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I've played a lot against my GK friend and despite him loving the new buffs that GKT have gotten with the new book, it still leaves a lot to be desired for several units like Dreadnoughts, BC, and Techmarines.

The biggest disappointment however is Strike Squads and how they're effectively a non-choice for pure (and even allied) GK lists given that they can't compete with the vastly more cost efficient GKT.

So what would bring Strike Squads as a viable alternative to GKT? A 3 ppm price drop? Does it have to do more with the inherent issue of salvo on psycannons for non-relentless platforms? Or...maybe make them act like psychic beacons? Have it so they either can buy teleport homers or have a special rule like:

First to the Fray: Grey Knight Strike Squads act as the tip of the spear that guides the rest of the silvered blade of the GK into battle. If held in Deep Strike reserve, GK Strike Squads do not require a dice roll to decide whether or not they can be deployed, they can come on automatically after Turn 1 (or on Turn 1 if taking the Nemesis Strike Force) if the player so chooses. All GK strike squads that Deep Strike must always deploy via Deep Strike first before any other non-GK strike squad unit held in reserve with Deep Strike. After these deep strikes are done, subsequent GK units that deep strike do not scatter if they deploy within 6" of a GK strike squad that deep struck that turn.

That's all I've got for now, any suggestions?

So they'd basically be really expensive homing beacons?

Strike Squads were good exactly as they were with psybolt ammo and no salvo. Fix salvo, because it's a stupid rule, and bring back psybolt ammo. Done.

Though the new cc weapon costs are much better balanced, they should stay.

Stormraven helps them out tremendously.

But i agree that they feel a bit underwhelming together with dreadnoughts.

You could make up a formation of Strikes + Dreads to make them viable, for example.

Something like:

2 squads of strikes
1 dread

- The whole formation gets deepstrike and can arrive from reserves turn 1 rerolling failed results.
- Units in this formation get relentless.

Will fit the deepstriking spam theme. This way we fix a problem with salvo psy-cannons.

Or you could make them interesting for a non-alpha-striking game instead. Could be done too, i suppose.

- Units in this formation get Scout and Crusader.
- Dreadnought gets 5++ and Preferred Enemy. Grants units from this formation Preferred Enemy when they are within 12".

This way you could buff a dread to 4++ which is very handy! And scout helps them get in place to either shoot psy-cannons or push a flank. However, they won't benefit from preferred enemy if they just bunker in a rhino. Also forces decisions which is good.

 koooaei wrote:
Stormraven helps them out tremendously.

But i agree that they feel a bit underwhelming together with dreadnoughts.

You could make up a formation of Strikes + Dreads to make them viable, for example.

Something like:

2 squads of strikes
1 dread

- The whole formation gets deepstrike and can arrive from reserves turn 1 rerolling failed results.
- Units in this formation get relentless.

Will fit the deepstriking spam theme. This way we fix a problem with salvo psy-cannons.

Or you could make them interesting for a non-alpha-striking game instead. Could be done too, i suppose.

- Units in this formation get Scout and Crusader.
- Dreadnought gets 5++ and Preferred Enemy. Grants units from this formation Preferred Enemy when they are within 12".

This way you could buff a dread to 4++ which is very handy! And scout helps them get in place to either shoot psy-cannons or push a flank. However, they won't benefit from preferred enemy if they just bunker in a rhino. Also forces decisions which is good.

Great ideas Koooaei! Seems like formations are the way to go in fixing some of the issues for units nowadays huh. Was hoping there would be a more intrinsic way of making the unit viable, but given that salvo rules aren't going to change anytime soon...

Make psybolt a psychic power they know? Warp charge one blessing, if it goes off their storm bolters are S5 until the next turn?

Salvo has fethed two of my favorite armies now it needs to die. That said I think strikes would return to relevance simply with access to melta. Make it a unique ordo weapon or a psych power or whatever but give them some ap1-2 ranged.

Well, they should give Pilencers something more. Force looks cool on paper, but do a little math and you're often better off just whittling down the target with Psycannons, and Psilencers can't even hurt Wraithknights or vehicles. If Psilencers had Rending, though, even if they stayed Heavy they would suddenly become a very, very viable alternative to Psycannons, while still being able to at least hurt vehicles.

New Salvo rule really killed my love for strike squads. Loss of psybolt ammo even made it worse. If they gave them a psychic power that either gave them psybolt, or relentless(like Biomancy Endurance) for a turn it would really help them out. I think those powers wouldn't break the game while making them more viable.

 koooaei wrote:
Stormraven helps them out tremendously.

But i agree that they feel a bit underwhelming together with dreadnoughts.

You could make up a formation of Strikes + Dreads to make them viable, for example.

Something like:

2 squads of strikes
1 dread

- The whole formation gets deepstrike and can arrive from reserves turn 1 rerolling failed results.
- Units in this formation get relentless.

Will fit the deepstriking spam theme. This way we fix a problem with salvo psy-cannons.

Or you could make them interesting for a non-alpha-striking game instead. Could be done too, i suppose.

- Units in this formation get Scout and Crusader.
- Dreadnought gets 5++ and Preferred Enemy. Grants units from this formation Preferred Enemy when they are within 12".

This way you could buff a dread to 4++ which is very handy! And scout helps them get in place to either shoot psy-cannons or push a flank. However, they won't benefit from preferred enemy if they just bunker in a rhino. Also forces decisions which is good.

Though I like these ideas, I think they are actually a better fit for Purgation Squads and Dreadnaughts. Giving Purgation squads Relentless actually makes them able to use Psilencers and the new Psycannon.

I guess the general question I have is what is it exactly that makes us not play with Strike Squads right now. Lowering the price doesn't really help when they are already 55 points cheaper than the unit we are using instead of them already.

I don't run them often personally because I usually only run 1 Troop in the NSF, so the extra survivability is useful, along with the higher base attacks and leadership of the Terminators. They become my Troop of choice if I am really tight on points and can't cut them anywhere else.

I like the idea of the Deep Strike advanced team, but think you should limit it to 1 unit can Deep Strike without scattering within 6" per Strike squad. Otherwise there is the chance that people will just take one bear Strike Squad and place them say 7-9 inches away from a really valuable unit and drop the mother of all Alpha Strikes on them with Dreadknights or other Incinerator armed units. The limitation would give a benefit without people calling cheese (well, as much).

Sadly, I think we are stuck with the Salvo rules for the foreseeable future.

No one uses them as they take points away from Dreadknights, Draigo, and Imperial Knights.