Author |
Message |
 |
|
 |
Advert
|
Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
- No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
- Times and dates in your local timezone.
- Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
- Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
- Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now. |
|
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/06 22:58:57
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Sinister Shapeshifter
The Lair of Vengeance....Poole.
|
So. The Clash 15 pack is out. Check it out here
I'm planning on running my casual games under it, as it's probably the most balanced pack out there right now. What are your opinions on it? Asides from the Wood Elf comp, which is just baffling to me.
|
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/07 02:21:00
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 11:11:09
Subject: Re:Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife
|
Full disclosure: i'm biased.
The High and Dark elves restrictions seem heavy handed to me, and it's a little unfair that all of the armies that have had an end times focused book on them get to take some of their new toys, but Elves don't. So elves don't get to have dual prowess', but Skaven get Stormfiends and (while i wouldn't take him personally), the verminlord that has the 12" range, 3" purple sun. Ok.
Chaos dwarf ones are interesting, but there should be some sort of gunline limit, because that's the power list. Though i suppose capping warmachines and making the K'daai Destroyer count as a warmachine is an effective solution as well, as long as we're okay with effective solutions being "reclassifying entire models". I'd almost rather the K'daai be a 0-1 choice rather than counting as 2 warmachines.
Honestly ? I see some good ideas. Most of it appears a touch capricious to me, and a little bit of it seems reactionary and knee jerk (i.e. - There's still Teclis hate ? He had his fangs pulled largely in 8th and is no way near his points anymore, even despite having Lore: Yes in end times magic. Also, i can understand restricting the Banner of the World Dragon, but i can't have that and BoH and a dispel scroll ? Dafuq? ).
I dunno. I have always found custom comp systems just someone's way of grandstanding to say "this is what i don't like about the game" cloaked in an attempt to seem altruistic to bring the struggling armies up to par, no matter how large the venue. So overall, not a fan. Just me. I'm a filthy casually hardcore though, by my own admission.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/07 11:12:07
daedalus wrote:
I mean, it's Dakka. I thought snide arguments from emotion were what we did here.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 14:33:10
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Sinister Shapeshifter
The Lair of Vengeance....Poole.
|
The Teclis thing is basically because of Mat Sewell.
I think the skaven one is because nobody's played Stormfriends competitively. Same with verminbros.
As a Delf player, the dark elf one is needed. Even ETC lets me run a fully fledged cauldron gunline. So, considering the lighthandedness of the comp for the army to date, so a bit of heavy handedness is needed.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 14:58:01
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife
|
thedarkavenger wrote:The Teclis thing is basically because of Mat Sewell.
I think the skaven one is because nobody's played Stormfriends competitively. Same with verminbros.
As a Delf player, the dark elf one is needed. Even ETC lets me run a fully fledged cauldron gunline. So, considering the lighthandedness of the comp for the army to date, so a bit of heavy handedness is needed.
I still don't get Teclis. Full disclosure, no idea who Matt Sewell is. As i said, i'm casually hardcore.  End times gave him a little bit of balls back, but prior to end times magic he was a really expensive take compared to his 7th ed incarnation.
Fair on Dark elfs. There's some disgusting things they can do. Though i can't say i'm a fan of pendulumism (meaning "oh we were easy on them last time around, so time for some down-home dick hammering.").
Curious on your thoughts about Chaos Dwarves ?
Edit: small, but important point of clarity in grammar.
|
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/07 14:59:02
daedalus wrote:
I mean, it's Dakka. I thought snide arguments from emotion were what we did here.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 15:36:18
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Sinister Shapeshifter
The Lair of Vengeance....Poole.
|
Haight wrote: thedarkavenger wrote:The Teclis thing is basically because of Mat Sewell.
I think the skaven one is because nobody's played Stormfriends competitively. Same with verminbros.
As a Delf player, the dark elf one is needed. Even ETC lets me run a fully fledged cauldron gunline. So, considering the lighthandedness of the comp for the army to date, so a bit of heavy handedness is needed.
I still don't get Teclis. Full disclosure, no idea who Matt Sewell is. As i said, i'm casually hardcore.  End times gave him a little bit of balls back, but prior to end times magic he was a really expensive take compared to his 7th ed incarnation.
Fair on Dark elfs. There's some disgusting things they can do. Though i can't say i'm a fan of pendulumism (meaning "oh we were easy on them last time around, so time for some down-home dick hammering.").
Curious on your thoughts about Chaos Dwarves ?
Edit: small, but important point of clarity in grammar.
The delf comp has recently been too soft, as it's just limiting fast cav. Not cauldron shooting. Not soulblights, Fast cav.
As for chaos dorfs, I don't care. The stuff in the army does different things every game. Also, #notarealarmy.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 18:10:48
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Confessor Of Sins
WA, USA
|
I get most of it, though I can't say I understand why Cloak of Twilight denies the use of a Dispel Scroll.
|
Ouze wrote:
Afterward, Curran killed a guy in the parking lot with a trident.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 18:26:31
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
Overall: good. Shots rule is weird and not really well-thought out. 200 NG archers have as much hitting power as 200 NG spear-armored Goblins yet wouldn't be allowed. The problem with limiting it to shots is that it automatically assumes all shots are equally strong, which is a logical fallacy. Not sure why there's an additional restriction gimping Goblin armies in regards to taking WM.
|
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/07 18:28:06
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 19:00:19
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife
|
thedarkavenger wrote: Haight wrote: thedarkavenger wrote:The Teclis thing is basically because of Mat Sewell.
I think the skaven one is because nobody's played Stormfriends competitively. Same with verminbros.
As a Delf player, the dark elf one is needed. Even ETC lets me run a fully fledged cauldron gunline. So, considering the lighthandedness of the comp for the army to date, so a bit of heavy handedness is needed.
I still don't get Teclis. Full disclosure, no idea who Matt Sewell is. As i said, i'm casually hardcore.  End times gave him a little bit of balls back, but prior to end times magic he was a really expensive take compared to his 7th ed incarnation.
Fair on Dark elfs. There's some disgusting things they can do. Though i can't say i'm a fan of pendulumism (meaning "oh we were easy on them last time around, so time for some down-home dick hammering.").
Curious on your thoughts about Chaos Dwarves ?
Edit: small, but important point of clarity in grammar.
. Also, #notarealarmy.
The comp system you endorsed seems to imply otherwise, but the last thing i want to do is make this yet another thread about whether or not forgeworld things are okay or not. It yields absolutely nothing fruitful.
|
daedalus wrote:
I mean, it's Dakka. I thought snide arguments from emotion were what we did here.
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 19:15:28
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
Chaos Dwards are a fully legit army and fully supported and endorsed by all major tournaments.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 19:15:47
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Sinister Shapeshifter
The Lair of Vengeance....Poole.
|
Sigvatr wrote:Overall: good. Shots rule is weird and not really well-thought out. 200 NG archers have as much hitting power as 200 NG spear-armored Goblins yet wouldn't be allowed. The problem with limiting it to shots is that it automatically assumes all shots are equally strong, which is a logical fallacy. Not sure why there's an additional restriction gimping Goblin armies in regards to taking WM.
It's more to stop armies like the 100 NG archers with poisoned arrows, the 100 Trueflight Wood Elves, and the Dark Elf Cauldron Gunline.
Haight wrote: thedarkavenger wrote: Haight wrote: thedarkavenger wrote:The Teclis thing is basically because of Mat Sewell.
I think the skaven one is because nobody's played Stormfriends competitively. Same with verminbros.
As a Delf player, the dark elf one is needed. Even ETC lets me run a fully fledged cauldron gunline. So, considering the lighthandedness of the comp for the army to date, so a bit of heavy handedness is needed.
I still don't get Teclis. Full disclosure, no idea who Matt Sewell is. As i said, i'm casually hardcore.  End times gave him a little bit of balls back, but prior to end times magic he was a really expensive take compared to his 7th ed incarnation.
Fair on Dark elfs. There's some disgusting things they can do. Though i can't say i'm a fan of pendulumism (meaning "oh we were easy on them last time around, so time for some down-home dick hammering.").
Curious on your thoughts about Chaos Dwarves ?
Edit: small, but important point of clarity in grammar.
. Also, #notarealarmy.
The comp system you endorsed seems to imply otherwise, but the last thing i want to do is make this yet another thread about whether or not forgeworld things are okay or not. It yields absolutely nothing fruitful.
I think you should check the army commentaries on the Clash website.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 19:16:54
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Decrepit Dakkanaut
|
thedarkavenger wrote: Sigvatr wrote:Overall: good. Shots rule is weird and not really well-thought out. 200 NG archers have as much hitting power as 200 NG spear-armored Goblins yet wouldn't be allowed. The problem with limiting it to shots is that it automatically assumes all shots are equally strong, which is a logical fallacy. Not sure why there's an additional restriction gimping Goblin armies in regards to taking WM.
It's more to stop armies like the 100 NG archers with poisoned arrows, the 100 Trueflight Wood Elves, and the Dark Elf Cauldron Gunline.
People actually fear 100 NG archers with poison arrows?
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 19:20:15
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Sinister Shapeshifter
The Lair of Vengeance....Poole.
|
Sigvatr wrote: thedarkavenger wrote: Sigvatr wrote:Overall: good. Shots rule is weird and not really well-thought out. 200 NG archers have as much hitting power as 200 NG spear-armored Goblins yet wouldn't be allowed. The problem with limiting it to shots is that it automatically assumes all shots are equally strong, which is a logical fallacy. Not sure why there's an additional restriction gimping Goblin armies in regards to taking WM.
It's more to stop armies like the 100 NG archers with poisoned arrows, the 100 Trueflight Wood Elves, and the Dark Elf Cauldron Gunline.
People actually fear 100 NG archers with poison arrows? 
When people play the list correctly, then you have to.
|
|
|
 |
 |
![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/02/07 19:50:32
Subject: Clash 15 Pack. Opinions?
|
 |
Regular Dakkanaut
|
Haight wrote:Chaos dwarf ones are interesting, but there should be some sort of gunline limit, because that's the power list. Though i suppose capping warmachines and making the K'daai Destroyer count as a warmachine is an effective solution as well, as long as we're okay with effective solutions being "reclassifying entire models". I'd almost rather the K'daai be a 0-1 choice rather than counting as 2 warmachines.
I dunno. I have always found custom comp systems just someone's way of grandstanding to say "this is what i don't like about the game" cloaked in an attempt to seem altruistic to bring the struggling armies up to par, no matter how large the venue. So overall, not a fan. Just me. I'm a filthy casually hardcore though, by my own admission. 
thedarkavenger wrote:As for chaos dorfs, I don't care. The stuff in the army does different things every game. Also, #notarealarmy.
this.
|
|
|
 |
 |
|