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Made in gb
Hellacious Havoc






Hello
So im flipping through my codex and I've been thinking about what I'd want to see when the new edition codex's are released:

More use out of the Dark Apostle, seeing how he is quite a lack luster HQ for the points which is equal to (more or less) 2 Lords, Better WS and the ability to become a Psyker at a cost would be good.

A better balance of the Cult Elites, personally for me I would like to see Khorne Berzerkers have a +1 WS increase but bring their BS down to a 3> seeing how they are an assault troop, scrapping BS for 1+ A and a WS+1 for me would be fine. Thousand Sons, Bring the points down to about 20> per unit and access to at least 1 special weapon (Blast master, Plauge Knife, Chain Axe, Nothing for the can full of dust)

Helbrutes should have Deep Strike for each unit, not for a unit of 3+

Abaddon makes Terminators a troop choice, Fluffy and all that...

Possessed, Drop the BS completely and give them a WS of 5 and rather than Close Combat Weapons have access to CCW with AP 4>

Thats it for me, what would you like to see included in the next edition Codex?

oh also Cultists get 2+ armour save


10000
 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Oh hey! Time for this thread again!

No worries. I like seeing everyone's preferences and ideas come out in these.

My wishlist as it comes to mind:

*Option to make cultist characters ML1 psykers and/or to have the cultists perform a "ritual" rather than moving/shooting/assaulting in order to generate more warp charges. Possibly tie this one to a Mark of Tzeentch HQ.

*More toolboxy options for the HQs. Chaos is all about breaking away from the strictness of the Imperium, yet they have fewer options than marines.

*More daemonic/chaosy weapons. I'd like to see things akin to the hades autocannon and ectoplasmic cannon, especially as options for infantry.

* I kind of like the idea of dual-purpose marks. Make marks cheap or free but have no inherent rules boost, then have them unlock various abilities for the unit. A Mark of Nurgle, for instance, might give you the option between +1 Toughness and gaining Poisoned. My thinking here is that some mark options just aren't very useful against certain enemy armies, and I'd hate for a Nurgle player (for instance) to be punished for having a friend that likes to play dark eldar with their poison (for instance).

*God-specific mutations available as purchasable wargear. This makes it easier to reflect a certain chaos god fluff-wise. The mutation table is neat, but frustrating if it doesn't fit your fluff (Thousand Sons); it feels like a neat mechanic for an optional detachment.

*Noise Marines should go back to being assault/heavy rather than salvo. Their mark and doom siren are both cool but also kind of wasted unless the enemy is assaulting you.

*Thousand Sons should be 2 wounds and lose their invuls as a default. They're supposed to be hard to take down with little weapons but somewhat susceptible to heavier weapons. Currently, they die like normal marines to small arms fire but stand up well to things like lascannons. Their AP 3 weapons and invulnerable saves would make nice optional upgrades. There's no reason for them to be default. There's also no reason for them to be unable to take meltaguns, flamers, etc.

*Psykers should lose the silly rule about taking half their powers from a certain chaos god discipline.

*Daemon Princes really need either a price decrease or a defense boost. They're just way too squishy for their points even if they did have Eternal Warrior.

*Legion Tactics (or whatever you want to call them) would be cool. Heck, I'd kind of like to see every codex have these. Just brainstorming, you might see something like:

Alpha Legion: Gain infiltrate and maybe stealth. Let them replace cultist champions with aspiring champions.
Night Lords: Gain Fear. Things with ATSKNF are still susceptible to Fear from units with this Legion Tactic. Things without ATSKNF take a -1 penalty to Fear tests instead.
Word Bearers: Count as daemons for purposes of daemonology psychic tests.
Death Guard: Add a heavy support choice slot to CADs they're taken as part of maybe? Or grant them Stealth due to all the flies? I'd like to see more in-depth mechanics for these guys, but that's more Nurglekin territory.
World Eaters: Khorekin exists, and I'm happy with them in there.
Emperor's Children: Reroll to-hit rolls of one. Every strike must be perfect!
Thousand Sons: +1 ML to all psykers with this Legion Tactic. Ain't no psyker like a Magnus-trained psyker. Alternatively, just let them ignore perils on a 4+ or something so that you can throw psychic dice around without worrying about blowing your head up.

I'm sure I"m forgetting a few Legions there.

*Better trained cultist unit(s) for Alpha Legion. Hordes of ablative wounds have their place, but so do a team of snipers that a marine has been coaching for demolitions/assassination missions. I picture these sort of like IG special weapons teams with an attached marine character.

* Drop Pods and other transport options would be lovely.

* I'd love to see a Blood Tithe type mechanic for each chaos god, but that's probably more of a daemonkin thing.



ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in us
Savage Khorne Berserker Biker





Leesburg, FL

This is something that I would love to see in the rumored Tzeentch Deamonkin book:

Sons of Magnus formation

Formation restrictions:

HQ must be a sorcerer or Ahriman

Troops must be 1K sons (no cultists)

Every unit that can, must take MoT

Formation benefits:

All infantry models in this formation gain the VotLW special rule

All bolt weapons (bolt pistols, bolters, heavy bolters) gain the Inferno bolt special rule

HQ and aspiring sorcerers gain access to the Divination psychic discipline

I think a formation like this could really help the struggling Thousand sons compete with the newer dexs.




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Made in nz
Sinister Chaos Marine





OP: You want WS6 zerkers?

GW won't give Dark Apostle or Warpsmith bikes/jump packs without releasing models with those options, so, probably never :/ Dark Apostles should really boost units more, like they were rumoured to do before the current codex dropped.
I don't know why you'd want to give him psycher levels though, just take a Sorcerer.

Re: KSons: Two things would boost Thousand Sons significantly; Either remove the minimum roll requirement on god disciplines, or add a bunch more useful powers to the disciplines so they cease to be handicaps. E.g. add Divination-like and Telekinesis-like powers to Tzeentch. Add telepathy-like powers to Slaanesh and Biomancy-like powers to Nurgle.

We need formations that encourage use of actual Chaos Space Marines. Maybe they unlock veteran skills. Maybe they unlock free VotLW. Maybe they get re-rolls like loyalists or access to some special rules that somewhat resemble chapter tactics.

If a Tzeentch Daemonkin book is released, I would be surprised if there is any mention of Thousand Sons in there at all. I expect Tzeentch marked CSM and tzeentch daemons, and maybe bonus warp charges for doing stuff.

 
   
Made in gb
Hellacious Havoc





My mindset on the WS6 'Zerker comes from the fact that I would see them have no BS like a spawn and stick to their fluff and hit things with axes and swords etc, Have them become a 1 wound chaos assault terminator, also a decent CCW for the Sarge wouldnt hurt? like a weaker Gorechild?

Tzeentch Daemonkin would focus more on the daemons (obviously) and leave the 1k sons altered very slightly, however the are probably next in line to a separate codex, that or Nurgle...Coz screw Slannesh.

however I still am set on Cultists having +2 Save

10000
 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





Long range plasma light machine guns.

Plasma LMG 36" S7 Ap2 heavy 3 gets hot. 15 pts?

Ectoplasma upgrade for 5pts more which confers +1Str

Next idea is A weapon comparable to grav guns.
Any ideas?
   
Made in nz
Sinister Chaos Marine





I would prefer zerkers if they were a bit more berzerk and less skillful, e.g:
always hits on a 3+ in close combat
always hit by enemy on a 3+ in close combat
5+ feel no pain in close combat
retain bonus attacks on disorderly charges (hell they should be rewarded for getting more units into combat, not penalized).
be 1-2pts cheaper.
-1 BS.

Re Cultists: A 2+ armour save would horribly nerf Cultists as they will be hosed down by grav.


 
   
Made in gb
Hellacious Havoc





I love the idea of a Plasma multi attack weapon, but I would stick it in the high 20 points like a Lascannon just to keep everyone happy, and have them available like a Reaper Autocannon or Blastmaster so it only becomes available every 10 CSM or every 5 Terminators.

I'd also like to see a the Plague Knife Poisoned on a 3+ but at a 2-3 point cost Per Troop, I mean come on, its blessed by Papa Nurgle and is dripping in Bad Goo


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As far as Zerkers fluff is concerned they need to be more like one of Khorne's favourite Son's Kharn, High probability of hitting teamed with a frenzy which hits someone near you fail a 2+ D6


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Something else that sounds nifty, Give Noise Marine weapons and Plauge Marine Assault weapons to CSM that are marked with the god corresponding said weapon

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/08/17 00:51:24


10000
 
   
Made in nz
Sinister Chaos Marine





I don't see cult weapons being made available regular CSM (again), but that means it will absolutely definitely happen. GW would do this sell out of all their cult troop addons. Then the option will be revoked (again).

I can see people (ok, my SW player friend) charging frenzy zerker blobs with lone wolves or dreads and hoping the zerkers frenzy themselves to death. Sounds like fun!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/17 01:06:12


 
   
Made in gb
Hellacious Havoc





My friends are Shooty sell-outs so im being abit bias to my suggestions to try be Anti Tau/Necron...MELTA ON EVERYTHING! MELTA CHAINAXES!

10000
 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





special rules: Plasma Pistol Savants. Can use plasma pistols in close combat.

Plasma Bomb. Can use it like a grenade like a frag grenade and in close combat as a regular attack at initiative instead of I1.

Special Rules: Plasma Gun Overload: Use the 15pt Plasma Gun like a 1 time grenade that gets thrown 8" and detonates as a small blast.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/17 02:56:03


 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 KillMaimBurn96 wrote:
I love the idea of a Plasma multi attack weapon, but I would stick it in the high 20 points like a Lascannon just to keep everyone happy, and have them available like a Reaper Autocannon or Blastmaster so it only becomes available every 10 CSM or every 5 Terminators.

I'd also like to see a the Plague Knife Poisoned on a 3+ but at a 2-3 point cost Per Troop, I mean come on, its blessed by Papa Nurgle and is dripping in Bad Goo


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As far as Zerkers fluff is concerned they need to be more like one of Khorne's favourite Son's Kharn, High probability of hitting teamed with a frenzy which hits someone near you fail a 2+ D6


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Something else that sounds nifty, Give Noise Marine weapons and Plauge Marine Assault weapons to CSM that are marked with the god corresponding said weapon


If we're adding in more weapons, I'd rather see daemonic weapons rather than just modified imperial stuff (feels like more of a dark mechanicum thing). Where's my gun that shoots shoggoths at people, then pulls them back into the gun barrel screaming? How about a bilespewer for Nurgle or some sort of living lash weapon for Slaanesh?

I see where you're coming from with the plague knives, but consider that they're already allowing plague marines to reroll to-wound rolls against T3 armies and wounding MCs on 4's without having to use krak grenades (and thus give up attacks). Not super helpful against MEQ, but already darned useful against everything else.

Kharn's "kill your friends" rule is neat, but making it a thing for every squad of berzerkers seems like it would both be complicated and lose its novelty fast. I rather like the idea of letting them always hit and be hit on 3s.

The problem with giving noise, plague, and rubric gear to regular CSM is that it significantly disincentivizes taking the actual cult troops. Sure, plague marines would still have their FNP, Thousand sons would have their invuls, and noise marines would have... Um. Well the other two would still have something going for them, but you'd be taking away a significant chunk of the appeal. God-specific wargear for aspiring champs would be cool though. Toss a doom siren or some sort of mastercrafted rending weapon on the leader of some generic slaaneshi marines, for instance.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





I would like to see a better universal rule for CSM.
   
Made in au
Sinister Chaos Marine




Australia

I want a warp jump drive. 10 pts cheaper than drop pods d6 scatter. Can be taken by troops and elites. Special rule "The Gods can be fickle" can roll reserves from warp jump drives from turn 1. Lastly can't mishap except by going off the table.

SM eat your heart out.

Warp ammo for chosen
1. Only wounds on a 6 but is Strength D
2. Ap3 str 6 gets hot
3. Papa nurgle poison

Cheaper cults

No sorcerer but a upgrade for lords to take MLs

Champs to take ML1

Dark machanicum robots AI as troops. High T and S but slow low WS. Maybe I dunno about this one I've been reading about Mars a lot lately
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





Turn Defiler Into a Super Heavy Walker. Upgrade its battle cannon into rapid fire battle cannon and front armor to av13 by giving option upgrade. Rapid fire BC is 35pts more.Front Av13 is 30pts. Give it Stomp attacks and move 12". Keep its current bloated cost or add 30pts and make it into a LoW so limit 1 per CAD. Give it the op WK treatment.

So a rapid fire bc and front av13 defiler should cost 290pts. Then you can have upgrades like scourge n such and it gers into 300+points.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/18 15:25:16


 
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Earth

Mark of khorne: grants preferred enemy, blood rage: after destroying an enemy unit in combat gain rage and furious charge.
Khorne likes all martial skill, not just combat.

Mark of slaanesh: grants +1 ws in a challenge, +1 initiative at all times, move through cover. If enemy is killed in a challenge +1 to combat result.

Mark of nurgle: grants +1 toughness, cloud of flies. After destroying an enemy unit in combat, gains feel no pain 5+.

Mark of tzeench: grants mastery level 1 to the character, soul surge: mastery level increases dependent on enemy casualties caused by psychic powers, generate new powers in the normal way after each new level is gained.
5 casualties +1, 10 casualties +1.
Grants a 6+ invunerable to the unit as long as the character is alive.

Cultists cannot take marks, only icons. Marks are free.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




I actually like the idea of MoK giving PE and then the charge bonuses coming from elsewhere. It would make range support and things like MoK Obliterators and Havocs something to consider.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





I want this in the new CSM dex!!!




Ultra Dirge Caster Bus! 24" radius of no enemy overwatch. Also it has 2 firing modes; Single frequency of Str 8 Ap3 Large Blast ignores cover and Varied Frequency of Str 5 ap 4 heavy 8 ignores cover.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/08/19 06:23:20


 
   
Made in ca
Gargantuan Gargant






 Filch wrote:
I want this in the new CSM dex!!!




Ultra Dirge Caster Bus! 24" radius of no enemy overwatch. Also it has 2 firing modes; Single frequency of Str 8 Ap3 Large Blast ignores cover and Varied Frequency of Str 5 ap 4 heavy 8 ignores cover.


Hey buddy, we Orks called dibs on Mad Max vehicles. Where do you think Gorkamorka came from?

   
Made in ca
Tzeentch Veteran Marine with Psychic Potential





I just want a fluffy and competitive codex that can keep up with the likes of necrons, eldar, and space marines.

Definitely would enjoy god specific weapons too.

7500 pts Chaos Daemons 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut




Remove the invul on thousand sons and replace it by a rule that lets them re-roll their armor saves and give them AP2 bolters. Up their price to 28-30 ppm.

They're suposed to be super-resilient vs small-arms fire, about god damn time they make them that way.
Their bullets are supposed to pass through armor and attack the very soul of their targets, about god damn time they make them that say.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/08/20 15:33:19


You don't have to be happy when you lose, just don't make winning the condition of your happiness.  
   
Made in us
Grim Rune Priest in the Eye of the Storm





Riverside CA

DaPino wrote:
Remove the invul on thousand sons and replace it by a rule that lets them re-roll their armor saves and give them AP2 bolters. Up their price to 28-30 ppm.

They're suposed to be super-resilient vs small-arms fire, about god damn time they make them that way.
Their bullets are supposed to pass through armor and attack the very soul of their targets, about god damn time they make them that say.

So remove their Survivalabilty to Anti-MEQ Weapons and then make them more expensive???

Space Wolf Player Since 1989
My First Impression Threads:
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IEGA Web Site”: http://www.meetup.com/IEGA-InlandEmpireGamersAssociation/ 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Anpu42 wrote:
DaPino wrote:
Remove the invul on thousand sons and replace it by a rule that lets them re-roll their armor saves and give them AP2 bolters. Up their price to 28-30 ppm.

They're suposed to be super-resilient vs small-arms fire, about god damn time they make them that way.
Their bullets are supposed to pass through armor and attack the very soul of their targets, about god damn time they make them that say.

So remove their Survivalabilty to Anti-MEQ Weapons and then make them more expensive???

There's hardly such a thing as anti-MEQ range weapons (OH NO, VESPIDS AND DESTROYERS!). Making them more killy is what's needed.

Then again Destroyers are actually good.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Grim Rune Priest in the Eye of the Storm





Riverside CA

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Anpu42 wrote:
DaPino wrote:
Remove the invul on thousand sons and replace it by a rule that lets them re-roll their armor saves and give them AP2 bolters. Up their price to 28-30 ppm.

They're suposed to be super-resilient vs small-arms fire, about god damn time they make them that way.
Their bullets are supposed to pass through armor and attack the very soul of their targets, about god damn time they make them that say.

So remove their Survivalabilty to Anti-MEQ Weapons and then make them more expensive???

There's hardly such a thing as anti-MEQ range weapons (OH NO, VESPIDS AND DESTROYERS!). Making them more killy is what's needed.

Then again Destroyers are actually good.

Wat about all the S10 AP1 Pie out there?

Space Wolf Player Since 1989
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IEGA Web Site”: http://www.meetup.com/IEGA-InlandEmpireGamersAssociation/ 
   
Made in gb
Hellacious Havoc





The one thing I personally want to see with Thousand sons is not to increase the price, too damn pricey as is and 2 units of 10 cost the more than 10 terminators with full upgrades and Nurgle and as Thousand Sons stand now, I would take the terminators any day, I would also like to see them on par with Plauge Marines for toughness, T5 is a must, also something other than bolters with soul blaze...Jesus, everyone else is either great in assault or has access to incredible weapons.

Tzeench has to be the next to be updated and alot needs to be done for Thousand sons otherwise they are going to remain obscure and pointless in comparison to Plauge Marines...and Tzeench wont like Nurgle being superior



10000
 
   
Made in be
Khorne Chosen Marine Riding a Juggernaut





Belgium

Zerkers with 2A base, and options for 2 CCW weapons in the squad.

Kharn with either a 2+/4++, or EW and 4++, he's a former Legion Captain FFS.

Characters keep their options, rules, powers, artifacts when they turn Deamon Princes with Dark Apotheosis.

Open topped Rhinos option.

New LR variant.

Maulerfiends have WS4 and Init5, all this "Deamon engines are slow" is facking bs, you make Deamon engines, because they are better and meaner then normal machines, not worse...

New weapons based on Warp Tech in line with Grav guns etc.

rework VotLW and also makes it a, army wide rule, allready in the points of the models, i don't see Marines paying extra points for ATSKNF, COmbat DOctrines and Chapter tactics...

2+ save for HQ's..., seriously...

Deep Strike mitigation, WE ARE LITTERALLY LIVING IN THE WARP, but we are less accurate then Imperials that fears the Warp...

Either giv the Defiler an AV13 or a pts drop, 200pts for a AV12 model, is waaay too cracked up.

NIce Detachements and formations that are fun to play, not neccesarly OP; just fun and usefull.

And by the Way give the BT his STR8 back, its bullcrap to have him swing at STR6...

   
Made in gb
Hellacious Havoc





Tzeench Warptech weapons would be a nice available upgrade for Thousand Sons.

2 Attacks base for Berserkers and 3 For Champion and 5 For Kharn (increase Kharn price by 10-15 points as 10 Charge attacks is alot)

Warpsmith increase price by 15 points and makes Predator/Vindicator an elite would be nice personally coz I like running 3 Vindicators but if I was to Tournament I'd be limited to 2

Daemon Princes can make Cultists into corresponding daemon based on what Mark you take (Plaguebearers Bloodletter Daemonettes Pink Horrors) but on on roll of 3+ fails give an automatic wound to the amount of troops that fail e.g. 20 cultists, 6 fails, 6 die 14 become Plaguebearers (Chaos Daemon update)


10000
 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





Steel Brethren Formation

3-6 squads of possessed marines (this is the useless tax)
6-12 squads of Marines
3-6 squads of havocs

This formation gets free rhinos but upgrades must be paid for. Thats 12 rhino boxes normally cost 420pts which allows for purchase of 12 combi gun for 120pts or hml costing 144pts. However the minimum is 390 for 3 useless possessed. 900 pts of minum bare bones Marines and havocs. On second thought seems to be more over powered than Gladius. What If we add Chosen as point sinks. Or more useless possessed marines?

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 Filch wrote:
Steel Brethren Formation

3-6 squads of possessed marines (this is the useless tax)
6-12 squads of Marines
3-6 squads of havocs

This formation gets free rhinos but upgrades must be paid for. Thats 12 rhino boxes normally cost 420pts which allows for purchase of 12 combi gun for 120pts or hml costing 144pts. However the minimum is 390 for 3 useless possessed. 900 pts of minum bare bones Marines and havocs. On second thought seems to be more over powered than Gladius. What If we add Chosen as point sinks. Or more useless possessed marines?



Not a fan of formations that basically encourage you to field tons of units that you won't enjoy using but will be annoyingly effective at winning games. Why not just wishlist to have possessed marines to be better or to have a Steel Brethren formation that basically just lets you slot extra havocs into whatever the decurion equivalent is?


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





What are the negatives of the decurion and gladius formations? I need that kind of drawback to balance out 420pts of free rhinos.
   
 
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