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soo I was reading the new necron codex, and I noticed something intreasting

At great cost, Captain Cato Sicarius, the Ultramarines 2nd company and their allies, destroy the necron lord known as the undying and reclaim Demos for the Imperium

now Damnos has been listed as including most of the ultramarines chapter, but the wording of this has me wondering if GW is retconing this to simply an action of the 2nd company as well as "supporting elements"

Well, given how much of a glory hound Cato Sicarius and his golden boys are I wouldn't be surprised of the rest of the Ultramarines chapter felt left out enough to just consider him an ally at best.

Sounds like a retcon to me

BrianDavion wrote:
soo I was reading the new necron codex, and I noticed something intreasting

At great cost, Captain Cato Sicarius, the Ultramarines 2nd company and their allies, destroy the necron lord known as the undying and reclaim Demos for the Imperium

now Damnos has been listed as including most of the ultramarines chapter, but the wording of this has me wondering if GW is retconing this to simply an action of the 2nd company as well as "supporting elements"

Well, I haven't read the passage in question, but if Cato and the 2nd is essential to destroying the Undying--even if large elements of the Ultramarines Chapter were involved---then that sentence could be viewed as truthful.

If defeating the Lord was generally viewed as the turning point of the war to reclaim Damnos, then the ones who killed him take credit for turning the tide. It's not saying that no other Ultramarines were involved in the war, just that the 2nd was the ones who took out the Undying.

Honestly, it sounds like the sort of thing "Glory Hound" Sicarius is known for (and loved/hated for). He holds back from committing his forces to the grinding attrition of the early battles, and avoids getting bogged down in the front line conflict, then displays a gifted tactical sense for where to strike to make the most difference. I'm sure that a lot of people see him as a master tactician, and a lot of Marines who are tasked with all of the essential, but unglamorous actions, roll their eyes and curse him under their breath.

As long as Calgar (or whoever the Captain of the First is if the Chapter Master isn't both, I can't remember) wasn't around, technically no matter how many companies are involved, Sicarius would be overall commander since the Captain of the Second has precedence over all lesser Captains.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
As long as Calgar (or whoever the Captain of the First is if the Chapter Master isn't both, I can't remember) wasn't around, technically no matter how many companies are involved, Sicarius would be overall commander since the Captain of the Second has precedence over all lesser Captains.

except in warzone Damnos Calgar was indeed around

Either a retcon or just a complete screw up.

In fall of damnos (book), the second company had their butts kicked.

In warzone: damnos Calgar led first and second companies. Sicarus was by no means in charge. There were no "allies"

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Damnos

Ultrasmurfs got their butts kicked, Sicarus loses, Necrons pwn all

The entire Imperium is demoralized by the defeat, Sicarus obsesses on his training to the edge of madness, trying to wipe away the stain of defeat.

25 years later Terra orders that Damnos be retaken, 500 ultrasmurfs plus Guard and Deathwatch attack. The outcome I'll leave you to read yourselves

 Exalted Pariah wrote:
http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Damnos

Ultrasmurfs got their butts kicked, Sicarus loses, Necrons pwn all

The entire Imperium is demoralized by the defeat, Sicarus obsesses on his training to the edge of madness, trying to wipe away the stain of defeat.

25 years later Terra orders that Damnos be retaken, 500 ultrasmurfs plus Guard and Deathwatch attack. The outcome I'll leave you to read yourselves

I'm aware. I was talking about the return.

When everything and nothing in the fluff is all "canon" there aren't any retcons to speak of.

clively wrote:
Either a retcon or just a complete screw up.

In fall of damnos (book), the second company had their butts kicked.

In warzone: damnos Calgar led first and second companies. Sicarus was by no means in charge. There were no "allies"

Actually, there were. Deathwatch Kill-Team Lazarus were the people who actually killed the Undying, regardless of what Sicarius thinks.

Order of events, as described in Warzone: Damnos:

a) The Kill-team are fighting alongside the Ultramarines
b) The Necron Elite Lycgraurd gets committed to the battlefield, led by the Undying (the necron overlord)
c) Kill-team leader tells Sicarius "you're on your own" and the Deathwatch withdraws from the battle without warning
d) Sicarius accuses the deathwatch of cowardice and betrayal and throne-knows-what, but they're already gone
e) Ultramarines just about manage to stop the necron Lychguard, despite suffering serious casualties
f) Sicarius goes toe-to-toe with the Undying
g) Sicarius gets beaten down badly, but - being the Ultramarines' poster hero, does a last-minute 'hope spot' and takes the Undying down
h) The Undying laughs like a drain as he just phases out back to his fortress to self-repair and awaken more troops
i) Awakens in a stasis crypt, beginning appropriate "Fool! I am Invincible!" monologue...
j) ....to find the five members of the Deathwatch formed up in a firing squad around his open stasis crypt, waiting patiently for him to reappear
k) Fade out to the sound of godwyn-patterns rapid firing anti-phasic bolts at point blank range....

@iocarno24: You're right.

Somehow I missed the deathwatch's involvement. Found it on pg 24, 3rd paragraph.