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Hi to all im a new W40k player and i want to create a csm World Eaters army to 1000 pt

this is my army list please feel free to suggest what ever you like and rating this army list



HQ-----------------KHARN THE BETRAYE------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HQ-----------------DEMON PRINCE / mark of khorne / power armor / axe of bliding fury--------------------------------------------
(i know that khorne mark isnt so great but i want to keep the army theme,and i use prince as anti-tank unit)

TROOPS---------KHORNE BERZERKERS x7 /6 with chainaxes/ champion with power fist / combi melta / veteran-------

TROOPS----------KHORNE BERZERKERS x6 /6 with chainaxe/ champion with combi melta/veteran---------------------------

TRANSPORT----CHAOS RHINO ( squad with power fist champion)---------------------------------------------------------------------

HEAVY------------CHAOS LAND RAIDER /combi melta (squad with troops and Kharn-----------------------------------------------



i dont want to be super competative i try to keep mostly the theme and ofc not to be so bad list..so i wait your seggustions thnks guys

A couple of tips, dont post unit costs, its against forum rules and edit your tilte to remove the capslock!

Its a good start to a list with some very hard hitting elements.

thnks mate i correct them

I'd maybe not bother with the combi-melta on the Land Raider and put Dirge Casters on instead. You've got lascannons on it already, a single melta shot is probably going to be less useful than not being shot by overwatch. I reckon, anyway.

I would also look at the Khorne Daemonkin book. You would lose the option of taking Kharne and the Axe of Blind Fury, but it gives you other options.

The chain axes on your berserkers are wasted points. 3 points for AP4 is not worth it to me. If it was AP3, it would be a different story.

Also, the powerfist squad should go with Kharne. Since you have to issue and accept all challenges, that champion will most likely never get to swing. Putting him with Kharne lets Kharne accept the challenge while your champion punches the normal squishy stuff.

AP4 is great versus most units. I always take them.

 Green is Best! wrote:

The chain axes on your berserkers are wasted points. 3 points for AP4 is not worth it to me. If it was AP3, it would be a different story.

True, zerkers already massacer things with 4+ saves or worse. They dont need to cost more to do it any better.
In fact you probably want to kill less, grind a bit so that they don't get out of combat and then get shot.

What about Orks and Nidz ? The more you kill all the better.

Depends on who you're playing for the chainaxes. For me, I play one regular opponent all the time, who generally fields a variety of different Space Marine forces, so I don't get much benefit from the AP3. Rule Of Cool dictates that I have a few however. They're good if he gets out his Guardsmen - sorry, Astra Militarum - though.

 Dozer Blades wrote:
What about Orks and Nidz ? The more you kill all the better.

few orks / nids have 4+ armor although some do. Most have 6+ in which case it really isnt a noticable change. 3 ppm increases the cost by 15%. You know what kills orks and nids, 15% MORE bezerkers.



What sounds better? 7 Berzerkers with chain axes or 8 Berzerkers without. More attacks, more shots, more wounds vs ignoring armor saves of weak enemies that do not have good armor saves. Consider that even against nids or orks, you are going to take some causualties before you make contact. What about after the unit takes 2 wounds? What about 3-4? The Zerkers without just keep getting better.

My point exactly. This list has 36 points of chainaxes that could be used for all sorts of things. Another berserker. Dirge casters. Havoc launchers.

The problem running without chainaxes is that even things like termagants will have a 16% chance of saving against you VS all of your hits.
Whilst threy are obviously suboptimal VS 3+ in an all comers list I think they are worthwhile.
An extra bezerker is not going to make that much of a difference when you go up against 20 termagants and another 4 of them make saves against your AP- attacks. Especially since that zerker is only putting out 3 basic attacks himself.

Quality over quantity.

 Ratius wrote:
The problem running without chainaxes is that even things like termagants will have a 16% chance of saving against you VS all of your hits.
Whilst threy are obviously suboptimal VS 3+ in an all comers list I think they are worthwhile.
An extra bezerker is not going to make that much of a difference when you go up against 20 termagants and another 4 of them make saves against your AP- attacks. Especially since that zerker is only putting out 3 basic attacks himself.

If the termagants charge
the 8 zerkers get 24 attacks
16 hit 11 wound
9 die and 2 live because they got an armor save

the 7 zerkers with chain axes get 21 attacks
14 hit 9 wound
9 die because they get no armor save.

either way 11 gaunts strike back and kill 1 marine. Next turn the zerkers with chain axes will do less damage because now they have less models.


If the zerkers get the charge, they will do considerably more damage, but the damage will be proportionally the same.

Against 5+ saves the chain axes do better, an additional enemy lives on(IG)
Against 4+ saves the chain axes do significantly better(Fire warriors or Skitarri)

The thing you never start just in combat. The chain axes lose out because you are losing models before you get to combat. What about overwatch? There are a lot of enemies with 4+ saves who can put out some punnishing overwatch. 5+ saves are mostly IG and Eldar. You will suffer some casualties before you make it there.

And chain axes do nothing against -/2/3+ saves or units with invulnerable saves


Naked is the TAC choice. Wielding chain axes is the specialist 4+ save niche. If you want to have a bloodbath against Flayed ones, take chain axes. If not, leave them at home.

I'm not too worried about overwatch from gants.

I'd take a look unto the Daemonkin codex as well to field a World Eaters Army.

And for both the Daemonkin & CSM I wouldn't take a LR, specially on a 1000pts list. It takes 1/4 of the list, sure it'll probably last the whole game unless there are units with grav weapons, or haywire, or the necron hits on 6's (iirc) but it's a lot of points for 2 lascannons when not moving.

If going for a themed WE army with CSM I'd field:

HQ

Kharn
Jugger Lord - MoK, Jugger, Sigil of Corruption, AoBF, Meltabombs, VotLW

Troops

8 zerks - power weapon on champion (axe or sword), VotLW
8 zerks - power weapon on champion (axe or sword), VotLW
Rhino - Dirge Caster

Fast
5x Spawns
Dreadclaw

Total, 1000 pts

You'd need a Dreadclaw thou, which can either be from FW or converted from a loyal drop pod. Anyway, with this you could get kharn with the dreadclaw squad to deepstrike on turn one near the enemy lines, and be succesfully charging on turn 2, the Jugger Lord with spawns can ride behind the rhino.

The jugger hopefully charges on turn 2 as well, and in this same turn disembark the zerks to get a turn 3 charge on whatever needs to get wrecked

 Lord Yayula wrote:

8 zerks - power weapon on champion (axe or sword), VotLW
8 zerks - power weapon on champion (axe or sword), VotLW

It is almost always better to take a single lightning claw instead of a sword.
It does the same or more damage except when your strength is greater than enemy toughness AND your base attacks are 2 or less. The lightning claw does significantly more damage against higher toughness or when you have more base attacks or are charging.

So for a zerker, you have str4 and 2 meaning you would only get value out of the power weapon against T3 or less when not charging (or being charged)

With FC you strength goes up, but you also get more attacks. Which sounds better. 5 attacks rolling 3+ to wound or 4 attacks rerolling 3+ to wound with shred.

really good seggustions thanks a lot
i think to remove combi-meltas but what can i then do against enemy land raiders?

ravenhellblader wrote:
really good seggustions thanks a lot
i think to remove combi-meltas but what can i then do against enemy land raiders?

what can a combi melta do?

One shot
2/3 change to hit
very likely pen
1/3 chance to explode

overall it's not likely to destroy a landraider. Meltabombs at least allow you to try multiple times.

If the choice is 7 or 8 guys, you take 8. Always 8. Who do you think they are, plague marines?

Remember your chaos numerology people!

Personally, I would consider some basic csm as troops to go with kharn. He kills your dudes on 1s, so you can minimise your own losses in points terms since zerks die just as easily to gorechild as regular csm. You can also throw in things like melta or plasma if you want (but see above ref more expensive marines).

For theme just paint em up as pre-initiate zerks and throw on an extra ccw or mark to taste. More bodies are often better when you still have base t4 and a 3+ save to all the shooting you suffer before the assault. As Stalin once said: quantity has a quality all its own.

Theorycraft... in practice I have found chain axes to be absolutely worth the points (not that I wouldn't mind paying less for them). The more attacks you have the more 5's and 6's they will roll. Definitely enough to make the axes worth it. I play mostly against orks, nids and tau, sometimes guard, all of which suffer greatly from the axes.

I'd take melta havocs/chosen in a dreadclaw over a landraider. I've tried a khorne prince with wings and the axe. I got lucky, but I took out most of my opponents army with the prince alone. He's really brutal....with wings. Without wings your going to struggle. You'd probably get better resulsts from a blood slaughterer (with impaler), deepstriking or otherwise, plus you'd have more points. Even maulerfiends might be better considering their cost in comparison (against tanks anyway).

Maybe use the other points on another dreadclaw for kharn.

You may be better off putting Kharn in a Cultist Squad. Use them as a fleshy envelope to mail him to the enemy.

Roknar wrote:
Theorycraft... in practice I have found chain axes to be absolutely worth the points (not that I wouldn't mind paying less for them). The more attacks you have the more 5's and 6's they will roll. Definitely enough to make the axes worth it. I play mostly against orks, nids and tau, sometimes guard, all of which suffer greatly from the axes.

Well that is the real trick now isn't it?

If you KNOW you are playing orks, nids, and tau they are absolutely worth it.
if you are playing against space marines or even sisters of battle..... wasted points.

 Green is Best! wrote:

Roknar wrote:
Theorycraft... in practice I have found chain axes to be absolutely worth the points (not that I wouldn't mind paying less for them). The more attacks you have the more 5's and 6's they will roll. Definitely enough to make the axes worth it. I play mostly against orks, nids and tau, sometimes guard, all of which suffer greatly from the axes.

Well that is the real trick now isn't it?

If you KNOW you are playing orks, nids, and tau they are absolutely worth it.
if you are playing against space marines or even sisters of battle..... wasted points.

It appears that many players would argue that even against orks etc the axes are barely worth it...if at all. In which case axes are just a waste of points all together.
I'm just saying that I disagree to a point where I will take them if I have the points left and there is a any chance at all I'm going against something like orks. That said they're not a huge priority. But I've failed miserably in enough combats against "weak" units that I definitely keep them on my radar.