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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 16:07:32
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
CL VI Store in at the Cyber Center of Excellence
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agnosto wrote: CptJake wrote:The pay for public office jobs is not great, it is the POWER that can be turned into financial gain that is the issue. Congress critters don't make enough via salary to be millionaires, yet most see their personal wealth increase vastly as they stay in office.
Even POTUS does not make that much compared to a CEO of a big company, but when you get a six figure fee for a speech once you are out of office...
The salaries are not lucrative, it is the power and gains from abuse of that power that are lucrative.
It depends upon what you're comparing the salary to. For 90% of Americans the minimum of $174,000 and an expense account (average 1.2 million for House and 3.2 million for Senate for travel, office, and personnel expenses) is a big chunk of change. Serve 5 or more years and you'll get a pension at 62 this means a one-term senator will get about $16k/year for life when they retire for just serving one term. They're also eligible for social security and can participate in the federal employee healthcare system instead of medicare. While they're in office, they have to contribute 1% of their salary into the "thrift savings plan" and the government kicks in 5%.
That's on the books money.
I do pretty well but nowhere near $174k. Median income in the US is $50,500/year with no expense account for travel costs. Average income for someone with a Doctorate degree is $80k. Less than 1/2 of 1% of workers in the US earn the minimum, starting salary of a person in congress. Public service. Compare that to the $24k I made as a Social Worker in 08 as a public employee with a Master's Degree.
Office space and staff costs in DC are expensive. Having to maintain staff and offices in your district as well adds cost. For most business, those are considered business costs and not wrapped into a salary. Median income is also irrelevant, as is Doctorate holder pay. I never said these guys are not paid decently, I said their salary is not the issue. The influence and their ability to turn that influence into $$$ is the issue.
Your 24 K is also a silly comparison. For the congress critters you wanted to add in their operating budget (staff/travel/etc). You didn't add in what ever costs your organization had to rent the office space you used and so on. And I suspect you couldn't drive the types of decisions the congress critters do.
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Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 17:05:23
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
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CptJake wrote: agnosto wrote: CptJake wrote:The pay for public office jobs is not great, it is the POWER that can be turned into financial gain that is the issue. Congress critters don't make enough via salary to be millionaires, yet most see their personal wealth increase vastly as they stay in office.
Even POTUS does not make that much compared to a CEO of a big company, but when you get a six figure fee for a speech once you are out of office...
The salaries are not lucrative, it is the power and gains from abuse of that power that are lucrative.
It depends upon what you're comparing the salary to. For 90% of Americans the minimum of $174,000 and an expense account (average 1.2 million for House and 3.2 million for Senate for travel, office, and personnel expenses) is a big chunk of change. Serve 5 or more years and you'll get a pension at 62 this means a one-term senator will get about $16k/year for life when they retire for just serving one term. They're also eligible for social security and can participate in the federal employee healthcare system instead of medicare. While they're in office, they have to contribute 1% of their salary into the "thrift savings plan" and the government kicks in 5%.
That's on the books money.
I do pretty well but nowhere near $174k. Median income in the US is $50,500/year with no expense account for travel costs. Average income for someone with a Doctorate degree is $80k. Less than 1/2 of 1% of workers in the US earn the minimum, starting salary of a person in congress. Public service. Compare that to the $24k I made as a Social Worker in 08 as a public employee with a Master's Degree.
Office space and staff costs in DC are expensive. Having to maintain staff and offices in your district as well adds cost. For most business, those are considered business costs and not wrapped into a salary. Median income is also irrelevant, as is Doctorate holder pay. I never said these guys are not paid decently, I said their salary is not the issue. The influence and their ability to turn that influence into $$$ is the issue.
Your 24 K is also a silly comparison. For the congress critters you wanted to add in their operating budget (staff/travel/etc). You didn't add in what ever costs your organization had to rent the office space you used and so on. And I suspect you couldn't drive the types of decisions the congress critters do.
Nope. I separated their salaries and operational expenses for a reason and that's to illustrate that they are in fact paid very, very well compared to the bulk of their constituency. I would hazard a guess that quite a few of them make more than anyone else in their congressional district.
Let's look at average salaries in my neck of the woods:
Mean Salary Oklahoma:
Administrative Law Judge $91,030
Chemical Engineer $95,670
General / Operations Manager $98,640
Attorney / Lawyer $112,520
$174k per year makes my representatives the highest paid, outside of the petroleum industry, in my state. There are literally only 4220 people in the state of Oklahoma that make more than they do and they're all in the healthcare industry.
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_ok.htm
By paying them as much as we have, we've created a class of people who have no idea what their constituency goes through on a monthly basis and we're seeing the results in the asinine comments that they make about welfare, education, and a host of other topics. When you can afford to fly first class every time that you travel, you don't know how much leg room is in coach.
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Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 17:08:51
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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agnosto wrote:
$174k per year makes my representatives the highest paid, outside of the petroleum industry, in my state. There are literally only 4220 people in the state of Oklahoma that make more than they do and they're all in the healthcare industry.
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_ok.htm
I see they didn't count anyone named Kevin Durant, or with the last name Stoops there  and neither of them work in the healthcare industry
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 17:11:24
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
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Ensis Ferrae wrote: agnosto wrote:
$174k per year makes my representatives the highest paid, outside of the petroleum industry, in my state. There are literally only 4220 people in the state of Oklahoma that make more than they do and they're all in the healthcare industry.
http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_ok.htm
I see they didn't count anyone named Kevin Durant, or with the last name Stoops there  and neither of them work in the healthcare industry 
Yeah, different animal. They only cover real employment not millions to play a game.
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Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 18:54:57
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Reading 538 articles/comments during lunch...
I get the sense that HRC is in really strong position if both Bush and Rubio drops out.... Florida is likely to go blue.
Hence, if Bush doesn't make any waves by NH (February), look for him to drop out to help Rubio.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/16 18:55:12
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 19:32:01
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges
United States
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CptJake wrote:Having to maintain staff and offices in your district as well adds cost.
Why are you assuming that staff are paid? Have you not heard of the unpaid intern?
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Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 19:39:30
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
CL VI Store in at the Cyber Center of Excellence
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dogma wrote: CptJake wrote:Having to maintain staff and offices in your district as well adds cost.
Why are you assuming that staff are paid? Have you not heard of the unpaid intern?
Of course there are unpaid interns, and that has zero fething bearing on my point, because each congress critter has a paid staff and is allocated funds to pay them.
http://time.com/3105933/congress-staff-pay/
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Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 21:08:02
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges
United States
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CptJake wrote:
Of course there are unpaid interns, and that has zero fething bearing on my point, because each congress critter has a paid staff and is allocated funds to pay them.
It only has no bearing if you ignore the importance of political interns.
You didn't read that article, did you?
While senators make $174,000, staff assistants and legislative correspondents — by far the most common positions in the Senate — have median pay of $30,000 and $35,000, respectively, significantly less than Senate janitors and a fairly low salary for college graduates in a city as expensive as Washington.
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Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 21:24:01
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Of course there are unpaid interns,
You now have Bill Clinton's complete and undivided attention. Please continue.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 21:27:10
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
CL VI Store in at the Cyber Center of Excellence
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dogma wrote: CptJake wrote:
Of course there are unpaid interns, and that has zero fething bearing on my point, because each congress critter has a paid staff and is allocated funds to pay them.
It only has no bearing if you ignore the importance of political interns.
You didn't read that article, did you?
While senators make $174,000, staff assistants and legislative correspondents — by far the most common positions in the Senate — have median pay of $30,000 and $35,000, respectively, significantly less than Senate janitors and a fairly low salary for college graduates in a city as expensive as Washington.
Yes I read it, and it has no bearing on my point. And the importance of interns has no bearing on my point. My point is the congress critters are allocated funds to pay staff. That accounts for a big chunk of the number used in the post I replied to.
What point are you trying to make and how is it relevant to mine?
Or are you just being your normal argumentative self because it is who you are, even if it is not relevant?
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Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 22:16:29
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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[MOD]
Not as Good as a Minion
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Politeness and relevance in our posts guys, remember the rules.
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I wish I had time for all the game systems I own, let alone want to own... |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/16 22:37:03
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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motyak wrote:Politeness and relevance in our posts guys, remember the rules.
yea guys be calm, and think "what would Bill Clinton do?" Why he would break out the saxophone and party, not trade personal insults!
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 00:26:46
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
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Frazzled wrote: motyak wrote:Politeness and relevance in our posts guys, remember the rules.
yea guys be calm, and think "what would Bill Clinton do?" Why he would break out the saxophone and party, not trade personal insults!
Interns and cigars, interns and cigars.
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Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 00:32:22
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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[MOD]
Not as Good as a Minion
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In case it wasn't clear, that includes purely 'lol' posts that add nothing to the discussion
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I wish I had time for all the game systems I own, let alone want to own... |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 03:50:51
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Dwarf High King with New Book of Grudges
United States
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CptJake wrote:
What point are you trying to make and how is it relevant to mine?
My point is that much of Congressional staff is unpaid and, as such, the personnel allowance isn't important. Indeed, it works against what can easily be characterized as exploitation.
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Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 13:51:18
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Courageous Grand Master
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Interesting developments in Europe.
You may or may not know that the European Union has launched a massive anti-trust case against Google.
American politicians have been getting involved, in some instances lobbying the EU to drop the case...
But these same politicians have received funding from Google, so no conflict of interest there
European Union is not happy, well they never are
If anybody is interested in this, and it shines some light on Google's influence in Washington, you can read about it here: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/17/google-lobbyists-congress-antitrust-brussels-eu
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"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 15:02:44
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Not sure I fully understand why Google is being targeted by anti-trust activities...
I mean... if you break up Google's search engine from it's advertising business (and others), I'm not sure how you can do that.
This isn't like Microsoft's dominance of Internet Explorer in the early Window years.
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 15:07:01
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Courageous Grand Master
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whembly wrote:Not sure I fully understand why Google is being targeted by anti-trust activities...
I mean... if you break up Google's search engine from it's advertising business (and others), I'm not sure how you can do that.
This isn't like Microsoft's dominance of Internet Explorer in the early Window years.
The European Union ( EU) thinks that Google is stifling competition and dangerously encroaching on people's liberties with its data gathering, which is ironic, considering some of the anti-democratic activities the EU has ben conducting these past years.
Whembley, consider yourself lucky that you're free from EU jurisdiction.
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"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 15:12:04
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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Europe is generally more hawkish when it comes to Anti-Trust than the US (our laws on the matter are so littered with exemptions, exceptions, or ignored/rewritten with such frequency they are mostly useless here).
That aside, I agree. I'm not really sure what the case against Google is here. They dominate the search engine market? That's all it seems to be about, Is there more to it than that?
It's not like Google has any real competition. Much like Microsoft in the 90's, their market dominance has been driven more by the ineptitude of their competitors than anything else.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:The European Union ( EU) thinks that Google is stifling competition and dangerously encroaching on people's liberties with its data gathering, which is ironic, considering some of the anti-democratic activities the EU has ben conducting these past years.
That makes a bit more sense, but feels like it's a matter of consumer rights/privacy rights, not anti-trust legislation.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/17 15:14:55
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 15:27:57
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Courageous Grand Master
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LordofHats wrote:Europe is generally more hawkish when it comes to Anti-Trust than the US (our laws on the matter are so littered with exemptions, exceptions, or ignored/rewritten with such frequency they are mostly useless here).
That aside, I agree. I'm not really sure what the case against Google is here. They dominate the search engine market? That's all it seems to be about, Is there more to it than that?
It's not like Google has any real competition. Much like Microsoft in the 90's, their market dominance has been driven more by the ineptitude of their competitors than anything else.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:The European Union ( EU) thinks that Google is stifling competition and dangerously encroaching on people's liberties with its data gathering, which is ironic, considering some of the anti-democratic activities the EU has ben conducting these past years.
That makes a bit more sense, but feels like it's a matter of consumer rights/privacy rights, not anti-trust legislation.
This is just my opinion, but the general feeling in EU HQ in Brussels, is that Google is getting too big for its boots, and needs a reminder of who is boss...and something about civil liberties being abused through Google's data gathering
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"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 15:32:12
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau
USA
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I happily admit that the growing size of corporations and conglomerates concerns me, and I don't really have issue with making them justify rolling as one business. The US had some pretty dark times in the late 19th, early 20th century when we allowed business' and their owners to run rampant and unchecked. TO make it worse, we made money speech and corporations people, and that's just a winning combination /sarcasm
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/17 15:32:59
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 16:39:40
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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LordofHats wrote:
Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:The European Union ( EU) thinks that Google is stifling competition and dangerously encroaching on people's liberties with its data gathering, which is ironic, considering some of the anti-democratic activities the EU has ben conducting these past years.
That makes a bit more sense, but feels like it's a matter of consumer rights/privacy rights, not anti-trust legislation.
This... I can see it as consumer rights/privacy rights thing...
Automatically Appended Next Post: LordofHats wrote:TO make it worse, we made money speech and corporations people, and that's just a winning combination /sarcasm
Erm... you referring to that Citizen United case?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/17 16:40:18
Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 18:56:15
Subject: Re:The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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And people wonder why Trump is leading the polls now...
http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/263529-funding-deal-hits-backlash-over-increase-in-worker-visas
Funding deal hits backlash over increase in foreign worker visas
The $1.1 trillion omnibus funding bill includes language that would dramatically increase the number of visas available for foreign workers, setting off alarm bells among conservatives and labor unions.
Congressional leaders quietly slipped the provision into the 2,009-page funding bill, with rank-and-file lawmakers only discovering it Wednesday morning. The move immediately sparked protests from across the political spectrum.
The provision could more than triple the number of H-2B visas for foreign workers seeking jobs at hotels, theme parks, ski resorts, golf courses, landscaping businesses, restaurants and bars. The move is intended to boost the supply of non-agricultural seasonal workers.
“These foreign workers are brought in exclusively to fill blue collar non-farm jobs in hotels, restaurants, construction, truck driving, and many other occupations sought by millions of Americans,” said Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Ala.), an outspoken critic of President Obama’s immigration policies, in a statement.
“The GOP-led Congress is about to deliver Obama a four-fold increase to one of the most controversial foreign worker programs. The result? Higher unemployment and lower wages for Americans,” he said.
Sessions estimates the number of H-2B visas will soar from 66,000 to 250,000 because of the language in the omnibus. He took to the Senate floor Wednesday afternoon to protest the maneuver.
Chris Chmielenski, a spokesman for NumbersUSA, a group that advocates for less immigration, criticized Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) for allowing the provision into the omnibus after pledging to look out for American workers in his first speech to the House after taking the gavel.
Ryan called on Congress to look after working-class families after he won election to the Speaker’s office in October.
i“If there were ever a time for us to step up, this would be that time. America does not feel strong anymore because the working people of America do not feel strong anymore,” he told colleagues on the House floor. “I’m talking about the people who mind the store and grow the food and walk the beat and pay the taxes and raise the family.”
Chmielenski said those same working families would be hurt by the visa rider.
“H-2B visas are for low-skilled foreign workers who typically compete with people who have a high school diploma or less and these are the people who are struggling the most,” he said.
“These are the people that Ryan seemed to be referencing in his speech, and yet he sneaks in a provision in the omnibus that’s going to quadruple the number of low-skilled foreign worker visas,” he added.
NumbersUSA plans to mobilize its grassroots activist network in an effort to get the language removed from the spending package.
Conservative Rep. Steve King (R-Iowa) said in October that Ryan promised the House Republican Conference before being elected that he would not bring a comprehensive immigration reform bill to the floor while Obama was still in the Oval Office.
A House GOP aide said the visa provision was written by the Judiciary Committee, and that the Speaker was not involved.
The aide added that Ryan did not pledge that he wouldn’t touch any programs related to immigration, only to keep major legislation, such as the 2013 Senate bill that included a pathway to citizenship, from moving. The language in the omnibus falls well short of that.
The policy rider comes at a sensitive time for Republicans, with their leading candidates for president engaging in a fierce debate over immigration.
At the presidential debate in Las Vegas Tuesday evening, Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas) slammed rival Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.) for co-authoring a comprehensive reform bill in 2013 that would have given a path to citizenship to millions of illegal immigrants.
Rubio shot back by arguing that Cruz at the time supported dramatic increases in the number of visas for foreign workers. He claimed Cruz supported a 500 percent increase in the number of H-1B visas for skilled workers and doubling the number of green cards.
But the uproar over the visa provision isn’t confined to conservatives.
The AFL-CIO and the International Labor Recruitment Working Group, powerhouses in the labor movement, also took aim at the visa provision, warning it would lead to exploitation of foreign workers and Americans losing jobs.
“The language basically rolls back protections for low-wage workers and guest workers and American workers in this industry while lowering the protections for workers,” said Joleen Rivera, a legislative representative at the AFL-CIO.
She said that only 66,000 foreign seasonal workers are allowed into the United States per year but predicted the number could swell to 200,000 because of the language in the omnibus.
Rivera said it would also water down workers’ protections in dangerous industries such as forestry and seafood harvesting.
“We’re extremely disappointed that these measures are in the bill,” she said.
Labor groups say the language should go through regular procedural order instead of being thrown into a catchall bill.
“The House language would lead to the admission of almost 200,000 additional low-wage guest workers and would eliminate protections that keep workers from being brought in and idled without work or pay for long periods of time,” the International Labor Recruitment Working Group said in a statement.
The group said the language would prevent U.S. workers from getting “first dibs” on jobs and deny U.S. workers the rights to the rights to the same wages.
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 19:48:22
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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LordofHats wrote:The US had some pretty dark times in the late 19th, early 20th century when we allowed business' and their owners to run rampant and unchecked.
In an eerie example of "those who do not know there history are doomed to repeat it" a large number of trends seen in that time period can no be seen in multinational corporations today. We are quite literally reliving the economic past on a larger scale, but at least the upside is we know there is a decent resolution that is relatively reasonable. Then in another century we'll repeat the cycle.
[edit] Speaking of... the above article Whembly posted reeks of corporate bribery, sorry, 'lobbying'. A measure that could never gain traction if it was discussed openly is .ninja'd into a larger package by a small group of unidentified individuals, and who wins if it goes through? The greedy who just can't afford to let their workers be getting a piece of those multi-million dollar paychecks.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/17 19:55:40
Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 20:14:15
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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NinthMusketeer wrote: LordofHats wrote:The US had some pretty dark times in the late 19th, early 20th century when we allowed business' and their owners to run rampant and unchecked.
In an eerie example of "those who do not know there history are doomed to repeat it" a large number of trends seen in that time period can no be seen in multinational corporations today. We are quite literally reliving the economic past on a larger scale, but at least the upside is we know there is a decent resolution that is relatively reasonable. Then in another century we'll repeat the cycle.
[edit] Speaking of... the above article Whembly posted reeks of corporate bribery, sorry, 'lobbying'. A measure that could never gain traction if it was discussed openly is .ninja'd into a larger package by a small group of unidentified individuals, and who wins if it goes through? The greedy who just can't afford to let their workers be getting a piece of those multi-million dollar paychecks.
The corporatism and crony capitalism of today has a lot more to do with using govt regulation to stifle competition and innovation than with controlling labor costs. Technology has been consistently reducing the amount of workers need to produce goods and services for centuries and will continue to do so without needing any legislative help.
And to whembly, I think McCutcheon v. the FECis a more apt case for Lordofhat's metaphor about making money into people/constiuents. It's a case that for some reason doesn't get the publicity of Citizens United but its effect is much worse for our republic.
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Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 20:31:37
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)
Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!
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Prestor Jon wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: LordofHats wrote:The US had some pretty dark times in the late 19th, early 20th century when we allowed business' and their owners to run rampant and unchecked.
In an eerie example of "those who do not know there history are doomed to repeat it" a large number of trends seen in that time period can no be seen in multinational corporations today. We are quite literally reliving the economic past on a larger scale, but at least the upside is we know there is a decent resolution that is relatively reasonable. Then in another century we'll repeat the cycle.
[edit] Speaking of... the above article Whembly posted reeks of corporate bribery, sorry, 'lobbying'. A measure that could never gain traction if it was discussed openly is .ninja'd into a larger package by a small group of unidentified individuals, and who wins if it goes through? The greedy who just can't afford to let their workers be getting a piece of those multi-million dollar paychecks.
The corporatism and crony capitalism of today has a lot more to do with using govt regulation to stifle competition and innovation than with controlling labor costs. Technology has been consistently reducing the amount of workers need to produce goods and services for centuries and will continue to do so without needing any legislative help.
And to whembly, I think McCutcheon v. the FECis a more apt case for Lordofhat's metaphor about making money into people/constiuents. It's a case that for some reason doesn't get the publicity of Citizens United but its effect is much worse for our republic.
yeah... that's another biggie.
I just like bringing up Citizens because the government attorney actually argued that the government can ban books.
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Alito’s question was simple: Could the government ban political books that contained express advocacy if an incorporated entity was involved?
After much ducking, weaving, bobbing, and a few desperate clicks of his heels while shouting “there’s no place like home, there’s no place like home,” Stewart gave the answer that 100 years of campaign finance “reform” had forced him into: Yes. The government did have the power to ban books.
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So yeah... about that...
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Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 21:20:59
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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Prestor Jon wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote: LordofHats wrote:The US had some pretty dark times in the late 19th, early 20th century when we allowed business' and their owners to run rampant and unchecked.
In an eerie example of "those who do not know there history are doomed to repeat it" a large number of trends seen in that time period can no be seen in multinational corporations today. We are quite literally reliving the economic past on a larger scale, but at least the upside is we know there is a decent resolution that is relatively reasonable. Then in another century we'll repeat the cycle.
[edit] Speaking of... the above article Whembly posted reeks of corporate bribery, sorry, 'lobbying'. A measure that could never gain traction if it was discussed openly is .ninja'd into a larger package by a small group of unidentified individuals, and who wins if it goes through? The greedy who just can't afford to let their workers be getting a piece of those multi-million dollar paychecks.
The corporatism and crony capitalism of today has a lot more to do with using govt regulation to stifle competition and innovation than with controlling labor costs. Technology has been consistently reducing the amount of workers need to produce goods and services for centuries and will continue to do so without needing any legislative help.
Even if there are differences (there always are; that's why its an analogy and not a clone), it is the same reasons causing the same problem, and it is producing the same results. I am pretty sure there are more similarities than differences when it comes to us re-living that particular section of history.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 21:58:49
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Grisly Ghost Ark Driver
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Speaking of out dated ideals. I learned that in MI an employer can make an employee work however many hours they feel necessary. Which explains why half my family is telling me they have to work 7 days a week right now.
I had thought the US had a maximum number of hours employers could mandate employees had to work. Turns out it could be as many as they want if you don't want to be fired.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/17 21:59:39
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 21:58:57
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Thane of Dol Guldur
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(Sorry, read something wrong)
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/17 22:00:00
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/12/17 22:07:48
Subject: The Political Junkie™ Thread - USA Edition
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Fixture of Dakka
CL VI Store in at the Cyber Center of Excellence
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BrotherGecko wrote:Speaking of out dated ideals. I learned that in MI an employer can make an employee work however many hours they feel necessary. Which explains why half my family is telling me they have to work 7 days a week right now.
I had thought the US had a maximum number of hours employers could mandate employees had to work. Turns out it could be as many as they want if you don't want to be fired.
As long as they are getting overtime (in MI I think that is 1.5 regular pay) the employer is probably legally sound.
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Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings. |
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