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The points still add up, I will edit the Onager in.
EDIT: what are you guys thinking for counter daemon lists? I am thinking of tweaking my servitor/haeomotrope list to drop a ballistari and some rangers to squeeze in a second icarus. Yeah, the second icarus won't help me versus tau, but daemon lists are devastating to warcon and I need more anti FMC in my list.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/19 23:36:15
Nelson Mechanized wrote: Another thing I've been thinking about that involves adding that good ol 25 point inquisitor, bring cawl and give the inquisitor the relic that lets you use skyfire. Then, attach him to a 5 man unit with arqebuses. Skyfire 60" 360 degrees armorbane sniper rifles. Grab the unit an omnispex and even flyrants have a good chance that they'll be making grounding checks. Any AV10 flier is royally screwed and will have a hard time reaching them before the rifles shoot. And let us not forget, you can pick tank or monster hunter as well and they come stock ap3...
Not saying they're finally worth that 25 points, but still...
Why would you need the inquisitor couldn't the skitarii ranger character just take it. Makes it free in a war convocation as well. Even still though Arquebus' are far from impressive. Its worse than a missile launcher at killing armour 10-13, and exactly even at armour 14.
If I was going to put it on an inquisitor I think breachers would be better. 24"grav with skyfire, monster hunter, or tank hunter is pretty scary. Immobilizations are pretty good against flyers, and way way better against FMC's which I think are more common. Although I suppose its garbage against kairos and that's the flyer that needs to die the most.
But, you're not taking arqebuses w/ that relic to crack av14. You're taking it to wreck transports and fliers. Most fliers are av10 so w/ an average of a 7, your odds of a pen are high. The icarus is overkill and clunky. All you need to do is put them on snap shots or a crew stunned. That'll all but negate anything a flier can do. And at 60", no flier should be able to take them off the board before they shoot.
The arc rifles may kill things outright, but the trick isn't killing things outright, it's slowing the whole army. Fliers are screwed, period. Especially if you take 3 arqebuses. Transport either have to eat the shots or move to avoid LoS which will slow them down. Most people aren't bringing a full army of landraiders. MC's are still at a disadvantage w/ the long guns being ap3 stock, and fmcs won't be any worse off facing an icarus. The 360 degree 60" omni directional is the big difference.
And, worse case scenario, you still have 2 units of grav. Move the inquisitor to them. That's why it's better on the inquisitor than the alpha. All I'm saying is that basically a unit with 3 arqebuses and that relic has way more potential and utility than an icarus. Onager slots should go to neutron lasers.
Probably been discussed already but anyone found away of fielding an effective Skitarii CAD now they can take Cawl as a HQ?
Objective secured probably isn't worth the loss of mobility the the maniple offers but does finally allow you to field an Ordinatus. Also seems to be some synergy between forgeworld secutarii and Cawl with them allowing him to reroll fails on his 2+ armor save aswell as making him effectively T7, Peltasts would be more effective but I feel the Hoplites would look the part as a bodyguard unit.
These options together could make a pretty cool aesthetic for an army in my opinion (big mar machine supported by a mob of infantry) but I can't think of a way to make it effective on the table, especially lacking mobilty. How do people find dragoons or ironstriders as objective grabbers in this case? Sure they lack obsec but dunestrider seems a pretty handy rule.
Dragoons are great in maelstrom games were you might get an turn objective saying you have to have objective 1 t/m 6 at the end of your turn. Dragoons are then fantastic to have, 9'' movement and then a D6+3 run allows them to take any objective not contested by your opponent. They are also good enough on the charge to take small groups of objective huggers out.
So I have been rethinking my LVO list, and I think this is the final iteration. I banged out some more converted and magnetized Skitarri-Kataphron-Servitors. The only changes I am considering are maybe Ballistari? But I think the lancers will live longer and possible grab me an objective to allow me to win. I am also considering dropping the second inquisitor (who gets me another strategic warlord trait) in favor of a 25 point astropath with level 1 in telepathy.
Wulfey wrote: So I have been rethinking my LVO list, and I think this is the final iteration. I banged out some more converted and magnetized Skitarri-Kataphron-Servitors. The only changes I am considering are maybe Ballistari? But I think the lancers will live longer and possible grab me an objective to allow me to win. I am also considering dropping the second inquisitor (who gets me another strategic warlord trait) in favor of a 25 point astropath with level 1 in telepathy.
Inquisition Representative 2
Ordo Xenos Inquisitor (25pt.) Psyk-out grenades;
I would keep the Dragoons. They are fast enough to keep up with your infiltrators and their inbuilt coversave helps them a lot and with an army like this one, having some quick units to capture objectives with are never a bad choice.
I would however reconsider the plasma on your rangers for Arc rifles or Arquebus to keep them the long ranged unit they are.
Also, do not drop the inquisitor for an astropath. An extra warlord trait is worth more then only one measly psyker level.
Wulfey wrote: So I have been rethinking my LVO list, and I think this is the final iteration. I banged out some more converted and magnetized Skitarri-Kataphron-Servitors. The only changes I am considering are maybe Ballistari? But I think the lancers will live longer and possible grab me an objective to allow me to win. I am also considering dropping the second inquisitor (who gets me another strategic warlord trait) in favor of a 25 point astropath with level 1 in telepathy.
Where have you had success with the Arquebus? I modeled up three of them as soon as I got my kits because they looked so cool but the rules were so trash.
I could see using the Arc Rifles. I have very low expectations from the Arquebus's. I think they are terrible. They are one shot weapons that have only a 50% chance to wound a Space Marine. It is cool that they also have a 50% chance to wound a Riptide ... but they are only AP3. Each Arquebus has about a 58% (7 on a 2D6) chance of glancing AV11. I am pretty sure the Arc Rifle with its Str 6 has at least the same odds to wound against any imaginable T6 or less opponent but many times the odds to harm a vehicle compares to the Arquebus. I get that the Arquebus has 60" range ... but using that 60" range means the rest of my ranger squad likely isn't firing.
I run all plasma because I like my infantry up there and shooting. Everyone poops on the Ranger's rifles, but if you can get into rapid fire range then Rangers can be as deadly as Vanguard. The plasma threatens everything and happens to synergize with Skryerskull Perspicatus and the Haemotropes if I get desperate.
EDIT: with regards to using servitors, my logic is as follows:
Warcon has a Cult Mech Battle Congregation Cult Mech Battle Congregation is limited to (and allows) Cult Mechanicus faction units Imperial Agents added 'Cult Mechanicus' servitors as an elites option Battle Congregation has 4 elite slots for 'Cult Mechanicus' units
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/25 18:09:17
Ah ok, that makes sense, I was not aware that they could be taken as an Elite choice on their own, thought you needed an Enginseer to unlock them as an option
Plasma lists with a Haematrope do look pretty fun though
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/25 18:10:49
Wulfey wrote: Where have you had success with the Arquebus? I modeled up three of them as soon as I got my kits because they looked so cool but the rules were so trash.
I could see using the Arc Rifles. I have very low expectations from the Arquebus's. I think they are terrible. They are one shot weapons that have only a 50% chance to wound a Space Marine. It is cool that they also have a 50% chance to wound a Riptide ... but they are only AP3. Each Arquebus has about a 58% (7 on a 2D6) chance of glancing AV11. I am pretty sure the Arc Rifle with its Str 6 has at least the same odds to wound against any imaginable T6 or less opponent but many times the odds to harm a vehicle compares to the Arquebus. I get that the Arquebus has 60" range ... but using that 60" range means the rest of my ranger squad likely isn't firing.
I run all plasma because I like my infantry up there and shooting. Everyone poops on the Ranger's rifles, but if you can get into rapid fire range then Rangers can be as deadly as Vanguard. The plasma threatens everything and happens to synergize with Skryerskull Perspicatus and the Haemotropes if I get desperate.
EDIT: with regards to using servitors, my logic is as follows:
Warcon has a Cult Mech Battle Congregation
Cult Mech Battle Congregation is limited to (and allows) Cult Mechanicus faction units
Imperial Agents added 'Cult Mechanicus' servitors as an elites option
Battle Congregation has 4 elite slots for 'Cult Mechanicus' units
Sure Atquebus's are not that great, I agree with you on that. Still loving the model.
But having a squad of rangers with Arc rifles is great, their S4 hit is good enough to help you out sometimes when shooting at AV10. In my local meta there are enough people who use AV10 transports and walker units so when the haywire fails to deliver, the rangers still have the option to use their guns. Give it a try, they never fail me in making their own points back.
Now one question from me, does the LVO allow you to take the secutarii units from Forgeworld as elite options?
WrentheFaceless wrote: Yes ITC allows the Secutarii, the only issue is that they're not usually taken as they cant go in a War Convocation.
Ah, alright.
I kinda try to stay away from the War Convocation formation these days and try out some other Admech builds. I have had quite some success on smaller local tournaments.
And I really like the Secutarii Peltast, since they are quite versatile.
Guys I'm starting to build a 2000 pts list to know where to go with my purchases, and I was wondering.
I want to stay Battleforged, really not Unbound at all so. I'd like to include a Cohort Cybernetica in my list. Can I run my Skitarii list allied with Cult Mechanicus this way ? Or to have them as allies, I absolutely require an Allied detachment ? I don't really want to have two Techpriests but I'd like to run my Kastelans efficiently, so this formation seemed the best with an Autocaduceus to keep them alive.
I hope I'm being clear, my English is not perfect so it's hard to formulate difficult sentences haha
The Cohort Mechanicus is a detachment if memory serves, so you can absolutely include the skitarii detachment and the cohort in the same list
It's similar to using it as a CAD / Allied, but instead it's Maniple/Cohort.
Experience is something you get just after you need it The Narkos Dynasty - 15k Iron Hands - 12k The Shadewatch - 3k Cadmus Outriders - 4k Alpha Legion Raiders - 3k
Ah okay thanks I was always confused with those. So I can take it ? Nice ! However I won't have any place for my lone Kataphron unit then, I might have to swap some stuff.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Would it be cheesy to have 6 Robots in my Cohort Cybernetica at 2000 pts ? And also, Power Fists for them, yay or nay ?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/28 21:14:55
Cohort Cybernetics with 6 robots and no upgrades is still over 900 points. Throw in a relic and an upgrade or two and you are looking at that being over half your army in a single slow moving unit. A strong unit, but a single unit with 6"movement can be avoided so I don't see it as cheesy.
General consensus is no on power fists. They are strength 6 naturally which is good enough for most things, and AP2 from being an MC. If you really need the strength 10 smash let's you do that too only losing one attack each.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/01/28 23:13:24
You could run Cohort Cybernetica like Joshua Death's Tripartite lance list. You bring 1100 points with of robots, 400 worth of conclave, and 350 worth of psykana division. The psykana spams demon summoning, the conclave unloads buffs on the cohort.
I usually run CoHort cybernetica at around 800pts with the rest in skitarii, with heavy tanks and the like. a good number of bodies backing up a solid wall of robotics seems like a good idea generally, and it can lay down the hurt well enough while providing a tough brick in the center of the army.
That being said I can't wait for FW's Castelex instead. I like 4W robots more than FNP.
3x Kastelan Robots and 1 Datasmith, Twin-linked Heavy Phosphor Blasters, Incendine Combustor - 440 pts
3x Kastelan Robots and 1 Datasmith, Twin-linked Heavy Phosphor Blasters, Incendine Combustor - 440 pts
1x Techpriest Dominus, Volkite Blaster and Macrostubber, Autocaduceus of Arkhan Land, Raiment of the Technomartyrs - 165 pts
The Warlord's unit is basically just a dakka dispenser, I think about keeping them close to the Onagers so they can protect them and benefit from the Ld10 due to the Onagers and their Broad Spectrum Data Tether.
The other Vanguards squad should try to follow close to the Sicarians if that works, to assist them in melee and shoot vehicles.
The Sicarian will try to murder anything they get close to, with assistance from the Radsquad to get the most out of the debuffs.
Dragoons are going to do Dragoon stuff, so charging weak squad or light vehicles.
Onagers will stay away from the heat of battle and sow S10 Blasts everywhere, because that works. Additional Heavy Stubbers are there because I had the points and they allow them to shoot really meanly with that much guns on anything coming close to them. More of an insurance really.
And of course the Cohort Cybernetica, delivering torrent flames and loads of S6 shots while being basically invincible of I'm lucky enough. The Techpriest is an additional shooting force but I guess most of the time he'll redirect shots from the Kastelan and repair them.
What do you think about this ? I don't know what kind of lists I could face at this points level, but it looks like I can cover almost any situations. Maybe things could get difficult against things like Genestealers who can ambush and stuff.
Aaranis wrote: Ah okay thanks I was always confused with those. So I can take it ? Nice ! However I won't have any place for my lone Kataphron unit then, I might have to swap some stuff.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Would it be cheesy to have 6 Robots in my Cohort Cybernetica at 2000 pts ? And also, Power Fists for them, yay or nay ?
IMHO the best possible build for Robots is TL Hvy Phosphor blasters and the TORRENT Flamer as carapace weapon. With the Cohort, you can effectively get the base package to have all 4 Robots fire at different targets. Against, horde lists, that's GG right there.
Oh I'm going to mount them all this way, I need flamers, and torrent flamers are even better !
On a side note, I'm thinking about placing a Hellrain Brigade in a 1500 pts list as allies for an AdMech force. Would it be nice ? It's seems pretty cool from my newbie point of view. As long as I keep the Commissar alive I can send suicide squads to get vehicles or anything else in Deep Strike. And I keep the Taurox for my Vanguards Plasma squad or anything else. Rules of the detachment below:
Spoiler:
Nothing prevents me to grab two of these detachments right ? Could use two Tauroxes, and that would just make me buy two Start Collecting boxes. I like infantry, so if I could take an alternative to Kataphron spam that would be nice. Kastelans forever though, and Techpriests. I'll look up the rules of Fall of Cadia someday, I'll ask my LGS if I can borrow it from someone. There seems to be a bunch of cool rules in there.
Yep, take two of them. Make the suicide squad all Plasma, including a Plasma Pistol, and make the Command Squad all Melta or Volley Guns (if you're holding an objective). Deep Strike all of them no matter what and just sit back and enjoy a respawning squad and stuff.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: Yep, take two of them. Make the suicide squad all Plasma, including a Plasma Pistol, and make the Command Squad all Melta or Volley Guns (if you're holding an objective). Deep Strike all of them no matter what and just sit back and enjoy a respawning squad and stuff.
Hmm the Command Squad doesn't respawn though, so thinking about outfitting them with Volley Guns to have some nice staying power. I was thinking about using a Plasma pistol, Meltagun and a Volley Gun or Flamer for the regular squad, in the 1500 pts list I made. I already have a Plasma Caliver in my Warlord's unit and he'll have the Taurox, so I don't know if any more is necessary ?
With Plasma you can guarantee them dying much quicker and getting the most out of the formation. Also doesn't matter if the command squad won't respond. 5 Melta Guns wasn't meant to live anyway. Pop your big target and live with the fact they're dead next turn.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
3000
4000 
The Narkos Dynasty - 15k
Iron Hands - 12k 
The Shadewatch - 3k 
Cadmus Outriders - 4k 
Alpha Legion Raiders - 3k 
