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You know, at various points in this thread, I've heard the rules pamphlet compared to x-wing's (apparently by a gw rep). The warscrolls having specific rules on them 'like x-wing' apparently by a gw rep.

And I just noticed the minimum playing area is 3'x3'. Same as x-wing.

Are we getting pre-painted blisters next.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Wonderwolf wrote:

 zedmeister wrote:

 Xyxox wrote:
Here's a BatRep:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5aBPxtBIGU

That pile up at the end - expect that to be a common occurrence in the game.

Yup.

Was gonna say it. Only skipped and fast-forwarded, but everything just ends up in a big pile, stuck in combat, unable to leave, and at that point it is only alternate rolling of dice till one player wins.

With no incentives to stay back, even with shooty stuff, no objectives, no advantages gained through movement, it's just "run-to-the-middle-and-dice-it-out".

So its basically just the assault phase in 40k, except simplified.
This is horrible.

Wasn't there a 'retreat' option if you're stuck in 3"?

 Eggs wrote:
You know, at various points in this thread, I've heard the rules pamphlet compared to x-wing's (apparently by a gw rep). The warscrolls having specific rules on them 'like x-wing' apparently by a gw rep.

And I just noticed the minimum playing area is 3'x3'. Same as x-wing.

Are we getting pre-painted blisters next.

Business wise, it would be a smart decision. X-Wing is FFG's biggest seller by far. I think it was like a 3rd of their whole revenue last year.

 warboss wrote:

 Avrik_Shasla wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Don't be ridiculous. The 40k HH version had a bunch of augmented superwarriors in heavy plate armor created by a god emperor sent forth after a period of great dispair and darkness to conquer the various realms by travelling through magical gates in space during which a flying godlike figure in gold fought a giant demon of hate. This is totally different.

This is why I like you.

You make me laugh.

Sure it's not because you both like Robotech?

Don't be ridiculous. Everyone likes Robotech... some just don't know it yet or have been misled by Palladium's earnest efforts to the contrary.

Well, it's probably because we both enjoy watching some of our favorite ways to pass the time (HHHobby!) be torn apart by people we have no influence over.

It's like a messed up version of Stockholm Syndrome.

At least FW is releasing Perturabo.

 Angry Marine wrote:

 Eggs wrote:
You know, at various points in this thread, I've heard the rules pamphlet compared to x-wing's (apparently by a gw rep). The warscrolls having specific rules on them 'like x-wing' apparently by a gw rep.

And I just noticed the minimum playing area is 3'x3'. Same as x-wing.

Are we getting pre-painted blisters next.

Business wise, it would be a smart decision. X-Wing is FFG's biggest seller by far. I think it was like a 3rd of their whole revenue last year.

Could you imagine the price of a pre-paint though?

1 sigmarine? £20? £30?

 Angry Marine wrote:

 Eggs wrote:
You know, at various points in this thread, I've heard the rules pamphlet compared to x-wing's (apparently by a gw rep). The warscrolls having specific rules on them 'like x-wing' apparently by a gw rep.

And I just noticed the minimum playing area is 3'x3'. Same as x-wing.

Are we getting pre-painted blisters next.

Business wise, it would be a smart decision. X-Wing is FFG's biggest seller by far. I think it was like a 3rd of their whole revenue last year.

But X Wing's good?

 Xyxox wrote:

 TheWaspinator wrote:
The thing is, there are plenty of board games with way more in-depth rules than this. Risk is not the game you should be comparing this to. Look up Star Wars Imperial Assault. It has a 28 page reference rulebook. Not big at all by miniatures games standards, but way more complicated than AOS.

Di you watch the BatRep? Everybody moves to the center, piles up, and then it's a dice roll off.

Yeah, AoS is pretty simple.

WFB games I ever played/watched either hit a flank and rolled it up until somebody cried uncle (usually around center) or wound up with the largest part of the fight in the center as well.
KoW also did similar. When most of your scenarios are line up and kill each other, there's not a lot of choices.

Hmm, I'm still torn over this. I want to play Fantasy in some form still, but honestly The Hobbit (which is actually my favourite setting by leaps and bounds) has a bigger following locally. I have a bunch of stuff for 3 or 4 Warhammer armies that was enough when I last played, but nowhere near enough for 8th. I was sort of slowly bolstering that when I found deals, but since the end of End Times I've stopped altogether.

So, can my 24 Chaos Warriors be the core of a real force in this game? How about my 2 Cannons and 60 Empire soldiers? My 10 Bretonnian Knights? If the answer is yes, and there are some others involved in the game, I may just take it up.

 Azreal13 wrote:

 Angry Marine wrote:

 Eggs wrote:
You know, at various points in this thread, I've heard the rules pamphlet compared to x-wing's (apparently by a gw rep). The warscrolls having specific rules on them 'like x-wing' apparently by a gw rep.

And I just noticed the minimum playing area is 3'x3'. Same as x-wing.

Are we getting pre-painted blisters next.

Business wise, it would be a smart decision. X-Wing is FFG's biggest seller by far. I think it was like a 3rd of their whole revenue last year.

But X Wing's good?

That is just a minor detail.

NoggintheNog wrote:

 Bull0 wrote:
There's definitely a point to be made that the future of 40k looks a bit bleak if this is how GW will treat one of its' biggest products... :/

I'm no...given how the fluff reads, the level of writing talent that created the worlds of both Warhammers (and yes, both were/are very derivative at base level but add in bucket loads of unique character) just is not there any more at GW.

Well, when you have to turn to internet fan-boyz to write your stuff, ya gotta expect what ya get

Products not even out yet...

GW be like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsQOWCbiQvI

 krazynadechukr wrote:
Products not even out yet...

GW be like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsQOWCbiQvI

Why? we read the rules it's trash. Sigmar now names everything after himself and you renamed all the armies with stupid names.

privateer4hire wrote:

 Xyxox wrote:

 TheWaspinator wrote:
The thing is, there are plenty of board games with way more in-depth rules than this. Risk is not the game you should be comparing this to. Look up Star Wars Imperial Assault. It has a 28 page reference rulebook. Not big at all by miniatures games standards, but way more complicated than AOS.

Di you watch the BatRep? Everybody moves to the center, piles up, and then it's a dice roll off.

Yeah, AoS is pretty simple.

WFB games I ever played/watched either hit a flank and rolled it up until somebody cried uncle (usually around center) or wound up with the largest part of the fight in the center as well.
KoW also did similar. When most of your scenarios are line up and kill each other, there's not a lot of choices.

Most of mine tended to turn into battles on the flanks; maybe it has to do with differences in positioning, or both sides going for a refused flank and running into each other...

You know? I've been trying to figure out what the new names remind me of - orruks and deadwalkers and so forth - because it's been bugging me. I knew I'd seen something like that naming pattern before, and -



Oh, there we go.

I think one of the few things I like about this is that giant Sigmar vs. Xenomorph with Horns piece of art - and the problem is that it looks nothing like Warhammer. It's something I could very easily see on a Magic card, or the cover of a computer game, but none of it conjures up images of anything related to the setting and game I'd grown so attached to. It doesn't seem like it shares the world with ratcatchers and their small but vicious dogs, or goblins that get drunk on fungus beer and accidentally leave the squig pen unlocked, or any of the hundreds of interesting little things attached to the Grim World of Perilous Adventure.

It looks neat, but for a company as attached to its IP as GW is, they really took an axe to the stuff.

...and the less said about the rules, the better.

I onced laughed at Mierce Miniature's names.. but GW became even worse.

Hey! At least the Darklands nomenclature is rooted in genuine historical language, not just a pitiful attempt to protect something which doesn't need protecting!

Lord Corellia wrote:
Hmm, I'm still torn over this. I want to play Fantasy in some form still, but honestly The Hobbit (which is actually my favourite setting by leaps and bounds) has a bigger following locally.

OH! I get it now!

GW is releasing AoS to boost flagging Hobbit/LotR sales! They think folks that want a decent, tactical ruleset will switch over there! Sales there are gonna go through the roof. (Never mind that Mantic stuff or other systems, mind...)

As a kid growing up in the 70's. My brother and I played "toy soldiers".
It involved having an equal amount of toy soldiers on each side - for fairness.
We were only allowed to pick 2 toy soldiers that were in a laying down pose as part of our team.
We then had an equal amount of marbles, a balanced amount of small and large marbles each.
We set our soldiers up at the ends of the hallway in our parents home and took it in turns to roll marbles at each others soldiers until one person had knocked all of the the soldiers down.

I know for a start that as a pair of brothers aged 7 and 9, we seem to have invented a more complex AND balanced rule system than GW can manage nowadays.

I'm gobsmacked by how poor this release seems.

What I'm even more amazed at, it all the people saying they'd hate to play KoW because it 1) is too simple and 2) doesn't have their beloved WFB background.
Erm... now these people are happily stating they'll give AoS a try? It seems to have exactly the same reasons they won't play KoW.

I've played GW stuff since 1984 and the best thing that GW have done recently - last year or so - was changed my WD subscription to Visions. It forced me to find a local model shop to buy WD.
And because of that, I've since discovered Deadzone, Kings of War and Bolt Action. All my gaming era's covered without GW anymore. I can now watch this train wreck and not care less anymore. I can use all my fantasy armies as they are in KoW so need to qq and sell them.

In all fairness, all the name changes for IP reasons, they started with paints and in 40k started pushing me away anyway.

/said my piece.

Problem I have with kings of war is the models they are crap with very few exceptions. Until that changes I won't play it I enjoy painting and kow just doesn't have it for me wish it did would save me a fortune.

Think age of sigma is a weird way for gw to go no idea if its a standalone or new warhammer or even if the new warhammer is around the corner.

I honestly don't know what to think of this game I wish I did I hate skirmish games so its big battles or nothing for me so untill I see something a damn site more impressive than what I have seen so far I think I am stuck with 40k have tryed infinite, warpath, dystopian wars, star wars armada and so many more I just see sigma as nothing more than a gimic untill something more worth while comes along

You can use all your fancy GW models when playing Kings of War.

Thing you may have missed about KoW, although I'm not a player I've seen it mentioned enough, is that you're under no obligation to use any Mantic models in your armies, even at sanctioned events.

They're very much the anti-GW when it comes to that sort of thing, so you can play the rules and use whichever models you like. There's even a semi-official project to make tourney legal lists for all the WHFB factions on the go as I understand it.

I can live with name changes - I've never heard anyone call Imperial Guard anything else - and I have to praise GW for at least being bold with AoS.

WFB was dead for a long time before now, so it'll be a hard task for AoS to be an outright failure. I would love to see how it sells in comparison with Island of Blood over the first month, but I guess that's data we'll never get to know.

Dropfleet Commander is something I'm looking forward too for now 40k will do .

 Death By Monkeys wrote:
GW is releasing AoS to boost flagging Hobbit/LotR sales! They think folks that want a decent, tactical ruleset will switch over there! Sales there are gonna go through the roof. (Never mind that Mantic stuff or other systems, mind...)

Lol, I love pointing out to some of my pals just how wrong they were with LoTR. Back when it started, they derided it for being "too simple" and "a kid's game" and now they're all wishing Fantasy and 40K were as elegant and well-balanced! My only real issue with the LoTR/ Hobbit rules is how some profiles are handled in comparison to their book/ film counterparts. The rules are pointed well and balanced, but something like a Warrior of Gondor or Rider of Rohan should be better than they are portrayed in-game (with an appropriate points increase, of course!)

Again, I love my Warhammer stuff. My Empire army especially, but I don't know the future of it and that's enough to worry me into not buying a damn thing for now. The love is keeping me interested in what GW will pull out though.

Put the models together today, so we can play some without proxies now! I must say, i think these are some of the most stunning models GW has ever done. It reminds me of opening the box of Space Hulk and seeing the high quality of the models.

Mold lines are nearly non-existent. The Khorne Lord and relictor are personal favorites. I can see this set selling just for the models, especially for 40k projects.

10penceman wrote:
Problem I have with kings of war is the models they are crap with very few exceptions. Until that changes I won't play it I enjoy painting and kow just doesn't have it for me wish it did would save me a fortune.

I play KoW. I actually own very few Mantic fantasy models. People need to get out of the GW hhhobby mindset of thinking you have to stick to 1 company for both the game and models.

Do as I do.... use the good GW models with the good KoW ruleset. I've also discovered a few other good fantasy models that fit my armies and aren't Mantic or GW.
I just wish I'd taken this step years ago.

Yeah, the policy for Kings of War is "use whatever models you like as long as you have the correct unit base size". It's surprisingly gamer-friendly.

And the new edition is coming out in free PDF July 10th, which is either a hilarious coincidence or a brutally effective marketing idea:

http://manticblog.com/2015/07/03/try-kings-of-war-for-free/

Oh, and the GW army lists are not semi-official, they're official.
http://manticblog.com/2015/07/01/want-a-good-reason-to-switch-to-kings-of-war/

there are in fact two supplementary books coming with lists for historical armies and for fantasy armies that we don’t make miniatures for, like medieval human armies, and lizard-, beast- or rat- men forces.

Well, I finally read the WD75 over coffee this morning. I was too excited about the Stormcast Eternal yesterday to read it. I wrote this in the Discussions thread already, but it's worth mentioning here:

It says clearly on the page before the rules describing the box contents (P.20):

"Perhaps the most exciting thing in the box after the jaw-dropping miniatures, is the 96-page book detailing the opening battles of the Age of Sigmar."

That 96 page book probably isn't a zillion battlescrolls in microscopic print; more likely, you can download the full battlescrolls online (there are a thousand fantasy kits after all), and the 96 page book contains a combination of battlescrolls and scenarios detailing the opening battles of AoS.

So, if Scenarios are not your thing (a) make up your own balancing system or mechanism or (b) play something else.

I read through the rules; they look to be exactly what Games Workshop wanted -- a simple system that takes minutes to learn, enabling you to pew-pew your model collection in skirmishy battles. There is no way this game will "scratch my itch" -- it's missing vehicles, huge robots, medium robots, guns, large armies, looks to use minimal terrain, and it isn't nearly complex enough for me. Then again, WHFB wasn't the thing for me either, because ranks of models in movement trays have little appeal to me. But this might be a decent time killer for little pockets of time. Or it might be a nice box of models to paint up and put into a display case

I can believe the reasoned post about abandoning the current market of WFB and trying to create a new market of buyers for AOS, except for one thing:

GW is pushing the old WFB IP with Mordheim, Vermintide, Total War, etc. games.

That doesn't disprove it, but it makes me scratch my head.

If people play one of these games and like it, and say, "Hey, that's really cool! How can I explore this more?" , the answer has to be "you can't. GW doesn't make this stuff any more." It's the same weird decision that sees Bloodbowl as a video game (and BFG, and Space Hulk, etc.), but not as a playable game from the owner of the IP.

Except that at least with Bloodbowl or Battlefleet Gothic, the developer knew what they were getting into. Did the guys who are working on Vermintide, or Warhammer: Total War (or whatever) know that GW was going to blow up and completely abandon the IP they were working in? It's one thing to develop a game that serves as an ad for a game GW no longer makes. It's another to maybe think GW will be able to promote your game to their players, only to discover that GW has completely destroyed the setting of your game in their player base.



On a completely unrelated topic, has anyone else noted (because I don't see any comments on it), the complete lack of customization so far?

You don't have magic items. You don't have weapon and armor choices. So far, nothing in the game can be fielded in any way other than the way it is packaged. Is the warscroll for an Empire Hero going to have the options for greatweapons/handweapons/shields/mounts/pistols/lance/blah/blah/blah? I recognize that the Warscrolls we have now are for the newest units only, but does anyone really think that the options for customization that were previously available are still going to be there?

Anyone think there gonna be chaos Stormcast Eternals?

Da Butcha wrote:


On a completely unrelated topic, has anyone else noted (because I don't see any comments on it), the complete lack of customization so far?

You don't have magic items. You don't have weapon and armor choices. So far, nothing in the game can be fielded in any way other than the way it is packaged. Is the warscroll for an Empire Hero going to have the options for greatweapons/handweapons/shields/mounts/pistols/lance/blah/blah/blah? I recognize that the Warscrolls we have now are for the newest units only, but does anyone really think that the options for customization that were previously available are still going to be there?

Yep, this is a lot like GW's competition. It makes for a much simpler game modelling-wise, which is a complaint that many people have about 40k -- "I don't want to think about what gun to glue onto the Space Marine". It also makes unit selection more equitable and makes it less likely that you'll find min/max optimizations or configurations that are clearly superior (why take a chainsword when a bolt pistol is better in every way).

Not for me, as I love deciding those types of things. But no different than WMH models.

On the bright/dark side, it means GW is probably going to make more snapfit models. Again, not really my thing, but a lot of people prefer them to multipart plastic, because they are just easier to build. It appeals to a different niche of modeler/painter (than me).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 rabidaskal wrote:
Anyone think there gonna be chaos Stormcast Eternals?

They're called Blood Warriors -- all the models on p. 18 are fantasy CSM