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Hi everyone,

I am currently working on a project writing a set of rules for the battlestar galactica universe. I'm in the very early stages of the rules writing and I am curious to know what dice people would prefer to use in a game system.

I am currently wiring the rules to work around d10's as I feel it'd give more flexibility per die roll needed in the game. However I'm not sure if using d10's would make the game more difficult to play or it would be simply easier to write the game system to use to use D6's?

So if you answer the poll please post your reasons


Thanks for your time,
Wolf

D6s are easy to come by, D10s are good if you need more precision, especially if you sometimes need to go up to either D100 or D66. Unless you want D8s for their utility with grids (4 sides + 4 diagonals = 8 results), I'd stick to one of those two.

Depends how many dice you're going to be rolling. If you only have a few dice rolls, then more sides is better.

If you're going to be like 40k where you roll dice by the handful, I think D6 is better. D6 are faster when you roll 10+ dice, they are quicker to count (because they are cubes you don't have to count 18 dice individually, you just arrange them 3x6) then it's quicker just to sweep away the failures/successes ready to be rolled again. If 40k were based on D10 or D12 like some people want, games would take significantly longer. They're also easier to obtain cheaply which is useful when you need 50 of the buggers.

But it's not so much a problem when you're only rolling a few dice at a time.

You're going at this one arse about face imo.
Pick the job that you need to do first, the dice will follow shortly.
What, if anything, do you need to randomise?

As said, it depends on what you want. If you'll be throwing buckets full of dice then D6 is the way to go; most gamers already have loads, they are easy to count and roll en masse, the results have a nice curve to them that is easy to implement into mechanics (no reason why you couldn't do the same with D10s, but people are more familiar with the probabilities on a 2d6 than 2D10)

D10, on the other hand, gives you more precision and detail, potential to implement %-based systems which could be useful in a space combat game for things like power distribution, shields, weapon efficiency, damage and such and are probably better if you want a more complex system.

The other thing to consider is that there's no law saying you have to stick to just 1 type. There's no need to go full-DnD and have everything from D4s to D20s, but it does give you some options. Pulp Alley, as an example, always uses the same mechanics, but weaker models have a 'smaller' dice to roll, so you can instantly set up differences in power. To translate this into space combat terms, a ship might have a Defence that requires a 6+ to beat; a snub fighter might only roll a D6 against that, and thus have small chance to damage, while a similarly large ship might roll a D10. If you're using truly massive ordnance, you could do the same roll on a D12 or D20.

Hope that's of some help. I'm not overly familiar with BSG, but I have done a fair bit of rules design over the years, so if you want me to take a look at whatever you come up with then let me know.

What product do you want to deliver? box product, or print and play?

For the first dice do not matter since you provide them for the second there is a big discussion, what is your target audience?

Seasoned gamers probably have or can have access to any dice, novice do not, but I can argue that novice or starters would not be your target audience.

From your options D6 are the most common dice everybody has them and it was the driving force why 40k is with D6 and not with D10 for example as Rick Priestly wanted.

D6 have an awful distribution but, 2D6 produce a bell curve that makes things quite predictable.

D10 is a dice that allows stats to be easily understood with percentages, it saves a lot in stats calculation and predictability (D20 allows more flexibility, but it more is not always better).

I have not studied D12 a lot seems to be a "forgotten" dice mainly because 2D6 are better for the job.

Now the decision of randomizers is a crucial and fundamental part of designing a system and will carry over to the rest of the system do not make decisions over what people want but what you want what suits you better or are better familiar with (or want to experiment) ultimately, if your design is sound and has something eye catching people will come regardless of randomizers used.

So design ahead.

2d6.

The big weakness of 2D6 is that it sucks for batch rolling. If one fighter rolls 1D6 then five fighters can roll 5D6 without any trouble, but if one fighter rolls 2D6 you cannot just grab ten dice and roll them all at once without changing the mathematics.

Indeed, then again I do not like batch rolling mechanic.

Squads can be represented with modifiers, stat increases or rerolls, I do not like the intermediate approach were a squad is an entity comprised of individuals.

1d2. Know No Limits!

Thanks for your replies guys everything you have said is certainly getting me thinking more into the details of the system I am writing however it is still very early days,

 Paradigm wrote:
As said, it depends on what you want. If you'll be throwing buckets full of dice then D6 is the way to go; most gamers already have loads, they are easy to count and roll en masse, the results have a nice curve to them that is easy to implement into mechanics (no reason why you couldn't do the same with D10s, but people are more familiar with the probabilities on a 2d6 than 2D10)

D10, on the other hand, gives you more precision and detail, potential to implement %-based systems which could be useful in a space combat game for things like power distribution, shields, weapon efficiency, damage and such and are probably better if you want a more complex system.

The other thing to consider is that there's no law saying you have to stick to just 1 type. There's no need to go full-DnD and have everything from D4s to D20s, but it does give you some options. Pulp Alley, as an example, always uses the same mechanics, but weaker models have a 'smaller' dice to roll, so you can instantly set up differences in power. To translate this into space combat terms, a ship might have a Defence that requires a 6+ to beat; a snub fighter might only roll a D6 against that, and thus have small chance to damage, while a similarly large ship might roll a D10. If you're using truly massive ordnance, you could do the same roll on a D12 or D20.

Hope that's of some help. I'm not overly familiar with BSG, but I have done a fair bit of rules design over the years, so if you want me to take a look at whatever you come up with then let me know.

That is quite an interesting idea using different die for certain units showing their strength or their lack of it against larger heavier ships. Thinking of what I have written so far that could actually work really well in terms of fighters coming up against Larger ships, and larger ships shooting onto smaller frigates or the likes. Certainly given me a lot to ponder there and your offer for help is greatly appreciated once I have them typed out on the computer I will give you a shout for sure

 PsychoticStorm wrote:
What product do you want to deliver? box product, or print and play?

For the first dice do not matter since you provide them for the second there is a big discussion, what is your target audience?

Really it's only going to be a print and play set of rules unless it really kicked off into something big then I would tackle that whenever
My target audience will most liekly be people who are interested in the game from noive to veterans, people who have atleast a small understanding of tabeltop wargames. That been said I am trying to design them and not makem overly complicated like BattleFleet Gothic for example.

Again thanks for you input guys, you will probably find I will be putting up a thread in the future with the WIP rules to get feedback and thoughts on what I have done.

A space combat game I play (namely Star Fleet Battles) uses d6s for everything and they work just fine. If you want more detail, use d10s (as they can also be used for d100). Of course, if you want d100, you could use one of those ball dice designed by Lou Zocchi!

Off topic: I love your avatar! Mr. Bean is hilarious!

Just another question I have while I think of it, what would you class as batch rolling? Would say 6 dice be too many for a d10 or just at the limit of too many ?

Cheers
Wolf.

Half a dozen seems fine. Infinity goes about as high as 5 D20 and that's not considered to be a game with a ton of rolling.

When it comes to numbers, though, the most important consideration is whether you need that many. If you do because of some mechanic that won't work any other way, then fine, but the novelty throwing in tons of dice just for the sake of it wears off fast. The more dice you're throwing, the more random something is, which is fine in some cases but if you want to be precise about something then fewer dice is generally better.

From my experience, D10 is the way to go if you want a flexible but not too complicated system. D10 makes it really easy to work with percentages, and that's a blessing for both game designers and players.

If you want custom dice got for D6s as it's massively cheaper to get them printed than it is to do any other size (and there are far more places that offer the service)

If you want a more nuanced game I'd go for d10s, it give you more spread on your rolls and more flexibility for bonuses etc in your game mechanic

as to how many dice, now more than an easy handful for an adult with small hands per roll 5 to 10 say (and preferably less if possible).


Any game where you have to scoop up a bucket (usually d6) in 2 hands and basically just drop them makes me annoyed.... Blob of 40 troops, 2 attacks each + leader with 4 attacks = 88 dice = Aaaaargh

(try and arrange either the mechanics and/or the number of attackers in the unit and/or the number of attacks given to each model to minimise this)

I am in the process of writing a (relatively small, simple) wargame ("KOG light"), and I am going with standard d6s because they are common.

 Wolf wrote:
Really it's only going to be a print and play set of rules unless it really kicked off into something big then I would tackle that whenever

My target audience will most liekly be people who are interested in the game from noive to veterans, people who have atleast a small understanding of tabeltop wargames. That been said I am trying to design them and not makem overly complicated like BattleFleet Gothic for example.

Again thanks for you input guys, you will probably find I will be putting up a thread in the future with the WIP rules to get feedback and thoughts on what I have done.

Print & play means that you're looking at 1 set of Bicycle dice (5d6) -or- 1 set of D&D dice (d4 d6 d8 2d10 d12 d20). Needing several d10s is a no-go, as it's a very difficult set to buy, whereas the others are easy to get anywhere.

BFG is a great game, and it's actually very clean for a space battles game, although the Orders dice are problemat at this point. It is helpful that you call out BFG as above your maximum complexity level. It's good that you're keeping focused.

Quite frankly, if you are doing BSG, your best bet could be to adapt X-wing. It has a lot of players, and the core mechanics are well-understood. Steal their dice and templates from a starter set.

Had an idea a while back, take a d12, put a green dot over the '11' and a red one over the '12' (or symbols etc, dots are easy)

Roll like a d10, except you now have a face for 'success' and one for 'failure'.

Can have +/- modifiers easily now and keep away from 'a one is always a miss' and the discussion on if that's a natural or modified 'one'

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Needing several d10s is a no-go, as it's a very difficult set to buy, whereas the others are easy to get anywhere.

Whut?

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Needing several d10s is a no-go, as it's a very difficult set to buy, whereas the others are easy to get anywhere.

White Wolf RPGs used D10 dice pools for their mechanics, so after D6s they are probably the easiest dice to get in bulk.

I don't know if I'd even put them as low as that.

http://www.em4miniatures.com/acatalog/POLYDICE_BAGGED.html
https://www.thediceshoponline.com/dice-sets/41/-Dice-Dice-Sets

After clicking 'by sides' and 'd10', the Dice Shop wrote:There are 728 products in this category

Or I can walk into the Forbidden Planet branch I regularly visit and pick up a fistful of d10s from a box on the counter. Used to be able to do that at a model shop too, tho I haven't checked it in a while. A historical, scale model, tangentially-related-to-gaming-let-alone-RPGs shop.

I've been buying multiples of polydice from EM4, from d4s to d20s, for Mayhem, because the dice mechanic grabs me. Heck, I almost felt complete as a gamer when I took possession of my first d20. If Wolf's rules are half as good (no reason why not, and more), a couple of packs of d10s would be nothing. An investment, at the very least.
I know d6s are more familiar, probably because you get them in Ludo or Monopoly, or for lame reasons like 'that's all GW sells!' and 'that's what 40K uses! And lots of 'em!' But, c'mon.

My comment was simply tied to the ease for having the tools available to play the game.

In terms of gaming supplies, packs of ordinary d6s are available at Target, with the playing cards. They're packed in most poker sets for reasons I don't understand.

DnD polyhedrals are pretty well known, and there are starters with such dice at Barnes & Noble.

White Wolf is a tiny niche, and it's not as reasonable to expect someone to know of them.

If you're only only one or two dice at a time, I say go for d10's. If you are looking at severeal dice per roll, d6's are going to be more managable to play with.

If it's only 1 die, he could go with a d20, readily available as a "spindown" life tracker for Magic : the Gathering.

There are sets of ten D10 dice for like 3€ on eBay. And less. Free shipping all over the world as far as I'm concerned.