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What does everyone think the best CC units are in the Dex (am interested in playing Necrons, but a CAD, so no beautiful Decurion bonus. I think at 1250, which is what I usually play these days, it's just too restrictive on what you have to take).

Rule Number Two is Stay On Topic

To quote my esteemed colleague:

 reds8n wrote:
The debate about the number of spyders allowed, whilst somewhat related, is really not worth discussing in this thread.

So please don't discuss it here any more.

Further posts on this tangent will be treated as spam.

I've edited the posts in question. Further off-topic posting will be deleted/beg suspensions.

 Frozocrone wrote:
Anyhoo tactics. What does everyone think the best CC units are in the Dex (am interested in playing Necrons, but a CAD, so no beautiful Decurion bonus. I think at 1250, which is what I usually play these days, it's just too restrictive on what you have to take).

Nearly every Assault unit in the dex is worth taking now, even without the Decurion bonus. Flayed Ones tear things up, Lychguard are either unkillable or will blend anything (depending on weapon), Wraiths are still Wraiths, and Praetorians are pretty good despite my misgivings of them. C'Tan I wouldn't take outside of the Conclave formation, though. Without the support and T8 they're nothing special.

I suppose it depends on what you want to do with your Assault. Praetorians and Wraiths are fast, Flayed Ones are numerous, and Lychguard are durable. It's hard to say one is better than the other, since all of them have their niche, and are quite good in it. You'll hear Wraiths as the popular answer, but Flayed Ones actually have better damage output against many Toughness levels and Lychguard are more durable (especially when taken with Orikan).

I'm pretty fond of Praetorians right now just because they're way more survivable than previously with being able to get that T5 4+ save that's pretty damn rad. I'm a advocate of using all three in a army because all three Wraiths , Flayed Ones , and Praetorians bring some thing to the army and work well.

I'm not particularly fond of Lychguard because of their reduce movement, I'll take flayed ones ability to infiltrate.

The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

A full Destroyer Cult with zero upgrades on the Lord but all other upgrades taken is 1010 points.

So if you don't mind doing a light unbound option to add a small escort unit to the D Lord, 1250 is a pretty good points value for a Destroyer army.

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

Glancing on a 6 is not my idea of "easily"

Does anyone know how to add the conclave in battlescribe? i cant seem to find it! is a formation on the Decurion?

changemod wrote:
What I like about the Night Shroud and Tesseract Ark is that they're Stormraven and Land Raider equivalent vehicles... That don't waste time on troop transport and just take firepower.

Sadly the Ark has been severly hurt by the new quantum shielding rule. Can now be glanced by S7, which is far more spamable than S8


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Resonance wrote:
Does anyone know how to add the conclave in battlescribe? i cant seem to find it! is a formation on the Decurion?

Add a force type: formation detachment from catalogue Necrons 2015.

Click the add button under the formation heading and choose a conclave. Then under "no category" add relics and warlord traits, and select Mephrit, which will allow you to bring the shackle on crypteks.

DaPino wrote:

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

10 Praetorians with Voidblades statistically only deal 2 Hull Points to a non-immobilized vehicle. That's not easily.

Requizen wrote:

DaPino wrote:

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

10 Praetorians with Voidblades statistically only deal 2 Hull Points to a non-immobilized vehicle. That's not easily.

I feel as though that's not correct. Also, what vehicle are we talking about? A Rhino or a Land Raider?

 krodarklorr wrote:

Requizen wrote:

DaPino wrote:

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

10 Praetorians with Voidblades statistically only deal 2 Hull Points to a non-immobilized vehicle. That's not easily.

I feel as though that's not correct. Also, what vehicle are we talking about? A Rhino or a Land Raider?

...wow my math was totally wrong, nvm.

What do people think of this (from the last several pages it didn't come up nor did i see it on the front page so I'm assuming it is something either not known about or talked about)

With the new Deathmarks they can come in if you have allied Spacewolves or marines with drop pods that come in turn one since they are considered enemy units, toss in a D.lord with the s7 ap2 flamer and you have a very nasty alpha strike. Add in a cryptek with a veil of darkness then on the next turn you can move them to safty or re-potition them to attack again and help the survival rate of the marks and D.lord.

Thoughts?

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Resonance wrote:
Does anyone know how to add the conclave in battlescribe? i cant seem to find it! is a formation on the Decurion?

Add a force type: formation detachment from catalogue Necrons 2015.

Click the add button under the formation heading and choose a conclave. Then under "no category" add relics and warlord traits, and select Mephrit, which will allow you to bring the shackle on crypteks.

Oberron wrote:
What do people think of this (from the last several pages it didn't come up nor did i see it on the front page so I'm assuming it is something either not known about or talked about)

With the new Deathmarks they can come in if you have allied Spacewolves or marines with drop pods that come in turn one since they are considered enemy units, toss in a D.lord with the s7 ap2 flamer and you have a very nasty alpha strike. Add in a cryptek with a veil of darkness then on the next turn you can move them to safty or re-potition them to attack again and help the survival rate of the marks and D.lord.

Thoughts?

You only have your wounding on 2's for the first turn (and only against the "enemy unit" IIRC so you really waste their benefits by tying them to your unit as the "enemy". The issue really is their falloff after the first turn. They would be fine if they always wounded on 2's (even if it was just for 1 unit) but as is, it's tough to justify them

 adamsouza wrote:
Glancing on a 6 is not my idea of "easily"

When you have a lot of attacks, it becomes pretty darn easy.

VB/PC Praetorians completely eradicate vehicles.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Requizen wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

Requizen wrote:

DaPino wrote:

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

10 Praetorians with Voidblades statistically only deal 2 Hull Points to a non-immobilized vehicle. That's not easily.

I feel as though that's not correct. Also, what vehicle are we talking about? A Rhino or a Land Raider?

...wow my math was totally wrong, nvm.

...I was gonna say ...


Also, keep in mind they have S6 pistols as well, raising the bar against AV 12 and lower even more.

Pistols aside, though. 5 guys do 2.22 HPs against any vehicle. That's not bad at all.

What do people think about the following "Bomb" army?

Orikan
Obyron
total : 240
Elites
15 Flayed Ones (195)

Troops
5 Immortals w/ Night Scythes
5 Immortals w/ Night Scythes
total : 430
Fast Attack
6 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils (258)
3 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils (129)
3 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils (129)


Formation
Conclave of the Burning One
Night Bringer
Cryptek w/ Solar Staff , God Shackles
Cryptek w/ Veil of Darkness, Chronometron
Total : 465

 krodarklorr wrote:

Requizen wrote:

DaPino wrote:

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

10 Praetorians with Voidblades statistically only deal 2 Hull Points to a non-immobilized vehicle. That's not easily.

I feel as though that's not correct. Also, what vehicle are we talking about? A Rhino or a Land Raider?

I was thinking of walkers, as they are the worst case scenario.

 Tyran wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

Requizen wrote:

DaPino wrote:

 Tyran wrote:
The only problem with the assault units is that only the warscythe is good against vehicles and high T MC.

I strongly disagree, praetorians w/ voidblades get rid of vehicles very easily and they're more mobile than any other CC unit we have avaible.

10 Praetorians with Voidblades statistically only deal 2 Hull Points to a non-immobilized vehicle. That's not easily.

I feel as though that's not correct. Also, what vehicle are we talking about? A Rhino or a Land Raider?

I was thinking of walkers, as they are the worst case scenario.

Yeah, true. A dreadnaught would be a rough fight, but I have faith that the Praetorians could still do some damage.

Not if it was a full squad they'd straight up Clown a Dreadnought on the charge.

Yeah, true. A dreadnaught would be a rough fight, but I have faith that the Praetorians could still do some damage.

Depending on the Dread, the TPs should win most fights pretty comfortably, maybe losing 1 or 2 guys in the process.

(Edit :: Assuming 5 guys, here)

A full ten man squad charging a dreadnought will kill it.

Hollismason wrote:
A full ten man squad charging a dreadnought will kill it.

Yeah, 10 guys would crush. In fact, 10 guys will take out a Knight in about two rounds without too much trouble (unless the Knight gets a crazy lucky stomp roll).

ShadarLogoth wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
A full ten man squad charging a dreadnought will kill it.

Yeah, 10 guys would crush. In fact, 10 guys will take out a Knight in about two rounds without too much trouble (unless the Knight gets a crazy lucky stomp roll).

Yeah, now that I think about it, thats 40 attacks on the charge. Pretty silly. On average that should do at least 3-4 Hull points.

Yes, 280 points of Triarch Praetoreans can defeat a Dreadnaught, most of the time, by averaging 20 hits to get 3 hull points in glances.
280 points also buys 19 bases of Scarabs (95 attacks, 31 hits, 5 hull points) or 21 Warriors who can do the same job from 12" away (42 shots, 21 hits, 4 Hull Points).

You should buy Triarch Pratoreans for attacks with MEQ/TEQ killing AP, not "reliable" anti tank.

Necron Anti Tank is all about volume of fire, hoping for 6's. You probably shouldn't try to achieve that volume of fire with the most expensive units in the codex.

Yeah if I could just figure out how to make a 2 x 10 man Praetorian Judicator and Canoptek Harvest work in the Decurion at 1850 .

 adamsouza wrote:
Yes, 280 points of Triarch Praetoreans can defeat a Dreadnaught, most of the time, by averaging 20 hits to get 3 hull points in glances.
280 points also buys 19 bases of Scarabs (95 attacks, 31 hits, 5 hull points) or 21 Warriors who can do the same job from 12" away (42 shots, 21 hits, 4 Hull Points).

You should buy Triarch Pratoreans for attacks with MEQ/TEQ killing AP, not "reliable" anti tank.

Necron Anti Tank is all about volume of fire, hoping for 6's. You probably shouldn't try to achieve that volume of fire with the most expensive units in the codex.

Well yeah, I would rely on them to do that. I personally see them as light infantry killers, but I enjoy the fact that they have the versatility to be like "Oh, well, I really need that vehicle dead this turn, these guys can help out".

Their also fearless which is a huge boon as well.

Voidblade Praetorians don't excel at anything in particular, but there's no unit in the game they can't engage. Lots of attacks, AP4 for light infantry, rending for heavy infantry, entropic strike for vehicles. The trick is to take advantage of this versatility. I've only played them with rods myself, but after facing a couple of Knights and gargantuans I've occasionally wished I took voidblades instead.