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That's what it seems to me. This kid is getting the run-around from someone who is getting a paycheck for only doing half their job.

Obviously the advisor had the time for e-mail, but couldn't spare five minutes for a face to face explanation?

Seriously, what is wrong with academia?

xraytango wrote:


Seriously, what is wrong with academia?

There's a lot... and it's not just advisers at many schools. Places such as my school are funneling money to the top, and basically screwing all the other staff, and students in the process.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

xraytango wrote:


Seriously, what is wrong with academia?

There's a lot... and it's not just advisers at many schools. Places such as my school are funneling money to the top, and basically screwing all the other staff, and students in the process.

It's time to realize that students are not just students, but "revenue source" to these schools.

 whembly wrote:

It's time to realize that students are not just students, but "revenue source" to these schools.

Sadly, I think that to certain people in the various schools around here, that's all we are.

Between jacking up tuition rates, and decreasing staff pay in the "pecking order" it's no wonder people are becoming disenfranchised with higher education.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 whembly wrote:

It's time to realize that students are not just students, but "revenue source" to these schools.

Sadly, I think that to certain people in the various schools around here, that's all we are.

Between jacking up tuition rates, and decreasing staff pay in the "pecking order" it's no wonder people are becoming disenfranchised with higher education.

The way to fix that is a combination of A) allowing school debt to be dischargable and B) when "a" happens, the schools becomes liable for it at a percentage. Let them have a little "skin" in the game.

 whembly wrote:

The way to fix that is a combination of A) allowing school debt to be dischargable and B) when "a" happens, the schools becomes liable for it at a percentage. Let them have a little "skin" in the game.

I think the problem with that solution, is that I can already see that schools having a "little skin" in the game, are going to take it out on the hides of their adjuncts, who are already seriously underpaid.


Personally, I am a fan of what Bernie Sanders has been saying about needing to fix higher ed in the US. Will it solve issues like in the OP? Probably not, but that's why students need to take matters into their own hands and file numerous complaints and reports against terrible staff.

I had quite a few lectures cancelled last year because of striking lecturers.

They were quickly rectified when students began sending requests for tuition funds to the chancellor, but that's what happens when you muck around law students.

But the whole point of being in a waiting room is waiting.... I've done far worse things to get the attention of people who think they are too good to talk to me. Especially when I'm the reason they are getting paid.

But it seems like the advisers are not doing their jobs at all, they are supposed to be there for the welfare of their students.

nkelsch wrote:
Basically this is how it went from what I read:

*Student asked some questions of his adviser, which were somewhat complicated.
*Adviser Responded with an email with a link to a "read this and follow it" much how tech support places say 'have you checked the FAQ'.
*Student responded with 'I didn't understand the document links you sent me, it is confusing. Please, can we meet?
*Adviser responded with "Re-read the document. Period."
*Student fills out forms to make multiple appointments. Every appointment is canceled, rescheduled, or blocked from being made because "his question was already answered"
*He went to the head of his academic department who basically said "Yep, you should transfer to a school with Advisers who give a darn and work for a living" eluding to a similar frustration or knowledge that this is a known issue.

The emails are from August 2014. He has them datestamped.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 whembly wrote:

The way to fix that is a combination of A) allowing school debt to be dischargable and B) when "a" happens, the schools becomes liable for it at a percentage. Let them have a little "skin" in the game.

I think the problem with that solution, is that I can already see that schools having a "little skin" in the game, are going to take it out on the hides of their adjuncts, who are already seriously underpaid.


Personally, I am a fan of what Bernie Sanders has been saying about needing to fix higher ed in the US. Will it solve issues like in the OP? Probably not, but that's why students need to take matters into their own hands and file numerous complaints and reports against terrible staff.

That maybe true... but the administrative cost of higher educations has skyrocketed as well.

There's no easy solution... only that right now, there's easy money for very little risk for these schools.

In the Healthcare industry, for hospitals at least, there is a program called "meaningful use". In this program, there are criteria these instituions need to maintain/prove in order to qualify for the full reimbursement rates from the government. One result of this, is that after a patient has been discharged, that patient is assigned a "care coordinator" to ensure the patient is educated, and even assist in followup visits to their primary care physicians. The idea here is to mitigate any "re-admission" within 30 days.

Maybe something like that could be created for qualified schools to use some sort of benchmark for these students (graduating? hired in their field? something?) so the the schools have more incentives to ensure the successes of their students. Know what I mean?

Because, frankly, most of these schools don't really care if their students are successful... just that they've attended and the classes are paid for.

But... enough of distracting this thread... as to the OP, it looks like it's a school cultural issue and lack of leadership in that department.

 whembly wrote:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 whembly wrote:

It's time to realize that students are not just students, but "revenue source" to these schools.

Sadly, I think that to certain people in the various schools around here, that's all we are.

Between jacking up tuition rates, and decreasing staff pay in the "pecking order" it's no wonder people are becoming disenfranchised with higher education.

The way to fix that is a combination of A) allowing school debt to be dischargable and B) when "a" happens, the schools becomes liable for it at a percentage. Let them have a little "skin" in the game.

Take the federal gov't out of the student loan business. As long as they are in it and guarantee loans to pretty much anyone with a heartbeat regardless of their actual potential to graduate let alone graduate with a degree that gives them a chance to realistically pay back their debt, the schools KNOW they can charge as much as they want as the Feds just write checks for a larger amount.

If you had to go to a local bank and apply for a student loan and the bank was allowed to actually say NO, a C student in some over crowded humanities major would not be a risk the bank would put money on. Making the debt dischargeable mens the banks would have to be smart about the risk they accepted. As it stands, us tax payers have no say in the risk though in essence we are the ones floating the loans.

If that is harassment, I'm guilty of harassment too.

Couldn't count the number of times I have harassed someone in this way.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

nkelsch wrote:

In my day, advisers were faculty, basically my professors in my major. I know some schools make the positions a non-professor clerical position.

The school I'm currently at has both. We even have a "Veterans Adviser" who handles only students on the various VA paid programs. The reason we have both, is that if you are a future transfer student (such as I am) even the best field adviser may not have all the answers to what transfers where. So for instance, if my current adviser, who is a history professor because my goal is to transfer out and get a bachelor's in history says, "Well you really need to get another science class knocked out of the way" but isn't sure exactly which science class to take due to transfer requirements, I can go down to the main advising office and say, "My adviser says I need to take X class, but it needs to fulfill requirements A, B, and C"


Ultimately, at least at my school ,and even the school I'm transferring to, they need both the Student Adviser, who is a professor in the field of study, to ensure that the student stays on the right track to meet their goals, but then the "scheduling adviser" (for lack of a better term) is there to make sure that the classes are available and meet your needs.... kind of like the high school guidance counselor did (I know that's about all mine were good for)

Same here, and im thankful for it, the typical wait for a student to talk to a academic advisor is about 3 hours. Down in the VA section its maybe 30 min. That being said, this guy was very calm, I hope that lady loses her job for being a witch bag.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

xraytango wrote:


Seriously, what is wrong with academia?

There's a lot... and it's not just advisers at many schools. Places such as my school are funneling money to the top, and basically screwing all the other staff, and students in the process.

This is a huge problem. A lot of schools are cutting great programs, departments and professors, while hiring more full time administrators. And a lot of times they'll let an older tenured professor retire, and then not hire a replacement, and let the courses be taught by adjuncts (or not at all), so many departments end up going shorthanded. Tenure-track positions (arguably the lifeblood of an actual university education) are drying up, while administrative bloat appears to be in full swing many places.

Educational institutes need to get into their heads that the students are customers, and they are paying a lot of money for their services.

I am constantly harassing my Doctors at the clinic, but they make me wait so they incur their own harassment? Confusing.

But wants me to face-palm me unconscious.

 Jehan-reznor wrote:
I am constantly harassing my Doctors at the clinic, but they make me wait so they incur their own harassment? Confusing.

But wants me to face-palm me unconscious.

Once again:

What constitutes "harassment" in a legal definition might not apply here--and we didn't have the full story anyways, as there was clearly some discussion going on between the adviser who was recorded and the student. The video opens up with the adviser telling him that he can't just wait around for a "Missus Tilly".

We need a students' Bill of Rights!

The Right to speak to an adviser at least once per semester!
The Right to have a goddam roommate that isn't if fething MIS major on the 6 year program when you're a chemical engineer trying to get out in 4.
And most importantly, you gotta fight for your right to party!

Students bill of rights should also include lots of topless sorority chicks and yoga pants on every girl I find attractive!

Bonus points if she's a hot sorority chick with no shirt on wearing yoga pants, doing light sprints up and down the dorm room hallway.

I second this!

The advising at my university was so bad that at one point I was simply told that my faculty advisor "wasn't doing it anymore". At which point I knocked on random office doors until someone signed my schedule. This kind of assertiveness is downright necessary if you want to navigate bureaucracy and doesn't have the faintest resemblance to harassment. I'd defy anyone to show me a bureaucratic organization that adheres 100% to the rules as written.

 CptJake wrote:

Take the federal gov't out of the student loan business. As long as they are in it and guarantee loans to pretty much anyone with a heartbeat regardless of their actual potential to graduate let alone graduate with a degree that gives them a chance to realistically pay back their debt, the schools KNOW they can charge as much as they want as the Feds just write checks for a larger amount.

Federal backing is a relatively minor concern (footing a college bill by way of federal loans and grants alone is quite rare) when laid against the fact that student loans can't be discharged, something which encourages banks to lend ridiculous amounts of money to people that can almost always be characterized as long shots.

 CptJake wrote:

If you had to go to a local bank and apply for a student loan and the bank was allowed to actually say NO, a C student in some over crowded humanities major would not be a risk the bank would put money on.

Oh, you mean like "Business"?

Regardless, private banks are presently allowed to say "NO". I don't know why you believe that they can't.

 CptJake wrote:

As it stands, us tax payers have no say in the risk though in essence we are the ones floating the loans.

Some of them, but not all of them, not even most of them.

'Human Resources', enough said.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Jehan-reznor wrote:
I am constantly harassing my Doctors at the clinic, but they make me wait so they incur their own harassment? Confusing.

But wants me to face-palm me unconscious.

Once again:

What constitutes "harassment" in a legal definition might not apply here--and we didn't have the full story anyways, as there was clearly some discussion going on between the adviser who was recorded and the student. The video opens up with the adviser telling him that he can't just wait around for a "Missus Tilly".

I agree with this; too little info to go off of right now.

That reaction was not one of "Oh, this guy is just sitting in the lobby, waiting for someone to be available"....

 Slarg232 wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Jehan-reznor wrote:
I am constantly harassing my Doctors at the clinic, but they make me wait so they incur their own harassment? Confusing.

But wants me to face-palm me unconscious.

Once again:

What constitutes "harassment" in a legal definition might not apply here--and we didn't have the full story anyways, as there was clearly some discussion going on between the adviser who was recorded and the student. The video opens up with the adviser telling him that he can't just wait around for a "Missus Tilly".

I agree with this; too little info to go off of right now.

That reaction was not one of "Oh, this guy is just sitting in the lobby, waiting for someone to be available"....

Except there is also absolutely no evidence to suggest anything other than that happened.

Add in that this was apparently not the first time this advisor had been rude and downright unprofessional to students and it just becomes even more unlikely that Bruce was doing anything wrong.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

 Slarg232 wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Jehan-reznor wrote:
I am constantly harassing my Doctors at the clinic, but they make me wait so they incur their own harassment? Confusing.

But wants me to face-palm me unconscious.

Once again:

What constitutes "harassment" in a legal definition might not apply here--and we didn't have the full story anyways, as there was clearly some discussion going on between the adviser who was recorded and the student. The video opens up with the adviser telling him that he can't just wait around for a "Missus Tilly".

I agree with this; too little info to go off of right now.

That reaction was not one of "Oh, this guy is just sitting in the lobby, waiting for someone to be available"....

Except there is also absolutely no evidence to suggest anything other than that happened.

Add in that this was apparently not the first time this advisor had been rude and downright unprofessional to students and it just becomes even more unlikely that Bruce was doing anything wrong.

This advisor, sure. But what about "Miss Tully"?

We have three players in the game; Miss Tully, the Rude Advisor, and Brucey. If it was just Bruce and the blonde chick, I would say 100% Bruce is in the right, but who the heck is Tully? How does she fit into this?