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Grav is the hard counter to GCs. It's almost as if it is exactly designed for the job.

"Look at that huge, heavy, walking monstrosity, Sarge!"
"Oh yeah? Watch me crush it under its own mass. Physics, b*tch!"

Well, that and other super heavies with titan killing weapons.

You can get almost three Knights for that price, and I'm pretty sure they could deal with the Hierophant.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/654710.page

For the general consensus on this matchup according to dakka. Don't be so silly as to think a GMC should be able to survive against a round of shooting from a grav devastator squad.

 Blacksails wrote:
Well, that and other super heavies with titan killing weapons.

You can get almost three Knights for that price, and I'm pretty sure they could deal with the Hierophant.

The Hierophant is not even D in melee.

You could take it in CC with one knight.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Lets see, lascannons? Nope, can't get enough for 1000 points.

Melta? Still too few shots needing 5s to wound, and requires you to get too close.

Plasma? Hell no. 6s to wound is garbage.

All we are left with is Grav.

I dunno how many wounds it has , but anything with fleshbane is going to pull a number on it.
Even "just" a poultry sorceror with iron arm and the black mace is going to take a huge chunk out of that titan.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Blacksails wrote:
Well, that and other super heavies with titan killing weapons.

You can get almost three Knights for that price, and I'm pretty sure they could deal with the Hierophant.

The Hierophant is not even D in melee.

You could take it in CC with one knight.

It doesn't need to be. Str10 is plenty to wreck up a Knight. Does depend on how lucky the knight rolls for his multiple wounds.

2 I think do statistically put it in the ground, but that depends on a lot of variables.


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Roknar wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Lets see, lascannons? Nope, can't get enough for 1000 points.

Melta? Still too few shots needing 5s to wound, and requires you to get too close.

Plasma? Hell no. 6s to wound is garbage.

All we are left with is Grav.

I dunno how many wounds it has , but anything with fleshbane is going to pull a number on it.
Even "just" a poultry sorceror with iron arm and the black mace is going to take a huge chunk out of that titan.

Not much Fleshbane has Ap2 to go along with it.

Its full defensive statline is T9, 10 wounds, 2+ armor, and FnP.

 Grey Templar wrote:


It doesn't need to be. Str10 is plenty to wreck up a Knight. Does depend on how lucky the knight rolls for his multiple wounds.

2 I think do statistically put it in the ground, but that depends on a lot of variables.

Yeah, which seems fairly reasonable to me. I feel that if you're playing a game with super heavies, a reasonable counter is a rough equivalent in opposing super heavies. At least then you have the spectacle of watching your giant gribblies wrestle with each other.

Of course having a squad of Centurions deep strike in and heroically annihilate the enemy with its own weight is also pretty cool.

Not so cool for the Tyranid player, I imagine.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Of course having a squad of Centurions deep strike in and heroically annihilate the enemy with its own weight is also pretty cool.

If you're the commander of the cents, sure.

If I had the Hierophant, and given the choice between death by grav cents and death by Knights/Stompa/other large beasty, I'd choose the latter.

YMMV of course. All that said, I feel that grav and/or certain carriers of grav could use a sprinkling of nerf dust.

You're not forging the narrative hard enough, because a team of Space Marines podding in next to a giant monstrosity to take it out with Marine-portable weapons is exactly the kind of thing 40K is known for.... it is, in fact, the sort of thing the game strives to depict.

Being the commander of the heirophant I would even be ok with a similar amount of points shooting into it to take it down (even if it only takes one turn's worth of shooting). The fact that if a group of grav devastators catches one out of cover they easily remove it is just... wtf

 Psienesis wrote:
You're not forging the narrative hard enough, because a team of Space Marines podding in next to a giant monstrosity to take it out with Marine-portable weapons is exactly the kind of thing 40K is known for.... it is, in fact, the sort of thing the game strives to depict.

Yea, just as long as its the space marines being the hero

Roknar wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
You're not forging the narrative hard enough, because a team of Space Marines podding in next to a giant monstrosity to take it out with Marine-portable weapons is exactly the kind of thing 40K is known for.... it is, in fact, the sort of thing the game strives to depict.

Yea, just as long as its the space marines being the hero

Then the Centurions get swamped by Gaunts.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Grav amps are free on devastators too.

? Am I missing something?

Centurion Devastators pay 25 points for Grav + Amp.

Regular Devastators pay 35 points for Grav + Amp.

 kronk wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Grav amps are free on devastators too.

? Am I missing something?

Centurion Devastators pay 25 points for Grav + Amp.

Regular Devastators pay 35 points for Grav + Amp.

I mean they come free with the cannons.

 Psienesis wrote:
You're not forging the narrative hard enough, because a team of Space Marines podding in next to a giant monstrosity to take it out with Marine-portable weapons is exactly the kind of thing 40K is known for.... it is, in fact, the sort of thing the game strives to depict.

40k is equally known for giant monstrosities fighting other giant monstrosities.

Given a choice between the two equally fluffy and reasonable ways to delete a hierophant, I'll always choose the option where giant things fight other giant things.

So, Grey Templar, since grav is perfectly fine and other things just won't do it against 'phants, does that mean I can't kill the 'phant as a CSM player? I have no grav, after all.

 Ashiraya wrote:
So, Grey Templar, since grav is perfectly fine and other things just won't do it against 'phants, does that mean I can't kill the 'phant as a CSM player? I have no grav, after all.

Playing CSM tho, forging the narrative means you're forever trapped in the role of punching bag. :V

 Ashiraya wrote:
So, Grey Templar, since grav is perfectly fine and other things just won't do it against 'phants, does that mean I can't kill the 'phant as a CSM player? I have no grav, after all.

Possibly. GW has repeatedly screwed CSM in the balance department.

 winterwind85 wrote:
I played my Biotitan in the Last apoc Game.
Space Marine Player dropped a squad of 3 centurions with Pod next to him killing him Instantly with grav And missile Shooting in the Shooting Phase.
300 points Unit killing a 1000 Point Unit ... No way to avoid!!!!!

We Need a fix for grav And gargantuan creatures

What were you using to support/bubble wrap your bio-titan?

Roknar wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
You're not forging the narrative hard enough, because a team of Space Marines podding in next to a giant monstrosity to take it out with Marine-portable weapons is exactly the kind of thing 40K is known for.... it is, in fact, the sort of thing the game strives to depict.

Yea, just as long as its the space marines being the hero

Has GW ever really gone any other way for long?

 winterwind85 wrote:
... No way to avoid!!!!!

That isn't true at all. There is castling and bubble wrap. Gaunts are probably the cheapest bubble wrap in the game.

If your opponent has pods of any kind I say it is your fault for using poor tactics and not considering threat.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Super heavy vehicles ignore the incremental damage results from penetrating hits though. They don't get stunned/shaken, they don't lose weapons, they don't get immobilized.

Do Gargantuan Creatures ignore the Concussive effect of Grav?

 winterwind85 wrote:
I played my Biotitan in the Last apoc Game.
Space Marine Player dropped a squad of 3 centurions with Pod next to him killing him Instantly with grav And missile Shooting in the Shooting Phase.
300 points Unit killing a 1000 Point Unit ... No way to avoid!!!!!

We Need a fix for grav And gargantuan creatures

Good luck that happening. The IoM would flip out if they couldn't drop pod and instantkill whatever they want anymore.

Pretty much this XD

Alcibiades wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Super heavy vehicles ignore the incremental damage results from penetrating hits though. They don't get stunned/shaken, they don't lose weapons, they don't get immobilized.

Do Gargantuan Creatures ignore the Concussive effect of Grav?

I don't think so, but they're all pretty much I1 anyway.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Super heavy vehicles ignore the incremental damage results from penetrating hits though. They don't get stunned/shaken, they don't lose weapons, they don't get immobilized.

Why would would an anti-personnel round have a chance of hurting Godzilla?

Not all sniper weapons are strictly anti-personnel. The TA for Skitarii, for example, is given Armourbane to represent the fact that it's firing a huge round and ripping clean through tanks and their crews.

It's a hard fix, but the biotitans do need a buff from what I've seen.

And that buff isn't just to flatout ignore their counter, grav weaponry. They already ignore Poisoned weapons and Sniper weapons.


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 cosmicsoybean wrote:

 winterwind85 wrote:
I played my Biotitan in the Last apoc Game.
Space Marine Player dropped a squad of 3 centurions with Pod next to him killing him Instantly with grav And missile Shooting in the Shooting Phase.
300 points Unit killing a 1000 Point Unit ... No way to avoid!!!!!

We Need a fix for grav And gargantuan creatures

Good luck that happening. The IoM would flip out if they couldn't drop pod and instantkill whatever they want anymore.

Let's remove Strength D from Eldar and see how they'd feel.

I'm completely fine with wraithguard and d-cannon batteries having their old rules.

As am I, and my second army is Eldar.