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So, the Emperor has been around for roughly 48000 years.

So before he was interred into the Golden Throne he was alive for 40K years...

why is he deteriorating on the throne then?

Whats causing a perpetual to die or die slowly?

Because he was killed. His soul has just refused to vacate the premises.

When Malcador sat upon the throne, it took so much out of him that he literally turned to dust after he was unhooked. Even if you subscribe to the theory that the Emperor shall rise once he dies, the Throne is sapping his strength to keep the astronomican running and holding back the daemons. Basically, have you ever watched The Mummy?

 Johnnytorrance wrote:
So, the Emperor has been around for roughly 48000 years.

So before he was interred into the Golden Throne he was alive for 40K years...

why is he deteriorating on the throne then?

Whats causing a perpetual to die or die slowly?

I don't remember the timeline.. but it was real quick ... after he was hooked up on the GT... he stop communicating with the outside world with in weeks or a few years... not even century or anything like that.. real fast.

All this time even now..... he is fighting demons trying to break into the GT gate. So he is the Astromacion (sp) and fighting demons at the same time for 10,000 years on the GT.

I might be mistaken....

Cause he's physically dead.

Well the Throne keeps him alive, but alive doesn't mean healthy. It could be supplying him with enough nutrients to keep his mind working, but 10K years of not moving will have made his muscles fade away, and then rot as bacteria settles below the skin.

Considering he's a skeleton, using words such as "alive" aren't really all that relevant to his current condition. Corpse Emperor indeed. Of course, it's not like he really needs the body anyway. He's more or less already a warp god.

Because he really is dead, his soul was removed from his body.

 Wyzilla wrote:
Considering he's a skeleton, using words such as "alive" aren't really all that relevant to his current condition. Corpse Emperor indeed. Of course, it's not like he really needs the body anyway. He's more or less already a warp god.

The old fluff stated that the reason he ordered the Golden Throne to be converted into a life support system is because his body is still a powerful conduit into the material realm for him.

 david choe wrote:

 Johnnytorrance wrote:
So, the Emperor has been around for roughly 48000 years.

So before he was interred into the Golden Throne he was alive for 40K years...

why is he deteriorating on the throne then?

Whats causing a perpetual to die or die slowly?

I don't remember the timeline.. but it was real quick ... after he was hooked up on the GT... he stop communicating with the outside world with in weeks or a few years... not even century or anything like that.. real fast.

All this time even now..... he is fighting demons trying to break into the GT gate. So he is the Astromacion (sp) and fighting demons at the same time for 10,000 years on the GT.

I might be mistaken....

Astronomican was just fine when the Emperor was out crusading with the First Legion, so Astronomican has nothing to do with the Golden Throne.

 dusara217 wrote:

Astronomican was just fine when the Emperor was out crusading with the First Legion, so Astronomican has nothing to do with the Golden Throne.

Yeah, this actually always bugged the hell out of me.

I just wrote it off as the astronomicon being maintained through the thousands of psykers sacrificed to it every day and that the Emperor's will keeps it lit. As his will waivers, the light dims. No volume of sacrificial psykers will change that.

The GT tie in for me is that it keeps his conduit to the material realm and continues to will the damn thing to be lit.

 Shidank wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:

Astronomican was just fine when the Emperor was out crusading with the First Legion, so Astronomican has nothing to do with the Golden Throne.

Yeah, this actually always bugged the hell out of me.

I just wrote it off as the astronomicon being maintained through the thousands of psykers sacrificed to it every day and that the Emperor's will keeps it lit. As his will waivers, the light dims. No volume of sacrificial psykers will change that.

The GT tie in for me is that it keeps his conduit to the material realm and continues to will the damn thing to be lit.

This has already been addressed in the Black Library fluff, apparently, although I forget which book it came from (it got added to the wiki when that book came out but now the page has so many sources listed that I dunno which source this was exactly from)

During the Great Crusade, the Emperor powered the Astronomicon himself with his psychic power. Back then the Imperium was small enough that he could do it without too much distraction. But as the Imperium grew, it got harder and harder and even almost got him killed once. That's when he came up with the idea of the sacrificing of psykers to ease up the burden (or maybe Malcador suggested it to him. I forget. EDIT: Oh, he needed the psyker sacrifices so he could focus more on the webway project, and it was indeed Malcador's suggestion). He didn't LIKE that solution, but he figured it was just a temporary thing until his webway project got finished. One of the reasons he had to withdraw after declaring Horus Warmaster was because by then the Imperium was so large that he couldn't power the Astronomicon from a distance anymore.

Of course, then the Horus Heresy happened so his temporary solution of psyker sacrifice and him being confined to the golden throne became a permanent one.

Thanks! I'd like to read this fluff sometime. If you ever remember, please let us know!

Addendum: Oh, he needed the psyker sacrifices so he could focus more on the webway project, and it was indeed Malcador's suggestion

 Shidank wrote:
Thanks! I'd like to read this fluff sometime. If you ever remember, please let us know!

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Astronomican

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/index.php?title=Astronomican&diff=165586&oldid=136619


Judging by the edit history of this page, it would appear that fluff comes from Horus Heresy Book One: Betrayal, from Forge World (which I guess might make it even more "canon" than Black Library? Depending on how you look at it, I guess) (explains why it's really good logical fluff, IMHO. Forge World is generally very good with fluff)

I could be wrong, just to warn you. But given that "Betrayal" was added to the sources on the same day that the page was updated to include that fluff, I'd say that's probably it.

Because its also failing.

Its ability to operate drops slowly, the tech is way too advanced for them to mend. The golden throne will fail, be in hundreds, thousands, its going to break. The Emperor will die.

Which might actually be a good thing, maybe. Problem is, no one knows for sure. Maybe he'll reappear somewhere in the galaxy, in his Final Form, ready to kick ass and chew bubble-gum...

... or maybe he's reborn to regular human parents as a baby and has to grow into his powers once again. This would be bad.

 Psienesis wrote:
Which might actually be a good thing, maybe. Problem is, no one knows for sure. Maybe he'll reappear somewhere in the galaxy, in his Final Form, ready to kick ass and chew bubble-gum...

... or maybe he's reborn to regular human parents as a baby and has to grow into his powers once again. This would be bad.

How did you come up with this solution? Did you use the Chaos Theory to solved this problem? Did you consult Edward Lorenz to get this solution?

It's one of the more highly popularized theories of the Emperor's death.

Or he ceases to have a place in the material world and is forced to create his own daemons to help him combat the other Gods of the Warp, since he is now a vulnerable Warp God with not tether to the physical world.

 dusara217 wrote:
Or he ceases to have a place in the material world and is forced to create his own daemons to help him combat the other Gods of the Warp, since he is now a vulnerable Warp God with not tether to the physical world.

If the emperor is a warp god, and if this was the case, he would actually be one of the strongest gods in the warp almost immediately, possible more powerful than any of the 4 chaos gods singly and maybe combined. Chaos god powers are said to be fuelled by their followers, the big E has a LOT of worshippers, he would have warp power for fun to make daemon after daemon if he so pleased.

Probably struggle with Gork and/or Mork if they ever got their act together though.

 david choe wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Which might actually be a good thing, maybe. Problem is, no one knows for sure. Maybe he'll reappear somewhere in the galaxy, in his Final Form, ready to kick ass and chew bubble-gum...

... or maybe he's reborn to regular human parents as a baby and has to grow into his powers once again. This would be bad.

How did you come up with this solution? Did you use the Chaos Theory to solved this problem? Did you consult Edward Lorenz to get this solution?

Because the Emperor is a Perpetual, according to the HH novels, and this is the manner in which Perpetuals who "die" are returned to life. They either just reappear somewhere, or are re-born.

That raises a valid point. Do we have confirmation that the unique being of the Emperor is a Perpetual?


We have evidence to suggest so, but do we have a confirmation?

I think Grammaticus says something about the Emperor being 'one of us' or something like that, in Legion where he's saying about meeting the Emperor.

I think I vaguely remember the scene you're talking about.

I'm not fighting the Emperor being a Perpetual, I'm just wanting a little more drilled down knowledge of exactly....how?

 Psienesis wrote:

 david choe wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Which might actually be a good thing, maybe. Problem is, no one knows for sure. Maybe he'll reappear somewhere in the galaxy, in his Final Form, ready to kick ass and chew bubble-gum...

... or maybe he's reborn to regular human parents as a baby and has to grow into his powers once again. This would be bad.

How did you come up with this solution? Did you use the Chaos Theory to solved this problem? Did you consult Edward Lorenz to get this solution?

Because the Emperor is a Perpetual, according to the HH novels, and this is the manner in which Perpetuals who "die" are returned to life. They either just reappear somewhere, or are re-born.

Lol....you didn't get the joke.

Shidank wrote:I think I vaguely remember the scene you're talking about.

I'm not fighting the Emperor being a Perpetual, I'm just wanting a little more drilled down knowledge of exactly....how?

Yeahhh I don't know haha. I don't think there's anything in the fluff past that he is a perpetual.

david choe wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:

 david choe wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Which might actually be a good thing, maybe. Problem is, no one knows for sure. Maybe he'll reappear somewhere in the galaxy, in his Final Form, ready to kick ass and chew bubble-gum...

... or maybe he's reborn to regular human parents as a baby and has to grow into his powers once again. This would be bad.

How did you come up with this solution? Did you use the Chaos Theory to solved this problem? Did you consult Edward Lorenz to get this solution?

Because the Emperor is a Perpetual, according to the HH novels, and this is the manner in which Perpetuals who "die" are returned to life. They either just reappear somewhere, or are re-born.

Lol....you didn't get the joke.

I'd hardly call it a joke.

 ImAGeek wrote:

Shidank wrote:I think I vaguely remember the scene you're talking about.

I'm not fighting the Emperor being a Perpetual, I'm just wanting a little more drilled down knowledge of exactly....how?

Yeahhh I don't know haha. I don't think there's anything in the fluff past that he is a perpetual.

david choe wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:

 david choe wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Which might actually be a good thing, maybe. Problem is, no one knows for sure. Maybe he'll reappear somewhere in the galaxy, in his Final Form, ready to kick ass and chew bubble-gum...

... or maybe he's reborn to regular human parents as a baby and has to grow into his powers once again. This would be bad.

How did you come up with this solution? Did you use the Chaos Theory to solved this problem? Did you consult Edward Lorenz to get this solution?

Because the Emperor is a Perpetual, according to the HH novels, and this is the manner in which Perpetuals who "die" are returned to life. They either just reappear somewhere, or are re-born.

Lol....you didn't get the joke.

I'd hardly call it a joke.

You wouldn't call it that because you are still stuck with the other chaos theory in the storm with Tzeentch back in the other post

Yes. That's exactly why. Spot on.

Nothing about it being asinine or pointless, and just not funny. Definitely not. And again, I wasn't talking about chaos theory earlier. I don't know anything about chaos theory. I was talking 40k chaos. Dunno why you're still not getting that after I've said about three times.

 ImAGeek wrote:
Yes. That's exactly why. Spot on.

Nothing about it being asinine or pointless, and just not funny. Definitely not. And again, I wasn't talking about chaos theory earlier. I don't know anything about chaos theory. I was talking 40k chaos. Dunno why you're still not getting that after I've said about three times.

Didn't you suggested that to advance science....you have to study Chaos just like gravity and tornados need to be study to advance science.... the asinine part is how you suggested that to understand Science..you need to study Chaos too. In universe....Man have advanced to the Dark Age of Technology and built the Iron Man (the most advanced phase in Man's civilization history) with out even knowing of the Chaos god. Ooops lets get back to GT topic.

Do you have an actual rebuttal for the Emperor's state of being a Perpetual, as we're told in the HH novels?

 ImAGeek wrote:
I think Grammaticus says something about the Emperor being 'one of us' or something like that, in Legion where he's saying about meeting the Emperor.

But then the question is, is he an actual perpetual or a manufactured one. Grammaticus is only a perpetual after the machinations of the Cabal, same as Damon Prytanis

EDIT: Answered in Know No Fear

I'm only what I am now thanks to xenos intervention. You, you're a true Perpetual. You're still like him

Says Grammaticus