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Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker






 Ol'Dirty wrote:
what's the current opinions on special weapon selection on the troops and performance of rangers vs vanguard?

Personally I've been needing some 6man or lower squads for my IG to put in my vendettas and love the look of the mech-dudes. Thinking I'm gonna use these as my new IG allies, pick up a box of troops and some spider tanks

Oh, do the doctrines bonuses to BS affect snap shots? that might make that skyfire array of doom more flexible if it did.


In my opinion rangers and vanguard have the potential to perform well but in different roles. If I were to want a squad to sit back and take long range shots, rangers are pretty solid. However, this isn't what I need them to do so I will likely go with vanguard, to act as short range anti-infantry. They don't have the greatest durability against any dedicated assault troops so ideally they will work in support of my assaulters to soften up tough targets for the heavy hitters. For this reason, I think the plasma calivers will be my go to special weapon. Though, I am a bit concerned about pumping out that many plasma shots. Gets Hot has not been my friend in the past. If they can pull it off though that is some serious devastation potential. The arc rifles are also very good if you want them to focus more on wrecking vehicles. I have other allies for that duty though and passing up those calivers is just too tough to do.

Since snap shots don't have a set modifier number, they just reduce your BS to 1 regardless, I don't believe you can offset this penalty with the imperatives. I've been out for a while and am just now getting back into 40K so I'm a bit rusty on the rules, but this is how I think it would work. Someone else may have a different take however.
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Any opinions on the tactical objective deck? Are the Skitarii tactical objectives listed in the codex?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/13 04:13:01


 
   
Made in ru
!!Goffik Rocker!!






 Talys wrote:

Edit: I'm not sure that made sense. I mean, people don't seem to have reacted as badly to Skitarii not having HQs as they did with Harlequins not having HQs.


Cause eldar are spoilt with their 6-th dex.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/13 04:19:40


 
   
Made in us
Boom! Leman Russ Commander






the_hanged_man wrote:
Any opinions on the tactical objective deck? Are the Skitarii tactical objectives listed in the codex?

Yes, they have a listing for them. They actually seem good and fluffy.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/13 04:20:25


clively wrote:
"EVIL INC" - hardly. More like "REASONABLE GOOD GUY INC". (side note: exalted)

Seems a few of you have not read this... http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/forum_rules.jsp 
   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker






the_hanged_man wrote:
Any opinions on the tactical objective deck? Are the Skitarii tactical objectives listed in the codex?


Yes, there are six unique tactical objectives listed in the codex. The datacards will likely be fairly useful. Besides the objectives, they will also have the Doctrina Imperatives, which could be helpful in keeping them organized during the game.
   
Made in us
Beautiful and Deadly Keeper of Secrets





The only Tactical Objective I see an issue for them is denying a power.
   
Made in dk
Servoarm Flailing Magos






Metalica

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
The only Tactical Objective I see an issue for them is denying a power.


You don't think manifesting one is more problematic?

 
   
Made in us
Beautiful and Deadly Keeper of Secrets





 Purifier wrote:
 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
The only Tactical Objective I see an issue for them is denying a power.


You don't think manifesting one is more problematic?


I was speaking of their specific tactical objectives, what was it.. A victory for logic?

Also one for mysterious objectives, which most people don't use.
   
Made in dk
Servoarm Flailing Magos






Metalica

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
 Purifier wrote:
 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
The only Tactical Objective I see an issue for them is denying a power.


You don't think manifesting one is more problematic?


I was speaking of their specific tactical objectives, what was it.. A victory for logic?

Also one for mysterious objectives, which most people don't use.


I thought basically everyone used the houserule that if you actually cannot complete the objective (under any circumstances.. like getting manifestation of psychic power when you have no psychic powers) you get to reroll it.

 
   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka






 Purifier wrote:


I thought basically everyone used the houserule that if you actually cannot complete the objective (under any circumstances.. like getting manifestation of psychic power when you have no psychic powers) you get to reroll it.


Yeah, I can't recall a game I've played where this was not understood to be the case, even though it's not in the rules.
   
Made in us
The Last Chancer Who Survived





Norristown, PA

Picked up the codex, cards and 2 boxes of troops yesterday. Barely skimmed it before cracking open my boxes (as usual). I haven't played a single game of the current or previous edition so I'm a little lost with all the new stuff. Want to build a solid army, not a min-max win at all costs kind of thing, but I would still like to be able to not lose all the time. So what's the "best" loadouts for the rangers and vanguard?

Just for these 2 boxes worth, I was thinking of starting with 1 unit of 6 rangers w/ 2 of those long rifle thingies on the oval base (forget the name) .. then 2 units of 7 vanguards, 1 with 2 plasmas and the other with 2 of that other squarey plasma looking gun.

Or should I try to bump em down to have 4 units of 5? or 2 units of 10? 5 + 5 + 10?

My plans for the army and my wallet is to try and just keep these 2 boxes worth, then get 1-2 boxes of the melee fellas, and then mostly add in lots of walkers after that, cuz I always prefer to build and paint and play with the bigger stuff. So just trying to figure out how to get the best options out of what I got so far.

 
   
Made in us
Boom! Leman Russ Commander






Im wanting to try to stick with larger units. This to add survivability to the squads and special weapons.

the sniper weapons.... I like them but think they would be best used with 3 in a squad but even so dont see them doing that great against meq type armies due to ap on them.

I plan to get with the plasma to use as teleporting termy hunters but this is mainlyto deal with a local who spams those.

i'm putting phospher pistals on my vanguaalphas along with arc mauls. this way, I hae something to assault a vehicle withfiring it firstinstead of the quads guns can help ainst cover saves for the rest of the squad. Range permitting of course lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Question for the alpha...
Do you think it is more worthwhile to give him a special weapon in order to have the 3rd one for the unit or give him a close combat weapon and a pistal choice (im leaning towards the phospher pistol and arc maul) or to go overboard and do both?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/13 17:55:08


clively wrote:
"EVIL INC" - hardly. More like "REASONABLE GOOD GUY INC". (side note: exalted)

Seems a few of you have not read this... http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/forum_rules.jsp 
   
Made in us
Preacher of the Emperor





Hanford, CA, AKA The Eye of Terror

I see this book as being what scions should have been for a precursor book. I think that all the units that are our now plus a few extras (an HQ, prob another elite, maybe some sort of artillery, possibly a flyer of some kind, or at least have rules for the forgeworld stuff). However, i predict that the Cult have a much different take on the units. It will likely either have completely different imperatives or even scrap them altogether for something more centered on the HQ and some sort of powers/orders that they use (why else would they have those data links that improve Ld?) additionally, the detachment with scout and crusader, which is super awesome, will not be present outside of allying in from the skitarii book, which will make the skitarii a different style of army to take on their own when compared to the "parent" codex.

So far I like what what I see in the book, they will give me great fun as an ally force, maybe might even let me run a very fun and unique army list. I kinda feel that using the skittari book will make fluffier Scions than the actual scion book! They have better units, better guns, better leadership, and hell, they reflect the unquestioning nature of the scions themselves and are only lacking transports......which can still be taken from using a second Scions CAD!!! I'd say putting vanguard in Taurox Primes would be quite fun and extremely deadly. The only thing they wont get is scout (and seriously, why don't scions have a detachment just like this one?) but you will still be able to bring a lot of mobile firepower to bear, and still have dragoons to keep up and counter assualt anything headed for your troops, plus you can Valkyre in any additional troops.

Also I vote on the Cult book getting something silly like fast rhinos, that way GW gets to sell additional stuff without actually having to make new models.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/04/13 22:02:18


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"Remember, Orks are weak and cowardly, they are easily beat in close combat and their tusks, while menacing, can easily be pulled out with a sharp tug"

-Imperial Guard Uplifting Primer 
   
Made in us
Latest Wrack in the Pits




Skitari look Awesome Im torn between getting some now or waiting to see if the Cult Mechanicus rumors hold water to see about getting into them.

BTW does anyone else kinda want to put Dunecrawler legs on an Imperial Knight?
   
Made in us
Irked Necron Immortal




 EVIL INC wrote:
Ithe sniper weapons.... I like them but think they would be best used with 3 in a squad but even so dont see them doing that great against meq type armies due to ap on them.


They are AP3. You will be killing at least one MEQ a turn at 60", at least until your Ruststalkers and Vangaurd get into it, after that they can support by taking pop-shots at tanks thanks to S4 vs vehicles and armorbane.

I plan I keeping them back line to shoot out meltas, laz, plaz, ect. so my dragoons can stomp out troops
   
Made in us
Brainy Zoanthrope






Thoughts on Rangers vs Vanguard for putting in my vendettas? Rangers are 10pts more expensive, but w/ mtc they won't have to worry about the dangerous terrain test if they scatter from a grav chute insertion.

Another quick question to anyone who's opened a box of troops; did gw do that bs where they only put one of each special weapon in the box even though you can have 3 of one in a 10man squad?


/

 
   
Made in ca
Commander of the Mysterious 2nd Legion





 Ol'Dirty wrote:
Thoughts on Rangers vs Vanguard for putting in my vendettas? Rangers are 10pts more expensive, but w/ mtc they won't have to worry about the dangerous terrain test if they scatter from a grav chute insertion.

Another quick question to anyone who's opened a box of troops; did gw do that bs where they only put one of each special weapon in the box even though you can have 3 of one in a 10man squad?


yup only 1 special weapon per box sadly. as for what to put in vendettas it'll depend on what your doing with em. Rangers are a solid backfield sniper unit. whereas vanguard are better at closer ranges. thus if your goal is to drop em in your enemies midst and cause chaos, vanguards are PROABLY the better choice. especially because their rad aura means people may be hesitant to charge them.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Assault 3 is so nice on the calivers, but htey are considerably more expensive than a plasma gun. -1T in combat means theyre still wounding MEQ on 3s, but probably not worth thinking about combat

2x5 man units, 2 calivers and two arcs, in vendettas seems a steal to me.
   
Made in de
Mysterious Techpriest






Except you use a 10man squad for the calivers to get that extra wounds in front of those expensive guns.

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Made in us
Boom! Leman Russ Commander






For what its worth, you can buy that extra one guy to make 6 for the squad.

What do you guys think of getting chimeras for guard and having these guys hop in on turn one to start an advance? Dont think they can start the game in them.

clively wrote:
"EVIL INC" - hardly. More like "REASONABLE GOOD GUY INC". (side note: exalted)

Seems a few of you have not read this... http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/forum_rules.jsp 
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws



Sioux Falls, SD

 EVIL INC wrote:
For what its worth, you can buy that extra one guy to make 6 for the squad.

What do you guys think of getting chimeras for guard and having these guys hop in on turn one to start an advance? Dont think they can start the game in them.


Not a terrible Idea, basically like allying with SM and jacking their rhinos, you can't start inside the vehicle but turn 1 you can all pile in. Hey look the blood angels left this convenient fast rhino for their devastator squad here, be a shame to leave them machine spirit out better take care of it...{Quickly runs off to study the engine}

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/04/15 12:05:03


Blood for the bloo... wait no, I meant for Sanguinius!  
   
Made in dk
Servoarm Flailing Magos






Metalica

 Necros wrote:
[reasonable thinking and level headedness]

Yeah, I didn't go the route of level headed thinking. I saw the Cavalier formation and built an 1800p pure skitarii army around it, and then bought all of the models needed for it.

So my pure Skitarii looks like this:

Skitarii Maniple:
9 Infiltrators and an Infiltrator Princeps.
The Princeps runs as the Warlord and is fairly well kitted to handle the role.
All using Flechette and Taser Goads, of course.

9 Vanguard and an Alpha
One carries a Plasma Caliver

9 Vanguard and an Alpha
One carries a Plasma Caliver

9 Rangers and an Alpha
Three carry Arquebuses

3 Dunecrawlers
All have the Neutron Laser/Cognis Heavy Stubber kit and an extra Heavy Stubber. (dual heavy cognis stubbers makes for a painful unit to charge.)
You really want these in a group of 3 to get the 4++ invuln. Gee-dub knows how to sell the worst of their overcosted models. "Want one? Might as well take three, yeah?"

Ironstrider Cavaliers formation:
2 Ballistarii with lascannons

3 Dragoons
each has a Phosphor Serpenta

3 Dragoons
each has a Phosphor Serpenta

Throw some kit on the alphas to round out the points and I ended up right on target.

Is this a competetive army? Not by a long stretch. The Skitarii lack the versatility to be on their own. But I'm a purist at heart. It just feels right to field pure armies. And I think it's gonna be a lot of fun. The Formation for the two units of dragoons and one of ballistari is where my heart is at.

If you want Skitarii to be competitive on their own, I believe you want to basically just run hordes of Vanguard. They are ridiculously undercosted. They can easily outperform Sisters in versatility and they are cheaper to boot, and Sisters aren't a bad horde army in their own right.
Maybe back them up with some Ballistari to punch holes through heavy targets.
The only problem is how much more easy it is to get AP4 than AP3.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/04/15 14:17:05


 
   
Made in us
Abel





Washington State

Here is a question or two about the Sicarian Ruststalkers:

The base squad has transonic blades, chordclaws, and mindscrambler grenades. The Ruststalker Princeps can also take a prehensile dataspike.

All of the above weapons have a melee profile, and when you make your close combat attacks, all your attacks have to be made with the same weapon. Yet the chordclaw has molecular dissonance- one of it's close combat attacks has the Fleshbane rule.

The Prehensile Dataspike also has a close combat profile, and it allows an attack at I10 in addition to its regular close combat attacks.

So just to be clear, when I attack in close combat with the Ruststalkers, I have to use the transonic blades, OR chordclaws OR dataspike, but not all three, correct? I know there was a bunch of questions about similar wording in the Harlequin Codex and the Harlequin's Kiss.

Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience  
   
Made in us
Brainy Zoanthrope






While I'm testing the list I'm going to run rangers in one vendetta and vanguard in the other. I know I'm going 2 arc rifle on one squad, but I'm not 100% sure about going plasma caster on the other, I kinda wish they had a flamer type option.

Kinda want to find a way to avoid buying another box just for the weapons since I just need the 2 squads of 5 dudes (All my infantry models are in vehicles the way I play my IG atm).


/

 
   
Made in us
Boom! Leman Russ Commander






Find someone else and trade bits. Thinking of maybe using the ranger bits on the bodies of cheaper models in greatcoats fom another army. Now to see if I have an unbuilt one of those other models to try it on before getting another 2 boxes of them....

clively wrote:
"EVIL INC" - hardly. More like "REASONABLE GOOD GUY INC". (side note: exalted)

Seems a few of you have not read this... http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/forum_rules.jsp 
   
Made in us
Boosting Space Marine Biker






 Tamwulf wrote:
Here is a question or two about the Sicarian Ruststalkers:

The base squad has transonic blades, chordclaws, and mindscrambler grenades. The Ruststalker Princeps can also take a prehensile dataspike.

All of the above weapons have a melee profile, and when you make your close combat attacks, all your attacks have to be made with the same weapon. Yet the chordclaw has molecular dissonance- one of it's close combat attacks has the Fleshbane rule.

The Prehensile Dataspike also has a close combat profile, and it allows an attack at I10 in addition to its regular close combat attacks.

So just to be clear, when I attack in close combat with the Ruststalkers, I have to use the transonic blades, OR chordclaws OR dataspike, but not all three, correct? I know there was a bunch of questions about similar wording in the Harlequin Codex and the Harlequin's Kiss.


That's not the way I understand it. According to the wording you get an additional attack for the dataspike at Initiative 10, then you make you regular attacks. For the chordclaws, you make your close combat attacks as normal, and one of them will have the dissonance rule...meaning that one of your attacks is made with the chordclaw and the others are with your razors. So, yes you use all three, which I realize is not how things have worked traditionally but this is RAW in the codex.
   
Made in us
Irked Necron Immortal




 Gridge wrote:
 Tamwulf wrote:
Here is a question or two about the Sicarian Ruststalkers:

The base squad has transonic blades, chordclaws, and mindscrambler grenades. The Ruststalker Princeps can also take a prehensile dataspike.

All of the above weapons have a melee profile, and when you make your close combat attacks, all your attacks have to be made with the same weapon. Yet the chordclaw has molecular dissonance- one of it's close combat attacks has the Fleshbane rule.

The Prehensile Dataspike also has a close combat profile, and it allows an attack at I10 in addition to its regular close combat attacks.

So just to be clear, when I attack in close combat with the Ruststalkers, I have to use the transonic blades, OR chordclaws OR dataspike, but not all three, correct? I know there was a bunch of questions about similar wording in the Harlequin Codex and the Harlequin's Kiss.


That's not the way I understand it. According to the wording you get an additional attack for the dataspike at Initiative 10, then you make you regular attacks. For the chordclaws, you make your close combat attacks as normal, and one of them will have the dissonance rule...meaning that one of your attacks is made with the chordclaw and the others are with your razors. So, yes you use all three, which I realize is not how things have worked traditionally but this is RAW in the codex.


In Melee you name which weapon you are going to be using before rolling your to-hit. The Dataspike, Cordclaw, and Razors are all close combat weapons and are all viable weapons to use in melee. If you nominate your Dataspike you get your normal attacks and the extra I10 attack. These will all have Haywire and the Dataspike counts as a specialist weapon and follows any restrictions based on that. If you nominate your Cordclaw you get all of your attacks with the exception that one of them must be rolled separately and has fleshbane, all of these attacks have Transonic. If you nominate your Razor you get Transonic only, no extra gimmicks.

Similarly, if you have a Bolt Pistol and a Power Sword you can choose to attack with the Bolt Pistol instead. These attacks are at S User with no AP.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






I'm convinced that Ruststalkers are the bee's knees IF you can protect them with an assault vehicle, even if that's a Land Raider. With haywire grenades, Fleshbane, and AP2 they're a threat to literally every unit (except those damn Necron wraiths.) And the Zealot mask is an obvious choice if your squad is larger than 5.

Tell me what I'm missing and why they're actually risky. Is it because they'll always be caught out in the open after ripping up units?

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Made in gb
Guardsman with Flashlight






No idea how they perform on the table for me yet. But I've just ordered my first 2 boxes of vanguard/rangers and I cannot wait. Models look great and 'fluffy'. Army rules seem in keeping with their feel and I'm hearing rumours of more Ad Mech to come in 40k later this year. For once, GW leave me smiling with a release

"Drive me closer! I want to hit them with my sword!" 
   
Made in us
Sagitarius with a Big F'in Gun





tornado alley, United States

Even thought I have the super shiny codex, for me this army is sitting on the back burner. I have too much other stuff going on right now...and i'm content to wait and see when the other ad mech stuff drops.

It's not helping that as the year goes on the next major rumor release that I will probably HAVE to drop $$$ on is genestealer cult.

I want to run these guys for the next round of kill teams though.


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I do not work for GW in any fashion. When I edit my post, either I've misspelled something, punctuation, or I'm fixing swearing. Oops.  
   
 
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