Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Are they any other cost effective means to down a Wraithknight other then mass grav weapons for vanilla marines?

Best I can think of is triple Land Speeder Typhoons.

A Psyker can strip a few wounds off a Wraithknight with Psychic Shriek, if you get lucky. Rending is also very effective (tag it with Misfortune). High-strength melee attacks with the right attackers can work (Iron Arm or Hammerhand). And of course Instant Death is good, deny FNP and D3 wounds.

S8 AP3 is good but you might have better targets.

Rending weapons, massed Lascannons to the face, instant death weapons is what comes to mind

Don't rely on sniper/poison/rending; the Feel No Pain on the Wraithknight and any sort of cover it can take advantage of will easily neutralize any wounds you deal. Consider massed krak missiles or lascannons instead.

3 Typhoons would hardly damage a Wraithknight at all. Hit 4x, Wound 2x, 1.32 Unsaved Wounds after FnP. Even worse if it's the 5++ WK. Meh.

 TheNewBlood wrote:
Don't rely on sniper/poison

And both only damage a GC on a 6+. Not a good idea

Generally speaking the Grav cannon on a rentless platform maybe the only effecient way to take down such a undercosted monster before it does too many havoc. If you are not able to use that for whatever the reason, possibly a full squadron of Tri-Lascannon Predator is the second best. Even better if you have divination Librarian nearby granting rerolls. So that is 9 shots reroll to hit and reroll to wound Lascannon. Hopefully it can kill the WK in two turns.

Just hope none of your tank is hurt by the D cannon before you start putting wounds on that WK.

TH/SS Termies do well against WK if you can get them in close combat. That's a pretty big if, it would require a Stormraven so your looking at 400 points +

Yea... Even as a BT player, if at all possible, I'd just find a way to get deepstriking Grav on T1 to delete that damn thing before it kills half your army.

Alternatively, don't take any vehicles worth more than 75 points.

Assault Cannons and Lascannons are fairly reliable ways to kill a WK. Assault Cannons lack range, but can be purchased for cheap, especially in a Gladius Strike Force, where they can be picked up for 20 pts for TL Assault Cannons (that just so happen to come attached to a Razorback), and be bought en masse. Lascannons have much better range and strength, but they lack shots. Still, a Trilas Predator or a squad of Lascannon Devs can get the job done, though not necessarily in one turn. A squad of TriLas Predators, though expensive as hell, is going to rip a WK (and basically any MC or Tank) apart though.

Sticking a TDA Librarian with a squad of Terminators (Assault or Tactical, really) in a Land Raider or Stormraven is probably the best general way of killing a WK in CC, IMO.

Still, a squad of Death Company with a few Fists mixed in might be a good way of hacking a WK apart if they get the charge off. So many Str 5 attacks with a few surprise Power Fists, even if most of those aren't going to have an AP worth a damn, is just going to overwhelm a WK. This is provided that they get into CC with a WK and don't get Stomped for their trouble.

Devastators with missile launchers or lascannons will end it quick.

 buddha wrote:
Devastators with missile launchers or lascannons will end it quick.

A Wraithknight will end 300-500 points of stuff quicker.

I wish Sternguard's poisoned ammo still worked on a 2+.

I was thinking of massed thunder hammers or power fists but the units who can carry them are either too slow (terminators) or not durable enough (vanguard)

 Selym wrote:

 buddha wrote:
Devastators with missile launchers or lascannons will end it quick.

A Wraithknight will end 300-500 points of stuff quicker.

I'm not saying the wraithknight isn't OP, but outside of grav per the OPs post, devs are the best bet.

 buddha wrote:

 Selym wrote:

 buddha wrote:
Devastators with missile launchers or lascannons will end it quick.

A Wraithknight will end 300-500 points of stuff quicker.

I'm not saying the wraithknight isn't OP, but outside of grav per the OPs post, devs are the best bet.

Fair enough.

 minigun762 wrote:
I wish Sternguard's poisoned ammo still worked on a 2+.

I was thinking of massed thunder hammers or power fists but the units who can carry them are either too slow (terminators) or not durable enough (vanguard)

You're referring to the hellfire round, correct? Unless I'm reading the codex wrong, it says "Poisoned (2+)" in the profile.

 GangstaMuffin24 wrote:

 minigun762 wrote:
I wish Sternguard's poisoned ammo still worked on a 2+.

I was thinking of massed thunder hammers or power fists but the units who can carry them are either too slow (terminators) or not durable enough (vanguard)

You're referring to the hellfire round, correct? Unless I'm reading the codex wrong, it says "Poisoned (2+)" in the profile.

Gargantuans make poison only wound on 6+

 CrownAxe wrote:

 GangstaMuffin24 wrote:

 minigun762 wrote:
I wish Sternguard's poisoned ammo still worked on a 2+.

I was thinking of massed thunder hammers or power fists but the units who can carry them are either too slow (terminators) or not durable enough (vanguard)

You're referring to the hellfire round, correct? Unless I'm reading the codex wrong, it says "Poisoned (2+)" in the profile.

Gargantuans make poison only wound on 6+

Didn't know that! I've thankfully never had the pleasure of facing any.

Thanks for the info.

Looks like the non-grav options are really slim. The cheapest way to field massed lascannons (for SM) is five man Devastators and that's still 150 points or 127 points per wound on average.

Compare that with 43 points per wound from Gravturions. BIG efficiency difference!

Vulture gunships?

Well, Vanguard with SS and PF are 47 points each, only a couple more points than an Assault Termie with TH / SS.

Against most non-Bolter-Equivalents, the save is going to be the same, definitely in close combat. So for a couple more points each, you're jumping instead of walking.

For the past 13 years, Marine players have been removing Wraithlords from the board without any difficulty.

Wraithknights are only slightly harder to kill than 2 Wraithlords (since they have Feel No Pain now).

Whatever you were doing with your army before that made you unconcerned with the possibility of 2 Wraithlords still stands. Continue doing that.

DarknessEternal wrote:For the past 13 years, Marine players have been removing Wraithlords from the board without any difficulty.

Wraithknights are only slightly harder to kill than 2 Wraithlords (since they have Feel No Pain now).

Whatever you were doing with your army before that made you unconcerned with the possibility of 2 Wraithlords still stands. Continue doing that.

Wraithlords don't have 6 wounds, the option for an invulnerable save, Feel No Pain, the option for D-weapons, and are actually appropriately costed. They are not comparable to the Wraithknight.

 TheNewBlood wrote:

Wraithlords don't have 6 wounds,

2 Wraithlords do, which is what I said. The invulnerable save is no greater than the cover save they'd be getting, and I did mention Feel No Pain.

Wraithknights are simply not as difficult to kill as the internet likes to pretend they are.

The only difference is that one Wraithknight will actually kill things whereas 2 Wraithlords will not.

Wraithlords also move half as quickly, don't reduce the efficiency of poison and sniper rules, and actually die to ID rather than taking additional wounds.

Given as the SM arsenal includes poison (on Sternguard), snipers (on scouts), and ID (on librarian force weapons) - I'd say Wraithknights are measurably harder to bring down for Marines than Wraithlords without the consideration of grav.

there are far more differences then you glossing over over darkness....


WL dont move 12", no str d, IE threat range is way different, damage out put is different, pts cost is different,

shooting at two targets that move 6" is vastly different then shooting at something that moves 12"

simply put outside of grav, there are options, but they suck for the pts you have to sink into it.

grav is the only thing that is cost effective for dealing with WK's that wont also tie up a large part of your PTs with just dealing with WK's to the exclusion of most other things.

FRFSRF + Misfortune is always funny.

Sniper no longer works because its a Gargantuan.
Grav still should work and so can fleshbane.

a Lucky Vortex O Doom can work.

Bike Smashers can work. stacking invisibility helps it.

All alternative options require a LOT of point AND luck :/

 Desubot wrote:
FRFSRF + Misfortune is always funny.

thats actually one of the things I was coming up with the other day after the 4th time in a row my 3 iron priests on TW (so 12+ str 10 attacks each round) failed to kill a WK before it stomped them into dust.

main issue being OFC how random it is to get misfortune, but its a great thing if you can swing it!

actually gunning for misfortune when I have loads of lasguns is one of my favorite go to's as its effective against everything,

not so hot for a marine player though.

such a shame skyhammer is non purchasable as its the perfect counter for WK

 easysauce wrote:
such a shame skyhammer is non purchasable as its the perfect counter for WK

What is the consensus on Skyhammer? I didn't buy it, but I definitely have the models to play it. Is it illegal for someone to bring it as part of their army if they don't have that laminated dataslate?

 Lord Corellia wrote:

 easysauce wrote:
such a shame skyhammer is non purchasable as its the perfect counter for WK

What is the consensus on Skyhammer? I didn't buy it, but I definitely have the models to play it. Is it illegal for someone to bring it as part of their army if they don't have that laminated dataslate?

I am opposed to any revenue for GW, so I'm cool with anything off the internet.

 Lord Corellia wrote:

 easysauce wrote:
such a shame skyhammer is non purchasable as its the perfect counter for WK

What is the consensus on Skyhammer? I didn't buy it, but I definitely have the models to play it. Is it illegal for someone to bring it as part of their army if they don't have that laminated dataslate?

its been allowed around here, I know last year at the LVO several people I played against used the flesh tearers formation to get some FA pods and didnt have those rules but it was allowed, so i dunno? ask your TO?