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So how good is warpath as a replacement large army sci fi game for 40k?

I have read that many people are happy with KoW for WHF replacement, is this situation similar?


edited to add.

Also, I thought deadzone was their skirmish game... but now they are adding firefight which is also a skirmish game?
What is the difference between deadzone and firefight?

Firefight=40k third edition
Deadzone=Necromunda
Warpath=current 40k

In terms of scale and such. That's what I've been hearing thrown around.

 MLaw wrote:

 Tamereth wrote:
Somebody wake me up when the warpath Kickstarter begins, this is just all Deadzone stuff.

Seriously I thought the kings of war 2 Kickstarter was light on new models but this is ridiculous.

Yeah.. I'm fully in this camp now. They say they want to flesh out whatever.. but lead with existing stuff and a couple of characters/vehicles.. Then go on to talk about how they aren't going to be releasing stuff for some factions? I'm rolling my eyes for those of you who can't see. I was pretty excited for this to be honest but man, they're pulling a Mantic.

I'm glad to see "pulling a Mantic" is still a thing. And I have little interest in Warpath to begin with - but looking through their offerings it does seem a little disappointing. I'd think properly launching Warpath would be a BIG priority and would entail Mantic looking to release a few hard plastic kits per army in a big multi-million dollar kickstarter.

This, in contrast seems pretty low-key and half-hearted.

I'm willing to bet that it this campaign will end with at least two factions with solid plastic ranges funded out of the kickstarter. KoW2 got that much on a much slower start, and sci-fi sells much better than fantasy in general.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Firefight=40k third edition
Deadzone=NecromundaF
Warpath=current 40k

In terms of scale and such. That's what I've been hearing thrown around.

But Deadzone also appears to be played on a 'grid', like a board-game more than an open field minis game, from what I've seen (I have the game and have looked through the rules, but haven't played a game yet).

I'd be pretty surprised if Firefight didn't let you play with 12-20 guys as well, being aimed at the small-scale of things.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gitzbitah wrote:
This is far fewer new models than I was expecting as well- but Galva-dwarf is awesome.

Spoiler:

I don't see a fig in this KS that looks even remotely like that...

If you mean the dwarf leader, I think you need to go back and try again.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Firefight=40k third edition
Deadzone=Necromunda
Warpath=current 40k

In terms of scale and such. That's what I've been hearing thrown around.

Deadzone is a great game, and uses a similar amount of models, but it's not a Necromunda substitute in any way, sadly. The rules are very different, the playing area is 1/4 the size but most importantly, it doesn't have any of the narrative qualities of Necromundas campaign system. To me, the post game is 80% of the fun in Necromunda. In Deadzone, I'd much rather play one-off games.

I think the thing with this Kickstarter is that tooling a single vehicle takes up at least $75k of funding, so things are heavily focused on that currently.

The starter set seems like the best deal to pick up currently, gets you both resin models rather than just one and seems to be better value than the army deals.

I'm sticking with that for the time being and seeing what happens, a set of three vehicles for $75 would he good. Mantic have stated that vehicle bundles are going to happen in the comments.

No idea what is upcoming, but I'd expect a Veer-myn vehicle somewhere around $250-$300k and then possibly moving on to the Plague.

The last Deadzone Kickstarter was kind of a Warpath Kickstarter in disguise, so a lot of the armies are already complete apart from vehicles.

decker_cky wrote:
I'm willing to bet that it this campaign will end with at least two factions with solid plastic ranges funded out of the kickstarter. KoW2 got that much on a much slower start, and sci-fi sells much better than fantasy in general.

They also shifted focus from Deadzone being "these models will be unique, distinct specialists with additional details that you won't find on our normal Warpath range" to "we can use Deadzone to fund a good chunk of our Warpath range before even Kickstarting the latter". The start of this campaign may not have the "wow" factor of everything being completely unseen, hard plastic products, but:

1) The initial funding goal would have been much higher, meaning that people would get impatient about reaching stretch goals.
2) Even having a full range of plastic stuff right from the start is no guarantee of mega success, a la Maelstrom's Edge.
3) They already had at least 2 "core" hard plastic sprues for each of the Enforcer, FF & Veermyn armies, which are going to be the majority of models in any given army.
4) They are prioritising the funding of at least 1 vehicle, with variant options, in hard plastic for each of these armies. This seems sensible to me, as these were clearly the largest gaps in their range.

Mantic has confirmed that the next faction will appear in the next $75k.

I think there's some really good odds of seeing 6 factions at this rate.

Plague already have zombies in hard plastic, which just leaves 3rd Gens to fill out the infantry (hopefully with some options to make an alternate unit/ weapon loadouts), and then it seems a looted interceptor is on the cards for them in terms of vehicles, possibly other vehicles too if Corp get funded. They also have a lot of stuff already done as part of Deadzone.

Beyong 400k, Corp and Asterians are likely, again, both of which already have a good amount of minis already completed. I'd be happy with just some vehicle kits for Corp personally, the infantry is rather nice already.

The first vehicle battle group has been announced it's $75 for 3 Interceptors/persecutors plus you get parts in resin to make an Arbiter armed with Polaris cannons.

The battle group can be chosen as part of the Advanced warfare pledge or bought for an extra $75

@Scarletsquig - the KS exclusive faction character specialists are metal, not resin, unless I missed something.

@DaveC - I don't think the resin ship parts are KS exclusive, just only available to buy through this KS via the get 3 for $75 deal. At least, that's how I read it.

Huh, the way I read that wasn't that the arbiter was KS exclusive, just that the only packaging of the resin bits in the KS was with the battlegroup. --like Vermonter said.

Not really sure if I love that scheme or not. They know 25/each isn't as enticing as 60 for 3 so they added on the resin bits but what if its like 40k and the meta makes the arbiter the best build? Then what?

Oh well its still a bundle deal. Gotta stay light in this KS though which might keep me from going in on too many vehicles. I hadn't thought new plague would be my main goal, but its starting to sound like it.

Veermyn character seems cool too, I appreciate as much fluff as they're willing to print.

 Vermonter wrote:
@Scarletsquig - the KS exclusive faction character specialists are metal, not resin, unless I missed something.

@DaveC - I don't think the resin ship parts are KS exclusive, just only available to buy through this KS via the get 3 for $75 deal. At least, that's how I read it.

Changed it - I could have sworn it originally said exclusive or did I mix it up with the VeerMyn

Well, I was hoping for new battlegroups that look like this. Whilst it might not be this specific one that I go for, getting one of them is probably enough to keep me in at the EB I nabbed.

4 flyers (or maybe tanks) for... £75? ish? Plus all the rules, freebies etc. Yeah, I'll likely stick now.

I just noticed the rulebook will include a 'how to use 10mm miniatures for WarPath' section. I would like to see a 10mm starter box with a couple of forces and some terrain. That would get me to pledge this KS quickly.

There's been a lot of banter about minis, the last few pages, but how has all this progressed in the meantime?

Alex C wrote:
Basically you buy a unit in batches. Each of these batches has a "hub" that everything is measured from. The rest of the figures in a batch are irrelevant. You have to keep each hub in the unit within a certain distance of the other hubs in a unit and then arrange the rest of the models around the hubs. It's just a pain in the arse to be fiddling around like that when the aim of the game is to make streamlined mass battles a quick and easy thing to do. If they want a multibase game, make the whole bloody unit on a base, rather than this middle ground nonsense that just complicates things.

Bolognesus wrote:
On the other hand, the hub idea feels so convoluted and impractical to me that it'd be enough for me to shrug and simply accept there's not going to be any proper large platoon 28mm scifi game on the market.

adamsouza wrote:Yeah, the hub concept kept me from even trying the Alpha rules with my gaming group.

judgedoug wrote:The Warpath Alpha rules released several months ago were a weird combination of some unit-based rules but still holding onto individual-model rules with a death grip. It was awkward and made little sense.

judgedoug wrote:

• Get into the thick of the action, using true LOS, per-model hits in shooting and melee, improved terrain occupying rules, and Warpath’s Orders system.

using true LOS

true LOS

lord_blackfang wrote:Reading the Warpath beta I definitely had the feeling that the author had never seen any rulesets other than Mantic's existing games and 40k. It is a crappy Frankenstein's monster stitched together from KoW, Warpath 1.0, Deadzone and 40k. No other influences. None.

(I'm too lazy to download and read pdfs)

It hasn't progressed, we're still waiting for the first alpha of Firefight, and another update of Warpath to see what they do about hubs - so far it sounds like hubs is being shunted to the back of the book for people who don't want to multibase, while the main rules will encourage unit stands ala Dropzone Commander infantry. I'd also stake money on Warpath switching to the KoW abstract LoS system, but getting Firefight away from TLoS will probably be another battle entirely.

I can live with TLOS in Firefight, I think, if it's about individual models. Where it breaks down for me is when the whole squad can be wiped out because one guy's elbow can be seen around a corner. Like what happens in 40k from 5th onwards.

 NTRabbit wrote:
It hasn't progressed, we're still waiting for the first alpha of Firefight, and another update of Warpath to see what they do about hubs - so far it sounds like hubs is being shunted to the back of the book for people who don't want to multibase, while the main rules will encourage unit stands ala Dropzone Commander infantry. I'd also stake money on Warpath switching to the KoW abstract LoS system, but getting Firefight away from TLoS will probably be another battle entirely.

WP is abstract LoS....?

Yes, the plan is to put hubs into an appendix for people without stands now and the main rules will be on the basis of collective basing.

Wait... collective basing and TLOS?
Just to confirm, is that what the mass-combat thing is going to look like? That sounds terrible if it's true.

Just read the alpha rules guys. Warpath is more or less an abstract line of sight like Kings of war.

I'd bet that mid-campaign, they'll release a beta set of rules that are a significant step forward.

Schmapdi wrote:

 MLaw wrote:

 Tamereth wrote:
Somebody wake me up when the warpath Kickstarter begins, this is just all Deadzone stuff.

Seriously I thought the kings of war 2 Kickstarter was light on new models but this is ridiculous.

Yeah.. I'm fully in this camp now. They say they want to flesh out whatever.. but lead with existing stuff and a couple of characters/vehicles.. Then go on to talk about how they aren't going to be releasing stuff for some factions? I'm rolling my eyes for those of you who can't see. I was pretty excited for this to be honest but man, they're pulling a Mantic.

I'm glad to see "pulling a Mantic" is still a thing. And I have little interest in Warpath to begin with - but looking through their offerings it does seem a little disappointing. I'd think properly launching Warpath would be a BIG priority and would entail Mantic looking to release a few hard plastic kits per army in a big multi-million dollar kickstarter.

This, in contrast seems pretty low-key and half-hearted.

What they should do is a series of $5000 stretch goals to produce restic models

Which everyone loved

We all love restic, right guys

Lots and lots of restic

 judgedoug wrote:


What they should do is a series of $5000 stretch goals to produce restic models

Which everyone loved

We all love restic, right guys

Lots and lots of restic

I'm holding out on pledging until they announce a hybrid restic metal version of the vehicles at full retail as an add on.

 warboss wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:


What they should do is a series of $5000 stretch goals to produce restic models

Which everyone loved

We all love restic, right guys

Lots and lots of restic

I'm holding out on pledging until they announce a hybrid restic metal version of the vehicles at full retail as an add on.

Don't forget a badly cast resin add on component

(I'm looking at you, Marauder Bull Quad)
restic, resin, and metal
best kit ever
EVER

 judgedoug wrote:


Don't forget a badly cast resin add on component

That's like adding sour in front of the word lemon; it's redundant. When you say restic or finecast, it's assumed.

Hey, I'd happily take some super cheap restic stuff!

Nevermind the naysayers. If it ended up at comparable quality of the DBX stuff, fine by me.

I'm (shoddily) painting shooty spaceman toys. I'm not attempting to put together a Golden Demon/ Crystal Brush winner.

Yeah, it would be nice of Mantic had some shiny to show off for this one to lure people in. The two vehicles are nice, but should have been a part of it from the start. The initial funding goal should have included at least one new plastic infantry kit and one vehicle for each faction, even if that meant a $200k stating goal.

I'm in anyway, because I want a Forge Fathers army and don't already have one. But there's not much here so far beyond new rulebooks for those who already have armies.

Don't get me wrong, it's still a good deal for the money, but to be the big launch for their 40K alternative, there just isn't enough shiny at the moment.

On the other hand, maybe they know something we don't: that the new Warpath rules will be published just in time for GW to AoSify 40K. They had that same near-perfect timing with KoW...

I'm in for now, the 4 flyers and a rulebook for £80 is a very nice buy in point to complement my bits and bobs from the last deadzone kickstarter. Really really hoping we can start getting into the meat of this kickstarter soon as I really want to see what they have to offer for the other races.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I can live with TLOS in Firefight, I think, if it's about individual models. Where it breaks down for me is when the whole squad can be wiped out because one guy's elbow can be seen around a corner. Like what happens in 40k from 5th onwards.

40k also uses TLOS on an individual basis. Can't kill what you can't see!