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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 13:52:09
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Psienesis wrote: hotsauceman1 wrote:I think 10$ is perfect for what min wage is meant for. Teenagers and college students working for spending money.
It is not meant to support a 40 yr.
You want a job, go train for one. a guard card is 200 in california, and depending on the establishment, you could get 600 a night
Except that's a universe that is not the one we live in. Security here makes minimum wage unless you work security for a place that is a union shop (like Virginia Mason hospital). Nearly half the people being hired to minimum wage jobs are over the age of 21, and of that half, something like a third have families.
$10 is, in the Seattle area, in no way, shape, or form a livable wage.
What is a "living wage" in Seattle? How is it that figure determined?
If increasing the minimum wage is a purely beneficial move why delay it for 7 years? If it's a great idea wherein everyone benefits then there was no need to do a slow phase in, make minimum wage in Seattle $15/ hr and have it go into effect tomorrow. Boom, problem solved everyone is happy, right? By the time it's 2022 and people in Seattle earn $15/ hr for minimum wage is that really going to give them a significant increase in purchasing power? If increasing minimum wage is just another factor added into all of the other factors occuring over the next 7 years that drive up prices how much of the increase will already be absorbed by the time it goes into full effect?
Will earning $15/ hr in Seattle in 2022 really solve whatever financial problems are faced by people currently earning in the minimum wage in Seattle today?
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Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 14:42:31
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Last Remaining Whole C'Tan
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djones520 wrote:You'll never sell me on the idea that her employees are worth paying 30k a year though for the work that they do.
I never attempted to. I worked at a pet shop and we had kennel staff, and they got paid a lot less than $30k. Since it's a wholly unskilled job anyone who walks off the street could be taught to do in less than 30 minutes, prospective employees have little room to negotiate better value than the minimum wage.
I simply pointed out that she was making about as much as a starting assistant manager at McDonalds while doing a hell of a lot more than a shift manager at McDonalds by your description, but of course there are these benefits to which you are privy and I am not, so obviously I am not really able to gauge the whole package the way you can; if you say it's a good deal then I assume that's true.
Out of curiousity, did she ever wind up owning the place?
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lord_blackfang wrote:Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote:The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 15:41:50
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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djones520 wrote: Ouze wrote: KalashnikovMarine wrote: djones520 wrote:her pay (not including other benefits) will be starting at $15 an hour. She will be running a 1.5 million dollar business at that pay. This type of minimum wage hike? She'd have to pay the folks who do nothing more then clean the poop out of the stalls and wash towels the exact same.
Sounds like your relative isn't getting paid enough.
Yeah, I feel like Djones heard that anecdote and maybe took away the wrong conclusion. Sounds like a lot of work and responsibility for a lousy $30k a year.
Reminds me of a joke:
I was sitting at the negotiation table when the deal was made. As I said in the part you quoted, there were other benefits involved. To include pay raises, and even eventual ownership of the business. You'll never sell me on the idea that her employees are worth paying 30k a year though for the work that they do.
As for Peregrines quote (I'm lousy at multi-quoting), the conservative ideology also leads to the belief that you pay someone for the work that they do. If all your job entails is feeding dogs, and spraying gak, you aren't exactly busting your ass and "earning" a significant wage.
Oh yeah, did the other employees get benefits to include pay raises, and even eventual ownership of the business?
Those monsters, having to do all the physical labor and expecting to be able to afford to live. I mean, all they have to do is live with feces and deal with dogs they have never met before that could be less than friendly to them. No big deal.
PS: Your family member got robbed on her pay.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 15:44:08
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Fate-Controlling Farseer
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Ouze wrote: djones520 wrote:You'll never sell me on the idea that her employees are worth paying 30k a year though for the work that they do.
I never attempted to. I worked at a pet shop and we had kennel staff, and they got paid a lot less than $30k. Since it's a wholly unskilled job anyone who walks off the street could be taught to do in less than 30 minutes, prospective employees have little room to negotiate better value than the minimum wage.
I simply pointed out that she was making about as much as a starting assistant manager at McDonalds while doing a hell of a lot more than a shift manager at McDonalds by your description, but of course there are these benefits to which you are privy and I am not, so obviously I am not really able to gauge the whole package the way you can; if you say it's a good deal then I assume that's true.
Out of curiousity, did she ever wind up owning the place?
She will. This is something that just started. My great aunt is the current owner, and is looking to pass the business along within the family. My mother will be taking the job, will become eventual owner, and it's likely the place will pass along to me at some point. Her pay seems low right now, but there is room to grow it, and 10-15 years, she'll climb into the 6 digit numbers, once she takes full ownership of the place. It's a long term investment really.
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Full Frontal Nerdity |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 16:26:24
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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Peregrine wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
hotsauceman1 wrote:I think 10$ is perfect for what min wage is meant for. Teenagers and college students working for spending money.
It is not meant to support a 40 yr.
You want a job, go train for one. a guard card is 200 in california, and depending on the establishment, you could get 600 a night
It must be nice living in a fantasy world where everyone can get a job that pays better than minimum wage with a trivial amount of effort. Too bad that isn't the one we actually live in, where a lot of people don't have the same lives as middle-class college students.
One, not middle class but working class.
2. Than fix the damn actual problems, where it is people are relying on min wage jobs to support a family,which it is not meant for nor designed for.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 16:28:40
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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hotsauceman1 wrote: Peregrine wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
hotsauceman1 wrote:I think 10$ is perfect for what min wage is meant for. Teenagers and college students working for spending money.
It is not meant to support a 40 yr.
You want a job, go train for one. a guard card is 200 in california, and depending on the establishment, you could get 600 a night
It must be nice living in a fantasy world where everyone can get a job that pays better than minimum wage with a trivial amount of effort. Too bad that isn't the one we actually live in, where a lot of people don't have the same lives as middle-class college students.
One, not middle class but working class.
2. Than fix the damn actual problems, where it is people are relying on min wage jobs to support a family,which it is not meant for nor designed for.
Question: What is it meant/designed for?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 16:31:09
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
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sebster wrote: AnomanderRake wrote:Minimum wages have nothing at all to do with income equality and everything to do with artificially creating inflation. You hike wages, people hike prices to compensate, you end up back where you started only the numbers are larger.
That’s completely wrong. The impact on inflation will only be proportionate to the part of the economy made up minimum wage. That is, in an economy where the only input in to production is minimum wage work, and everyone earns minimum wage, then the result will be as you explain.
But in an economy where there are other factors, such as rent, raw materials, and people who earn more than the minimum, then the flow on inflation by definition has to be less than the increase in minimum wage, meaning an overall improvement in the living standards of people earning the minimum wage.
The minimum wage is $10 an hour, you're making $15 an hour. Suddenly the minimum wage gets pumped to $15 an hour. What do you do? Sit back and watch all the peons get a raise but not you?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 16:33:45
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Chongara wrote: hotsauceman1 wrote: Peregrine wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
hotsauceman1 wrote:I think 10$ is perfect for what min wage is meant for. Teenagers and college students working for spending money.
It is not meant to support a 40 yr.
You want a job, go train for one. a guard card is 200 in california, and depending on the establishment, you could get 600 a night
It must be nice living in a fantasy world where everyone can get a job that pays better than minimum wage with a trivial amount of effort. Too bad that isn't the one we actually live in, where a lot of people don't have the same lives as middle-class college students.
One, not middle class but working class.
2. Than fix the damn actual problems, where it is people are relying on min wage jobs to support a family,which it is not meant for nor designed for.
Question: What is it meant/designed for?
Certainly not survival.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 16:46:42
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander
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What is the plan regarding tips and waiting staff?
The US's tradition of letting waiting staff live off of tips and this would seem to be coming to an end now where there is a significant hourly wage rise. Has there been any push back on this? Are Waiters expecting a big raise and tips to boot?
I see some interesting post meal payment interactions.
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How do you promote your Hobby? - Legoburner "I run some crappy wargaming website " |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 16:54:58
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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notprop wrote:What is the plan regarding tips and waiting staff?
The US's tradition of letting waiting staff live off of tips and this would seem to be coming to an end now where there is a significant hourly wage rise. Has there been any push back on this? Are Waiters expecting a big raise and tips to boot?
I see some interesting post meal payment interactions. 
You tip them in cash so its not reported. If you tip them on the credit/debit receipt then it is reported towards their earning.
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Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog
Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
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DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:09:00
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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notprop wrote:What is the plan regarding tips and waiting staff?
The US's tradition of letting waiting staff live off of tips and this would seem to be coming to an end now where there is a significant hourly wage rise. Has there been any push back on this? Are Waiters expecting a big raise and tips to boot?
I see some interesting post meal payment interactions. 
Presumably it works* much as it currently does. The wait staff minimum hourly wage lowered is low compared to the real minimum wage, say $7.50 to the proposed $15.00. If tips fail to make up the difference between that lower hourly wage and the minimum of $15.00, then the employer has to pay the difference. If the tips meet or exceed the $15.00 rate then good for the wait staff.
*well is supposed to work at any rate.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 17:09:38
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:11:37
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Chongara wrote: hotsauceman1 wrote: Peregrine wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
hotsauceman1 wrote:I think 10$ is perfect for what min wage is meant for. Teenagers and college students working for spending money.
It is not meant to support a 40 yr.
You want a job, go train for one. a guard card is 200 in california, and depending on the establishment, you could get 600 a night
It must be nice living in a fantasy world where everyone can get a job that pays better than minimum wage with a trivial amount of effort. Too bad that isn't the one we actually live in, where a lot of people don't have the same lives as middle-class college students.
One, not middle class but working class.
2. Than fix the damn actual problems, where it is people are relying on min wage jobs to support a family,which it is not meant for nor designed for.
Question: What is it meant/designed for?
According to the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938 the purpose of the federal minimum wage was to require:
Every employer shall pay to his employees who is engaged in commerce or in the production of goods for commerce wages at the following rates:
1) during the first year from the effective date of this section, not less than 25 cents an hour
2) during the next six years from such date, not less than 30 cents an hour
3) after the expiration of seven years from such date, not less than 40 cents an hour, or the rate (not less than 30 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8, whichever is lower, and
4) at any time after the effective date of this section, not less than the rate (not in excess of 40 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8.
http://www.legisworks.org/congress/75/publaw-718.pdf
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Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:15:08
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Prestor Jon wrote:
According to the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938 the purpose of the federal minimum wage was to require:
Every employer shall pay to his employees who is engaged in commerce or in the production of goods for commerce wages at the following rates:
1) during the first year from the effective date of this section, not less than 25 cents an hour
2) during the next six years from such date, not less than 30 cents an hour
3) after the expiration of seven years from such date, not less than 40 cents an hour, or the rate (not less than 30 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8, whichever is lower, and
4) at any time after the effective date of this section, not less than the rate (not in excess of 40 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8.
http://www.legisworks.org/congress/75/publaw-718.pdf
Right, but why? What was the purpose of it? You've certainly done a great job of finding of the practical implementation of it, but that wasn't really what I was speaking to. What were those pay minimums meant for? What was the purpose of providing them? What was the law designed to achieve, that is what was the merit in asking sure people were paid at least $0.25.
That's part I was trying to get hotsauceman1 to consider.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 17:15:29
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:17:32
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Chongara wrote:Prestor Jon wrote:
According to the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938 the purpose of the federal minimum wage was to require:
Every employer shall pay to his employees who is engaged in commerce or in the production of goods for commerce wages at the following rates:
1) during the first year from the effective date of this section, not less than 25 cents an hour
2) during the next six years from such date, not less than 30 cents an hour
3) after the expiration of seven years from such date, not less than 40 cents an hour, or the rate (not less than 30 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8, whichever is lower, and
4) at any time after the effective date of this section, not less than the rate (not in excess of 40 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8.
http://www.legisworks.org/congress/75/publaw-718.pdf
Right, but why? What was the purpose of it? You've certainly done a great job of finding of the practical implementation of it, but that wasn't really what I was speaking to. What were those pay minimums meant for? What was the purpose of providing them? What was the law designed to achieve, that is what was the merit in asking sure people were paid at least $0.25.
That's part I was trying to get hotsauceman1 to consider.
The purpose was to help FDR and other Democrats get re-elected because the people that would now be making at least $0.25/ hr would be happy to vote for them. It certainly wasn't going to fix the Great Depression or get more people hired.
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Mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:30:37
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Hallowed Canoness
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Chongara wrote:What people fail to understand that is that minimum wage labor costs constitutes 100% of a businesses expenses. This is why raising the minimum wage will always lead to a direct increase in prices in exact proportion to the increase in the minimum wage. It's plainly obvious it's impossible to make any sort of positive change with an increased minimum wage since the only effect will be to diminish the buying power of those making above minimum wage, as the buying power of their dollars are decreased. It does nothing meaningful for those making minimum wage because the direct increase in the price of goods and services causes them to break even, no better than they were with the old minimum wage.
If there were other factors to the cost of goods like fuel, non-minimum wage labor, land, taxes, raw materials, rent, equipment, equipment maintenance, marketing, shrinkage, insurance, licensing, energy, R&D, transportation, security or human error that wouldn't be the case. In such a fantasy universe minimum wage increases might grant those making it increased buying power, while not affecting the buying power of those above them by a large margin because the cost of goods & services would only go up relative to the moderate to minor portion of their cost made up by minimum wage labor.
However we do not in such a fantasy land, so a minimum wage increase will always be a net loss for everyone.
I am not a native English speaker, and I am not very bright, but you seem to speak in antiphrasis or similar “I say something but mean the exact opposite” way.
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"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1 |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:32:12
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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Chongara wrote:Prestor Jon wrote:
According to the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938 the purpose of the federal minimum wage was to require:
Every employer shall pay to his employees who is engaged in commerce or in the production of goods for commerce wages at the following rates:
1) during the first year from the effective date of this section, not less than 25 cents an hour
2) during the next six years from such date, not less than 30 cents an hour
3) after the expiration of seven years from such date, not less than 40 cents an hour, or the rate (not less than 30 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8, whichever is lower, and
4) at any time after the effective date of this section, not less than the rate (not in excess of 40 cents an hour) prescribed in the applicable order of the Administrator issued under section 8.
http://www.legisworks.org/congress/75/publaw-718.pdf
Right, but why? What was the purpose of it? You've certainly done a great job of finding of the practical implementation of it, but that wasn't really what I was speaking to. What were those pay minimums meant for? What was the purpose of providing them? What was the law designed to achieve, that is what was the merit in asking sure people were paid at least $0.25.
That's part I was trying to get hotsauceman1 to consider.
oh, I know that people think it is meant to provide a liveable wage. But no matter what, it will fail at that
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:33:13
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: Chongara wrote:What people fail to understand that is that minimum wage labor costs constitutes 100% of a businesses expenses. This is why raising the minimum wage will always lead to a direct increase in prices in exact proportion to the increase in the minimum wage. It's plainly obvious it's impossible to make any sort of positive change with an increased minimum wage since the only effect will be to diminish the buying power of those making above minimum wage, as the buying power of their dollars are decreased. It does nothing meaningful for those making minimum wage because the direct increase in the price of goods and services causes them to break even, no better than they were with the old minimum wage.
If there were other factors to the cost of goods like fuel, non-minimum wage labor, land, taxes, raw materials, rent, equipment, equipment maintenance, marketing, shrinkage, insurance, licensing, energy, R&D, transportation, security or human error that wouldn't be the case. In such a fantasy universe minimum wage increases might grant those making it increased buying power, while not affecting the buying power of those above them by a large margin because the cost of goods & services would only go up relative to the moderate to minor portion of their cost made up by minimum wage labor.
However we do not in such a fantasy land, so a minimum wage increase will always be a net loss for everyone.
I am not a native English speaker, and I am not very bright, but you seem to speak in antiphrasis or similar “I say something but mean the exact opposite” way.
Sarcasm is what we call it. He is laying it on thick.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:40:34
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Dakka Veteran
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Maybe in a way it's a good thing they are doing this in Seattle. The folks there voted for it and the rest of us will see what impact it has (all the academic hypothesizing aside).
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 17:59:08
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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hotsauceman1 wrote:
oh, I know that people think it is meant to provide a liveable wage. But no matter what, it will fail at that
Im sure at some point someone will drag up the FDR quote where he fairly explicitly states what his intention in a "minimum wage" is, (and it's supposed to be a living wage), however I somewhat agree with you in saying that High Schoolers, and those living in a situation where they are no supporting themselves don't really "need" a living wage. Automatically Appended Next Post: KiloFiX wrote:Maybe in a way it's a good thing they are doing this in Seattle. The folks there voted for it and the rest of us will see what impact it has (all the academic hypothesizing aside).
Problem with this is, the "voting power" in Washington, from what I've seen, routinely votes against their own self interest
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 18:00:19
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:07:58
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Blood Angel Captain Wracked with Visions
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KiloFiX wrote:Maybe in a way it's a good thing they are doing this in Seattle. The folks there voted for it and the rest of us will see what impact it has (all the academic hypothesizing aside).
California has shown us the financial and social cost of illegal immigration. Yet we still have a push to legitimize these individuals
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 18:14:50
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:10:43
Subject: Re:Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Are they fining individuals now in Seattle if they have more then 10% food waste in their garbage on pick up? I live across the Sound
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Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog
Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:33:04
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Omnipotent Necron Overlord
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In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
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If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:35:45
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Fate-Controlling Farseer
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Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
There is not untruth in this. I'm a meteorologist, and that is a battle that we've been fighting for the last decade alone already...
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Full Frontal Nerdity |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:35:57
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
Who says people need to learn a living? If robots are producing all our food, manufacturing all our goods, and just generally keeping everything running smoothly I don't see any reason we shouldn't spend all our time eating, drinking and fething.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 18:36:38
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:39:18
Subject: Re:Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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I think the Earth crust will not be able to hold the weight of the population if we go that far
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Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog
Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:41:10
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
Seattle
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Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
In 50 years I will most likely be dead or living in a VA retirement home. Automation is not going to replace that many jobs in 20 years (and in 25 years I'll be retired). My advice? Learn how to build, install, fix and repair the automated units.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 18:42:28
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:43:41
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Chongara wrote: Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
Who says people need to learn a living? If robots are producing all our food, manufacturing all our goods, and just generally keeping everything running smoothly I don't see any reason we shouldn't spend all our time eating, drinking and fething.
Because the people who own the robots aren't going to waste any money on your sorry  ?
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 18:57:12
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Frazzled wrote: Chongara wrote: Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
Who says people need to learn a living? If robots are producing all our food, manufacturing all our goods, and just generally keeping everything running smoothly I don't see any reason we shouldn't spend all our time eating, drinking and fething.
Because the people who own the robots aren't going to waste any money on your sorry  ?
As the need for human input into production at any level approaches zero and the population stabilizes at the robot's carrying capacity the value of all things also approaches zero. Your question becomes nonsensical as there is no money to waste.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 19:03:03
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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Fixture of Dakka
Kamloops, BC
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Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
How do you know this? Do you have a time machine? Are you secretly trapped in a movie and read the script? We're you given a prophecy? I said how do you know this?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/03/19 19:04:01
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2015/03/19 19:05:42
Subject: Seattle's $15 Minimum Wage debacle
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5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)
The Great State of Texas
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Chongara wrote: Frazzled wrote: Chongara wrote: Xenomancers wrote:In 20 years 50% of you will be unemployable due to automation. This debate is pointless. Technology will eventually make most all human beings unemployable (withing 100 years) . So what will people do to earn a living then? It sure will be interesting.
Who says people need to learn a living? If robots are producing all our food, manufacturing all our goods, and just generally keeping everything running smoothly I don't see any reason we shouldn't spend all our time eating, drinking and fething.
Because the people who own the robots aren't going to waste any money on your sorry  ?
As the need for human input into production at any level approaches zero and the population stabilizes at the robot's carrying capacity the value of all things also approaches zero. Your question becomes nonsensical as there is no money to waste.
And you still won't get jack...
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
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