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Those blood angel parts are getting me all hot and bothered. Very nice. Are they just getting the upgrade kits out because they're popular, you think, or does this point to some book love soon for the DA/BA?

 Haighus wrote:

The second angle I find odd, as it is a completely different stand-point to the way FW has viewed plastic GW 40k models in both the Legionnes Astartes and the Imperialis Auxilia: FW has promoted the use of AM models for the Imperial Army, and has put plenty of snippets in the HH books for using GW plastic vehicles for the Legions. Not to mention a good chunk of the stuff used by 40k Adeptus Mechanicus is ancient technology. I can understand the armies playing very differently and having different structures, but the equipment being used by 40k Skitarii should not be so far removed from 30k Skitarii, so the models should be comparable (especially with an upgrade kit). The fluff for Galvanic rifles has them being in constant use since the very beginnings of the Martian Cult for example. Strange.

Don't know what the exact reason is, but I would guess it's a) design, b) their own model range they want to sell and c) the rules.

a) The FW models look very different compared to those from main GW (except the Magos Dominus). Models with joust lances or muskets (when even the lowest 30k troops wield more futuristic weapons) would look out of place. They used GW Servitor models in the earlier books as servo-automata (even if the stats were totally different), but now the real stuff is out and those things don't look human at all. At the moment the 30k range Mechanicum humans are either Magi, extremely powerful elite troops (Myrmidons, Thallaxi if you count them) or, well, those tech-thralls. The Magi surround themselves with automata rather than human servitors, field armies of robots and man even their battle tanks personally as if they trust the human flesh even less than their 40k successors.

b) Surely they want to sell their models. I guess they'd do less if you could use the 'cheaper' stuff to build a complete 30k army (I suppose the 30k community is now large enough for this being a factor for FW sales but not large enough for GW to fulfill those demands).

c) Merging two more or less complete armies isn't easy in terms of internal balancing and avoidance of units doing basically the same.(one of them will usually do it better). And here it's even more complicated, as the armies were designed for settings with different opponents.

 Bull0 wrote:
Those blood angel parts are getting me all hot and bothered. Very nice. Are they just getting the upgrade kits out because they're popular, you think, or does this point to some book love soon for the DA/BA?

They are supposedly going to have an army list in the next book, along with the DA.

However, it's not "their" book.

 Bull0 wrote:
Those blood angel parts are getting me all hot and bothered. Very nice. Are they just getting the upgrade kits out because they're popular, you think, or does this point to some book love soon for the DA/BA?

Yeah, I love those BA parts!

IIRC BA, DA, and WS are gettin Legion traits/rites of war in the next book, but not characters/special units yet.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
IIRC BA, DA, and WS are gettin Legion traits/rites of war in the next book, but not characters/special units yet.

Yeah, this. I assume that means they won't get their fluff piece til later books either which is a bit of a shame.

Surely with the DA bits, it'd be easy enough to buy a set of heads, torsos, and pads from FW, add legs of choice from Anvil Industry, and use arms and guns you have lying around from GW? Almost all PA infantry boxes these past few years have a load of spare arms and bolters.

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
Surely with the DA bits, it'd be easy enough to buy a set of heads, torsos, and pads from FW, add legs of choice from Anvil Industry, and use arms and guns you have lying around from GW? Almost all PA infantry boxes these past few years have a load of spare arms and bolters.

This is pretty much what I've been doing for my Iron Hands - the FW kits mixed with GW plastics and Anvil & Kromlech bionics.

Yeah, same here. I've done an ultramarines boarding assault squad using the anvil shields, various anvil legs and torsos, GW arms, backs, FW upgrade kits.

 Darth Bob wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

I like those breasplates and the pauldron sculpts, but why did they have to use armets instead of great helms?

Great helms are more of an Imperial Fists or Black Templars thing, in my mind. But if you want more great helm-ish heads, just get these upgrades instead:

Yeah, and those look absolutely godawful with the swept out facial guard. Downright cartoonish.

Armet style helmets generally look fantastic, or so I think.

Just recived my Mechanicum LRB! :]

Page 17:

"other force organisation charts (as well as formations and detachments) from the WH40K rulebook and other game expansions, as well as unbound armies, are not designed with the age of darkness missions in mind and should not be used in battles iof the age of darkness games unless by the mutual prior consent of all parties involved."

Page 21:

"In order to represent this diversity when it comes to super-heavy vehicles and flyers, it is perfectly acceptable to use specific imperial super-heavy vehicles and flyer units from forgeworlds wider imperial armour range such as 'apocalypse' and 'aeronautica'"

Page 28:

partis cybernetica - "A character with this special rule may join a unit of monstorus creatures so mlong as they have the cybernetica cortex special rule, even though this would not usually be allowed."

Page 33: calleb decima has the independent character special rule!!! and a bit of wargear to make him relentless!!!

Page 39: thallax can take a triaros as a dedicated transport!

Page 41: castellax are 105pts each now

Page 62: two types of ordinatus!!! volcano cannon or sonic destructor!

Page 81: ordo reductor force org chart - compulsory HQ 2 troops and 2 heavy support! optional 2 LOW slots!!!!

 SirDonlad wrote:


Page 62: two types of ordinatus!!! volcano cannon or sonic destructor!

Without falling foul of any dakka rules, what are the Ordinatus like ruleswise?

volcano cannon 180" S:d AP:1 10" blast machine destroyer primary wepon
sonic destroyer71" S:X AP:2 armourbane, instant death etc

14 hull points 14 13 13 BS4

the dipersion field is crazy first turn -3, second turn -2, third turn -1.
for incoming shooting attacks and rolls on the d-chart - works on front, sides and any angle using barrage

I think we'll be okay so far - any more detailed info by PM i think.

Can you give more rule for the sonic screwdriver?

What does strength x mean?

So, does this mean that the Mechanicum red book does not feature the rules for the Questoris Knights army list?

no it doesn't - it mentions you can use draycavac with it, and has the profiles for each of the indentured knight types, but you'll need to keep book 4.

looks like the 'mechanicum land raider' is now called the "Macrocarid Explorator" with a change in options available: the hull mounted heavy bolter is now a mauler pattern bolt cannon - no more quad heavy bolter sponsons.

On the plus side, calleb decima's isstvan profile allows me to take a single space marine tank as a heavy support choice so i can feature a landraider achillies in my ordo reductor!!

The artillery battery changed and is a bit wierd now, but hey - i get four HS slots with two of them compulsory!

plus, they are now scoring units and have obsec in maelstrom missions!!



Ah, just noticed that i can't have allies or fortifications...




One must disappear for food, but will be back later and happy to answer any asks of LRB conent.

Bah, so much for not having to lug along a heavy book next year.

SirDonlad wrote:volcano cannon 180" S:d AP:1 10" blast machine destroyer primary wepon
sonic destroyer71" S:X AP:2 armourbane, instant death etc

14 hull points 14 13 13 BS4

the dipersion field is crazy first turn -3, second turn -2, third turn -1.
for incoming shooting attacks and rolls on the d-chart - works on front, sides and any angle using barrage

I think we'll be okay so far - any more detailed info by PM i think.

Excellent, was hoping the old dispersion field would appear again.

SirDonlad wrote:
looks like the 'mechanicum land raider' is now called the "Macrocarid Explorator" with a change in options available: the hull mounted heavy bolter is now a mauler pattern bolt cannon - no more quad heavy bolter sponsons.

Hmmm, interesting. Proper Mechanicum pattern Land Raider inbound? Ordo Reductor only, aye?

In book 3, the Taghmata could also take the land raiders, so I would think they can still take it. I doubt FW would make a large vehicle model that only one small part of a faction could take.

It's in the main taghmata list under heavy support.

Page 47 : avenger strike fighter can take two sets of 2 kraken penetrator missiles pow! (it can get tank hunters too)

Page 50: the arvus can be upgraded to carry a pair of vorax or a single castellax

Page 51: thanatar cohort size reduced to 3

Page 55 macrocarid explorator can take a 'servo-rig' which allows a model with the battlesmith rule to attempt to fix a vehicle within 3 inches while inside. it also can do a shooting attack - 3" S8 AP2 heavy1 (targets seperately)

 SirDonlad wrote:

Page 51: thanatar cohort size reduced to 3

Please tell me the other Thanatar variants can take multiples per maniple entry?

The thanatar-calix can only be taken singly per slot, but the thanatar-cynis can also be taken in squads of three.

makes sense, given the rivalry between ryza and estaban.

 SirDonlad wrote:
looks like the 'mechanicum land raider' is now called the "Macrocarid Explorator" with a change in options available: the hull mounted heavy bolter is now a mauler pattern bolt cannon - no more quad heavy bolter sponsons.

Forge World wrote:This is a complete resin and plastic kit. Although not used by the Space Marine Legions during the Horus Heresy, the Land Raider Prometheus can be used to represent one of the Mechanicum Land Raider options. Fire Raptors Resin doors are sold seperately.

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Land-Raider-Prometheus
So, Forge World managed to invalidate their own recently written fluff description in about a month...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SirDonlad wrote:
The thanatar-calix can only be taken singly per slot, but the thanatar-cynis can also be taken in squads of three.

makes sense, given the rivalry between ryza and estaban.

Yeah, also makes sense that only the Calix is more limited as it is the most complex version.

Ryza ftw!

Yeah, some of GW's legendary 'lojik' has rubbed off a bit.

I'm still a bit perplexed with the lack of LR achillies for the ordo reductor - they're rare, but not that rare! we make the damn things!!

It's primarily because vanilla legion marines can take one per heavy support slot, yet the ordo reductor can only use one when calleb decima is our warlord and we're on isstvan 3!

Still, at least artillery vehicles are cheap and scoring for us.

Are any of the Taghmata units "Approved 40k units" for Cult Mechanicus or Skitarii, in the new book? Or are units mutually exclusive to specific army list?

I.E. Can I sub in a Magos Prime from the Taghmata red book for an HQ choice, instead of a Tech-priest Dominus in my Cult Mechanicus army?

There is no cross-compatibility whatsoever. sorry dude.

Also, on page 17 the 'designers note' specifically says that formations, force org charts and detachments from 40k should not be used in the age of darkness.

Thanks for the quick response!

That news blows. I figured since the release of 40k Admech, that one of the intentions of this compilation was to also spice up those miniature sized codices. Every standard 40k codex has "40k Appoved" units available, for variety and bolstering FW sales. I think it was a HUGE miscalculation on their half not to include official crossover units.


/shakesfist@GW

 Nyghoma wrote:
Thanks for the quick response!

That news blows. I figured since the release of 40k Admech, that one of the intentions of this compilation was to also spice up those miniature sized codices. Every standard 40k codex has "40k Appoved" units available, for variety and bolstering FW sales. I think it was a HUGE miscalculation on their half not to include official crossover units.


/shakesfist@GW

Even if FW does crossover with the 40K Skitarii and Cult Mechanicus, they were not goin to do it in the Mechanicum Red Book, which is specifically designed for the HH era.

Wait for the next IA (14?) which is supposed to be Tau vs AdMech. 40K era, and we will likely see 40K versions of the rules for some of these units.

Yeah, it doesn't mean there won't be any crossover, but the red books are specifically for the Heresy (like the big Heresy books are) so it wasn't going to be in there. It's like the 40k rules for things like Sicarans and Spartans aren't in the red books, they're in Imperial Armour.