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 soomemafia wrote:
How do you guys split between Swords and Axes with the Sanguinary Guard.
I haven't been using them for a while but seeing all the positive comments makes me want to try them again.
My current SG of five guys has two Swords, two Axes and a Fist.
The Sanguinary Priest with them also has Sword (or Valour's Edge in the new book I guess).

I'm of the opinion that if you can find the points taking PFs over axes is the way to go. So on a unit of 5 dudes, 3 swords and 2 fists. 10pts is great value for a Pfist and the axe offers no other benefit apart from been 10 pts cheaper...

I also like the idea of the SS captain sponge to LoS ap2 <S8 with this unit....

D

>

So question. I've started Blood Angels recently (first SM army). Picked up a Vanguard Veteran kit, but am now wondering if it would be better to build them as Assault Marines. And then use the weapon bitz for my Death Company.

This one:
Baal Stikeforce

HQ

Sanguinary Priest
Jump Pack, Valours Edge, Bolt Pistol
96pts

Elites

Sanguinary Guard
5man
Chapter Banner, Power Fist, Infernus Pistol
210pts

Death Company
8man
Jump Packs, 2 Power Weapons, 2 Power Fists
264pts

Furioso Dreadnought
Frag Cannon, Magna Grapple, Heavy Flamer
(In a drop pod)
165pts

Troops

Tactical Squad
5man
Plasma Gun, Sergeant with Combi-Plasma
(In a las/plas Razorback)
180pts

Tactical Squad
5man
Plasma Gun, Sergeant with Combi-Plasma
(in a las/plas Razorback)
180pts

Fast Attack

Assault Squad
5man
2 Meltaguns, Sergeant with Combi-Melta
(in a Drop Pod)
115pts

Assault Squad
5man
2 Meltaguns, Sergeant with Combi-Melta
(in a Drop Pod)
115pts]

Heavy Support

Predator
Autocannon, Lascannon sponsons, Overcharged Engines
125pts

Predator
Autocannon, Lascannon Sponsons, Overcharged Engines
125pts

Stormraven Gunship
Assault Cannon, Multi-Melta, Extra Armour
205pts

=2000




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Happyjew wrote:
So question. I've started Blood Angels recently (first SM army). Picked up a Vanguard Veteran kit, but am now wondering if it would be better to build them as Assault Marines.

Depends on the type of list that you want to build really.
Assault marines can remove their jp and get a free drop pod if you like that kind of army, whilst vanguards are probably better using the formation that gives you a free power weapon or lightning claw on the squad (must be 10man) as well as free combis on the sternguard squads.

Pretty decent list. Very little fat to trim. I'd say the DC is overequipped. I'd drop the powerweapons, definitely drop the infernus pistol off the SG find a few more pts and take 2 extra DC. Then split the DC into 2 5's with a powerfist in each.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Happyjew wrote:
So question. I've started Blood Angels recently (first SM army). Picked up a Vanguard Veteran kit, but am now wondering if it would be better to build them as Assault Marines. And then use the weapon bitz for my Death Company.

You'll want 20 to run the formation with free powerweapons. Looks worth it. I wouldn't use them as VVs outside the formation.

Quick question: Have you opened the box yet? If not try and take it back!!! Not because it's VVs but because the monopose models in that box are not balanced very well at all, do not stick very easily and snap in a gentle breeze.

Ok, thanks for the feedback. The power weapons are mainly there for anti meq and the infernus pistol is to try to pop a tank when doa with dante. I originally had a 10man death company squad in my list, but I would rather up the number of sanguinary guard (most likely 8).

Yeh if you are deepstriking I suppose it's not too bad. If not deepstriking infernus pistols are pointless as if within 3" you will be charging and destroying it anyway.
Yeh I still can't decide whether to go for more SG or more DC either. It's a toughy! But a good difficult BA decision for once!

Tbf what you have above is a very decent list.

Thanks man, seems were are on the same wave length I suppose for me, my list includes dante and a priest, so by that I should be creating a dantestar.

Poly Ranger wrote:

 Happyjew wrote:
So question. I've started Blood Angels recently (first SM army). Picked up a Vanguard Veteran kit, but am now wondering if it would be better to build them as Assault Marines. And then use the weapon bitz for my Death Company.

You'll want 20 to run the formation with free powerweapons. Looks worth it. I wouldn't use them as VVs outside the formation.

Quick question: Have you opened the box yet? If not try and take it back!!! Not because it's VVs but because the monopose models in that box are not balanced very well at all, do not stick very easily and snap in a gentle breeze.

Unfortunately I've already opened it. I was considering building them as Assault Marines, and saving the collection of weapons for other purposes, such as upgrading characters, and/or Death Company.

Hang on... we are talking about the finecast VV squad right? Because their weapons are already attached to their hands. Or is there a new box?

 evildrcheese wrote:

 soomemafia wrote:
How do you guys split between Swords and Axes with the Sanguinary Guard.
I haven't been using them for a while but seeing all the positive comments makes me want to try them again.
My current SG of five guys has two Swords, two Axes and a Fist.
The Sanguinary Priest with them also has Sword (or Valour's Edge in the new book I guess).

I'm of the opinion that if you can find the points taking PFs over axes is the way to go. So on a unit of 5 dudes, 3 swords and 2 fists. 10pts is great value for a Pfist and the axe offers no other benefit apart from been 10 pts cheaper...

I also like the idea of the SS captain sponge to LoS ap2 <S8 with this unit....

D

>

The Axe also has Master-crafted and with WS5 that often means an extra hit.
So 3 hits with S5AP2 or two with higher S?

And I don't like the Captain idea. The squad costs a fortune already and adding extra 150 points just to save a couple of SGuard is not worth it.
It would also fill your HQ section, meaning no more FnP, no Corbulo, Mephiston, Librarian etc.

@Poly Ranger

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Vanguard-Veteran-Squad

This one. It's $7 (USD) more than Assault Marines, but comes with a bunch of melee weapons.

Ah sweet! Hadn't realised they'd released a new set. Discount what I said earlier, I've been very disappointed with the finecast version, this version looks a lot better by the sounds of it!

What would you guys say are the biggest weaknesses of the BA codex?

I understand the being an assault army in a shooty edition problem; might ally imperial forces remedy the problem?

Lack of a true death star, and a lack of long ranged firepower outside of heavy support. Also, limited anti air.

Allies? Probably either standard marines or guard.

I would say many of our weaknesses can be countered by IA:2. Although we get less access to the goodies in there than any other chapter.
GW have done a good job on the dex, there is no 'uber unit' that you can make a death star around as th3maninblak says.

We have pitfall units like the baal pred, there is no way an assault cannon is worth 30pts more than an autocannon and its absolutely laughable to say the same about a flamestorm. There are not as many pitfall units as some dexes though. If we try and shoehorn our old styles into the new dex we lose a lot of optimization, we no longer have av13 lists, mass razor lists, full jp lists etc.

The biggest 'weakness' we have is how well externally balanced our codex is with everyone else if you take out the top tier. Which obviously means it's not a top tier dex... that however, is not a bad thing.

I'd say another weakness is the temptation to take limited long ranged firepower, requiring us to destroy vehicles in combat. Not great when firedragons, wraiths with scythes, plasma totting weapons teams etc, piles out of it.

 th3maninblak wrote:
Lack of a true death star, and a lack of long ranged firepower outside of heavy support. Also, limited anti air.

Allies? Probablyn either standard marines or guard.

not completely true, imo. Long ranged fire we have in Fast with Typhoon Speeders and in Elite we can pick Dreaddies.

I think this codex lacks of Ignore Cover fire and of an efficient way to bring our units in HtH combat. Allies that can help us are psykers with access to Telepathy; ignores cover may be found with Astra Militarum.

Can I ask how you guys would go about adding 3 more sg to my list? Thanks


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Any of you guys got in any games recently?

You could drop 2 DC, a powerweapon and extra armour off the raven - that will get you 2 more SG if you want to go down that route.

Cool, thanks.

Just out of curiosity, what is the best way to run Death Company? As of right now, I have 5 unassembled from Deathstorm. But I'm not quite sure the way to go with them.

 Happyjew wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what is the best way to run Death Company? As of right now, I have 5 unassembled from Deathstorm. But I'm not quite sure the way to go with them.

I'm a big proponent of 2 X power fist and 10 X jump pack. Done. I usually put in libby level 2 with sanguinius discipline and valor's edge.

The Deer Hunter wrote:

 th3maninblak wrote:
Lack of a true death star, and a lack of long ranged firepower outside of heavy support. Also, limited anti air.

Allies? Probablyn either standard marines or guard.

not completely true, imo. Long ranged fire we have in Fast with Typhoon Speeders and in Elite we can pick Dreaddies.

I think this codex lacks of Ignore Cover fire and of an efficient way to bring our units in HtH combat. Allies that can help us are psykers with access to Telepathy; ignores cover may be found with Astra Militarum.

The regular Dreadnoughts are propably the worst use of Elite section. Typhoons might work tough...
I have no problem with "lack of long ranged firepower outside of heavy support". That's what HS is for.

What do you guys think of devastators in the new codex? Can they provide some answers to the lack of long-range firepower, or are they a way to squander the limited HS slots?

As soon as they raise their heads to get a shot off, they're going to snapfire then get bounced by a board-range ap2-3 blast.

All the star heavy weapon boys nowadays don't care if they had to move first.

I tried devs with flak missiles as an AA options against my mates nids (Flyrant :( )....

I found for the points they were not at all worth it

Hmm I figured hey weren't all that amazing since virtually none of the lists I've seen have them.

Does anyone know of any blogs/sites that have done a full tactical review of the new codex, preferably by experienced BA players? I'm looking for unit-by-unit analysis type of stuff.

Coming from IG I know all the good sites for Guard but it took a long time to find them, so if someone could help guide me I'd appreciate it!

I think it's because in our Heavy slots there are better units (Raven, Vindi, Tri-las preds....)..

For a full breakdown/discussion this is the only one I know of:

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Tactics/Blood_Angels%287E%29

sm3g wrote:
I think it's because in our Heavy slots there are better units (Raven, Vindi, Tri-las preds....)..

For a full breakdown/discussion this is the only one I know of:

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Warhammer_40,000/Tactics/Blood_Angels%287E%29

Ah yes, I've read this over before. It's good but seems to give very conflicting evaluations of each unit. Still a good read, thank you for replying!

Martel732 wrote:

 Happyjew wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what is the best way to run Death Company? As of right now, I have 5 unassembled from Deathstorm. But I'm not quite sure the way to go with them.

I'm a big proponent of 2 X power fist and 10 X jump pack. Done. I usually put in libby level 2 with sanguinius discipline and valor's edge.

So 10 DC Marines with Jump packs, 2 of which have Power Fists?

 Happyjew wrote:
Just out of curiosity, what is the best way to run Death Company? As of right now, I have 5 unassembled from Deathstorm. But I'm not quite sure the way to go with them.

I think the standard is about 1 powerfist and 1 power weapon per 5 guys. Perhaps a unit of 10 with 2 fists and 1 power weapon would be suitable.