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So I'm new to fantasy, but I've decided to start a Night Goblin army. I want to keep it thematically night goblin, but I'm not sure what are good units and how big I should make them? Can I get a little help?

You can't netlist fantasy to anywhere near the extend you can in 40k. Fantasy is a game about movement & positioning. About feigns, traps & setting up for 3 turns from now. You cannot just say "give me a basic list" because there isn't one.

Let me put it this way. I have had a 120 point unit of skeletons destroy a 400 point unit of dragon princes (elite heavy cavalry) in ONE round of combat. I sacrificed a unit of 40 point zombie dogs to draw these guys out of formation. Then I charged them in the flank. This means I have a STATIC (before any attacks) combat resolution of 6. I charged for +1, in the flank for +1, with 3 extra ranks of troops for +3 and a banner for an additional +1. He had a static resolution of +1 for a banner. He had 2 elves in base contact meaning those only 2 could fight (you don't get supporting attacks to the flank or rear). He had to do 5 wounds with 4 elf attacks & 2 horse attacks just to NOT LOSE that combat against a unit less than 1/3 of his point cost. He only killed 2, I got lucky & killed one. He lost combat by 4, took a break test at -4ld and ran. I rolled high & caught up with him destroying the unit.

The moral of that story is WHAT you take doesn't matter nearly as much as HOW you use it. That is step one of fantasy, it is NOT 40k don't go in with that mindset.

That said here are some things you will need:
A General - This will automatically be the character with the highest Ld, usually a lord. He allows any unit within 12" to use his Ld instead of their own.
A BSB - This will be a hero level character, the BSB FORCES (note FORCES not ALLOWS) any friendly unit to reroll any failed Ld test. This may also be your general but I don't recommend putting so many eggs in one basket.
A Wizard - Generally anything above 1200 you want a lvl 3 or 4. This may also be your general but I don't recommend putting so many eggs in one basket.

Things to look into:
A Bunker: Generally a tough unit or a unit that can sit back. Essentially they stay out of harms way & act as extra shooting wounds for your mage.
An Anvil: This will usually be a combat block that is durable or hard to break. You get this into combat in order to hold you enemy in place so you can deliver....
A Hammer: This will be a harder hitting but less durable combat unit. Think knights. They come in & hit the flank of whatever i fighting your anvil. This is USUALLY enough to win you the combat pretty heavily.
Shooting: Used to soften up enemy units before combat, often these double as bunkers. Do not expect to delete units with pure shooting like in 40k unless you're spamming heavy shooting or shooting at...
Chaff: Weak cheap fast & disposable. The purpose of this unit is to screen your other units & bloack / redirect / bait charges. This is what my zombie dogs were in the above story.


Night Gobbos:
Fanatics can be very great or very terrible depending on your enemy & where they decide to go. That said they're always very fun.
Warmachines. The strength of O&G lies in their super cheap warmachines. DoomDivers are great.

That's about all I know on the gobbos but welcome to Fantasy!

What I'm not sure about is what size units I should be taking? 10x5, 8x5, 6x5? And what's better to equip them with, spears, bows, or hand wep with shields?

I'm also just starting out a Night Goblin army, and I've noticed the importance of taking big blobs of spearmen already. 40-50 is a good place to start, and netters are essential if you want a chance in combat. Fanatics are a real risk but usually worth taking, if just for the psychological effect. Leadership can be a problem, so you might have to take a regular goblin general and a banner of discipline. You need something hard-hitting, too, since S3 won't always cut it, so trolls and squig herds are something that you should look into getting. Archers are important for support, but doom divers and rock lobbers will be your real source of ranged damage. Expect to spam Bigbosses with great weapons and shamans, too. There are plenty of other tricks and combos that you'll figure out on your own, as I'm still finding my way as well. If you're looking for a fun army, then you've found it, but if you want to go competitive, you might have a bad time with the cave gobbos alone.

You want massive blocks of spearmen in long narrow formations. 40 spearmen is a good place to start presuming you are playing games of 1000 points, but the more the better. Fanatics are a must, as are lots of heroes and bosses to sit at the front of each unit and do most of the killing. Spears are good because you get an extra rank of attacks when receiving a charge, but I wouldn't bother hoarding because you want to reduce the amount of enemy models in base contact.

I would field 40 night goblins in a 5 wide 8 deep formation. I would only increase the front to 6 of you want to put another boss in the front.

So here a few things:

any 20 model size unit is considered a sacrifice, if they do damage, then you are lucky, but don't expect it. (they are usually the first line)
25 models is a good operating size and should include a fantatic or more.
40 models or more units are swamps, if the enemy gets in close combat, then he will be stuck, like zombies, but not as effective.

Gargbosse give you good attack power, no need for magic items, better have more bosse. But they don't decide anything, but necessary
Shamans make a change, but unpredictable
Mastershaman is very important, more then the waaghboss

Squigs, Squighoppaz, Manglers, Doom divers and Trolls bring you victory, so far the nightgoblin mono army
Any adds from other Orcs & Goblins is a huge advantage and improves your victory chances.

Saying that. It is all about positioning. You will have a lot of fun againgst dwarfs, since you hate these guys, Winning against Chaos or Ogres is tough.
But anyway Night gobbos are huge fun to play, as Orks and Goblins in general are fun to play.
Go for it! Do what ever crazy thing you have in mind.

I created a night goblin clown character that gave everyone, including the Nightgoblins Leadership -1 and had a 3+ invulnerable safe. All he did was making fun of the opponents army and despite the troubles I get from him, it was so much fun and I actually won every game with him, including a huge victory against Vlad von Carstein.

So just go crazy and have fun. Night Gobbos are the best for it.

Always take Short Bows on NG. Perform about as well as regular NG but insanely more fun to shoot thousands of toothpicks at your enemy's ranks.

Spam War Machines, get 2 Mangler Squigs, horde of Squig Herders is a good hammer, skip named characters (terrible...Skarsnik is trash), spam lvl 1 NG shamans (bonus lulz wih End Times now that you can pick a good lore), get a regular Goblin as your general. 2-3 Goblin Wolf Charios. 2 Pump Wagons with explody stuff.

The secret is to swear an oath to skarsnik,Gork and Mork That you will avenge the greatest squig ever spawned by slaughtering every skaven,rat and stuntie you find.Then you will always win AND be SUPER thematic. This is what happens when something happens to a character I like...

I do play a nightgoblin army. The way to go for me is, make that Nightgoblin army a squig army. You can easily convert squig chariots, squig hoppas and 2 blocks of squigs really help out with holding a line (which should not be your game plan, but helps with the low moral). Shamans are fine, a hero on squig can put some pressure on small units(artillery) or try to protect your artillery from flyers, skirmishers,etc.

Fanatics are nice, but i wouldnt over commit to them. They are quite expensive and can be played around. Just the thread of there could be fanatics somethimes pays of more then the actual fanatic jumping out of the unit.

Catapults, kamikaze, bolthrower are all good and needed because you will have a hard time in close combat(exept maybe with the squigs). Forgeworld has a really nice large squig firing squigs, which i use as one of my katapults. I dont use the rules for it because a catapult is more needed but never heard complaints because the model is so nice.
Atm Im building a large squig as a "count as" large spider(cant remember the name right now).

Speers are most of the time not worth it for me.(as someone already pointed out)

Games are a hell lot of fun, but dont expect to win every game ;-) . If someone is a good player and can exploit your moral and weak stats, they can sometimes kick your butt very hard.
I most of time play against Vampire Counts, Skaven and Dwarfs. I have a winrate about 60% but I have years of experience over my opponents and can most of the time make them play "my game" with the help of the artillery and the squig thread.
If interessed I can post some lists later on.

I went up against a night goblin army last week. This player sees lots of victories with his army (he beat me quite solidly too). His army was:

2x 40 Night Goblins deployed in Horde formation. Each with full command, and some characters (one had shaman and BSB the other had a Big Boss). Both units had netters and 3 fanatics too. Armed with spears and shields.

1x Doom diver

2x Spear Chukkas

5x Stone Trolls

10x Squig Hoppers

I have to say the Doom Diver is lethal against elite troops as it ignores armour saves. (It killed 4 inner circle Knights in turn 1).

I always thought Night Goblin units would be better as long buses, but in this case horde was better for these reasons:

1. At 1250pts, 4 ranks deep is likely to give you steadfast against any units charge you in the early turns (like Knights).

The wider front means you can position fanatics much better.

As he was playing gunline goblins anyway. A unit that could challenge steadfast in combat (like my swordsmen) can be charged by the stone trolls and squig hoppers.

So yeah, I would experiment with deploying as a horde or a bus (10x4 or 5x8) to see which you prefer. And I would 100% get a Doom Diver!

Don't deploy NG in horde formation unless they're archers. You lose out on half of your ranks and having more ranks is the only good thing NG do. Yeah, war machines are absolutely mandatory

 Sigvatr wrote:
Don't deploy NG in horde formation unless they're archers. You lose out on half of your ranks and having more ranks is the only good thing NG do. Yeah, war machines are absolutely mandatory

Although like I just mentioned Horde formation at low point values can be good because you don't really need more than 4 ranks and it gives you a wider footprint to launch fanatics from.

The problem is that a horde of 40 models only needs to lose 1 model to lose its effectiveness. And that's 100% chance to be useless. If you want to effectively use Fanatics, have one unit of "lucky" fodder and one unit with NG right behind that unit. Once an enemy then charges the fodder unit, the Fanatics get triggered and they mow right through the fodder unit and the enemy.

"Ummm...great...so I kill my own units?" Yes. Why? You can't roll too short. With a regular launch, you have to roll 8'' or more. With this launch, you cannot fail the roll and will always hit your opponent. Lose a few 5 point models? Sure, why not. Chances that your enemy loses far more are way higher.

That's a cunning plan. I might have to try that once

Edit: thinking about it, how does it work? You need to keep the front rank of the decoy unit exactly 8" in front of the front rank of the fanatic unit so they only deploy only when the charging unit reaches base contact? Seems a little cumbersome to say the least

Also why would a horde lose it's effectiveness after one death? 39 spearmen in horde formation still make attacks 4 ranks deep when receiving charge.

Doink, my bad, mixed sth. up with the unit being forced to have at least 30 or 40 models. Still, I can only recommend always using NG as blocks with max ranks. That rank bonus is all you get as a goblin

You place the Fatanic unit about 7'' behind the lucky unit's frontage. When your enemy charges, your Fanatics get released before he makes contact. He has to stop. NOW, you want to roll veeeeery low. If you roll low (<8), then the Fanatics will just hit your own unit and pop out on the other side. Sounds bad? Nah. Your enemy then has to end his charge move and...end his movement on top of our little friends. Suddenly, twice the hits. Hilaritiy ensues. I kid you not, it's absolutely hilarious. Bonus points for doing this with EVERY unit or at least a few and some being bluffs. Your enemies will think twice before charging.

I'm going to use this tactic when I finally get to field my Night Goblin army (it's only 800 points atm). It sounds hilarious

Hell yeah it is. The most Goblin tactic that there is.

I currently own:

25 archers, 20 handweapon, 6 spears, 20 fanatics, 9 squig hoppers, 6 squigs with squig herders, 8 snotlings, a doom diver, 2 spear chuckas, and 2 unopened boxes of night goblin regiments.

I was thinking about turning those boxes into spears for a 10x4 but now I'm not sure?

Archers > Spears, imo. More versatile, 5 attacks more don't matter anyway. Too many fanatics, I'd convert some of them to Squig Hoppaz.

Wow 20 fanatics?? I can't see you ever needing more than 12 in a normal game (4 regiments with 3 each). I would put some on square bases to sit in your units and look cool

I think Sigvatr has a point about archers being a good choice. And in terms of what regiment size, buy a few regiment bases of various sizes and experiment. A 10x5 can be used as a 5x10 and that way you can experiment with the different sizes.

Edit: buy regiment bases I mean movement trays.

I do not agree with Sigvatr about archers and speers. For me they are on the same level.
Handweapon shield are great, since you get the illusion of protection with your 6+ invulnerable save. But at the end speers, crosswos or handweapon are all the same rubbish. Nightgobbos aren't good fighters except against dwarfs, but even against them there is the same old problem to wound.

Well I am a big supporter of Skarsnik. His evil plans have ruined many enemies plans so far and he is a decent fighter for a NGoblin. He looks great, Gobbla is fun and his Zap prodder, if it get's through is really nice. Price doesn't matter, it is a Goblin, still cheap if you look at his aquivalents in other armies, that he would totally beat up: Archaon, Thorgrimm, the emperor, Tyrion, Malekith, Nagash, Glottkin, Verminking. He would totally beat them up.

I'm sure it is not 20 but 2 fanatics. 20 is not possible.

I already have a thread up asking about a proper army list, but I figure that it might be worth asking here.
40 Night Goblin spearmen with 3 netters
40 Night Goblin archers
30 Goblins/Night Goblins (spears or hand weapons & possible command + netters) - these are converted Gnoblars
3 fanatics
1 Snotling Pump Wagon
1 Troll (regular)
4 Night Goblin big bosses/Warbosses/etc. (and some extra bitz to make another one?)
2 Night Goblin shamans
1 Spear Chukka
10 forest goblin spider riders
1 Doom Diver Catapult

@youidiotkid

Hi, I will post your thread later tonight too.
It greatly depends on the points and if you go tournament or fluff.
Here a fluff advice
Nice list, but I would add a few more trolls, (3 - 5)
Squighoppaz, and a boss on a greatersquig or/and a gigantuan spider.
Also a arachnarok would look good in it, but fluff wise, you should have more wood goblins, to make it more understandable, why a god is walking among your army. (always with a big shaman on it, so it would be good for a big army)
Here a guide of what to build up fluff wise thinking of a nightgobbo tribe:
more Nightgobbos
10 or more Squigs and Squighoppaz
more night gobbos
3 to six Trolls
more night gobbos
Artillery
more night gobbos
Goblin or Ork "Allies"
more night gobbos

you see where this is going.
every 200 - 500 points a new gargboss, waaghboss or shaman
every 700 a big shaman.

always more night gobbos.

It may not give you a big victory but you are following the idea of night gobbo tribes.
btw. they schould introduce a spell to raise night gobbos like undead, I mean, they are litteraly growing from mushrooms. I don't see an obstacle, that magic can accelerate the process.

Important for Nightgobbos are attacking the flanks and the rear of an enemy unit. Goblin magic supports that greatly. Artillery and shooting is nice, but your best way of winning is getting infantery units in the rear or flank of an enemy, once you have that, the victory should be yours, except you fight, chaos or elves.

I'm mostly going for a fun, fluffy army that can do decently enough in battle that I can manage a couple of victories here and there. The biggest priority is having an army that's both fun to play with and to play against, though. More footsloggers seem like the way to go now, though, right?

Yeah infantery is a tough one and now the battle of the skullpass is gone, which provided a great deal of my footsloggers, so it became even more difficult. I mean it brovided me with 360 of my of my 500 Nightgobbo infantery. Only hope now is a) 3d Print, b) ebay c) buying from GW

 gauckelnder_narr wrote:
I do not agree with Sigvatr about archers and speers. For me they are on the same level.

You agree with me then Both are about equal damage-wise, but bows are more versatile.

Well I am a big supporter of Skarsnik. His evil plans have ruined many enemies plans so far and he is a decent fighter for a NGoblin. He looks great, Gobbla is fun and his Zap prodder, if it get's through is really nice. Price doesn't matter, it is a Goblin, still cheap if you look at his aquivalents in other armies, that he would totally beat up: Archaon, Thorgrimm, the emperor, Tyrion, Malekith, Nagash, Glottkin, Verminking. He would totally beat them up.

If you want an army that's even nigh-competitive, never, ever get Skarsnik. He is grossly overcosted by at least 100 points, he is focused on melee in an army that wants to actively avoid melee and his special ability is very lackluster at its best.

Sigvatr
If you want an army that's even nigh-competitive, never, ever get Skarsnik. He is grossly overcosted by at least 100 points, he is focused on melee in an army that wants to actively avoid melee and his special ability is very lackluster at its best.

Well I'm not playing competitive just for fun and Skarsnik may be expensive for a Goblin but cheap for a special character lord choice in comparison with other armies. And I got several victories with him as a key player. Anyway the main objective for Orks and Goblins is to have fun. And he is a very funny character.

Sigvatr You agree with me then Both are about equal damage-wise, but bows are more versatile.

They can shoot and move yeah, and I always have some in too, but it sounds more like you prefer making them mono in the army and I would rather go with some bows, some spears and some handweapons. that gives more possibilities to answer the enemies army. We all want the 4th edition back, where all goblins, forest goblins and nightgoblins could have 2handweapons. crazy

Actually, I disagree. All NG blocks have the same purpose: tarpit enemies. No NG block will ever win a battle in his own.

Skarsnik isn't cheap in comparison to other Lord Choices as he is very lackluster and cannot hold up to most other lords. But alas, as you said, if you like him, run him.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Actually, I disagree. All NG blocks have the same purpose: tarpit enemies. No NG block will ever win a battle in his own.

Skarsnik isn't cheap in comparison to other Lord Choices as he is very lackluster and cannot hold up to most other lords. But alas, as you said, if you like him, run him.

What makes Skarsnik that bad?

 crazyfoxdemon wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Actually, I disagree. All NG blocks have the same purpose: tarpit enemies. No NG block will ever win a battle in his own.

Skarsnik isn't cheap in comparison to other Lord Choices as he is very lackluster and cannot hold up to most other lords. But alas, as you said, if you like him, run him.

What makes Skarsnik that bad?

I don't think that Sigvatr's trying to say that Skarsnik is bad, he's just very expensive for what you're getting.