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was it Roboute? Horus? or someone else

Magnus most certainly. He was the bookish Primarch after all.

After that, probably some list of Guilliman, the Lion, Ferrus, and Corax.

 Wyzilla wrote:
Magnus most certainly. He was the bookish Primarch after all.

After that, probably some list of Guilliman, the Lion, Ferrus, and Corax.

Magnus may have had the highest capacity for learning/knowledge, though he was very far from the smartest in my opinion. Smart people don't act like him.
I would argue Perturabo as the smartest, after reading his HH book. He was just stuck in the trenches for too long, rather than given the priority for learning.

EDIT: oh missed the raw intellect part of the title. Yeah Magnus.

Magnus, Lorgar and Guilliman were probably the most intelligent. Whether that also translates to smart actions is up for debate.

Second Perturbo in terms of smarts definitely. Magnus probably for raw intellect and capacity.

Magnus and Perturabo were the most intelligent, though I would argue the Lion would have a higher IQ(intellectual efficiency) rating.

it's hard to tell really.. ALL the Primarchs where absolutly brilliant individuals.

Probably Magnus.
It'd be hard not to find yourself kissing your own ass if you could reliably deal with any situation (and i mean any) by going all out and tossing mental explosions around.

Alpharius turned his legion into the most effective force in the galaxy, so I'm voting for him.

 RaptorusRex wrote:
Alpharius turned his legion into the most effective force in the galaxy, so I'm voting for him.

Very very debatable.

Magnus, probably. Perturabo was very clever, and Guilliman. But like someone said, they were all exceptional individuals.

If we're going with the intellect, as in the ability to understand, I'm gonna have to go with Alpharius, Roboute, or Horus. Alpharius had the ability to intellectually construct and predict scenarios to a degree most primarchs didn't have while not being emotionally stunted. Roboute for his ability to realise his own limits, something the primarchs were sadly lacking, and his foresight, similar to Alpharius. Horus for his combination of relating to other beings and being an intelligent commander.

Perturabo and Ferrus, while having the ability to understand machines, seem to just be lacking in other departments.

Reading books doesn't make your natural intellect any better. It hones what's already there or may awaken natural curiosity, but that's about it. Magnus may be learned, but that doesn't make him intelligent.

The Lion would probably be, if not dumbest militarily, but the socially least savvy, as he just doesn't "get" anyone, bar maybe Angron, but he has mitigating issues.

None of them. They were all short sighted brats in the bodies of demigods, not smart enough to think through their actions, let alone see past their own hubris.

SJ

They are all smart in different ways. Lion, Horus, Curze and Guilliman are the smartest in terms of strategy, or long campaigns (Kurze because he can win a war without a gak being fired, purely due to fear and intimidation). Lorgar and Magnus are the smartest in terms of written knowledge and philosophy. Alpharius and Corax are the smartest in terms of tactics or how to win a battle. Ferrus Manus and Vulkan are the smartest in terms of technology and crafting.

Which was the one who didn't have to resort to murder and didn't think his dad was a god, cause I'd vote for that fella.

 Gordon Shumway wrote:
Which was the one who didn't have to resort to murder and didn't think his dad was a god, cause I'd vote for that fella.

Well, they all resorted to murder, but only Lorgar really believed the Emperor was a god.

In terms of raw intellect, I'd say either Magnus or Alpharius. Other Primarchs were smart in a few areas, Magnus and Alpharius studied EVERYTHING, although for different reasons (Magnus because he just hungered for knowledge, Alpharius because he's the walking embodiment of the "knowledge is power" belief).

natpri771 wrote:
They are all smart in different ways. Lion, Horus, Curze and Guilliman are the smartest in terms of strategy, or long campaigns (Kurze because he can win a war without a gak being fired, purely due to fear and intimidation). Lorgar and Magnus are the smartest in terms of written knowledge and philosophy. Alpharius and Corax are the smartest in terms of tactics or how to win a battle. Ferrus Manus and Vulkan are the smartest in terms of technology and crafting.

except Kruze WASN'T smart long term. the problem with fear based tactics is once you remove the source of the fear problems arise again. which is why as soon as he left his homeworld, it fell into the same old problems.

and I'm not sure I'd agree with you on Alpharius and Corax. stealth and gurilla tactics aren't always the best tactics. sometimes it's best to just cut to the chase and "zerg rush" the other guy

I've said and continue to believe that Angron is the smartest Primarch. His hyper-aggressive strategy is a remarkably smart way to counter other hyper-intelligences. As long as you hit your enemy hard enough, fast enough, you can force them to abandon their plan and fight you on your terms. And if you ever fail, you can just chalk it up to not putting enough aggression on it.

 Jimsolo wrote:
I've said and continue to believe that Angron is the smartest Primarch. His hyper-aggressive strategy is a remarkably smart way to counter other hyper-intelligences. As long as you hit your enemy hard enough, fast enough, you can force them to abandon their plan and fight you on your terms. And if you ever fail, you can just chalk it up to not putting enough aggression on it.

Than the Orks must be the most intelligent species in the galaxy.

 Jimsolo wrote:
I've said and continue to believe that Angron is the smartest Primarch. His hyper-aggressive strategy is a remarkably smart way to counter other hyper-intelligences. As long as you hit your enemy hard enough, fast enough, you can force them to abandon their plan and fight you on your terms. And if you ever fail, you can just chalk it up to not putting enough aggression on it.

You seem to be confusing intellect with strategy here. I agree, that is a great military strategy, but nothing new (see Vikings, Blitzkrieg, Powell doctrine). An intelligent primarch wouldn't get into a fight in the first place-the whole war is the last option when all other options are off the table. The greatest intellects in the Imperium are likely in the AM (see all of the great intellects in the real world).

I would say Lorgar. He is the only one to have developped another intelectual sphere of interest beside war or weaponsmithing and produce ground braking work in those fields. He was the most politicaly minded of them all and had an actual project of society that would produce fonctional community for the worlds he conquered. He seemed also one of the most articulated. He is one of the few to have a hubris linked to higher knowledge. Lorgar wanted to find Truth.

epronovost wrote:
I would say Lorgar. He is the only one to have developped another intelectual sphere of interest beside war or weaponsmithing and produce ground braking work in those fields. He was the most politicaly minded of them all and had an actual project of society that would produce fonctional community for the worlds he conquered. He seemed also one of the most articulated. He is one of the few to have a hubris linked to higher knowledge. Lorgar wanted to find Truth.

except that's not true AT ALL. Lorgar was NOT the only Primarch who took an intreast in civil projects. he was not the only one intreasted in community building. everything positive you've just said about Lorgar can be said about Gulliman. except Gulliman didn't NEED religon.

 Iron_Captain wrote:
Than the Orks must be the most intelligent species in the galaxy.

Of course. Dey iz da best. Glad you're on the wagon

I'd sat perturbo. I mean just look at that iron cage

 Iron_Captain wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:
I've said and continue to believe that Angron is the smartest Primarch. His hyper-aggressive strategy is a remarkably smart way to counter other hyper-intelligences. As long as you hit your enemy hard enough, fast enough, you can force them to abandon their plan and fight you on your terms. And if you ever fail, you can just chalk it up to not putting enough aggression on it.

Than the Orks must be the most intelligent species in the galaxy.

Orkses even havz da god of cunning! Mork! Or Gork!

How the hell is anyone smarter than Pert "IN TERMS OF STRATEGY" as you say if even other Primarchs relied on him to strategize for them???
Pert was the smartest Primarch as was stated multiple times, He was a great builder as much as he was a great Destroyer.

 Great White wrote:
I'd sat perturbo. I mean just look at that iron cage

Not that I disagree, but Dorn is clearly one of the dumbest primarchs, if not the dumbest, both in terms of social intelligence and strategy.

Outsmarting Dorn is like winning a high school science fair.

"Smart," is an interesting word.

Magnus was, in my opinion, most skilled in the arcane arts, but Alpharius/Omegron were probably the most cunning. Perturabo was an astounding engineer, and Lorgar brilliant in his writings, which have endured to the present day.

While there are more to list, I would probably favor Alpharius/Omegon as 'smartest,' provided Alpha Legion proves Loyalist and truly beneficial to the Loyalist cause (issues which will probably never be resolved, see setting vs stories).

P.S. I would have to take a strike against Guilliman. He was the most practical and able, almost certainly. But that doesn't mean smartest.

DarkApothecary wrote:
"Smart," is an interesting word.

Magnus was, in my opinion, most skilled in the arcane arts, but Alpharius/Omegron were probably the most cunning. Perturabo was an astounding engineer, and Lorgar brilliant in his writings, which have endured to the present day.

While there are more to list, I would probably favor Alpharius/Omegon as 'smartest,' provided Alpha Legion proves Loyalist and truly beneficial to the Loyalist cause (issues which will probably never be resolved, see setting vs stories).

P.S. I would have to take a strike against Guilliman. He was the most practical and able, almost certainly. But that doesn't mean smartest.

all evidance suggests the Alpha legion has NOT been benifical to the loyalist cause, and that by the 41st millinum they have fallen to chaos

BrianDavion wrote:

DarkApothecary wrote:
"Smart," is an interesting word.

Magnus was, in my opinion, most skilled in the arcane arts, but Alpharius/Omegron were probably the most cunning. Perturabo was an astounding engineer, and Lorgar brilliant in his writings, which have endured to the present day.

While there are more to list, I would probably favor Alpharius/Omegon as 'smartest,' provided Alpha Legion proves Loyalist and truly beneficial to the Loyalist cause (issues which will probably never be resolved, see setting vs stories).

P.S. I would have to take a strike against Guilliman. He was the most practical and able, almost certainly. But that doesn't mean smartest.

all evidance suggests the Alpha legion has NOT been benifical to the loyalist cause, and that by the 41st millinum they have fallen to chaos

All evidence has been redacted.

Gordon Shumway wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:
I've said and continue to believe that Angron is the smartest Primarch. His hyper-aggressive strategy is a remarkably smart way to counter other hyper-intelligences. As long as you hit your enemy hard enough, fast enough, you can force them to abandon their plan and fight you on your terms. And if you ever fail, you can just chalk it up to not putting enough aggression on it.

You seem to be confusing intellect with strategy here. I agree, that is a great military strategy, but nothing new (see Vikings, Blitzkrieg, Powell doctrine). An intelligent primarch wouldn't get into a fight in the first place-the whole war is the last option when all other options are off the table. The greatest intellects in the Imperium are likely in the AM (see all of the great intellects in the real world).

Even if strategy did equal intellect, it would only really work if you were capable of more than just the one strategy, which Angron really isn't. So even then he's still just a lunatic. Angron is no where near the smartest.