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... you have nothing killy. Yeah, your stuff is going to be hard to kill, but they're not going to be doing much killing, and because you're not ObSec, you'll end up losing a lot of games if you can't clear enemy troops off of objectives.
Switch out some of those Warriors for a Destroyer Cult.
2015/08/10 05:25:32
Subject: Re:[2000] - Necrons - List for tournament
Sooo what's the point of the Canoptek harbest if not to kill stuff???
And Ive never had a problem getting objectives because I just surround them and my warriors usually hold their own with just weight of fire
Automatically Appended Next Post: And if I take the destroyer cult and have only my 30 infantry left I'll never be able to claim objectives cause I just won't have enough guys!!!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/10 15:41:46
The harvest can be killy, but only the wraiths really crack skulls, everything else is there as a tarpit, or to support wraiths. At 2000 points, six wraiths aren't killy enough to carry the rest of the army.
Also The night scythes will drop the troops off, and then be there for like half the game if you're lucky. After the initial deployment the warriors will be on foot, and if you deploy them to objectives, they could be isolated and taken out with local superiority. Both units are very unlikely to earn their points back. If your going to drop a unit off behind enemy lines, it better be some form of death star, and if you are not going to drop them off away from the main force then why use a night scythe.
Basically it comes down to you don't have anything to kill SMQ outside of one unit that can be tar pitted fairly easily. By putting everything in transports you are loosing a lot of volume of fire. You'll be hard to table, but without obsec that won't count for much in maelstrom missions.
Constantly being negative doesn't make you seem erudite, it just makes you look like a curmudgeon.
The night scythes are my air support they are there to take out enemy flyers
The Warriors inside them are usually on the table fighting from turn one unless it is more advantageous for me during deployment to keep them in the night scythes
And with Zandrekh choosing reroll reserves as his warlord trait turn 2 my night scythes have almost always come on and stayed on
Plus they are great extraction vehicles since they can pick up warrior squads that are in a bad way or to lose to an assault unit
And I've never had a problem with marines I usually can kill them just thorough weight of shots
And if the harvest is no good should I just get rid of it entirely
And if I lose my night scythes what do I have to fight against enemy air vehicles???
Automatically Appended Next Post: And please don't just not respond I am listening I just want to know if my usual tactics are false or not
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/10 16:55:53
2015/08/10 17:10:17
Subject: Re:[2000] - Necrons - List for tournament
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Troops - Necron Warriors [Squad 1] (X12) - 156pts ( In Night Scythe with Lord 1 and squad 1)
Troops - Necron Warriors [Squad 2] (X12) - 156pts ( In Night Scythe with Lord 2 and squad 2) - IN RESERVE
Dedicated Transport - Night Scythe W/ Twin-Linked Tesla Destructor - 100pts
Dedicated Transport - Night Scythe W/ Twin-Linked Tesla Destructor - 100pts
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the night scythe is under and so are the annihilation barges
and i also don't think your allowed to post exact point costs on the forum
His points are correct... if you're using the old codex
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
BlackConsulBrother wrote: The night scythes are my air support they are there to take out enemy flyers
The Warriors inside them are usually on the table fighting from turn one unless it is more advantageous for me during deployment to keep them in the night scythes
And with Zandrekh choosing reroll reserves as his warlord trait turn 2 my night scythes have almost always come on and stayed on
Plus they are great extraction vehicles since they can pick up warrior squads that are in a bad way or to lose to an assault unit
And I've never had a problem with marines I usually can kill them just thorough weight of shots
And if the harvest is no good should I just get rid of it entirely
And if I lose my night scythes what do I have to fight against enemy air vehicles???
Automatically Appended Next Post: And please don't just not respond I am listening I just want to know if my usual tactics are false or not
Regarding Nightscythes... first of all you're incorrect about one thing. They can not pick up Warriors from the board. They don't have any rules to allow Warriors or any other unit to embark while the model is zooming.
Secondly, they're not that great at killing fliers, especially flying monstrous creatures which are the most threatening fliers out there.
Thirdly, as super resilience necrons in a Decurion detachment, you don't need to worry about fliers that much. Most fliers won't be able to do enough damage to you to make their points and they won't be able to capture objectives while zooming/swooping.
Focus on the ground game and spend those points on more killy stuff. You definitely have volume of fire covered with all those warriors. If you really want to run that many warriors, then I'd say you should split the Harvest into 2 harvests with 3 wraiths to act as tarpits. Plan to tie up your opponent's heavy hitters while slowly chipping away at units with the warriors.
Grimgold wrote: The harvest can be killy, but only the wraiths really crack skulls, everything else is there as a tarpit, or to support wraiths. At 2000 points, six wraiths aren't killy enough to carry the rest of the army.
Well that ass-backwards if ever I've seen.
Destroyer Cult is hands down the deadliest thing we have in the new codex.
Most competent Necron players will tell you Harvest Wraiths are good for one thing in particular: running up and catching enemy units that are going to cause you trouble.
A simple guide to how to competitive 'Crons is basically:
• Destroyers murder MEQ better than anything we have
• Heavy Destroyers will rip vehicles apart with relative ease
• Wraiths tarpit things that will threaten the Destroyers
• Tomb Blades capture objectives
• Troops stay in their vehicles until needed
Obviously there are exceptions if you build your army around one particular play style (eg. Scarab Farm, Silver Tide, AV13 Wall, etc.), but generally this is how it goes.
i usually try to stick with the Silver tide idea and i never like having under 40 infantry on the table its always been a good number for me with all my armies
Automatically Appended Next Post: By infantry i mean warriors and Immortals
i know lychguard are infantry but they dont really count towards the foot slogger soldier idea
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/10 18:01:53
Decurion detachments don't have objective secured? I guess I just assumed they did but it seems weird that they do not.
That being said "silver tide" is good but you need to be careful about melee combat. If you loose it is very easy to catch your unit at initiative 2.
If I run something like this I would run
20 man foot slogging
10 warriors ghost arch
10 warriors ghost arch
5 mandatory immortals
2 units of tomb blades(for objective grabbing)
Either destroyer cult or mutiple harvests.
I would say destroyer cult for you since you lack strong shooting and this formation is great for, heavy inf, monsterous creatures, and vehicles.
Give your destroyer lord and overlorf Warsythes and stick them with the warrior blob or in something else vunerable to assualt. They will help you turn back assaults on your big blob of warriors. Which eight the two ghost archs, 4 re animation, and re rolls to 1s is pretty unkillable.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Due Instead of eight, autocorrect is a killer
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/10 19:19:27
And Ive never had a problem getting objectives because I just surround them and my warriors usually hold their own with just weight of fire
Automatically Appended Next Post: And if I take the destroyer cult and have only my 30 infantry left I'll never be able to claim objectives cause I just won't have enough guys!!!
Wraiths have never been here to kill shtuff. They are our ultimate tarpit, and can sometimes get lucky and do some decent damage. But don't rely on it.
Epartalis wrote: Decurion detachments don't have objective secured? I guess I just assumed they did but it seems weird that they do not.
Why is that? Each Detachment should have its own unique Command Benefits. Only the Combined Arms Detachment and the Space Marine Battle Demi-company have 'Objective Secured' as a Command Benefit.
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
BlackConsulBrother wrote: The night scythes are my air support they are there to take out enemy flyers
The Warriors inside them are usually on the table fighting from turn one unless it is more advantageous for me during deployment to keep them in the night scythes
And with Zandrekh choosing reroll reserves as his warlord trait turn 2 my night scythes have almost always come on and stayed on
Plus they are great extraction vehicles since they can pick up warrior squads that are in a bad way or to lose to an assault unit
And I've never had a problem with marines I usually can kill them just thorough weight of shots
And if the harvest is no good should I just get rid of it entirely
And if I lose my night scythes what do I have to fight against enemy air vehicles???
Automatically Appended Next Post: And please don't just not respond I am listening I just want to know if my usual tactics are false or not
It takes (2/3 *1/2 * 1/3) 9 gauss flayer shots to kill a space marine on average. If everyone of your warriors (50 of them) shot at a tac squad, it would take you two turns to kill them, that's 650 points shooting at 150. You are talking about using portions, perhaps even single squads to try and secure objectives, but there is no way a force with that little fire power could push ob sec units out of scoring.
Harvest isn't bad, Infact it's one of our better detachments, but you are depending on 258 points of wraiths to make up for a massive deficit in your offensive abilities. Even if they kill twice their points in a game (and against SMQ that's possible), your average damage per phase is dragged down by huge warrior blods in transports.
Also, Until they errata night scythes it's impossible to board them, the invasion ray only allows disembarking, and their minimum move is to fast to embark. As for anti-air, use your bikes, they ignore jink and are twin linked, which makes up for most of the disadvantage of snap firing. The math for non believers, Tomb blade shooting twin linked tesla, just shy of 1 in 3 hit (can not get extra hits on snap fire), 1 in 3 will get a glance/pen, no jink save, so it take about 9 shots. Night scythe will hit just less then 1 and a half hits per shot (twin linked tesla is pretty awesome like that), 1/2 get glance or better and then 1/2 of those get jinked, so it will take about 3 shots to get a Hull point on another flyer, so per round the tomb blades will get a hit a little less often, but not significantly less. However the tomb blades don't have to start in reserve, can spend the whole game on the table, and are required for a Decurion formation.
Constantly being negative doesn't make you seem erudite, it just makes you look like a curmudgeon.
Much more killy, I'd prefer nebuloscopes on the bikes to deal with jinkers like the aforementioned flyers, but having a 3+ jink is awesome if you intend to turbo boost them to capture objectives and do things like line breaker, so it's probably sixes.
Constantly being negative doesn't make you seem erudite, it just makes you look like a curmudgeon.
skoffs wrote: ... you have nothing killy. Yeah, your stuff is going to be hard to kill, but they're not going to be doing much killing, and because you're not ObSec, you'll end up losing a lot of games if you can't clear enemy troops off of objectives.
Switch out some of those Warriors for a Destroyer Cult.
Because strength five is so much preferrable? The destroyers will be better at killing somethings like flyrants, but they still have to snapshoot and pt for pt are worse against tanks. If you are bringing things specifically to kill tacticals then I just have one thing to say. Lolz
I'm not saying they are bad just saying I think warrior blobs can be good
Min rec legion just upgrading tomb blades and to 34 warriors with two ghost arks, two harvests min and a min destroyer cult 1846. Probably a better list Obviously you stick the two squads of ten inside and the squad of 14 rebuilding
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/08/11 16:11:52
MEQ are a problem for us, we don't have embedded special weapons, our fast melee units rely on rending, and our power weapon equipped units are on foot. Outside of a destroyer cult we have no ranged option with any appreciable volume of fire that can bypass a 3+.
it's silly to suggest you only bring them to shoot at tac squads, you are bringing them to deal with an entire class of army, who also happen to be the most common army you'll face. Even if your not facing MEQ, destroyer cults are point for point better at taking out vehicles than devastators or warriors.
The only thing destroyers are not better at taking out point for point are terminators and hordes. Add in a transport and you'll reduce the cost effectiveness of warriors to the point where destroyers are probably better at that too.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/08/11 16:57:17
Constantly being negative doesn't make you seem erudite, it just makes you look like a curmudgeon.
Okay, I see a D.Cult in the edited list, but it lacks the most useful models in that formation: Heavy Destroyers... please tell me you don't intended to cover anti-AV with Warriors.
Though, speaking of Warriors, pro-tip: stick that D.Lord in with the large blob. Gauss with PE is pretty sweet. Though you may want to drop a few to give him the 2+ relic so he can tank shots for them (remembering that anything AP1-2 gets Look Out Sir'd).
You could drop 2 Wraiths and 2 Scarabs to get you 126 points which is enough to upgrade 2 of those Destroyers into Heavy Destroyers and to purchase 2 Heavy Destroyers in their own unit for the cult.
Then switch the Shadowlooms to Nebuloscopes and remove the Particle Beamers. That should net you 8 points. Which will be just enough to upgrade the last Destroyer unit with a Heavy Destroyer.
Using Warriors to take out armor is an incredibly inefficient method.
You can do it, but seriously man, there are significantly better means available. Chief among them being Heavy Destroyers.
Superior range, high S, low AP, rerollable to-hit AND to-pen/wound. These guys are well worth their points.
Drop some Warriors. Stick in some HDs.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Were I to run a list like this, I'd fine tune it like so:
<Dynasty> 
War Coven of the Coruscating Gaze 
~3000pts
Thrice-Damned Plague Corps 
~3250pts
Admech (TBN) 
6000+
2000
2000
