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I am really starting to like Assault Centurions with twin-linked melta guns and twin-linked hurricane Bolters in a drop pod. Reece brought these to a battle report one time and though they underperformed in the mission I saw it out the idea in my head.

3 assault Centurions with melta are about 40-50 more points then a command squad with melta. They both hit about the same on the drop because of the twin-linked melta for the Centurions, but the Centurions have much more staying power after the initial drop. The addition of twin-linked hurricane bolters also gives the squad 18 twin-linked bolter shots on the drop so against hordes they are quite effective and not a waste.

What really shines for me are the siege drills. Each Centurion has 3 attacks on the charge with strength 10 armor bane, as at initiative 4. The initiative 4 is awesome against so many threats. They can kill a knight easily (and die in the return attacks), they can threaten armored 14 ceramite which few marine units can do.

To help mitigate their WS 4 I have been putting a Chaplain with auspex in the pod with them. The Chaplain does two things, first he can reduce the cover save of a target by 1. This can help the centurions destroy a target with melta or even help another units of mine farther downfield effectively shoot at something. Second the Chaplain gives the centurions the ability to reroll misses in the first assault phase. This makes them very deadly indeed. In a pinch the Chaplain can tank wounds so the squad survives. Along those lines I have toyed with the idea of giving an attached IC the armor Indomitas for the 2++ on the drop. This would allow the unit to survive most shooting and get into combat. The armor can also be used to tank wounds from a Wraithknight in assault, instead of using it during shooting.

3 assault Centurions in a Pod will rarely run roughshod over the enemy by themselves. However they make for a highly diversified shooing and assault force which can effectively engage a high number of different targets. They are not that much more expensive then a drop podding command squad and require much more resources from your opponent to remove. Adding them to a list with several more immediate threat units like a Knight, Bikes, even TWC, can make life very difficult for your opponent on turn 1.

I have even thought of fielding a larger squad of Assault Centurions and having Draigo Gate them all over. It would be a version of the Centstar that looks and plays more like a Necron Lychstar. I could field 6 assault Centurions for almost the same price as 4 Grav Centurions and use them to assault the enemy strong points instead of shooting grav at them. I imagine I would need more psychic defenses to protect that unit since they need to get closer then grav cents to be effective.

I actually really like this idea. I may steal it.

Along with the Chap, a character to tank stuff via EW and/or Pedro Kantor do wonders.

I think my bigger issue with assault cents is that now an ironcald dreadnought is just as good, if not better, for cheaper. An IC can still trade deaths with a knight, instagib with Str. 10, and is immune to str.6 and below. 180 total with a heavy flamer and drop pod is a steal compared to the assault cents.

The cents have way more attacks.

 buddha wrote:
I think my bigger issue with assault cents is that now an ironcald dreadnought is just as good, if not better, for cheaper. An IC can still trade deaths with a knight, instagib with Str. 10, and is immune to str.6 and below. 180 total with a heavy flamer and drop pod is a steal compared to the assault cents.

I really like the Ironclad in a pod and if you put one with the podding Cents, then the enemy will usually have to dedicate the same type of weapons to deal with both meaning one unit will get through to turn 2.

The Ironclad in Pod is 35pts cheaper then 3 assault Cents with meltaguns.

Ironclad has 5 attacks standard, 6 on the charge - Cents have 6, 9 on the charge
Ironclad has a heavy flamer to deal with hordes - Cents have 18 twin-linked bolter shots
Ironclad has a heavy flamer to shoot into the back of armor - Cents have 3 twin-linked meltaguns
Ironclad is immune to strength 6, unless they move around to the back armor of 11 - Cents are toughness 5 with a 2+ save

I think, for 35 more points, the 3 Cents are a better buy then an Ironclad. However I still think the Ironclad in a pod is an excellent unit to take.

I once killed 3 assault cents in cc with a wraithknight. I then went on to kill 3 devastator cents and Tigurius in the same combat. Lol. (I charged Tiggy's unit and the assault centurions charged me next turn.)

Anecdotal story aside, I think if you add a chaplain (as you will have in a Battle Company) to the unit and put them in a pod, they could be a respectable distration unit (or a Prescienced librarian, but his power isn't guaranteed and he lacks the Invuln save of the Chaplain). What's even better is to take them as White Scars to give them Hit-&-Run.

Put personally, I'd pay the price for the Devastator version instead.

Wraithknights are literally the worst targets for them. Not sure how they equate in price though.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Wraithknights are literally the worst targets for them. Not sure how they equate in price though.

Dunno. Orks aren't good, either. They are good at shooting Orks I guess, though.

 jy2 wrote:
I once killed 3 assault cents in cc with a wraithknight. I then went on to kill 3 devastator cents and Tigurius in the same combat. Lol. (I charged Tiggy's unit and the assault centurions charged me next turn.)

Anecdotal story aside, I think if you add a chaplain (as you will have in a Battle Company) to the unit and put them in a pod, they could be a respectable distration unit (or a Prescienced librarian, but his power isn't guaranteed and he lacks the Invuln save of the Chaplain). What's even better is to take them as White Scars to give them Hit-&-Run.

Put personally, I'd pay the price for the Devastator version instead.

Forget the Chaplain. Add Tigurius to the unit and give them Storm of Iron every turn. 3 twin-linked meltagun shots and 18 Twin-linked rending bolter shots a turn. Tiggy can give them Forewarning or Invisibility and now the Wraithknight won't be so brave. Heck up the Assault Centurions to 5 with Tiggy and Draigo and Gate them around the board with 30 twin-linked rending shots and 5 twin-linked meltaguns. The shooting is just one facet of the unit. They also assault with 15 str 10 ap 2 attacks at initiative 4.

DarthDiggler wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
I once killed 3 assault cents in cc with a wraithknight. I then went on to kill 3 devastator cents and Tigurius in the same combat. Lol. (I charged Tiggy's unit and the assault centurions charged me next turn.)

Anecdotal story aside, I think if you add a chaplain (as you will have in a Battle Company) to the unit and put them in a pod, they could be a respectable distration unit (or a Prescienced librarian, but his power isn't guaranteed and he lacks the Invuln save of the Chaplain). What's even better is to take them as White Scars to give them Hit-&-Run.

Put personally, I'd pay the price for the Devastator version instead.

Forget the Chaplain. Add Tigurius to the unit and give them Storm of Iron every turn. 3 twin-linked meltagun shots and 18 Twin-linked rending bolter shots a turn. Tiggy can give them Forewarning or Invisibility and now the Wraithknight won't be so brave. Heck up the Assault Centurions to 5 with Tiggy and Draigo and Gate them around the board with 30 twin-linked rending shots and 5 twin-linked meltaguns. The shooting is just one facet of the unit. They also assault with 15 str 10 ap 2 attacks at initiative 4.

I would laugh at the ignore the unit if my opponent gated them every turn.

What keeps grav or plasma weapons from tearing them to pieces? As far as I know the critical vulnerability in Centurions is the lack of any kind of save if their armor is penned. Does running them this way do something to address that?

You only really needed to Gate them once to get them into position to assault the enemy lines. Really drop podding them in is better.

Nothing keeps plasma or grav from shooting them. If you go the death star route with 5-6 assault centurions, then you will invest in a tank (Draigo or Lysander) and Psykers who cast things like Invisibility or Forewarning which will give them a strong defense against plasma or grav.

But now we have gone to far off into a tangent. Realistically all you need are 3 assault centurions in a pod to drop into the enemy lines cause havoc. They act just like a melta command squad, but have more staying power and are strong in assault. All for just 40 more points then the melta command squad.

Can the enemy shoot them with weapons that hurt? Yes, but this isn't your whole army and you should also have immediate threats to your opponents army in the list like podding Ironclad or Knight Titan or Bike command squad etc....

I definitely think they have merit.

DarthDiggler wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
I once killed 3 assault cents in cc with a wraithknight. I then went on to kill 3 devastator cents and Tigurius in the same combat. Lol. (I charged Tiggy's unit and the assault centurions charged me next turn.)

Anecdotal story aside, I think if you add a chaplain (as you will have in a Battle Company) to the unit and put them in a pod, they could be a respectable distration unit (or a Prescienced librarian, but his power isn't guaranteed and he lacks the Invuln save of the Chaplain). What's even better is to take them as White Scars to give them Hit-&-Run.

Put personally, I'd pay the price for the Devastator version instead.

Forget the Chaplain. Add Tigurius to the unit and give them Storm of Iron every turn. 3 twin-linked meltagun shots and 18 Twin-linked rending bolter shots a turn. Tiggy can give them Forewarning or Invisibility and now the Wraithknight won't be so brave. Heck up the Assault Centurions to 5 with Tiggy and Draigo and Gate them around the board with 30 twin-linked rending shots and 5 twin-linked meltaguns. The shooting is just one facet of the unit. They also assault with 15 str 10 ap 2 attacks at initiative 4.

The reason why I wouldn't do this (add Tiggy) is because I don't want to put my Warlord into a sacrificial unit like that. Besides, where I envision the Assault Centurions to work best is in a Battle Company, where they become ObSec and you can drop some ObSec Ironclads as well. In such a list, you'd already have a chaplain anyways.

They would be awesome in a battle company !

I was thinking a Stormraven and Landing Pad with 'Ready for Take Off'

Do units with S&P get overwatch? Or wall of death? I dont think they do, wich would make them a very poor choice to pod close to the enemy.

You could ally in BA, add a sang priest and take IH chapter tactics to give them all 4+++.

Plus in a battle company you can't just take empty FA pods right? So you'd need to take some kind of second detachment anyway.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Red Marine wrote:
Do units with S&P get overwatch? Or wall of death? I dont think they do, wich would make them a very poor choice to pod close to the enemy.

Except they're a solid melee unit. If your opponent wants to help you with your inability to get them in melee right away...

"Except they're a solid melee unit."

Hunh. Really? I want to play 40k where you play 40k.

I think this has enough merit to give it a shot. I really like the look of centurions, and have been trying to think of an excuse to get some for allies.

 Anpu42 wrote:
I was thinking a Stormraven and Landing Pad with 'Ready for Take Off'

That's too many points to be practical.

Martel732 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Wraithknights are literally the worst targets for them. Not sure how they equate in price though.

Dunno. Orks aren't good, either. They are good at shooting Orks I guess, though.

9-18 TL Bolter shots actually does something here. They also ID the important targets in melee. SO they do melee alright against Nobs at the very least, but definitely not something to use against hordes. That said, if you charge first, they'll be wounding on 6's instead. That'll keep a Green Tide occupied for essentially forever haha!

Mavnas wrote:
You could ally in BA, add a sang priest and take IH chapter tactics to give them all 4+++.

I didn't even think of that. That's REALLY clever.

Martel, that might be something to do on your end. I know you WANT to play Blood Angels, but since they don't have Centurions, this might be an option to get them in your army and do okay.

An even better idea is to stick Pedro with them.

He can take any plasma/grav shots with his 4++/FNP, gives them an extra attack, and can put his bombardment on a different target.

 Red Marine wrote:
"Except they're a solid melee unit."

Hunh. Really? I want to play 40k where you play 40k.

Presumably you're not dropping a 200-300 point unit in front of their biggest Deathstar. If you were, the lack of overwatch isn't what's going to kill them. I call them solid because they have S10 AP2 attacks at I4. Most of the things that can wreck them with AP2 melee attacks would swing second. Granted, a tanky character with a SS and EW or a unit with multiple SS could make them sad if it does the charging, but 18 BS1 bolter shots wouldn't have really dissuaded TWC from charging either and anyway those units would be more expensive than these guys and you get to pick where they show up.

Normally when evaluating a unit I consider what would happen if TWC or DCA, Crusaders, and priests with an inquisitor charged them, but in this case it wouldn't be fair to compare a sub 300 point unit to your opponent's biggest deathstar.

An even better idea is to stick Pedro with them.

But then their cost nearly doubles and they still crumple before a real deathstar. The potential I see in this unit is in the fact that it's not the only thing you dropped in the enemy's backfield and he has to choose which to deal with. As described, these guys are 215 pts + character. (And that Sang priest would be like 60 more... if you double their cost, they're not going to make their points back.)

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Wraithknights are literally the worst targets for them. Not sure how they equate in price though.

Dunno. Orks aren't good, either. They are good at shooting Orks I guess, though.

9-18 TL Bolter shots actually does something here. They also ID the important targets in melee. SO they do melee alright against Nobs at the very least, but definitely not something to use against hordes. That said, if you charge first, they'll be wounding on 6's instead. That'll keep a Green Tide occupied for essentially forever haha!

Mavnas wrote:
You could ally in BA, add a sang priest and take IH chapter tactics to give them all 4+++.

I didn't even think of that. That's REALLY clever.

Martel, that might be something to do on your end. I know you WANT to play Blood Angels, but since they don't have Centurions, this might be an option to get them in your army and do okay.

Maybe. But I have no plan of ever buying termitubbies.

Allying in BA is good for a couple reasons. The sanguinary priest with iron hands chapter tactics is good, but so is Mephiston rolling on straight sanguinary. All the powers in that discipline are solid. Shield for a 5++, rage for 4 attacks on the charge, extra shooting in the form of witchfires and beams, etc. Not to mention if anything charges them theyll have to deal with 5+d3 str10 attacks at a high ws and init from mephy. He also rounds out the unit by being able to take down wraithknights before they can swing.

Martel732 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Wraithknights are literally the worst targets for them. Not sure how they equate in price though.

Dunno. Orks aren't good, either. They are good at shooting Orks I guess, though.

9-18 TL Bolter shots actually does something here. They also ID the important targets in melee. SO they do melee alright against Nobs at the very least, but definitely not something to use against hordes. That said, if you charge first, they'll be wounding on 6's instead. That'll keep a Green Tide occupied for essentially forever haha!

Mavnas wrote:
You could ally in BA, add a sang priest and take IH chapter tactics to give them all 4+++.

I didn't even think of that. That's REALLY clever.

Martel, that might be something to do on your end. I know you WANT to play Blood Angels, but since they don't have Centurions, this might be an option to get them in your army and do okay.

Maybe. But I have no plan of ever buying termitubbies.

Haha haven't heard Termitubbies before! Good one!
At the very least, Iron Hands have good synergy with the Priest though. It's one of your cheaper HQ's, and can easily hand out the 4+++. Only issue is you need differently painted Marines. Not sure how many you got that are red...
Then again, there WAS a red Iron Hands successor...

This seems like a really fun idea. They're pretty comparable to Grey Knight paladins and actually come out on top in a lot of ways which I didn't really notice at first!

I think this is only really a tactic you would do in a combined arms detachment though. This is because if you were taking a glades battle company the equivalent units people have compared them to (ironclads and command squad) both get a free pod if they are taken in a gladius battle company, meaning you're paying 135-140 points for a drop pod distraction unit as opposed to 215. Secondly you have to squeeze in a combined arms detachment to get the centurion pod (the pod itself is then also not Obsec), and the only real reason I could see that is for taking thunderfire cannons by which point including an HQ and 2 troops you're actually fairly barebones and still need to add upgrades. just my thoughts

Assault cents can be pretty nasty. I play daemonkin and face them pretty regularly. I have basically nothing that can kill them in CC, t5 with 2+ is just too tough (DP or BT could probably do it but I don't want to waste my best units). My solution has been just to tarpit them with my 2 cultist squads and 2 spawn. My opponent puts the cents in a land raider so the tarpit units keep a lot points tied up

Just be wary of tarpit when you drop them. Drop pod is definitely a better way to deploy them