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Conclave of the Burning One Nightbringer
Cryptek with Veil
Cryptek with God Shackle
1999pts
Going with a Mephrit spirit here; small, elite force with destructive potential.
No fancy tricks or cunning strategy here... just in your face action on round 2.
The idea is the put Nemesor with one of the warrior blocks. Both warrior groups, the conclave, and the blades start on the board and as far away in cover as possible.
At the start of round 2, Nemesor switches traits to improve reserve rolls. The Obelisk drops in right away thanks to its rules, and hopefully both monoliths follow suit and don't scatter because of the obelisk. The formation rules then allow a group of immortals to disembark from each monolith, followed by the normal eternity gate rules allowing a group of warriors to teleport right after. Outflanking flayed ones should also arrive at this time, followed by the conclave deepstriking in close with the veil.
At this point, the entire army is directly on top of the enemy and going for the kill.
Necron Players don't let Necron Players take Monoliths
Seriously , Don't take Monoliths unless you are building a themed list, they're basically like taking -200 points against your opponent. The conclave of the burning one is a strong formation it's also not partof the Decurion.
The army just doesn't have any real killy stuff other than the Flayed Ones.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/08 08:35:24
If I lose it is because I had bad luck, if you win it is because you cheated.
Yeah two monoliths seems underwhelming, especially when you are gating in warriors and immortals instead of some killy cc stuff. The conclave and the flayed ones can already get up close quite easily. All you are really gaining from the monoliths is maybe a turn or two extra of rapid fire distance.
Alcibiades wrote: Deep Striking Land Raider with Living Metal, a battle cannon, four heavy bolters, and ability to teleport all other units = joke
Entirely a joke, yes.
It comes close, very close to being a good unit, but falls short in such specific ways as to be next to useless.
The role a Monolith is designed around is being a near-invulnerable beachhead which opens tactical options. In balance, it's slow and has low firepower for points spent.
Problem is, it hasn't quite got the durability it needs for that role. AV 14 and 4 hull points? Sure, but there's plenty of ways to instantly remove that and it's old 3rd edition immunity to Melta/Armourbane and so forth was what made it's durability one of the prime selling points.
Second problem is that Ordinance is a useless rule on a S8 AP3 large blast, and renders it's secondary fire worthless.
That's it. All it needs and it would be great. Just like how Pyrovores would suddenly be great if they were T5 Beasts but kept all their other stats intact. It's a ruleset where small tweaks make massive differences.
The Land Raider meanwhile is an Assault Vehicle that can choose to move 12 inches, and pays a premium for that ability that's factored into it's cost.
As a side note, looking back at the 3rd edition Monolith again I think I prefer how it handles Flux Arcs too. Short range, but punishes you for standing right next to the slow moving enemy vehicle you should really have been able to outrun.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/08 11:49:53
It's actually worse than the 5th edition codex it lost the Exile Ray thingie. It's all around just terribad as others have pointed out. It's a horrible point sink.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/08 16:33:18
If I lose it is because I had bad luck, if you win it is because you cheated.
Hollismason wrote: It's actually worse than the 5th edition codex it lost the Exile Ray thingie. It's all around just terribad as others have pointed out. It's a horrible point sink.
Yeah, I proxied it a few times out of curiosity, and the only fun part of running it was the ability to park next to a unit and vacuum a third of them up.
Got a Grey Knight Librarian that way, presumably because he had no idea what a monolith can do since they're never fielded.
There is no such thing as independent detachments, there is only detachments. And all the formations are detachments except when they are in a "formation of formations" like the Decurion.
Hollismason wrote: It's actually worse than the 5th edition codex it lost the Exile Ray thingie. It's all around just terribad as others have pointed out. It's a horrible point sink.
I've actually used it with great success in two different games now. I just look at it as NOT a weapons platform, but a tactical addition to the army. The portal is nice, and the little mini guns are more worth something now. Also, it's 40 points cheaper than a land raider.
I'm not trying to say it's the most awesome thing ever created, but it isn't a point sink depending on the army you're running. Footcrons isn't actually a bad idea anymore, and Monoliths would fit in just fine.
Hollismason wrote: It's actually worse than the 5th edition codex it lost the Exile Ray thingie. It's all around just terribad as others have pointed out. It's a horrible point sink.
I've actually used it with great success in two different games now. I just look at it as NOT a weapons platform, but a tactical addition to the army. The portal is nice, and the little mini guns are more worth something now. Also, it's 40 points cheaper than a land raider.
I'm not trying to say it's the most awesome thing ever created, but it isn't a point sink depending on the army you're running. Footcrons isn't actually a bad idea anymore, and Monoliths would fit in just fine.
Yes, it's a tactical addition. One that entirely relies on durability it can only pretend to have to get the job done.
If you blindly luck into someone who can't handle AV14 it suddenly manages to do it's job. Still a fraction short on firepower with the snap fire thing though. Doesn't need to be great there, just not actively hindering itself.
Tyran wrote:Pyrovores are actually quite good if they are in a Tyrannocite.
Not really. It solves the delivery issue, but at a points hike instead of innately resolving it.
An improvement, but an improvement from "One of the worst units in the entire game" to "Overpriced".
I use mine with high pressure assault armies. It's a pretty cheap investment, and basically makes everyoen say " Get away Get Away". So I usually run it with Wraiths / Flayed Ones infiltrating.
If I lose it is because I had bad luck, if you win it is because you cheated.
True story - I actually plan to try out two monoliths teleporting units around the board. I think it would be great for maelstrom. And it has NOTHING to do with the fact that I am trading two models I don't use for them That large blob of flayed ones or warriors? Well they are on the other side of the board now! I think people are really underestimating their utility for a footslogging army. Throw in a royal court (read: a ton of cheap res orb lords and crypteks for increased RP and added durability) and I think you've got a stupidly durable army that is also stupidly mobile. Grab Obyron and maybe Orikan for durability/killing power as well as more mobility.
In other news, I just went to a 3 round RTT that was pure maelstrom and a ton of fun. I actually wound up taking home the W with a couple close calls. Never lost though. Used the same list I posted a few pages back but I'll throw it up again for posterity:
Spoiler:
Orikan
D Lord w/warscythe, phase shifter, nightmare shroud, phylactery, res orb
Played an Eldar player with far too much Lance and a ton of str 8 ap 2 so that was bad for him from the get go. Wraiths mulched vehicles and jet bikes alike and he never really was able to jump over my wraiths, plus he fed Nightbringer a few units because of maelstrom and then basically ran out of models at the end. Big victory 17-6
Played a Tyranid player with leviathan (which for some reason the TO said was a CAD for this event, meaning it gained obsec and lost nothing....but whatever. I knew that going in and almost brought leviathan myself but it didn't feel right) and he had a good list. Trip Flyrants, 2 crones, a Dakkafex, 6 hive guard, 2 drop pods w/20 gants, then one more unit of 10 gants. 3 Flyrants almost blew a squad of wraiths off the board turn 1, but then I got lucky and grounded a hive crone, which resulted in first blood. It was a sort of unfortunate game for him because there was one big kill box of 5 objectives very close to each other, which wraiths love. And Orikan Star loves even more. The gants probably would have been a tarpit, but I was able to pull them out of stnapse once with a pile in, and then the other unit, well wraiths have a lot of attacks it turns out. The one objective way out in nowhere-ville he had his Dakkafex parked on...I think it shot its guns once all game and never was targeted or got to assault. In short, I was actually up big but we roared through like 3 game turns in less than half an hour (yeah really) which allowed him to make a big comeback because I wasn't doing anything to his Flyrants. At the end it was literally just his 3 Flyrants alive (although one was locked in combat and going to die) and his carnifex. I had 3 wraiths, my d lord and Orikan, who never went super Saiyan although the game went 6 turns. As his Flyrants whittled me down (primarily in turns 5 and 6) he caught up and almost tied me, but I took it 14-12 if memory serves. It was closer than it should have been because of those lightening turns. I was up 5 for most of the game.
The last round was actually against a good friend of mine from my FLGS, so that was awesome. We were the only two undefeated players at that point (it was kind of a small turnout) so we knew this was for the cup. He just had a TON of obsec marines in drop pods. Also had a storm raven and two storm guppies. So it was the game of could I kill him fast enough. I caught a huge break when I got first turn, which meant that my units were able to cover 4 out of the 6 objectives. Didn't get much in the way of cards, but I blocked all three of his drop pods from coming down on any objective as a result (and some friendly scatter). So that was huge. I made some great charge rolls and Nightbringer just refused to die. He didn't have a ton of special weapons and I locked most of my stuff up in combat turn 2, but I had zero wraiths die on turn 2 or turn 3. Even so, those stupid marines refused to know any fear (aka I couldn't sweep them) and his librarian WOULD NOT DIE. Just 2W t4 3+ save, but I think it took me 5 rounds of combat to kill him with 2 wraiths (and 6 wraiths in that last round). At the end, though, I had him tied up and with my lord and Nightbringer rampaging around, I barely took it 10-8. Super close though.
Observations:
My ghost ark got popped for first blood 2 out of 3 games. That was more of a product of horrible luck than anything else, and the Warriors were spectacular. 5+ FNP is awesome.
The fighter ace uograde on my night scythe...probably going to ditch it. +1 BS is worthless with twin linked, and IWND rarely comes into play. The +1 RP is actually great but I have too many wraiths for it to be effective.
So some tweaks are in order but overall I'm really enjoying this list. 6-1 with it and I couldn't be happier
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/03/09 00:59:46
The monolith can only move Infantry or jump infantry units. No more Pokemon C'tan. but that strat wasn't used much from what i recall. but i liked using it.
It's easy to assume that people arguing an interpretation you disagree with are just looking for an advantage for themselves... But it's quite often not the case.
luke1705 wrote: True story - I actually plan to try out two monoliths teleporting units around the board. I think it would be great for maelstrom. And it has NOTHING to do with the fact that I am trading two models I don't use for them That large blob of flayed ones or warriors? Well they are on the other side of the board now! I think people are really underestimating their utility for a footslogging army. Throw in a royal court (read: a ton of cheap res orb lords and crypteks for increased RP and added durability) and I think you've got a stupidly durable army that is also stupidly mobile. Grab Obyron and maybe Orikan for durability/killing power as well as more mobility.
In other news, I just went to a 3 round RTT that was pure maelstrom and a ton of fun. I actually wound up taking home the W with a couple close calls. Never lost though. Used the same list I posted a few pages back but I'll throw it up again for posterity:
Spoiler:
Orikan
D Lord w/warscythe, phase shifter, nightmare shroud, phylactery, res orb
Played an Eldar player with far too much Lance and a ton of str 8 ap 2 so that was bad for him from the get go. Wraiths mulched vehicles and jet bikes alike and he never really was able to jump over my wraiths, plus he fed Nightbringer a few units because of maelstrom and then basically ran out of models at the end. Big victory 17-6
Played a Tyranid player with leviathan (which for some reason the TO said was a CAD for this event, meaning it gained obsec and lost nothing....but whatever. I knew that going in and almost brought leviathan myself but it didn't feel right) and he had a good list. Trip Flyrants, 2 crones, a Dakkafex, 6 hive guard, 2 drop pods w/20 gants, then one more unit of 10 gants. 3 Flyrants almost blew a squad of wraiths off the board turn 1, but then I got lucky and grounded a hive crone, which resulted in first blood. It was a sort of unfortunate game for him because there was one big kill box of 5 objectives very close to each other, which wraiths love. And Orikan Star loves even more. The gants probably would have been a tarpit, but I was able to pull them out of stnapse once with a pile in, and then the other unit, well wraiths have a lot of attacks it turns out. The one objective way out in nowhere-ville he had his Dakkafex parked on...I think it shot its guns once all game and never was targeted or got to assault. In short, I was actually up big but we roared through like 3 game turns in less than half an hour (yeah really) which allowed him to make a big comeback because I wasn't doing anything to his Flyrants. At the end it was literally just his 3 Flyrants alive (although one was locked in combat and going to die) and his carnifex. I had 3 wraiths, my d lord and Orikan, who never went super Saiyan although the game went 6 turns. As his Flyrants whittled me down (primarily in turns 5 and 6) he caught up and almost tied me, but I took it 14-12 if memory serves. It was closer than it should have been because of those lightening turns. I was up 5 for most of the game.
The last round was actually against a good friend of mine from my FLGS, so that was awesome. We were the only two undefeated players at that point (it was kind of a small turnout) so we knew this was for the cup. He just had a TON of obsec marines in drop pods. Also had a storm raven and two storm guppies. So it was the game of could I kill him fast enough. I caught a huge break when I got first turn, which meant that my units were able to cover 4 out of the 6 objectives. Didn't get much in the way of cards, but I blocked all three of his drop pods from coming down on any objective as a result (and some friendly scatter). So that was huge. I made some great charge rolls and Nightbringer just refused to die. He didn't have a ton of special weapons and I locked most of my stuff up in combat turn 2, but I had zero wraiths die on turn 2 or turn 3. Even so, those stupid marines refused to know any fear (aka I couldn't sweep them) and his librarian WOULD NOT DIE. Just 2W t4 3+ save, but I think it took me 5 rounds of combat to kill him with 2 wraiths (and 6 wraiths in that last round). At the end, though, I had him tied up and with my lord and Nightbringer rampaging around, I barely took it 10-8. Super close though.
Observations:
My ghost ark got popped for first blood 2 out of 3 games. That was more of a product of horrible luck than anything else, and the Warriors were spectacular. 5+ FNP is awesome.
The fighter ace uograde on my night scythe...probably going to ditch it. +1 BS is worthless with twin linked, and IWND rarely comes into play. The +1 RP is actually great but I have too many wraiths for it to be effective.
So some tweaks are in order but overall I'm really enjoying this list. 6-1 with it and I couldn't be happier
Great Job! How are you liking the D-Lord, I've been raving about him for a while now people really don't realize how almost unkillable he is.
Did he ever die and how much fun was rolling 3 4++ ?
Whenever I do that it's just like super sad for my opponent their like wait he does what?!
If I lose it is because I had bad luck, if you win it is because you cheated.
Chaos isn’t a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail, and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some are given a chance to climb, but refuse. They cling to the realm, or love, or the gods…illusions. Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is, but they’ll never know this. Not until it’s too late.
D lord is stupid good. Re-rollable 2+ and then a 4+ (re-rollable for a single phase) means that he took 4 wounds all tournament long, and in my last game I divorced him from the Wraithstar on turn 2. He then proceeded to fail a single 4+/5++. Whoops lol.
But when he's attached to the wraith squad, I WANT you to shoot at him. Good opponents won't, and most armies can't deal with him and Orikan whaling on them, plus the unkillable wraiths with Orikan attached.
When it comes to Flayed Ones, do you think that multiple small squads are better or just one larger unit?
I feel that bringing, say, 3 min units of 5 gives you board control from Infiltrate, but a larger unit of 10-20 gives you an actual combat unit that works as a big speedbump/blender.
To use Orikan with wraiths you want to rely on deep striking the unit downfield or having Orikan leave a group that got him downfield (like Flayed Ones) and then join the wraiths when they get downfield. If you run lots of MSU Canoptek Harvests this is usually easy.
I don't think Flayed Ones in minimum squads are that great actually , because ultimately they have Warriors Survivability and they are not fearless. So having them break and run off isn't that fun.
I like the big units.
If I lose it is because I had bad luck, if you win it is because you cheated.
To use Orikan with wraiths you want to rely on deep striking the unit downfield or having Orikan leave a group that got him downfield (like Flayed Ones) and then join the wraiths when they get downfield. If you run lots of MSU Canoptek Harvests this is usually easy.
Talking about using a Veil for both of those? He couldn't Deep Strike with them (not that Wraiths can Deep Strike anyway) neither could he Infiltrate with the Flayed Ones.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/09 20:20:11
To use Orikan with wraiths you want to rely on deep striking the unit downfield or having Orikan leave a group that got him downfield (like Flayed Ones) and then join the wraiths when they get downfield. If you run lots of MSU Canoptek Harvests this is usually easy.
Talking about using a Veil for both of those? He couldn't Deep Strike with them (not that Wraiths can Deep Strike anyway) neither could he Infiltrate with the Flayed Ones.
I was thinking about veil in the first case and outflank in the second case. Thanks for noting that I wasn't being fully clear.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Hollismason wrote: I don't think Flayed Ones in minimum squads are that great actually , because ultimately they have Warriors Survivability and they are not fearless. So having them break and run off isn't that fun.
I like the big units.
Yea, their lack of fearless sucks. A large blob of them has synergy with a bargeLord. A re-rollable leadership 10 save is practically fearless to shooting and in CC they should be winning morale or just losing it barely.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/09 20:28:18
Yea, their lack of fearless sucks. A large blob of them has synergy with a bargeLord. A re-rollable leadership 10 save is practically fearless to shooting and in CC they should be winning morale or just losing it barely.
Depends of what charges them. Imperial Knights, T8 MC, rerolleable 2+ or invisible units have a good chance of sweeping the FO.
Yea, their lack of fearless sucks. A large blob of them has synergy with a bargeLord. A re-rollable leadership 10 save is practically fearless to shooting and in CC they should be winning morale or just losing it barely.
Depends of what charges them. Imperial Knights, T8 MC, rerolleable 2+ or invisible units have a good chance of sweeping the FO.
You shouldn't be putting them in a position to be charged by those things. They are a board control unit more than a combat unit.
That large blob of flayed ones or warriors? Well they are on the other side of the board now! I think people are really underestimating their utility for a footslogging army. Throw in a royal court (read: a ton of cheap res orb lords and crypteks for increased 
