Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Yes we have interests in the region. In actuality oil is the only security interest. How does wiping out the region help that interest?

Going "full bore" means hitting the sunnis, who will resist (again). Not going full bore keeps the crazy sunnis in place so they can fight the crazy shiities (miltias).

If you took the religion off of it and were Italian you would say this is Persia vs the Anatolian provinces or Carthage. You can either take it over Roman style and own it, or leave it alone until this generation's flare up fades.

 Frazzled wrote:

2. Lets assume godlike power. All Al Qaeda and ISIL are wiped out in six months once Team Texas enters the picture. Then what? There's still a power vacuum there. The factors that helped form ISIL are still there.

Once Team Texas cleans up the place, they can just colonize it and form New Texas! Crappy land full of oil? Toss some cattle around and they’ll feel right at home. And as it will now be full of texans, nobody will mess with it.

Problem solved.

Well that is a true statement. Plus we can import their crocodiles and poisonous snakes to make Texas even more Australia like. We could put water maccasins in the Jordan and Nile for grins and willies.

We could turn the Great Pyramids into a giant Buckeys gas station sign. Yes!

Interesting note on Deathworlds. The actor playing the bad guy in the latest Mad Max movie, played the bad guy in the first Mad Max movie.

I have to say Iraq is supplying ISIS quite well with US military hardware. Ramadi has fallen

 Frazzled wrote:
Well that is a true statement. Plus we can import their crocodiles and poisonous snakes to make Texas even more Australia like. We could put water maccasins in the Jordan and Nile for grins and willies.

Pretty sure there are already crocodiles in the Nile. Snakes'd be a welcome break.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
Well that is a true statement. Plus we can import their crocodiles and poisonous snakes to make Texas even more Australia like. We could put water maccasins in the Jordan and Nile for grins and willies.

Pretty sure there are already crocodiles in the Nile. Snakes'd be a welcome break.

For clarity. Import crocodiles and asps to Texas. Export water mocassins, brown recluses, copperheads, and crew cut sporting rednecks to the ME. This will insure the Deathworld that is Texas gets even stronger. After all, Dog created Texas to train the Faithful.

 Jihadin wrote:
I have to say Iraq is supplying ISIS quite well with US military hardware. Ramadi has fallen

. This is the desert version of 70's Cambodia, Laos, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Then we get people from the administration saying "not to light our hair on fire" when there's a setback:

http://www.kmbz.com/White-House-to-Reporters-on-Ramadi-Don-t-Light-You/21536584

No worries there, ISIS is the group lighting people's hair on fire when there's a setback against them.
I truly hate this administration.

Relapse wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
I have to say Iraq is supplying ISIS quite well with US military hardware. Ramadi has fallen

. This is the desert version of 70's Cambodia, Laos, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Then we get people from the administration saying "not to light our hair on fire" when there's a setback:

http://www.kmbz.com/White-House-to-Reporters-on-Ramadi-Don-t-Light-You/21536584

No worries there, ISIS is the group lighting people's hair on fire when there's a setback against them.
I truly hate this administration.

Agreed. The White house seems remarkably relaxed about this setback. Perhaps there's something they know that we don't know?

More weapons have been promised to Iraq, but if ISIL gets their hands on them, and it's likely that they will...

Does the US have plans drawn up for any further advances? ISIL's only 70 miles away from the capital, but everybody's acting like it were 700 miles. Nothing to see here, move on.

Airstrikes have been largely ineffective, and it seems to be like the fall of Saigon all over again.

Please tell me I'm exaggerating, but I'm getting that impression.

I'd bet good money if ISIL actually made it to Bagdad Iran sends full scale army units and Iraq officially breaks up into three nations.

Given the tribal dynamics, thats probably the best thing.

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

Relapse wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
I have to say Iraq is supplying ISIS quite well with US military hardware. Ramadi has fallen

. This is the desert version of 70's Cambodia, Laos, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Then we get people from the administration saying "not to light our hair on fire" when there's a setback:

http://www.kmbz.com/White-House-to-Reporters-on-Ramadi-Don-t-Light-You/21536584

No worries there, ISIS is the group lighting people's hair on fire when there's a setback against them.
I truly hate this administration.

Agreed. The White house seems remarkably relaxed about this setback. Perhaps there's something they know that we don't know?

More weapons have been promised to Iraq, but if ISIL gets their hands on them, and it's likely that they will...

Does the US have plans drawn up for any further advances? ISIL's only 70 miles away from the capital, but everybody's acting like it were 700 miles. Nothing to see here, move on.

Airstrikes have been largely ineffective, and it seems to be like the fall of Saigon all over again.

Please tell me I'm exaggerating, but I'm getting that impression.

Robert Gates, our previous SecDef was quoted yesterday as saying that the US does not have a Middle East strategy. The White House is relaxed about this, because they simply don't give a damn.

Robert Gates, our previous SecDef was quoted yesterday as saying that the US does not have a Middle East strategy. The White House is relaxed about this, because they simply don't give a damn.

Maybe because there isn't a good one except RUN AWAY

What you guys forget is that Baghdad is a HUGE city. Millions of people live here. It is also the heart of the Iraqi Shia majority as a whole, the metropolis is basically the heart and brain of the entire country.

I highly doubt ISIS will EVER be able to take the city. Remember they got their butts handed to them at the village of Kobani.

 djones520 wrote:

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:

Relapse wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
I have to say Iraq is supplying ISIS quite well with US military hardware. Ramadi has fallen

. This is the desert version of 70's Cambodia, Laos, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Then we get people from the administration saying "not to light our hair on fire" when there's a setback:

http://www.kmbz.com/White-House-to-Reporters-on-Ramadi-Don-t-Light-You/21536584

No worries there, ISIS is the group lighting people's hair on fire when there's a setback against them.
I truly hate this administration.

Agreed. The White house seems remarkably relaxed about this setback. Perhaps there's something they know that we don't know?

More weapons have been promised to Iraq, but if ISIL gets their hands on them, and it's likely that they will...

Does the US have plans drawn up for any further advances? ISIL's only 70 miles away from the capital, but everybody's acting like it were 700 miles. Nothing to see here, move on.

Airstrikes have been largely ineffective, and it seems to be like the fall of Saigon all over again.

Please tell me I'm exaggerating, but I'm getting that impression.

Robert Gates, our previous SecDef was quoted yesterday as saying that the US does not have a Middle East strategy. The White House is relaxed about this, because they simply don't give a damn.

Except to take credit for "ending" the war in Iraq. This compilation pretty much tells it all about Obama and the way he ran the situation. Trying to take credit, then realizing he could look bad and trying to shift blame:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KFqrBJ_1rro

Thats my point. They tend to get hammered when they get out of Sunni territory. Its almost like they lose their support base...

I hate to say it but Biden was right...

The thing about ISIS is that eventually someone will paste them. They pose way too big a threat for the powers in the region to leave alone. Even if Baghdad somehow falls I doubt the Iranians will let the entire region fall into ISIS control and I seriously doubt that either the Israelis or the Turks want something like ISIS on their borders. Its only a matter of time before someone smacks them down, my money is on Iran.

Right now however both the regional powers and the great powers seem content to let the Arabs kill each other.

 EmilCrane wrote:
The thing about ISIS is that eventually someone will paste them. They pose way too big a threat for the powers in the region to leave alone. Even if Baghdad somehow falls I doubt the Iranians will let the entire region fall into ISIS control and I seriously doubt that either the Israelis or the Turks want something like ISIS on their borders. Its only a matter of time before someone smacks them down, my money is on Iran.

Right now however both the regional powers and the great powers seem content to let the Arabs kill each other.

No its Sunnis vs. Shiites. Arabs (and gang) vs. Persians. I can almost see some guys in leather jockstraps coming over the hill, flexing pecs and shouting this is Sparta.

Sure, Iran doesn't want ISIS around. But since our two governments are having a hissyfit with each other, we don't want Iran involved. We should be working together, building bridges and all that, to make things better for all. But that's just my idealism talking.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
Sure, Iran doesn't want ISIS around. But since our two governments are having a hissyfit with each other, we don't want Iran involved. We should be working together, building bridges and all that, to make things better for all. But that's just my idealism talking.

That ship sailed 10 years ago.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Frazzled wrote:

 EmilCrane wrote:
The thing about ISIS is that eventually someone will paste them. They pose way too big a threat for the powers in the region to leave alone. Even if Baghdad somehow falls I doubt the Iranians will let the entire region fall into ISIS control and I seriously doubt that either the Israelis or the Turks want something like ISIS on their borders. Its only a matter of time before someone smacks them down, my money is on Iran.

Right now however both the regional powers and the great powers seem content to let the Arabs kill each other.

No its Sunnis vs. Shiites. Arabs (and gang) vs. Persians. I can almost see some guys in leather jockstraps coming over the hill, flexing pecs and shouting this is Sparta.

Still getting this image of Americans hanging from the last helicopter out of Baghdad, as ISIL overruns the place.

 Frazzled wrote:

 EmilCrane wrote:
The thing about ISIS is that eventually someone will paste them. They pose way too big a threat for the powers in the region to leave alone. Even if Baghdad somehow falls I doubt the Iranians will let the entire region fall into ISIS control and I seriously doubt that either the Israelis or the Turks want something like ISIS on their borders. Its only a matter of time before someone smacks them down, my money is on Iran.

Right now however both the regional powers and the great powers seem content to let the Arabs kill each other.

No its Sunnis vs. Shiites. Arabs (and gang) vs. Persians. I can almost see some guys in leather jockstraps coming over the hill, flexing pecs and shouting this is Sparta.

Shiite does not equal persian, currently its ISIS, an Arab movement, fighting the governments of Syria and Iraq, Arab nations

This is going to turn into one big civil war when we withdraw. If ISIS was smart they wait till Obama is ready to leave office and then go for it

I don't see the point in making another ISIS thread so I'll just put this here:

Ten Young People Detained In Canada for trying to join ISIS.

And another city goes down with statues being grabbed out of Palmyra in an attempt to save them.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/05/20/ancient-syrian-city-reportedly-in-isis-hands-amid-antiquities-outcry/

 Frazzled wrote:
Thats my point. They tend to get hammered when they get out of Sunni territory. Its almost like they lose their support base...

I hate to say it but Biden was right...

Don't hate to say it. Biden May make lots of stupid off the cuff remarks, but he knows his stuff. His problem is he is too much like the average American to get elected by Americans. I make stupid comments all the the time ( just ask my students). I had a roommate for three years from Ethiopia that used to work at a hotel in dc as a doorman that Biden used to frequent, and though he was extremely conservative, my roommate always complimented Biden on his ability to remember his name, always offer a tip, and ask how he was doing.

 EmilCrane wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:

 EmilCrane wrote:
The thing about ISIS is that eventually someone will paste them. They pose way too big a threat for the powers in the region to leave alone. Even if Baghdad somehow falls I doubt the Iranians will let the entire region fall into ISIS control and I seriously doubt that either the Israelis or the Turks want something like ISIS on their borders. Its only a matter of time before someone smacks them down, my money is on Iran.

Right now however both the regional powers and the great powers seem content to let the Arabs kill each other.

No its Sunnis vs. Shiites. Arabs (and gang) vs. Persians. I can almost see some guys in leather jockstraps coming over the hill, flexing pecs and shouting this is Sparta.

Shiite does not equal persian, currently its ISIS, an Arab movement, fighting the governments of Syria and Iraq, Arab nations

There is no government in Iraq now. There are the Sunnis (ISIL), Kurdestan, and Shiistan (Iran - aka Persia).
But agreed, ISIL is in Syria. I don't see how they can beat the Syrian military.

To quote the Roman Senator in Spartacus: "It takes us five years to train a legion, and these slaves build an army in six months!"

It's official, guys. Now we play the waiting game

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-32820857

The Iraqi government is calling on volunteers to help fight ISIL.

Anybody from Dakka ready to answer this call of arms?

Which side?

it is about time that joining ISIS = voluntary abandonment of citizenship.

That would solve a lot of problems, but proving it is potentially difficult, unless the bar is low. Then the cries of oppression will start.

I have a solution at least on the US side. Anyone leaving the US who doesn't have incriminating photos of attending drunken parties at Sandals or Cancun, shall not be allowed to re-enter the country, unless they can sing the Star Spangled Banner in proper key and recite Travis' letter from the Alamo word for word.

Soooo... Any Americans on here starting to understand how the British Empire came into existence yet? No?

OK, I'll come back in a few years and ask again.