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I really wish I had the time to get into 30k, but I can't really justify it alongside playing 40k :\

I mean, I could use my Daemons that I already own, but from what I understand they basically just play the same as 40k Daemons, which is to say, all that would change for me would be the opponents.

If they go for the old style multibases the individual infantry on one could move to 10mm scale and still fit in the same footprint, (looking at the old 6mm scale stuff it was rather wide for it's height probably to minimise breakage)

although that assumes plastic rather than resin for the small stuff

as you said the other stuff was bound to get bigger no matter what as it was all too small

As the owner of huge squat, Tyranid, Eldar and necrons epic armies I really don't welcome a scale change.

If its 6mm then sure, I'll add more and maybe start another army or 2.
But if its a different scale then I'll be back on eBay and GW make nothing from me instead.

Hey guys, was told to post this here. Lots of pictures of upcoming models

 Jackal wrote:
As the owner of huge squat, Tyranid, Eldar and necrons epic armies I really don't welcome a scale change.

If its 6mm then sure, I'll add more and maybe start another army or 2.
But if its a different scale then I'll be back on eBay and GW make nothing from me instead.

Change of scale = Epic Fail!

Who are they hoping to sell this to? If you don't play Epic already then 6 - 10 mm should make relatively little difference, with as pointed out above some people seeing the benefits of the smaller scale. If you are already invested then a change of scale will be a deal breaker for many.

Way to alienate a whole bunch of potential customers! This would change me from totally excited and ready to buy new stuff to an active opponent of any new game. "Sure I'll totally buy all my armies again in 10mm, now you're absolutely not going to change your mind and switch to 15 mm in a couple of years are you?"

I just spent 3 years painstakingly putting together 4 Epic: Armageddon armies from eBay leftovers, third party models, and my own 3d prints. I've finally gotten two friends into it too and they've each assembled an army.

I've been looking forward to this release with some trepidation. I figured even if they screw up the rules, at least I can keep using NetEA and pick up a few models to fill gaps in my lists (or even start that Chaos marine army I've been planning if they get better sculpts).

If they switch to 10mm though, I won't even bother looking at the rules, much less the models. Far too much time and money invested now, so they'll most definitely lose any and all sales my group would have given. What's worse, something stupid like this would only result in fracturing the already small and fractured existing player base, probably killing fan Epic and strangling their new game in its infancy all at the same time.

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:
I just spent 3 years painstakingly putting together 4 Epic: Armageddon armies from eBay leftovers, third party models, and my own 3d prints. I've finally gotten two friends into it too and they've each assembled an army.

I've been looking forward to this release with some trepidation. I figured even if they screw up the rules, at least I can keep using NetEA and pick up a few models to fill gaps in my lists (or even start that Chaos marine army I've been planning if they get better sculpts).

If they switch to 10mm though, I won't even bother looking at the rules, much less the models. Far too much time and money invested now, so they'll most definitely lose any and all sales my group would have given. What's worse, something stupid like this would only result in fracturing the already small and fractured existing player base, probably killing fan Epic and strangling their new game in its infancy all at the same time.

I personally don't see why you couldn't just play with the new rules but use your current collection of models. It's only 4mm difference.

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:
I just spent 3 years painstakingly putting together 4 Epic: Armageddon armies from eBay leftovers, third party models, and my own 3d prints. I've finally gotten two friends into it too and they've each assembled an army.

I've been looking forward to this release with some trepidation. I figured even if they screw up the rules, at least I can keep using NetEA and pick up a few models to fill gaps in my lists (or even start that Chaos marine army I've been planning if they get better sculpts).

If they switch to 10mm though, I won't even bother looking at the rules, much less the models. Far too much time and money invested now, so they'll most definitely lose any and all sales my group would have given. What's worse, something stupid like this would only result in fracturing the already small and fractured existing player base, probably killing fan Epic and strangling their new game in its infancy all at the same time.

From what I have read the reboot will focus more on titans rather than a entire army, bigger titan models means they can charge more, in addition they want to generate sales; so invalidating the old range of models is a easy way to make sure anyone who is interested in the game again wont use the secondary market on release.

 zedmeister wrote:
There's only one thing I want to say when I heard that Epic won't return in 6mm...

Spoiler:

Azeroth133 wrote:

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:

Spoiler:

I just spent 3 years painstakingly putting together 4 Epic: Armageddon armies from eBay leftovers, third party models, and my own 3d prints. I've finally gotten two friends into it too and they've each assembled an army.

I've been looking forward to this release with some trepidation. I figured even if they screw up the rules, at least I can keep using NetEA and pick up a few models to fill gaps in my lists (or even start that Chaos marine army I've been planning if they get better sculpts).

If they switch to 10mm though, I won't even bother looking at the rules, much less the models. Far too much time and money invested now, so they'll most definitely lose any and all sales my group would have given. What's worse, something stupid like this would only result in fracturing the already small and fractured existing player base, probably killing fan Epic and strangling their new game in its infancy all at the same time.

From what I have read the reboot will focus more on titans rather than a entire army, bigger titan models means they can charge more, in addition they want to generate sales; so invalidating the old range of models is a easy way to make sure anyone who is interested in the game again wont use the secondary market on release.

Oh, I get it. I just think it's cynical and short-sighted. They have a ready to go fan base for this game, but they'll get precious few converts if they invalidate everyone's existing forces. I'm not redoing my armies and terrain, and at that rate why even use the new rules? There would be zero crossover with new players due to scale difference, and the current rules work fine.

And yes, 6mm to 10mm is a big enough difference to matter. It's like asking why people don't mix and match 20mm and 28mm models. Maybe the rules are scale agnostic, but again, if there's no crossover with new blood and the old rules work fine, why switch?

Whether it's a full reboot or just Adeptus Titanicus, they're cutting off their nose to spite their face. The market for old Epic models is vanishingly small and the quality of those models is extremely inferior compared to what could be done these days. Making the models compatible would hardly put a dent in their sales and would bring most existing Epic players into the fold immediately.

 Fango wrote:

 zedmeister wrote:
There's only one thing I want to say when I heard that Epic won't return in 6mm...

Spoiler:

Was there any other info besides "We wont be doing epic in 6mm"?

 Fango wrote:
Was there any other info besides "We wont be doing epic in 6mm"?

Nope, evidently they didn't think that would be a controversial decision that might require some context...

I hope the rebooted Epic has 'everything' in it - Titans, Super-Heavies, Tanks, Vehicles, Flyers and, yes, Infantry!

I'll still be interested if it is 'just' Titans, but...

If the new rules aren't scale dependent, or are easily converted to 6mm, I may end up just sticking with what I've got. That's if the new rules are better than the choices we have floating around now...depressing news nonetheless, I cant afford to start a collection over from scratch, especially if most of it will be Forgeworld...

I own a 95% complete space marine chapter for epic. That totally wouldn't stop me buying new models when released if in 6mm scale. Indeed there are a lot of new units which never appeared in epic. Release models of those and I'll get enough for the whole chapter.
Release those new units in another scale, I'm very unlikely to buy them.

As I said if it's just some elements then it could work. If infantry stays the same on the same size bases, but titans are much bigger, when then I'll just buy a lot of new titans. Replace everything, and it's suddenly a huge leapt for me to buy into the game.

Epic always had a bit of a weird scaling, if anything infantry was a bit big compared to tanks, flyers were far to small (forgeworld stuff was much larger) titans were never big enough. There's no way 100 men were garrisoned in the leg of an imperator like the fluff suggested. Addressing this issue with a new edition is fine. Change for changes sake is just coursing problems.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 torgoch wrote:
I’m an Epic player (in fact we played NetEpic at my club last Thursday) and while there is an element of sadness that the new game will probably be 10mm in scale, I recognise it needs to be from GW’s perspective, otherwise no-one will buy any of the new range of figures. Epic Armageddon figures sales were terrible due to the fact everyone already had perfectly working armies.

If the rules are half-playable, I’ll almost certainly invest in a new army. The previous FW 6mm Epic stuff was gorgeous, so I've some high hopes if they do a 10mm version.

Here's the issue though; that was more than a decade ago. Lots of those folk who had perfectly working armies have moved on from the hobby by now, or split those armies up and sold them to a few dozen other people as small lots on ebay, so there's really very little reason to assume the same issue would arise again.

Actually, experience says the opposite. When Epic Armageddon was released, everybody and their brother's cousin's sister's nephew dug out their old Epic stuff and put it up on eBay. Due to all the competition, prices were so cheap that people gladly bought old models because they couldn't justify GW's idiotic prices. The lack of new sculpts in the 6mm plastics didn't help any because there were literally bucketloads of that stuff being offered on eBay.

 Tamereth wrote:
I own a 95% complete space marine chapter for epic. That totally wouldn't stop me buying new models when released if in 6mm scale. Indeed there are a lot of new units which never appeared in epic. Release models of those and I'll get enough for the whole chapter.
Release those new units in another scale, I'm very unlikely to buy them.

As I said if it's just some elements then it could work. If infantry stays the same on the same size bases, but titans are much bigger, when then I'll just buy a lot of new titans. Replace everything, and it's suddenly a huge leapt for me to buy into the game.

Epic always had a bit of a weird scaling, if anything infantry was a bit big compared to tanks, flyers were far to small (forgeworld stuff was much larger) titans were never big enough. There's no way 100 men were garrisoned in the leg of an imperator like the fluff suggested. Addressing this issue with a new edition is fine. Change for changes sake is just coursing problems.

I agree with everything you said in this post 100%. I have a similar sized collection, though scattered over several factions. It is GW though, so change for change's sake could just be par for the course. We saw what they did with Dreadfleet...

As I never bought into Epic, I have to say I'm fairly excited for the reboot.

I just hope it's not totally based in the Heresy, or they expand it to 40k later. I'm tentatively hopeful for Tyranid Bio-Titans eventually.

I think it's probable folk will just have to accept that, regardless of what they choose to call it, this will not actually be a revival of Epic but rather a new game entirely - "Apocalypse: Sensible Scale Edition", essentially.

Whether that will work out for them I don't know, but it seems evident that the new SG group have decided to adopt GW-proper's "Vets? What do animal doctors have to do with anything?" attitude, so they're not going to change course even if opposition to a scale change was universal, which of course it will not be.

EDIT: Actually Sinful, making it a Heresy-era game, at least to start with, is probably the only reason I'd buy in. Of course, they'd probably consider my reason for buying in a bad thing - collecting and playing a full-sized Heresy army in 10mm would, if they have any sense at all, be much cheaper and more engaging gameplay-wise than doing the present slightly ludicrous semi-fixed-40K-at-3-to-5k-points thing, so I could do that instead of spending thousands of pounds and years of hobby time building a 30K army.

I'm hoping for a Battle of Tallarn thing myself.

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:

Azeroth133 wrote:

 CalgarsPimpHand wrote:

Spoiler:

I just spent 3 years painstakingly putting together 4 Epic: Armageddon armies from eBay leftovers, third party models, and my own 3d prints. I've finally gotten two friends into it too and they've each assembled an army.

I've been looking forward to this release with some trepidation. I figured even if they screw up the rules, at least I can keep using NetEA and pick up a few models to fill gaps in my lists (or even start that Chaos marine army I've been planning if they get better sculpts).

If they switch to 10mm though, I won't even bother looking at the rules, much less the models. Far too much time and money invested now, so they'll most definitely lose any and all sales my group would have given. What's worse, something stupid like this would only result in fracturing the already small and fractured existing player base, probably killing fan Epic and strangling their new game in its infancy all at the same time.

From what I have read the reboot will focus more on titans rather than a entire army, bigger titan models means they can charge more, in addition they want to generate sales; so invalidating the old range of models is a easy way to make sure anyone who is interested in the game again wont use the secondary market on release.

Oh, I get it. I just think it's cynical and short-sighted. They have a ready to go fan base for this game, but they'll get precious few converts if they invalidate everyone's existing forces. I'm not redoing my armies and terrain, and at that rate why even use the new rules? There would be zero crossover with new players due to scale difference, and the current rules work fine.

And yes, 6mm to 10mm is a big enough difference to matter. It's like asking why people don't mix and match 20mm and 28mm models. Maybe the rules are scale agnostic, but again, if there's no crossover with new blood and the old rules work fine, why switch?

Whether it's a full reboot or just Adeptus Titanicus, they're cutting off their nose to spite their face. The market for old Epic models is vanishingly small and the quality of those models is extremely inferior compared to what could be done these days. Making the models compatible would hardly put a dent in their sales and would bring most existing Epic players into the fold immediately.

I never played the orginal epic, since many people perfered Necromunda and mordhiem since it used existing terrian, or Battle Fleet Gothic were terrian was super easy to make. No one wanted to play epic because of the investment of time and money into collecting a new scale of terrian.

But 10mm scale much closer to Z-gauge in model railroad building. Z-gague buildings are super common, and super cheap. Plus they already come pre-painted. This is the reason why alot of modren games like "Dropzone Commander" and "Firestorm: Planet Fall" use the 10mm scale. If GW dosen't bump the scale up to 10mm, I actually wouldn't even consider getting into the game and would rather Dropzone or Planet Fall since collecting terrian for these games is much easier.

 BrookM wrote:
I'm hoping for a Battle of Tallarn thing myself.

Which is part of the Heresy so

Im looking forward to 10mm Epic myself so no complaints here.
GW will still sell bucket loads.

No BFG news is disappointing though.

For those talking about 10mm mixed with original, it may work on vehicles, but infantry is a dead point.

Compare a warmaster or battle of five armies miniature to an original epic model.
Nearly double the size.

I only know as I ordered some warmaster and BOFA models for use with my epic squats and promptly binned them when I saw the difference.

Really looking forward to meshing all these games together into one narrative when the time is right.

Is it confirmed as 10mm yet? It's just not 6mm so that means it could even be 8mm and not match any other scales out there already. If they are focusing on Titans this might not be such a big deal.

Tbh, the main issue I have now is because of the 10mm rumor the eBay prices took a hike again.

Some epic models are just plain stupid for price now.

Does that domitar that was sold have same rules as those iron warrior body guard domitar? Or is he mechanicum unit?

Zwan1One wrote:
Is it confirmed as 10mm yet? It's just not 6mm so that means it could even be 8mm and not match any other scales out there already. If they are focusing on Titans this might not be such a big deal.

No scale has been confirmed. Just that it will be a different scale.

I'm not surprised by the change. When they made the Epic miniatures the different classes were made to different scale. The infantry was 6mm (1/285) but by GWs own admission the vehicles were 1/300, the aircraft were 1/350, the Titan were closer to 1/400. My guess is that in this era of better plastic technology and bigger plastic kits they will be remaking them to the same common scale. An Emperor Titan properly scaled to 10mm would be closer to a 40k Imperial Knight, a warlord like a 40k dreadknight, etc... It's a lot more exciting that way and accentuates GWs advantage as the number one manufacturer. GW's mantra as a miniature company will keep them from making anything that's too blobby like 6mm was.