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Considering that the Scout Sergeant can take stuff from the Melee wargear list, which is the best melee weapon to take with a Sarge's pistol (or if you're feeling cheesy, his sniper rifle)?

As the BA Scout Squad has both Furious Charge and Move through Cover, I'd expect a CQC-geared squad would be mediocre at worst.

Most of the time I just run 2 min sized scouts squads with ccws for troops, and if I give them any upgrades it's usually melta bombs or a combi melta on the sgt. But if you want something with a little more oomph, 10 dudes with shanks and a sarg with a power maul should do the trick for just 125 points. The maul is better than the sword vs vehicles and doesnt waste the potential init5 from baal strike force like the axe. 3 str7 ap4 attacks on the charge at init5 backed up by 27 str5 init5 attacks will knock out almost any light or medium vehicle and batter the majority of troop choices in the game

Yeh maul is probably the best bet. Although as th3maninblak states - melta bombs is probably your best shout.
I'd never go for a 10man squad though when you can take 2 5's for the same price and get a free second sarge and greater flexability. They can always combine on one target if you need to.

None.

I've actually done incredibly well using a 10 man squad in a storm raven.
9 guys with bolt pistol / ccw, serg w/ a power fist / shotgun.

Power fist / shotgun is maybe my fave wargear combo in the game in terms of coolness, and it's nice to not feel like you're losing out on an attack by pairing the power fist with a two shot assault weapon.
If only all space marine HQs could take that for free!

Anyway, flying in with a fully loaded storm raven is a tactic that a lot of people on this board don't like because it's risky, but no one in my meta plays with much anti-air, so I'm basically guaranteed a charge with a dreadnought, 10 melee scouts, and an HQ that's usually going to be some kind of librarian.

Let the librarian get in a challenge, then cast quickening on the scout serg for 4 to 6 S9 AP2 attacks on the charge. It's a good thing!

None. You would be better off spending those points on another scout. SM Sergeants are not strong enough fighters to make effective use of power weapons.

I use a fist on mine, but I draw the line at a larger squad for him. I give him the base 5 models to work with and let him go wander around trying to pick fights with things. This is not efficient. Not at all honestly, but he looks cool and sometimes when he finds something he can wail on it completely surprises the enemy. I've actually been seriously wondering if scout bikers serve much of any purpose lately. I can't really see much of one, but since alot of the time I play with cool looking mini's vs what I know to be better strategy, it doesn't phase me too much.

 Phyrekzhogos wrote:
I use a fist on mine, but I draw the line at a larger squad for him. I give him the base 5 models to work with and let him go wander around trying to pick fights with things. This is not efficient. Not at all honestly, but he looks cool and sometimes when he finds something he can wail on it completely surprises the enemy. I've actually been seriously wondering if scout bikers serve much of any purpose lately. I can't really see much of one, but since alot of the time I play with cool looking mini's vs what I know to be better strategy, it doesn't phase me too much.

Dude, seriously, try a large squad of scouts in an assault vehicle (ideally a storm raven, but the others could work in certain circumstances). Three S5 I5 attacks plus a shooting attack is so beastly for 11 points.

Like, when the new codex came out, I was all, okay, mephstar is dead, long live mephiston leading an actual squad, FINE. And I built a a command squad with storm shields and a power fist for him to fly into battle with in a storm raven.
Due to playing small games and a troop-heavy tournament, he's just been flying into battle in that thing backed up by 10 melee scouts lead by a vet serg. w/ a power fist/shotgun. They've been doing so much damage, I've got a feeling my command squad is going to be collecting dust.

I actually dig this idea a lot. Never thought about mephy with a bunch of scouts in a raven, since the scout squad is so cheap it's less of a point investment.

Anyone thought about a scout heavy list? Maybe sentinels of terra with baal strike force. Here would be the core.

Sentinels of Terra
-10x Scouts
Bolters
Combi Grav
-10x Scouts
Bolters
Combi Grav
-10x Scouts
Bolters
Combi Grav

Baal Strike Force
-10x Scouts
Shanks
Power Maul
-10x Scouts
Shanks
Power Maul
-10x Scouts
Shanks
Power Maul

735 points for 60 dudes. At 1850 it leaves 1115 points to play with. That many infiltrating bodies with either twin linked bolters or str5 init5 close combat attacks seems nuts.

 th3maninblak wrote:
I actually dig this idea a lot. Never thought about mephy with a bunch of scouts in a raven, since the scout squad is so cheap it's less of a point investment.

Anyone thought about a scout heavy list? Maybe sentinels of terra with baal strike force. Here would be the core.

Sentinels of Terra
-10x Scouts
Bolters
Combi Grav
-10x Scouts
Bolters
Combi Grav
-10x Scouts
Bolters
Combi Grav

Baal Strike Force
-10x Scouts
Shanks
Power Maul
-10x Scouts
Shanks
Power Maul
-10x Scouts
Shanks
Power Maul

735 points for 60 dudes. At 1850 it leaves 1115 points to play with. That many infiltrating bodies with either twin linked bolters or str5 init5 close combat attacks seems nuts.

I can think of some ways to make this even more of a tide of bodies that never ends.

-Use Death Company in the required elite slot for the BSF. Jump packs at about 3 ppm.
-For required HQ on the BSF, how about Phoros (If your opponent accepts FW stuff) . Hatred bubble, rage, a Glaive Encarmine, it's all FUN for the other guy when this list goes on the charge ! Hook my man Malakim up with good old Valour's Edge (Debatable if you want to swap the Glaive for this), at about 195 points total.
-Drop Pod for the DC, with the DC's pimp mobile totaling about 150 pts with dudes inside.

So that's about 345 points extra. Still a lot to play 'round with.

Maybe. Though we might be able to fit 3 drop pods in there. 2x5 sternguard from sentinels, and a command squad from BA to fill out the baal strike force. Combine that with Mephiston, a Bones of Osrek libby, and a TDA libby with Veritas Vitae and you've gotta pretty potent alpha strike force.

Edit: actually, it fits perfectly with just enough points for a 5 man death co squad with a power fist and jump packs, and clocks in at 86 models.

I'm just gonna point out that you generally can't buy any gear (like relics) to named characters.
Also, he doesn't seem to have much synergy with the list.

 Walnuts wrote:

 Phyrekzhogos wrote:
I use a fist on mine, but I draw the line at a larger squad for him. I give him the base 5 models to work with and let him go wander around trying to pick fights with things. This is not efficient. Not at all honestly, but he looks cool and sometimes when he finds something he can wail on it completely surprises the enemy. I've actually been seriously wondering if scout bikers serve much of any purpose lately. I can't really see much of one, but since alot of the time I play with cool looking mini's vs what I know to be better strategy, it doesn't phase me too much.

Dude, seriously, try a large squad of scouts in an assault vehicle (ideally a storm raven, but the others could work in certain circumstances). Three S5 I5 attacks plus a shooting attack is so beastly for 11 points.

Like, when the new codex came out, I was all, okay, mephstar is dead, long live mephiston leading an actual squad, FINE. And I built a a command squad with storm shields and a power fist for him to fly into battle with in a storm raven.
Due to playing small games and a troop-heavy tournament, he's just been flying into battle in that thing backed up by 10 melee scouts lead by a vet serg. w/ a power fist/shotgun. They've been doing so much damage, I've got a feeling my command squad is going to be collecting dust.

I've seen you talking about that one alot and honestly, I'm pretty game to give it a try, I'd just need to actually go buy a Stormraven first (my poor wallet!). Phoros can get himself a command squad on the table without using a force slot up, so my initial thought was to stick him with that since he can't get a jump pack, and just load those in the raven.

Offhand, since you said 3 S5 I5 attacks, I'm assuming you're running the scouts with bolters rather than CCWs? Most of the ones I own are CCW or sniper models. I think I've only got 4 of the bolter users, but that does seem like a nice little use for getting some close up shooting around on the board if you decide not to charge. Kinda warming up to that idea. If I stuck Phoros with them, he'd give them all a nice lil Hatred blanket, Rage and Zealot. As good as Mephy is, I'm sorta trying to stick to Lamenters only on my force for fluffiness mostly.

How are you getting three attacks with bolter Scout? Rage from Malakim?
Note that the squad only gets it if he loses a wound. And iirc, he doesn't have Zealot, just the Hatred bubble.

 Walnuts wrote:
I've actually done incredibly well using a 10 man squad in a storm raven.
9 guys with bolt pistol / ccw, serg w/ a power fist / shotgun.

Power fist / shotgun is maybe my fave wargear combo in the game in terms of coolness, and it's nice to not feel like you're losing out on an attack by pairing the power fist with a two shot assault weapon.
If only all space marine HQs could take that for free!

Anyway, flying in with a fully loaded storm raven is a tactic that a lot of people on this board don't like because it's risky, but no one in my meta plays with much anti-air, so I'm basically guaranteed a charge with a dreadnought, 10 melee scouts, and an HQ that's usually going to be some kind of librarian.

Let the librarian get in a challenge, then cast quickening on the scout serg for 4 to 6 S9 AP2 attacks on the charge. It's a good thing!

+1 for the power fist shotgun sergeant! That is an idea so cool that I now must build one...

I like the idea of power mauls as well, what are people using for mauls?

In terms of scout lists I'd thought about using Champions of Fenris to run an all Wolf Scout list, which gives you WS4 BS4 scouts but it is a bit of a pipe dream at the moment.

 soomemafia wrote:
How are you getting three attacks with bolter Scout? Rage from Malakim?
Note that the squad only gets it if he loses a wound. And iirc, he doesn't have Zealot, just the Hatred bubble.

1 base attack, +2 on the charge for furious. How else would you get 3?

Nah, he has Zealot in his profile. Take a look at him, he's not actually as bad as he's made out I think. The major thing I don't like about him is his rage only activating after a wound and no jump pack, but other than that, I kinda like him. I really did think Warlord was the same thing as LoW though, so now I guess I have to kinda rethink that part, but at least now I know.

Furious Charge only gives you +1 S when charging. Rage is the one that gives you extra attack on charge.

So they have one base, two CCW's and one for charge. After Malakim loses a wound, that would become four attacks on charge.

And yeah, I've been putting him in some lists recently. Haven't really had a chance to actually play him because every time I'm about to I realise that he costs as much as Mephiston...

 soomemafia wrote:
Furious Charge only gives you +1 S when charging. Rage is the one that gives you extra attack on charge.

So they have one base, two CCW's and one for charge. After Malakim loses a wound, that would become four attacks on charge.

And yeah, I've been putting him in some lists recently. Haven't really had a chance to actually play him because every time I'm about to I realise that he costs as much as Mephiston...

Grrr, you're right. I don't know how I mixed that up. I swear I get confused by the multitude of different profiles now more often than I ever used to back in 3rd when I originally learned the game. I have a lot to relearn and memorize.

Still, I could see maybe running him with the scouts. They'd definitely cost less than his command squad, and I wouldn't be risking quite as many points in the stormraven that way so I like the idea.

I have been playing around with my Bolter-Scout Sargent armed with a Combi-Grav and a Lighting Claw.

I would love to see that scout heavy army in action. I think it would catch a lot of people offguard and be great for seizing objectives, and that bolter drill thing would be great for compensating for scouts' crap BS.
Not sure how competitive it would be, but people seem to think lots of small units are the way to go atm, so who knows? Maybe?
I still think the powerfist on the melee sergs is the way to go on the melee sergs though, you need to be able to bust up big dudes, which are invariable going to crash into your lines if you're running around that close to the enemy.
I only ever play with one melee scout squad, but my powerfist serg busts up a lot.

The thing is, you're wasting the scouts high init on the charge. BSF gives init5 on the assault, which is huge now that eldar are back in a big way.

A full squad still gives you 27 S5 I5 attacks, which is the kind of massive dice chucking a marine player rarely gets to do. The extra S9 AP2 attacks just make sure that a single rampaging monstrous creature or knight can't take you out.
Plus, personally, my scouts usually escort Mephiston, and his AP3 in melee is one of his few weaknesses. Adding a power fist in the squad, especially one that meph can buff with d3 extra attacks compensates for his weakness very nicely.

Plus, the thing about eldar is, you're not really going to beat them.
If you get the bikes in hand to hand, you'll beat em, I5, I4, or I1, but of course, that's a VERY big 'if'. If you're concerned about rampaging wraith constructs, well, you'll need that fist. As for everything else in the list, well, if you're facing much of that then you're facing a very sub par list, so it shouldn't matter too much.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
BSF is really only useful against other marines, and if you're into using dreadnoughts (who benefit greatly from the I bonus against knights and monstrous creatures).

I'm actually moving away from BSF myself and instead abusing obj sec on fast tanks as much as possible. DC will usually rape a unit at INIT 4 as well as INIT 5.

Same. It's very situational, def not auto-take. Can't knock the good ole CAD! If you can't out fight em, at least out score em.

 Walnuts wrote:
Same. It's very situational, def not auto-take. Can't knock the good ole CAD! If you can't out fight em, at least out score em.

I was a huge deal in 5th because of assaulting against GK and SW. Now, in 7th, we have access back to init 5, but the game is so different that it's not like the good 'ol days. Against space wolves now, I'm just gonna shoot them with grav and plasma and not even pretend to punch them. The coward Angels are back in full effect. We're power armor Dark Eldar. Feth off, GW.

I'm firmly in the 'No upgrades for the sgt' camp.
Here's my reasoning:

Basically it's just a point sink, if you're going to bother giving the Sgt a upgrade CCW you'll want to get the most out of it so you need to upgrade him to a Vet Sgt. At this point the Sgt costs three times as much as a basic scout and all you're really gaining is +1A and +1LD.

I'd much rather use those points to put more scouts in the unit, more bodies means your opponent has to commit more firepower to remove them / gives them more hope of remaining locked in combat when they charge something. On top of that it's more S5 attacks on the charge.

The only upgrade I'd realistically consider is Melta bombs because dealing with AV14 is a pain in this edition.

D

CC weapons for scouts combi grav on sarge, with scout and infiltrate you can get a full salvo turn one in many situations or just sit midfield and wait with 4 dirt cheap ablaitive wounds in cover or outflank and get 2 shots off. Combi weapon makes them useful in both turn one and two. I think BSF is kinda overrated, if your running many scouts CAD seems way more useful.