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2015/07/03 14:03:25
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
The game is all flash and no substance. Flashy art and flashy models with nothing behind them. it will sell to the people that like the models at first, but after that.... probably not.
The problem with this discussion of "but you don't know, they might release something that's actually good later" is that all of these negative rumors (which I happen to believe) could have been stopped if GW actually discussed things with players.
"Yes, the box is overly simplistic, but the real rules and the full reboot of 9th fantasy is coming out later." Boom. Done. That's all they would have to say. (If it were true.)
But I don't think that is true. "This is the new game. No points. No balance. No real care for rules. Enjoy." - GW that's probably the truth.
Also, check out my history blog: Minimum Wage Historian, a fun place to check out history that often falls between the couch cushions.
2015/07/03 14:05:01
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
RacerX wrote: After over 200 pages, and lots of thinking in the car driving back and forth to work this week, I think I have the business plan on this figured out.
BRIEF Warhammer brand sales have continued to drop despite
- Repeated relaunching
- Focus on good, playable starter sets
- Addition of more powerful, characterful models (i.e. large scale kits as centerpiece attractors to armies)
- More powerful / deadly gameplay
The existing cycle of release, tweak, RE-release is not working.
Recruitment of NEW gamers is not replacing RETIRING gamers at a sustainable rate.
PROPOSAL Reboot the Warhammer world
- Completely new and fresh world with many dynamic elements, and more potential for expansion.
- Streamlined gameplay, easier entry point in model count and initial expenditure
- Eliminate STEEP LEARNING curve for new players who need to absorb and learn 100 page army books and 300 page rulebooks. INSTANT GRATIFICATION.
- Capitalize on existing STRONG and POPULAR imagery of the highly successful Warhammer 40K line.
- Provide way for existing players to remain in the game if they wish.
- Install thematic and gameplay factors that will entice existing players to purchase newer models (new races/factions/base size/style/gameplay)
- Thematic elements should be such that they tap into the aesthetic already preferred by WH40K players. For example, the scenery is "otherworldy" and suitable for WH40K gaming
- Results in more CROSS-SALES and game system conversions.
- Exiting Range of Models remains viable for the INITIAL RELEASE PERIOD - Ultimately ENTIRE RANGE will be re-tooled to the structure of AoS.
CONTINGENCIES - Eliminate large range of printed materials (high value to inventory)
- Create enough thematic hooks that model range will be attractive to 40K players (i.e. SigMARINES, Chaos warriors) - allow for easy conversions to 40K if desired.
- Maximize Intellectual Property uniqueness - Eliminate generic NAMES and indefensible Real-World, Historical References that are in the Public Domain.
- Steer Capital investment into tooling that can easily be ported AWAY from Warhammer in the event the range completely fails (i.e. Realm Gates, and Scenery Range can be sold as WARP GATES)
- Slowly introduce direct and indirect tie-in content to the Warhammer 40,000 universe. Allow for ultimate MERGING of the I.P and content if necessary.
RISKS - Market Segmentation / Cannibalization - 40K players shifting their SPEND to AoS - Hobbiest Base needs to ultimately EXPAND
- One-Time inventory obsolescence impact as all WH printed materials disposed.
So there's my take.
They are not trying to market to ME, or anyone LIKE ME.
Since I am an older, existing player, I am not the target.
Seems like a sane plan from a business perspective.
But like MIKHAILA has already said earlier, for ME, this is a funeral and I am coming to grips with the death of an old friend.
ANYONE FOR A GAME OF OLDHAMMER?
Repeated relaunching? you mean the two sets 5 years apart is repeated?
considering 40k got a relaunch after a yeah that is hardly repeated. the re doing Codexes year after year is repeated fantasy was just sort of had eh releases especially since the hardback no fluff army books.
Good starter sets? okay they had nice figures but the rules since the old high elves vs goblins set don't feel improved honestly.
Large kits are fine but power creeping is wrong see how pp creates center piece sets without needing to have said things in order to win.
Good game play .... subjective see starter set
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/03 14:06:42
2015/07/03 14:08:56
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
So now we have an idea of who the target market for this is.
Boardgamers.
Makes sense now. Vets, here's where the are cutting you off with unusable war scrolls for all your models and a nice pat on the head. The future is all about releasing new models with new scenarios to make things easy for people who play board games.
2015/07/03 14:10:44
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Well good news is that GW seems to finally understand the value of reaching out to the customer base.
The bad news is that they still killed Warhammer.
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2015/07/03 14:12:02
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Guys, don't worry. GW will come out with AOS 2nd edition in 1-2 years and there is (if you don't look at history) a 50/50 chance that they'll address the issues... as well as a 50/50 chance that they'll just double down on no points scrolls finding a way to make them even worse (higher chance if you look at the 40k 6/7th progression).
2015/07/03 14:12:39
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
So now we have an idea of who the target market for this is.
Boardgamers.
Makes sense now. Vets, here's where the are cutting you off with unusable war scrolls for all your models and a nice pat on the head. The future is all about releasing new models with new scenarios to make things easy for people who play board games.
Wasn't Warhammer orginally a board game? I only started in 7th ed, so I'm not that familiar with the exact history.
If so, GW have regressed back to the 80s.
Which explains the derpy model designs.
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2015/07/03 14:20:26
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Well this has been an absolutely amazing thread to read (yes all 200+ pages) and as a vet of this game for close to 20 years, I'm actually excited for a major change. Fantasy had grown stale and boring for me, which caused me to venture into other gaming systems. I'm still in love with the fluff (even the end times) and this for me is got my interest. I'm Hoping that this attempt by GW to get into the skirmish gaming (like Warmachine or Infinity) pays off for them...and in the long run for all of us. Personally I'm looking forward to getting my Ogres on some round bases and delving back into the realm of Mordheim....I mean Age of Sigmar.
2015/07/03 14:25:35
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Third_Age_of_Baggz wrote: Well this has been an absolutely amazing thread to read (yes all 200+ pages) and as a vet of this game for close to 20 years, I'm actually excited for a major change. Fantasy had grown stale and boring for me, which caused me to venture into other gaming systems. I'm still in love with the fluff (even the end times) and this for me is got my interest. I'm Hoping that this attempt by GW to get into the skirmish gaming (like Warmachine or Infinity) pays off for them...and in the long run for all of us. Personally I'm looking forward to getting my Ogres on some round bases and delving back into the realm of Mordheim....I mean Age of Sigmar.
Just make sure you bring lots of stuff that way your opponent has absolutely no chance ever. Unless he owns more stuff than you that is.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/03 14:25:53
2015/07/03 14:27:01
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Is there any news on what's coming out the week after AoS? I remember reading something like there will be no 40K for months now.
"If you don't have Funzo, you're nothin'!"
"I'm cancelling you out of shame, like my subscription to white dwarf"
Never use a long word where a short one will do.
2015/07/03 14:29:31
Subject: Re:Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Ok after all the leaks I finaly made up my mind about Arse of Sigmar - I despise it and even the hypothetical, most tactical and balanced ruleset ever brought to my doorstep on a golden plate by Jervis himself wouldnt change that a bit.
Half of the artwork looks like 40k without the cool bits like chainswords tanks guns etc, pictures of models on round bases dont help either.
It's noblish high fantasy, I guess the old stuff despite constant toning down was too nasty for the mums in the shops.
The names are idiotic, orrruks riding ogororos slaying aealaefs and dumbarin, am I supposed to use those with a straight face really.
It all seems to be ripped off hard from things that have ripped off GW for years, sure it happened before but on this scale it reeks of desperation, just like the whole Age of Sensless does tbh.
They killed whfb for this.
In the end there's a little thing called ruleset, or in this case Axe of System pushset. It doesn't look too good.
So, first time in my life GW, I wish you and your Age of Sycophants to flop, and flop hard, starter will not but it might take only a few failed models. Word for the wait and see brigade, Im not loosing my mind as I couldnt care less (though I wasnt negative by default either), Im here for the tragicomedy. Funny bottom line, if all this stuff was made into a single rumor, it would be ridiculed as absurd and dissmised as crazy fear mongering lol.
From the initial Age of Sigmar news thread, when its "feature" list was first confirmed:
Kid_Kyoto wrote:
It's like a train wreck. But one made from two circus trains colliding.
A collosal, terrible, flaming, hysterical train wreck with burning clowns running around spraying it with seltzer bottles while ring masters cry out how everything is fine and we should all come in while the dancing elephants lurch around leaving trails of blood behind them.
How could I look away?
2015/07/03 14:31:26
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
I'm personally quite upset by this. Really. I think I need to refocus on 40k at this rate. To see the complexity of WFB's rules slaughtered to such a simple state...to see a complete neglect of balance (No points LOLOLOLOLOLOL and bases don't matter! Ayyyy!) and to see the thematic slaughter that took place....
And what makes this even more painful? This is after a year of End Times releases...that averaged about £50 a book with around £120 worth of kits per book (with the exception of the Elves). If their issue with WFB not 'selling' is to slaughter the IP after a failed year of limited 'surprise' releases and hiked up priced kits then god help AoS. 6 months time....
We'll see...
AoS 2: Square Base Boogaloo.
This exciting expansion for AoS allows your units to fight in ranked formations. Only £60, limited edition, limited to 2 copies per store. Exclusive web warscroll that allows your army to win the game on a 2+ but only after you spend £3,000 on 'Grots'.
Now only a CSM player.
2015/07/03 14:32:46
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Alex C wrote: Terrain looks to be the best thing to come out of all this.
But being GW, it will be expensive.
I am most uninspired by the celestial gateway or whatever it's called. It looks like a standard WW2 historical European ruined church with a few statues added to it. I saw a practically identical terrain piece in a model shop today.
RacerX wrote: After over 200 pages, and lots of thinking in the car driving back and forth to work this week, I think I have the business plan on this figured out.
BRIEF Warhammer brand sales have continued to drop despite
- Repeated relaunching
- Focus on good, playable starter sets
- Addition of more powerful, characterful models (i.e. large scale kits as centerpiece attractors to armies)
- More powerful / deadly gameplay
The existing cycle of release, tweak, RE-release is not working.
Recruitment of NEW gamers is not replacing RETIRING gamers at a sustainable rate.
PROPOSAL Reboot the Warhammer world
- Completely new and fresh world with many dynamic elements, and more potential for expansion.
- Streamlined gameplay, easier entry point in model count and initial expenditure
- Eliminate STEEP LEARNING curve for new players who need to absorb and learn 100 page army books and 300 page rulebooks. INSTANT GRATIFICATION.
- Capitalize on existing STRONG and POPULAR imagery of the highly successful Warhammer 40K line.
- Provide way for existing players to remain in the game if they wish.
- Install thematic and gameplay factors that will entice existing players to purchase newer models (new races/factions/base size/style/gameplay)
- Thematic elements should be such that they tap into the aesthetic already preferred by WH40K players. For example, the scenery is "otherworldy" and suitable for WH40K gaming
- Results in more CROSS-SALES and game system conversions.
- Exiting Range of Models remains viable for the INITIAL RELEASE PERIOD - Ultimately ENTIRE RANGE will be re-tooled to the structure of AoS.
CONTINGENCIES - Eliminate large range of printed materials (high value to inventory)
- Create enough thematic hooks that model range will be attractive to 40K players (i.e. SigMARINES, Chaos warriors) - allow for easy conversions to 40K if desired.
- Maximize Intellectual Property uniqueness - Eliminate generic NAMES and indefensible Real-World, Historical References that are in the Public Domain.
- Steer Capital investment into tooling that can easily be ported AWAY from Warhammer in the event the range completely fails (i.e. Realm Gates, and Scenery Range can be sold as WARP GATES)
- Slowly introduce direct and indirect tie-in content to the Warhammer 40,000 universe. Allow for ultimate MERGING of the I.P and content if necessary.
RISKS - Market Segmentation / Cannibalization - 40K players shifting their SPEND to AoS - Hobbiest Base needs to ultimately EXPAND
- One-Time inventory obsolescence impact as all WH printed materials disposed.
So there's my take.
They are not trying to market to ME, or anyone LIKE ME.
Since I am an older, existing player, I am not the target.
Seems like a sane plan from a business perspective.
But like MIKHAILA has already said earlier, for ME, this is a funeral and I am coming to grips with the death of an old friend.
ANYONE FOR A GAME OF OLDHAMMER?
Repeated relaunching? you mean the two sets 5 years apart is repeated?
considering 40k got a relaunch after a yeah that is hardly repeated. the re doing Codexes year after year is repeated fantasy was just sort of had eh releases especially since the hardback no fluff army books.
Good starter sets? okay they had nice figures but the rules since the old high elves vs goblins set don't feel improved honestly.
Large kits are fine but power creeping is wrong see how pp creates center piece sets without needing to have said things in order to win.
Good game play .... subjective see starter set
This notion of repeated relaunching indicating WHFB's failure is just plain wrong. The 7th edition boxset was Battle for Skull Pass which was released in 2006. The 8th edition boxset was Island of Blood which was released in 2010. So between 2006 and 2015 there have been two editions of WHFB and I would argue that 8th was the most radical with the change in how charge movement was determined in addition to the scale creep in the rules. In that time there was no changes in the fluff while players were required to invest much higher amounts of money on boxsets containing smaller amounts of models in order to field viable units. Any notion that honest attempts were made to redress the very obvious problems that were causing WHFB to decline are erroneous.
The Starter box sets, particularly the Island of Blood one for 8th edition, were also not very playable until further investment was made in unit boxsets such as Swordmasters, Lothern Seaguard, etc.
For instance, the 2006 Battle for Skull Pass box contained: 12 Dwarf Warriors, 8 Dwarf Miners, and 10 Dwarf Thunderers; only the Thunderers were worth fielding on the table in those numbers. Similarly the 2010 Island of Blood box contained 10 Sword Masters of Hoeth and 10 Lothern Sea Guard; due to the scale creep and requirement for huge blocks of troops, in the new 8th edition rules, a High Elf Player would have to invest in a further 2-3 boxes of Sword Masters to field a viable unit.
A grudge never too old to settle with metal and ire on the funeral pyre of vanquished foe
2015/07/03 14:38:08
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Davylove21 wrote: Is there any news on what's coming out the week after AoS? I remember reading something like there will be no 40K for months now.
Well, typically GW tells us crapall, so who knows. Generally, one would expect a lot of support for the relaunch of WFB...but this isn't that, so hard to say. My guess is we will see some kits that quickly add on to AoS. There is also a deluxe edition of the fluff book, a painting guide, a novel, a deluxe version novel, some new paint colors and spray, but really thats about 2 weeks of releases.
Going forward, hard to say. The same mindset that thinks AoS will rule the gaming boards probably doubled down hard on new releases for it.
But lately, it's 40k that brings in the cash, so I still expect some 40k releases. (Please please keep doing 2 a month so we can get around to Orks again!)
....and lo!.....The Age of Sigmar came to an end when Saint Veetock and his hamster legions smote the false Sigmar and destroyed the bubbleverse and lead the true believers back to the Old World.
2015/07/03 14:40:27
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
GW cares not from where the cash flow, so long as it does.
Really, without wishing to drag the thread off into another "try this game" "don't like it for x reason" discussion, if you're really that affected by this release, you need to focus on non GW product if you can, otherwise there'll be nothing else to look at when this tanks through lack of sales and GW does the same thing to 40K through lack of ideas.
Davylove21 wrote: Is there any news on what's coming out the week after AoS? I remember reading something like there will be no 40K for months now.
Well, typically GW tells us crapall, so who knows. Generally, one would expect a lot of support for the relaunch of WFB...but this isn't that, so hard to say. My guess is we will see some kits that quickly add on to AoS. There is also a deluxe edition of the fluff book, a painting guide, a novel, a deluxe version novel, some new paint colors and spray, but really thats about 2 weeks of releases.
Going forward, hard to say. The same mindset that thinks AoS will rule the gaming boards probably doubled down hard on new releases for it.
But lately, it's 40k that brings in the cash, so I still expect some 40k releases. (Please please keep doing 2 a month so we can get around to Orks again!)
Something big and stompy for the Sigmarines would be my bet..
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/03 14:41:37
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
RacerX wrote: After over 200 pages, and lots of thinking in the car driving back and forth to work this week, I think I have the business plan on this figured out.
BRIEF Warhammer brand sales have continued to drop despite
- Repeated relaunching
- Focus on good, playable starter sets
- Addition of more powerful, characterful models (i.e. large scale kits as centerpiece attractors to armies)
- More powerful / deadly gameplay
The existing cycle of release, tweak, RE-release is not working.
Recruitment of NEW gamers is not replacing RETIRING gamers at a sustainable rate.
PROPOSAL Reboot the Warhammer world
- Completely new and fresh world with many dynamic elements, and more potential for expansion.
- Streamlined gameplay, easier entry point in model count and initial expenditure
- Eliminate STEEP LEARNING curve for new players who need to absorb and learn 100 page army books and 300 page rulebooks. INSTANT GRATIFICATION.
- Capitalize on existing STRONG and POPULAR imagery of the highly successful Warhammer 40K line.
- Provide way for existing players to remain in the game if they wish.
- Install thematic and gameplay factors that will entice existing players to purchase newer models (new races/factions/base size/style/gameplay)
- Thematic elements should be such that they tap into the aesthetic already preferred by WH40K players. For example, the scenery is "otherworldy" and suitable for WH40K gaming
- Results in more CROSS-SALES and game system conversions.
- Exiting Range of Models remains viable for the INITIAL RELEASE PERIOD - Ultimately ENTIRE RANGE will be re-tooled to the structure of AoS.
CONTINGENCIES - Eliminate large range of printed materials (high value to inventory)
- Create enough thematic hooks that model range will be attractive to 40K players (i.e. SigMARINES, Chaos warriors) - allow for easy conversions to 40K if desired.
- Maximize Intellectual Property uniqueness - Eliminate generic NAMES and indefensible Real-World, Historical References that are in the Public Domain.
- Steer Capital investment into tooling that can easily be ported AWAY from Warhammer in the event the range completely fails (i.e. Realm Gates, and Scenery Range can be sold as WARP GATES)
- Slowly introduce direct and indirect tie-in content to the Warhammer 40,000 universe. Allow for ultimate MERGING of the I.P and content if necessary.
RISKS - Market Segmentation / Cannibalization - 40K players shifting their SPEND to AoS - Hobbiest Base needs to ultimately EXPAND
- One-Time inventory obsolescence impact as all WH printed materials disposed.
So there's my take.
They are not trying to market to ME, or anyone LIKE ME.
Since I am an older, existing player, I am not the target.
Seems like a sane plan from a business perspective.
But like MIKHAILA has already said earlier, for ME, this is a funeral and I am coming to grips with the death of an old friend.
ANYONE FOR A GAME OF OLDHAMMER?
Repeated relaunching? you mean the two sets 5 years apart is repeated?
considering 40k got a relaunch after a yeah that is hardly repeated. the re doing Codexes year after year is repeated fantasy was just sort of had eh releases especially since the hardback no fluff army books.
Good starter sets? okay they had nice figures but the rules since the old high elves vs goblins set don't feel improved honestly.
Large kits are fine but power creeping is wrong see how pp creates center piece sets without needing to have said things in order to win.
Good game play .... subjective see starter set
This notion of repeated relaunching indicating WHFB's failure is just plain wrong. The 7th edition boxset was Battle for Skull Pass which was released in 2006. The 8th edition boxset was Island of Blood which was released in 2010. So between 2006 and 2015 there have been two editions of WHFB and I would argue that 8th was the most radical with the change in how charge movement was determined in addition to the scale creep in the rules. In that time there was no changes in the fluff while players were required to invest much higher amounts of money on boxsets containing smaller amounts of models in order to field viable units. Any notion that honest attempts were made to redress the very obvious problems that were causing WHFB to decline are erroneous.
The Starter box sets, particularly the Island of Blood one for 8th edition, were also not very playable until further investment was made in unit boxsets such as Swordmasters, Lothern Seaguard, etc.
For instance, the 2006 Battle for Skull Pass box contained: 12 Dwarf Warriors, 8 Dwarf Miners, and 10 Dwarf Thunderers; only the Thunderers were worth fielding on the table in those numbers. Similarly the 2010 Island of Blood box contained 10 Sword Masters of Hoeth and 10 Lothern Sea Guard; due to the scale creep and requirement for huge blocks of troops, in the new 8th edition rules, a High Elf Player would have to invest in a further 2-3 boxes of Sword Masters to field a viable unit.
I think that's a bit cynical. The High Elf portion of IoB was great. 5 Swordmasters is a legal unit, and a good bit of chaff that can do a few wounds on a flank. If you traded your skaven pieces for another HE set you had a good hq for low points, 2 fast cav, 20 sea guard, and 2x 10 sword masters. It was really easy to make HE work.
Third_Age_of_Baggz wrote: Well this has been an absolutely amazing thread to read (yes all 200+ pages) and as a vet of this game for close to 20 years, I'm actually excited for a major change. Fantasy had grown stale and boring for me, which caused me to venture into other gaming systems. I'm still in love with the fluff (even the end times) and this for me is got my interest. I'm Hoping that this attempt by GW to get into the skirmish gaming (like Warmachine or Infinity) pays off for them...and in the long run for all of us. Personally I'm looking forward to getting my Ogres on some round bases and delving back into the realm of Mordheim....I mean Age of Sigmar.
Just make sure you bring lots of stuff that way your opponent has absolutely no chance ever. Unless he owns more stuff than you that is.
Well I guess I now have my excuse to by all those monsterous creatures I've been wanting since Storm of Magic.
2015/07/03 14:44:43
Subject: Re:Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Grimtuff wrote: MWG made a similar observation. The HH game release month came and went. What if what whomever first saw those Sigmarines with no prior context thought they were Heresy marines?
My point was more a 'What if the rumours were true' + 'Be careful what you wish for'. Imagine if we are getting a HH game, but it's like AoS.
*Visibly shudders*
We have altered the 30 year old mechanics of one of our games. Pray we do not alter them further.
Games Workshop Delenda Est.
Users on ignore- 53.
If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them.
2015/07/03 15:02:09
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
. Similarly the 2010 Island of Blood box contained 10 Sword Masters of Hoeth and 10 Lothern Sea Guard; due to the scale creep and requirement for huge blocks of troops, in the new 8th edition rules, a High Elf Player would have to invest in a further 2-3 boxes of Sword Masters to field a viable unit.
I think that's a bit cynical. The High Elf portion of IoB was great. 5 Swordmasters is a legal unit, and a good bit of chaff that can do a few wounds on a flank. If you traded your skaven pieces for another HE set you had a good hq for low points, 2 fast cav, 20 sea guard, and 2x 10 sword masters. It was really easy to make HE work.
Oh I thought the models were great don't get me wrong but the point I was making was against RacerX's original premise that WHFB was failing despite repeated relaunches and very playable boxsets. Realistically, due to the rule changes in 8th edition, most players would be looking to field a unit of 30-40 Sword Masters of Hoeth. This meant acquiring the equivalent models from 3-4 Island of Blood boxsets.
A grudge never too old to settle with metal and ire on the funeral pyre of vanquished foe
2015/07/03 15:04:00
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
That pile up at the end - expect that to be a common occurrence in the game.
Yup.
Was gonna say it. Only skipped and fast-forwarded, but everything just ends up in a big pile, stuck in combat, unable to leave, and at that point it is only alternate rolling of dice till one player wins.
With no incentives to stay back, even with shooty stuff, no objectives, no advantages gained through movement, it's just "run-to-the-middle-and-dice-it-out".
2015/07/03 15:08:40
Subject: Re:Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
So after considering the twitter post where a board game reviewer got a review copy of the game, I've sort of come to a realization.
The strategy is to bring more people into the Games Workshop hobby (yeah, I know, but every time I've ever been in a store they always called it the "Games Workshop Hobby").
Since models are used in games, the target demographic is people who play games.
Board Games represents the largest demographic in the entire games demographic.
If they cna pull just one in one hundred board gamers into their market, they will succeed.
So, they make rules that are fairly simple to the war gamers crowd, but may seem just a bit complex to the board gamers. Four pages puts this at about the same level as Monopoly or Risk or maybe a bit higher.
They provide the scenarios where the board gamers get convinced the board is the entire tabletop and they've really got six different games in this box. this sucks in a percentage of the target for market. They then release new models with new war scrolls and new scenarios on a consistent basis, sucking them in even more.
Here's where I see the mistake in this strategy. They do not do market research. Painting models is going to be too much work for most board gamers. They like to play their games out of the box. Had they made the plastic models out of two different colors, and insured a different color of plastic for each different faction, this might be mire successful in sucking in the board gamers. As is, I doubt they'll even get 1 in 1000 board gamers who buy AoS to ever go any further.
2015/07/03 15:08:59
Subject: Re:Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Gothic Class battleships look amazing too, and you're not going to field them in 40k.
It's a really cool picture, but I don't think it does the job of telling us a story about the Age of Sigmar. Can these guys actually fight something that big? If so, why are they fighting dudes with two hand axes. It's an awesome pic, but the fact that things that you can't field in the game look really, really cool doesn't get me hugely excited about the game. If anything, it gets me worried that the game is perhaps focused on the wrong elements in the conflict. If beasties that immense are roaming about, who gives a rat's rear end about a River Troll anymore?
To me that looks like the jacket art from an LP by a hair band....
Not even all that inspiring. (I will be interested in hearing what my good lady makes of the art... she's a professional artist - I just paint minis. )
Hell, just Photoshop in 'Metallica'....
The Auld Grump
Kilkrazy wrote:When I was a young boy all my wargames were narratively based because I played with my toy soldiers and vehicles without the use of any rules.
The reason I bought rules and became a real wargamer was because I wanted a properly thought out structure to govern the action instead of just making things up as I went along.
2015/07/03 15:09:07
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
That pile up at the end - expect that to be a common occurrence in the game.
Yup.
Was gonna say it. Only skipped and fast-forwarded, but everything just ends up in a big pile, stuck in combat, unable to leave, and at that point it is only alternate rolling of dice till one player wins.
With no incentives to stay back, even with shooty stuff, no objectives, no advantages gained through movement, it's just "run-to-the-middle-and-dice-it-out".
So its basically just the assault phase in 40k, except simplified.
This is horrible.
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2015/07/03 15:11:13
Subject: Age of Sigmar 4th July WD leak and new names pg 1
Xyxox wrote: So after considering the twitter post where a board game reviewer got a review copy of the game, I've sort of come to a realization.
The strategy is to bring more people into the Games Workshop hobby (yeah, I know, but every time I've ever been in a store they always called it the "Games Workshop Hobby").
Since models are used in games, the target demographic is people who play games.
Board Games represents the largest demographic in the entire games demographic.
If they cna pull just one in one hundred board gamers into their market, they will succeed.
So, they make rules that are fairly simple to the war gamers crowd, but may seem just a bit complex to the board gamers. Four pages puts this at about the same level as Monopoly or Risk or maybe a bit higher.
They provide the scenarios where the board gamers get convinced the board is the entire tabletop and they've really got six different games in this box. this sucks in a percentage of the target for market. They then release new models with new war scrolls and new scenarios on a consistent basis, sucking them in even more.
Here's where I see the mistake in this strategy. They do not do market research. Painting models is going to be too much work for most board gamers. They like to play their games out of the box. Had they made the plastic models out of two different colors, and insured a different color of plastic for each different faction, this might be mire successful in sucking in the board gamers. As is, I doubt they'll even get 1 in 1000 board gamers who buy AoS to ever go any further.
But GW already makes board games.
Historically it's made some the most entertaining I've ever played.
To gut one of their core products to appeal to a sector they already have multiple items they can call on defies logic (which doesn't mean it's not true, this is GW after all!)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/07/03 15:12:35
We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark
The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.
The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox
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~1660
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