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So, what are we allowed to mold with green stuffs?

for example if I want to have more Kasrkin backpacks (which has been discontinued) am I allowed to mold and copy it with green stuff bought from GW?

what are your thoughts?

Do you care? They have no way of enforcing it even if it was 'banned'.

No, they usually take a sample of every piece of your model, test it in their laboratories and, if getting a positive, they'll send a squad of ninjas after you.

Verviedi wrote:Do you care? They have no way of enforcing it even if it was 'banned'.

I'm curious bout the exact rules, and also would like to stick to them if possible.

Sigvatr wrote:No, they usually take a sample of every piece of your model, test it in their laboratories and, if getting a positive, they'll send a squad of ninjas after you.

its easy to tell the two apart, as the original will be made from metal (much heavier), and the latter will be made from green stuff; much lighter.

There are no official rules apart from, well, using GW models. For the most part.

Thinking that they'll weight small model parts to check whether you used genuine GW green stuff (ehem...) is...well...

 Sigvatr wrote:
There are no official rules apart from, well, using GW models. For the most part.

Thinking that they'll weight small model parts to check whether you used genuine GW green stuff (ehem...) is...well...

well I'm more concerned about the rules regarding to copyrights, as we all know making GW rip-offs is pretty much illegal, but if we were to make parts with GW green stuffs for personal use; im not sure if we could count that as modification.

Greenstuff molds are illegal recasting, just like any other recasting. However, GW has better things to do than worry about every random person that makes a copy of a part or two for their own personal use. Just don't go into a store and start bragging about all of your recasting work.

 Peregrine wrote:
Greenstuff molds are illegal recasting, just like any other recasting. However, GW has better things to do than worry about every random person that makes a copy of a part or two for their own personal use. Just don't go into a store and start bragging about all of your recasting work.

I think this pretty much sums up everything I need to know, thank you.

 Peregrine wrote:
Greenstuff molds are illegal recasting, just like any other recasting.

Only if you sell it. In the US anyhow. Just like buying a dvd and duplicating 10 copies so you have one for every room, on the go and a backup without having to buy 10 more. Totally legal. Making 10 copies and selling them, illegal.

As far as GW goes, it would only matter in a GW store. Even then they usually require some majority percentage of each mini to be GW (75%, etc.) to allow for modding but keep it GW, I believe. In that case, duplicating assorted bits for your minis would still fly, assuming you aren't copying the entire mini.

 60mm wrote:
Only if you sell it. In the US anyhow. Just like buying a dvd and duplicating 10 copies so you have one for every room, on the go and a backup without having to buy 10 more. Totally legal. Making 10 copies and selling them, illegal.

That's not an accurate analogy because the exception that makes copying dvds/games/etc legal (in some situations, note that breaking the copy protection on a dvd is still illegal so you aren't going to be copying any mainstream movie dvds without breaking the law) is that you're just transforming your single copy into a different format to use elsewhere. The same reasoning would not apply to making multiple copies of a physical object so that you don't have to buy them, and there is no general rule that you can copy whatever you like as long as you don't sell it.

Making copies for Own use, go ahead just cannot sell em for profits.

 60mm wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
Greenstuff molds are illegal recasting, just like any other recasting.

Only if you sell it. In the US anyhow. Just like buying a dvd and duplicating 10 copies so you have one for every room, on the go and a backup without having to buy 10 more. Totally legal. Making 10 copies and selling them, illegal.

No. It's illegal to recast, even for personal use, in the US. DVDs and CDs (amusingly called 'phonorecords' in legalese) are specifically exempt from this, but toy soldiers aren't. (17 U.S. Code § 106-107)

 Sigvatr wrote:

Thinking that they'll weight small model parts to check whether you used genuine GW green stuff (ehem...) is...well...

Just like GW to do.
I would find it no surprise for our local GW manager to go over and pick up my model, and after noticing that it was lighter, to ban it from their tournaments and events.

I was done with that manager after he banned us from playing mtg while we waited for our opponents to arrive, solely because they weren't gw product.

Greenstuff illegal? Then why is GW selling it?

Davor wrote:
Greenstuff illegal? Then why is GW selling it?

Because that's not what the OP was asking. Doing your own sculpting work with greenstuff is legal, and it would be absurd to suggest otherwise. But the OP was asking about using greenstuff to cast copies of parts, which is not legal.

 Peregrine wrote:
Greenstuff molds are illegal recasting, just like any other recasting. However, GW has better things to do than worry about every random person that makes a copy of a part or two for their own personal use. Just don't go into a store and start bragging about all of your recasting work.

I can and will. Why not? They are probably bragging in their board rooms how those suckers keep buying the skitarii soldiers with one measly gun each.

 Orock wrote:
I can and will. Why not? They are probably bragging in their board rooms how those suckers keep buying the skitarii soldiers with one measly gun each.

Then don't be surprised when everyone in the store considers you TFG and the store owner kicks you out. Going into a store and bragging about how you've found a way to avoid buying the stuff a store is trying to sell you is just plain tasteless.

As long as you don't start selling your greenstuff backpacks on ebay or something, you're fine. Recast all you want for personal use, because no one who matters is ever going to know.

What a store does because you're being a cad is not a matter of rules, laws or anything like that, that's purely a reflection of "we reserve the right to refuse service". If you walk into a place of business and start acting like an ass, then the staff have every right to toss you out.

True, I think a balance must be struck.
There is nothing wrong with you modeling your oop backpacks because you can't find it, or an extra gun or two. Especially if you bought the kit from the FLGS. However making whole kits, purposefully bragging about avoiding spending money at/supporting the store is NOT cool.

As always, rule of cool applies.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Orock wrote:
I can and will. Why not? They are probably bragging in their board rooms how those suckers keep buying the skitarii soldiers with one measly gun each.

Then don't be surprised when everyone in the store considers you TFG and the store owner kicks you out. Going into a store and bragging about how you've found a way to avoid buying the stuff a store is trying to sell you is just plain tasteless.

This will probably cause some flame, but whatever.

I personally buy from as many recast sites as I can, not just because their cheaper, but because I vividly dislike gw and their business practices.
I avoid gaming at the local GW store as much as I can.
And on numerous occasions I have sent GW emails about my dislike.
If I were skilled enough to recast parts of my own models with green stuff, I would do it for sure.

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I personally buy from as many recast sites as I can, not just because their cheaper, but because I vividly dislike gw and their business practices.

Here's an idea: stop playing GW games with GW models. If GW is so morally wrong that you can't justify buying legal models then move on to something else. You aren't entitled to buy illegal recasts just because you really want to have those models.

I avoid gaming at the local GW store as much as I can.

No you don't. There is never a situation where you have to play at a GW store, so if you're playing there at all you're not avoiding it as much as you can. Which means you're willing to take advantage of the services GW offers, even though they're so evil that you can't stand the thought of buying their products legally.

One of the ways Privateer Press is cooler than GW. They fully endorse using greenstuff stamps to reproduce details of their models to put on other models as a shortcut to sculpting them yourself, from way back when they first came out as a miniatures company. Started as simply as reproducing icons off of Khador 'jacks to put on other 'jacks and scenery.

Oh look its the weekly dakka dejavu recast thread.

Peregrine, do you ever get bored of writing the same crap over and over? maybe you should have a notepad with all of these responses already typed out so you can just copy / paste it next time.

 Peregrine wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I personally buy from as many recast sites as I can, not just because their cheaper, but because I vividly dislike gw and their business practices.

Here's an idea: stop playing GW games with GW models. If GW is so morally wrong that you can't justify buying legal models then move on to something else. You aren't entitled to buy illegal recasts just because you really want to have those models.

And you aren't entitled to tell someone off for how they choose to play a game. Judge them for it silently, but when your fingers hit the keyboard leave the judgement out of it. Because this didn't cross the line you didn't get a warning, but it's getting close enough to it to warrant this. Cool it.

 Peregrine wrote:

 ninjafiredragon wrote:
I personally buy from as many recast sites as I can, not just because their cheaper, but because I vividly dislike gw and their business practices.

Here's an idea: stop playing GW games with GW models. If GW is so morally wrong that you can't justify buying legal models then move on to something else. You aren't entitled to buy illegal recasts just because you really want to have those models.

I avoid gaming at the local GW store as much as I can.

No you don't. There is never a situation where you have to play at a GW store, so if you're playing there at all you're not avoiding it as much as you can. Which means you're willing to take advantage of the services GW offers, even though they're so evil that you can't stand the thought of buying their products legally.

I enjoy the models and the game. I dont enjoy the company.

When I mean I avoid playing their, I mean I dont. I havent gone sense opening day.

 Peregrine wrote:
Greenstuff molds are illegal recasting, just like any other recasting. However, GW has better things to do than worry about every random person that makes a copy of a part or two for their own personal use. Just don't go into a store and start bragging about all of your recasting work.

Thank you, I missed that part. Problem reading the forums when tired. I was wondering why a lot of stuff wasn't making sense. I thought I read it as he was making them. Now I see the "Moulding" part. Now it all makes sense.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Orock wrote:
I can and will. Why not? They are probably bragging in their board rooms how those suckers keep buying the skitarii soldiers with one measly gun each.

Then don't be surprised when everyone in the store considers you TFG and the store owner kicks you out. Going into a store and bragging about how you've found a way to avoid buying the stuff a store is trying to sell you is just plain tasteless.

Molding the correct amount of weapons that should have been given in the first place does NOT make you TFG. It makes you the guy not willing to shell out 5 bucks on ebay per special gun because GW cant be assed to do something correctly. You are confusing me with someone press molding entire armies. Also I sculpt my own models, that too is something they can take a flying leap for if they think they can tell me its illegal.

 Orock wrote:
Molding the correct amount of weapons that should have been given in the first place does NOT make you TFG.

Maybe not, but going into a store and telling everyone how the store isn't selling you the product you deserve but you've found a way to "fix" the problem without buying anything is sure TFG behavior. The store owner (or employee, in the case of a GW store) has to sell their stuff, and proudly bragging about how clever you are for not buying from them is an pretty tasteless insult. You wouldn't go into a bookstore and tell all of the customers how stupid they are for buying books instead of pirating them, and talking about recasting in a store that sells the stuff you're recasting is no different. So, like I said, don't be surprised if they kick you out for your bad behavior.

Also, don't present this as some kind of production mistake, like parts you were entitled to just fell off the sprue. You got what exactly GW told you the kit contains.

Pressmolding your own meltaguns, buying them from ebay as bits, buying them from a third-party manufacturer....whatever. As long as you are not playing in a GW store with a tyrant of a manager, there are about 1,000 ways around a lack of bitz in a kit, only one of which even benefits GW.

Just have fun.