okay at the task, but VB/PC are bit better, particularly in that formation.

IMO the best "brick" to start with in a list contains the below;

Destroyer Cult;

1 x Destroyer Lord w/ 2+ armour save and a Warscythe

2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer

3 x Heavy Destroyers

Combined Arms Detachment;

5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe

Should be enough AA there to at least break even if not win the air battle, you also have the late game contest ability still. Destroyers arriving from reserve to contest / grab objectives and annoy the crap out of the enemy.

Any ideas on what else the list needs?

bodazoka wrote:
IMO the best "brick" to start with in a list contains the below;

Destroyer Cult;

1 x Destroyer Lord w/ 2+ armour save and a Warscythe

2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer

3 x Heavy Destroyers

Combined Arms Detachment;

5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe

Should be enough AA there to at least break even if not win the air battle, you also have the late game contest ability still. Destroyers arriving from reserve to contest / grab objectives and annoy the crap out of the enemy.

Any ideas on what else the list needs?

Meh, if you're gonna do flyer spam, take a Deathbringer flight and eradicate FMCs and heavy vehicles.

Necrons don't need to contest objectives with five guys, exterminating the offending unit and dropping a fast unit onto their objective to steal it works fine.

Requizen wrote:

I assume that's supposed to be Sentry Pylons?

Aye, Sylons = Sentry Pylons. Focused Death Ray, of course.

Night Scythes are good but you could also just spend the points on 3 Tomb Blades w/ Nebuloscopes and a Quad Gun, BS 4 Twin linked ignores jink. That's pretty good and cheap, pay for a upgrade of Particle Beamers or use them to grab late game objectives.

If flyers get close to a Tomb Blade unit with Gauss they can strip hull points if it's a large unit. Especially if they get Rear Armour Shots on them and they won't get their jink save against them at all.

Like others have said , basically have to almost ignore Flyers or out survive them now. FMC is something to worry about though and that's where Doomscythes and Tomb Blades on Quad Guns come in.

bodazoka wrote:
IMO the best "brick" to start with in a list contains the below;

Destroyer Cult;

1 x Destroyer Lord w/ 2+ armour save and a Warscythe

2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer
2 x Destroyers, 1 x Heady Destroyer

3 x Heavy Destroyers

Combined Arms Detachment;

5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe
5 x Immortals in a Night Scythe

Should be enough AA there to at least break even if not win the air battle, you also have the late game contest ability still. Destroyers arriving from reserve to contest / grab objectives and annoy the crap out of the enemy.

Any ideas on what else the list needs?

I think the CAD needs an HQ doesn't it?