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 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight, and is a total Shadowsun fan, you can say the Mont'ka formations have me on board. I just love everything about them.

If I were to run a Tau army, if given the choice between Shadowsun and Farsight, I am totally going Char Clone on this one. Would totally do everything up in Zeon colors too. Because it would be awesome. Given that if I start a new army any time soon, Tau are going to be it, this may end up actually happening.

Crisis Suits in Zaku Green
Crisis Body Guards in Gouf Blue
Broadside Suits in Dom Purple
Riptides in Gelgoog Grey and Green

...*looks at checking account, sees money* NO, BE STRONG!

I have no idea what that is, but when I googled Zeon it showed Nazi propaganda style Asuka, which is something I recognize as I liked Evangelion, so it's all good.

I did my Tau in Yellow originally and then while playing Boarderlands: The Presequal Handsome Jack mentions that he wants to make things yellow because it really makes his mechs pop to the eye, and I was like "Yup, I'm Hyperion Tau now" since his whole shtick was that he believed he was truly the hero.

Edit: Handsome Jack Trailer:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight

I thought people not liking Farsight was only a myth.

 Tinkrr wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight, and is a total Shadowsun fan, you can say the Mont'ka formations have me on board. I just love everything about them.

If I were to run a Tau army, if given the choice between Shadowsun and Farsight, I am totally going Char Clone on this one. Would totally do everything up in Zeon colors too. Because it would be awesome. Given that if I start a new army any time soon, Tau are going to be it, this may end up actually happening.

Crisis Suits in Zaku Green
Crisis Body Guards in Gouf Blue
Broadside Suits in Dom Purple
Riptides in Gelgoog Grey and Green

...*looks at checking account, sees money* NO, BE STRONG!

I have no idea what that is, but when I googled Zeon it showed Nazi propaganda style Asuka, which is something I recognize as I liked Evangelion, so it's all good.

I did my Tau in Yellow originally and then while playing Boarderlands: The Presequal Handsome Jack mentions that he wants to make things yellow because it really makes his mechs pop to the eye, and I was like "Yup, I'm Hyperion Tau now" since his whole shtick was that he believed he was truly the hero.

Zeon is the antagonist from the Gundam series. One of the main guys encountered is Char Aznable, a character that uses a custom red Zaku suit that is a faster version of the grunt suit (which are colored green). His signature color is red. His fighting style is even similar to Farsight's (rumor has it that Farsight is based, at least in a small part, on Char).

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight, and is a total Shadowsun fan, you can say the Mont'ka formations have me on board. I just love everything about them.

If I were to run a Tau army, if given the choice between Shadowsun and Farsight, I am totally going Char Clone on this one. Would totally do everything up in Zeon colors too. Because it would be awesome. Given that if I start a new army any time soon, Tau are going to be it, this may end up actually happening.

Crisis Suits in Zaku Green
Crisis Body Guards in Gouf Blue
Broadside Suits in Dom Purple
Riptides in Gelgoog Grey and Green

...*looks at checking account, sees money* NO, BE STRONG!

I have no idea what that is, but when I googled Zeon it showed Nazi propaganda style Asuka, which is something I recognize as I liked Evangelion, so it's all good.

I did my Tau in Yellow originally and then while playing Boarderlands: The Presequal Handsome Jack mentions that he wants to make things yellow because it really makes his mechs pop to the eye, and I was like "Yup, I'm Hyperion Tau now" since his whole shtick was that he believed he was truly the hero.

Zeon is the antagonist from the Gundam series. One of the main guys encountered is Char Aznable, a character that uses a custom red Zaku suit that is a faster version of the grunt suit (which are colored green). His signature color is red. His fighting style is even similar to Farsight's (rumor has it that Farsight is based, at least in a small part, on Char).

The similarities in Char and Farsight are pretty strong. I would be surprised if he wasn't inspired.

Since All I have painted for my Tau so far are some pathfinders, SDTs, a Remora, and a Piranha, I am very tempted to completely re-convert my entire XV-8 force to being a Zeon inspired group. It would work well with the coloring I already have.



In addition, I'm working my old Broadsides to have both Rails mounted on the same shoulder, with a nice big targeting optic that goes in front of the suits "head", and a double plasma on one arm.

I really liked Zeon in old MSG. They, and really the Federation GM models too, had more of a grunt/IFV/"realistic" Starship Troopers feel. Which makes sense, it's what they were based on.

Since I have long held the belief that the Tau were more SST and less Neon Genisis Evangelion magic pew pew space super bot! I may just do this. Maybe make the bigger suits some kind of Mobile Armor, so a LOT of conversion there...

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight, and is a total Shadowsun fan, you can say the Mont'ka formations have me on board. I just love everything about them.

If I were to run a Tau army, if given the choice between Shadowsun and Farsight, I am totally going Char Clone on this one. Would totally do everything up in Zeon colors too. Because it would be awesome. Given that if I start a new army any time soon, Tau are going to be it, this may end up actually happening.

Crisis Suits in Zaku Green
Crisis Body Guards in Gouf Blue
Broadside Suits in Dom Purple
Riptides in Gelgoog Grey and Green

...*looks at checking account, sees money* NO, BE STRONG!

P.S. And since the Retaliation Cadre or whatever is now a Core Choice, I could run an all battle suit army! Decisions decisions.

My Tau for Kill-Team used to have the Titans color scheme

 Grimdark wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight, and is a total Shadowsun fan, you can say the Mont'ka formations have me on board. I just love everything about them.

If I were to run a Tau army, if given the choice between Shadowsun and Farsight, I am totally going Char Clone on this one. Would totally do everything up in Zeon colors too. Because it would be awesome. Given that if I start a new army any time soon, Tau are going to be it, this may end up actually happening.

Crisis Suits in Zaku Green
Crisis Body Guards in Gouf Blue
Broadside Suits in Dom Purple
Riptides in Gelgoog Grey and Green

...*looks at checking account, sees money* NO, BE STRONG!

P.S. And since the Retaliation Cadre or whatever is now a Core Choice, I could run an all battle suit army! Decisions decisions.

My Tau for Kill-Team used to have the Titans color scheme

Now that is pretty cool. The blue on black/dark blue would be a great color scheme to work with. The EFSF GM colors (Red and light mint green) would also make for a nice color scheme, IMO. I am really going Zeon colors due to Farsight being Char. Visually, the suits resemble Federation mobile suits much more. Though Farsight in the colors of the Gundam would be an abomination.

 Grimdark wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight, and is a total Shadowsun fan, you can say the Mont'ka formations have me on board. I just love everything about them.

If I were to run a Tau army, if given the choice between Shadowsun and Farsight, I am totally going Char Clone on this one. Would totally do everything up in Zeon colors too. Because it would be awesome. Given that if I start a new army any time soon, Tau are going to be it, this may end up actually happening.

Crisis Suits in Zaku Green
Crisis Body Guards in Gouf Blue
Broadside Suits in Dom Purple
Riptides in Gelgoog Grey and Green

...*looks at checking account, sees money* NO, BE STRONG!

P.S. And since the Retaliation Cadre or whatever is now a Core Choice, I could run an all battle suit army! Decisions decisions.

My Tau for Kill-Team used to have the Titans color scheme

Have you got any pictures? I would love to see this.

krazynadechukr wrote:Can the Sky Rays move to their maximum allowed distance and still fire all the missiles?

Yes, they can.

maceria wrote:

Have you got any pictures? I would love to see this.

Unfortunately not.

After the 2nd crisis team i got tired of painting dark blue on darker blue/black. It didn't help that the red and yellow detailing left me quite unsatisfied.

It looks good on paper, but not on the mini. I needed a better contrast between the 2 primary colors because I was losing too much detail.

Well, assuming there isn't some special rule or formation that we haven't seen yet, the Dawnblade contingent certainly seems a lot more toned down/nicer/weaker than the Hunter contingent. Coordinated Firepower is pretty much the source of all the complaints about new Tau being OP (from what I've seen/heard), and without it Tau are kinda back to their old place in 7th at the middle, maybe upper middle of the pack. The Killing Blow rule is good, rerolling to wound and to pen is always nice, but it is limited and in no way as powerful as the other Decurion rules we've seen thus far. The auxiliary formations are fairly toned down too from what I can see. Yeah the two Wing formations are pretty gross, but they aren't in either of the contingents from what we've seen, so can get the benefits of coordinated firepower or killing blow. I predict they'll show up in tournaments of course, and likely in more than just Tau armies, but its too early to tell that.

The interesting and tricky thing is how I'm going to build a Dawnblade list. Normally in a Decurion list, your core formation is the rock of your army, the base of it while the auxiliary formations are your hammer, your killers. Dawnblade kinda reverses that, at least with Retaliation. Your core formation is now the hammer, DSing that many battlesuits turn 2. Very powerful and scary beta strike. But that means that whatever auxiliary formations you take have to be able to hold the board and survive until the suits come in. So the question is, what do you take with the Retaliation Cadre? (Not gonna talk about the Hunter Cadre right now, as taking that basically means you're just taking a neutered Hunter Contingent. Besides, we play FSE for the suits).

The Drone network seems like an auto take for me. Arguably the best source of MLs Tau has ever had, in my eyes. 4 units of Marker Drones at BS3 that have Jink, Interceptor, and Split Fire? And the BS3 extends to every Drone in your army. Oh man I'm in love. 4 units of 5 Marker Drones is what I'm thinking atm. BS3 means that on average I get 10 MLs a turn (divided up amongst potentially 5 targets). On a perfect turn (all hit and all split fire tests passed) I get 4 MLs on 5 different units in one shooting phase. Plus they can intercept, which means that my Riptides and Broadsides now have ML support for intercepting, albeit at BS2. Still more than they had before. Plus with jinking, the Drones got a lot more survivable, unless my opponent has copious amounts of AP4 and ignore cover (funny enough, Tau basically). All that for 280 points? Sign me up.

But, 4 units of Drones cannot hold out for long against an entire army for a whole turn, and will not be able to control the board and still live long enough to provide ML support, so we need another auxiliary. Right now I'm thinking about the Sky Ray formation. Even if the formation rules are either pointless or situational, Sky Rays are by themselves awesome. 18 Seeker Missiles minimum on BS4 platforms is nothing to sneeze at. Plus networked MLs mean that they don't need to rely on the Drones for support, and can assist the Drones with supporting the suits once the Missiles are spent. Plus 13/12/10 tanks with a 3+ jink save and move through cover (my go to upgrades for all Tau vehicles) definitely will have the staying power the list needs.

What's the rest of dakka thinking here? How're you guys planning on building a Dawnblade with what we've seen so far? Critiques of my analysis/potential list?

Any thoughts IG formations? They look interesting, but as a non-IG player, I'm not sure how good they'll be.

 jreilly89 wrote:
Any thoughts IG formations? They look interesting, but as a non-IG player, I'm not sure how good they'll be.

Compared to the Taus powerful new units and good to OP formations? One is still a 7.5 codex and the other....isn't

How do Crisis Bodyguards work? Could Farsight just detach himself from them and join a Retaliation Cadre?

 Verviedi wrote:
How do Crisis Bodyguards work? Could Farsight just detach himself from them and join a Retaliation Cadre?

Bodyguards are just an elite choice now, if I'm not mistaken. Basically just a unit of Shas'vres instead of Shas'uis (maybe with their old special rules about look out sir? I honestly glanced over them since the extra 10ppm was a bit of a dealbreaker for me). Farsight could absolutely join a Retaliation Cadre, AFTER they have DSed or if they start on the board. The automatic arrival on turn 2 is formation only, Farsight cannot get it from joining them.

 GI_Redshirt wrote:

 Verviedi wrote:
How do Crisis Bodyguards work? Could Farsight just detach himself from them and join a Retaliation Cadre?

Bodyguards are just an elite choice now, if I'm not mistaken. Basically just a unit of Shas'vres instead of Shas'uis (maybe with their old special rules about look out sir? I honestly glanced over them since the extra 10ppm was a bit of a dealbreaker for me). Farsight could absolutely join a Retaliation Cadre, AFTER they have DSed or if they start on the board. The automatic arrival on turn 2 is formation only, Farsight cannot get it from joining them.

This last but tends to be up for debate. You make a reserve roll for the unit and not for the individual models. If you're told that the unit automatically arrives on turns 2, again, you have the unit arrive and not the individual models. While joined, an IC is a member of the unit "for all rules purposes". Some people will think that Farsight can join in Reserves and ride in alongside the unit. Others think that an attached IC is somehow taking on special rules from another Formation and would be considered cheating.

I tend to be in the first group. If I join Farsight to a unit in Reserves, and that unit can automatically come in one turn 2, then Farsight should be able to ride along since he's considered a member of the unit. Tends to depend on wording. Wording that references "units from this Formation" would include attached ICs from other Detachments. Wording that references "models from this Formation" would not.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
But... this is a discussion for YMDC. Just trying to clarify what many would perceive to be a false statement.

 jreilly89 wrote:
Any thoughts IG formations? They look interesting, but as a non-IG player, I'm not sure how good they'll be.

Mainly onerous model counts for mediocre buffs: take 100+ infantry, get a free order to fire some extra S3 lasguns. I predict armies that rely on T2 and no saves will be quick to call the IG content in Mont'ka OP

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight

I thought people not liking Farsight was only a myth.

Really?

Consider all the gak the Tau Empire gets from a sizeable part of the community, who feel that the Empire's optimism, willingness to engage in diplomacy and apparent overall benevolence are completely at odds with the overall grimdark tone of the setting. Now imagine a character so noblebright he makes this faction look like a bunch of moustache-twirling saturday morning cartoon villains in the most black and white way possible. Farsight.

Others complain that the Tau are unfairly favoured in the fluff, seeing how they fight off a Tyranid Hive Fleet without taking a single casualty, and repeatedly worf IG regiments and, as of recently, space marine chapters. Now imagine writing a character that throughout his entire backstory makes numerous high-standing and accomplished members of this faction look like a bunch of conniving morons and mouth-breathing incompetents, by just simply being the 1337est guy that ever lived? Immortal Mary Sue Gundam Samurai Farsight.

 GI_Redshirt wrote:
Well, assuming there isn't some special rule or formation that we haven't seen yet, the Dawnblade contingent certainly seems a lot more toned down/nicer/weaker than the Hunter contingent. Coordinated Firepower is pretty much the source of all the complaints about new Tau being OP (from what I've seen/heard), and without it Tau are kinda back to their old place in 7th at the middle, maybe upper middle of the pack. The Killing Blow rule is good, rerolling to wound and to pen is always nice, but it is limited and in no way as powerful as the other Decurion rules we've seen thus far. The auxiliary formations are fairly toned down too from what I can see. Yeah the two Wing formations are pretty gross, but they aren't in either of the contingents from what we've seen, so can get the benefits of coordinated firepower or killing blow. I predict they'll show up in tournaments of course, and likely in more than just Tau armies, but its too early to tell that.

.........

What's the rest of dakka thinking here? How're you guys planning on building a Dawnblade with what we've seen so far? Critiques of my analysis/potential list?

So I have been working on putting together a list as well. After trying out the Hunter Contingent, I just do not want to field so many foot soldiers... I like you, love my suits!

One formation that stands out to me in the auxiliaries is the Range support Cadre (i think thats what it is called? 3 broads, 3 pathfinders). This formation is so strong for one reason alone. SHROUDED pathfinders! Aside from that prettty much amazing perk, the 3 broadsides get double markerlight uses on these targets. That can really help out. In my mind, I view this as a perfect way to field 3 solo railsides in a list. They are low threat, tanky enough to survive fire, yet can be a nuisance if not taken care of.

Lets look at an example. Guy rolls up in his Imperial Knight.. or even a Wraithknight. Start of your turn. Killing blow confirmed. Throw markers his way. lets say you get 6 marker hits. That is enough to give bs5 + ignore cover to all 3 broadsides. Which thanks to killing blow, has reroll wounds and pens. Maybe you paid +8 for that seeker missle too. (lets say you did).. 6 s8 shots at 60" range ... yes please. that should be plenty to take out an Imperial Knight, even severely wound a Wraithknight.

As for any other transports or lower hp vehicles, you can pretty much guarantee a takedown. This Aux I have at around 400 with minor upgrades in the squads. Not bad for solid backbone.

The drone network is good.. but its expensive over normal pathfinders... relentless and assault jumps definitely make you mobile though.. and interceptor markerlights is .. drool worthy.

Another Aux I really like is the 3 strike fighter formation. d3 free markerlights, no reserve rolls, and +1 BS against any flyer/skimmer/FMC is pretty amazing. Guarantees your taking down enemy flyers and putting some serious hurt on a lot of xenos lists.


On a completely different note... you can be that guy.. run the Retaliation Force as a dawn Blade contingent with a strike fighter (i think that's the cheapest auxiliary), and Run a standalone Optimized Stealth Cadre to be your Rock. =)

Grizzyzz wrote:

 GI_Redshirt wrote:
Well, assuming there isn't some special rule or formation that we haven't seen yet, the Dawnblade contingent certainly seems a lot more toned down/nicer/weaker than the Hunter contingent. Coordinated Firepower is pretty much the source of all the complaints about new Tau being OP (from what I've seen/heard), and without it Tau are kinda back to their old place in 7th at the middle, maybe upper middle of the pack. The Killing Blow rule is good, rerolling to wound and to pen is always nice, but it is limited and in no way as powerful as the other Decurion rules we've seen thus far. The auxiliary formations are fairly toned down too from what I can see. Yeah the two Wing formations are pretty gross, but they aren't in either of the contingents from what we've seen, so can get the benefits of coordinated firepower or killing blow. I predict they'll show up in tournaments of course, and likely in more than just Tau armies, but its too early to tell that.

.........

What's the rest of dakka thinking here? How're you guys planning on building a Dawnblade with what we've seen so far? Critiques of my analysis/potential list?

So I have been working on putting together a list as well. After trying out the Hunter Contingent, I just do not want to field so many foot soldiers... I like you, love my suits!

One formation that stands out to me in the auxiliaries is the Range support Cadre (i think thats what it is called? 3 broads, 3 pathfinders). This formation is so strong for one reason alone. SHROUDED pathfinders! Aside from that prettty much amazing perk, the 3 broadsides get double markerlight uses on these targets. That can really help out. In my mind, I view this as a perfect way to field 3 solo railsides in a list. They are low threat, tanky enough to survive fire, yet can be a nuisance if not taken care of.

Lets look at an example. Guy rolls up in his Imperial Knight.. or even a Wraithknight. Start of your turn. Killing blow confirmed. Throw markers his way. lets say you get 6 marker hits. That is enough to give bs5 + ignore cover to all 3 broadsides. Which thanks to killing blow, has reroll wounds and pens. Maybe you paid +8 for that seeker missle too. (lets say you did).. 6 s8 shots at 60" range ... yes please. that should be plenty to take out an Imperial Knight, even severely wound a Wraithknight.

Just a little note, missilesides are way still better against basically everything than railsides

Well, not 100% accurate.

Against T4 with at 4 wounds its equal, T4 with 3+ and at least 2 wounds the HRR wins, and 2+ in general the HRR wins.
Naturally, in the saves case-I'm assuming no cover/invul around.
A 2+ save backed by a 5+ cover/invul is in favor of HYMP, unless T4 with 2 wounds (or more)

Fringe as it gets, but the case exists. (seriously why is there no "rail" UST to make it good at tank hunting at least?!)

notredameguy10 wrote:
Just a little note, missilesides are way still better against basically everything than railsides

I agree, Misslesides are much more versatile. I am just afraid that without the range the rails have, running solo misslesides would be too threatening and thus be easy first blood kills.

My Core is going to have a solid squad of relentless misslesides though

 Commander_Avalanche wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Tinkrr wrote:
You know, as someone who doesn't like Farsight

I thought people not liking Farsight was only a myth.

Really?

Consider all the gak the Tau Empire gets from a sizeable part of the community, who feel that the Empire's optimism, willingness to engage in diplomacy and apparent overall benevolence are completely at odds with the overall grimdark tone of the setting. Now imagine a character so noblebright he makes this faction look like a bunch of moustache-twirling saturday morning cartoon villains in the most black and white way possible. Farsight.

Others complain that the Tau are unfairly favoured in the fluff, seeing how they fight off a Tyranid Hive Fleet without taking a single casualty, and repeatedly worf IG regiments and, as of recently, space marine chapters. Now imagine writing a character that throughout his entire backstory makes numerous high-standing and accomplished members of this faction look like a bunch of conniving morons and mouth-breathing incompetents, by just simply being the 1337est guy that ever lived? Immortal Mary Sue Gundam Samurai Farsight.

The Tau Empire is only bright if you're just poking the surface with a nerf dart. In actuality it's more a dystopia ruled by Ethereal slave drivers who are biologically capable of forcing the lower classes to do whatever the Ethereals want. Mind control (Vespids), mass sterilization and concentration camps (DOW), and a rigid, brutal caste system that forbids interbreeding is rampant throughout the Empire. Children are taken from their parents and raised by the Ethereal-controlled governments. The so-called "ally" races are third-class citizens, after the second-class citizens of the Tau and the first-class of the Ethereals. Any world they encounter either willingly enters this slavery, or is brutally subjucated by their fellows, the higher-class slaves of the Fire Caste.
And Farsight was ballsy enough to throw off his conditioning and found his own realm without Castes. He stood up for what he truly believed in, instead of submitting to the cancer of the Ethereals. He is immortal because he killed so many enemies in defense of this realm, a complete utopia by 40k standards. Not in ruthless expansion, but in pure defense. The Enclaves are not expanding. Farsight and his army defend them, because they believe that what they built is worth the constant war and bloodshed.
And that is why Farsight is a badass.

A question I do have, has anyone seen/heard/suspect, that the Mont'ka book will contain FSE relics and special rules from the supplement?

Will tau relics not be available to the dawn blade contingent?

 Grizzyzz wrote:
A question I do have, has anyone seen/heard/suspect, that the Mont'ka book will contain FSE relics and special rules from the supplement?

Will tau relics not be available to the dawn blade contingent?

Im pretty sure I saw pics that showed all FSE relic are usable in Mont'ka, which means the normal relics are not usable.

notredameguy10 wrote:
Im pretty sure I saw pics that showed all FSE relic are usable in Mont'ka, which means the normal relics are not usable.

Well, hopefully they were tweaked some (bringing the prices down), sadly I doubt this was the case. Oh well, warscaper drone is more than worth it, especially with a squad of deep-striking broads!

 Grizzyzz wrote:
A question I do have, has anyone seen/heard/suspect, that the Mont'ka book will contain FSE relics and special rules from the supplement?

Will tau relics not be available to the dawn blade contingent?

The FSE supplement already existed, the Mont'ka just updates it. it will probably have exactly the same relics as the supplement (even same costs)

The Dawn Blade contingent is FSE only. meaning, you can never fit tau empire relics in it.

Not that its a problem, they empire relics are far superior in hunter contingent where you can coordinate firepower.




And at what world is warscrapper drone worth it? none of the FSE relics bar the ECPA, and MAYBE the talisman were worth a damn, (talisman too, despite being good, has nobody that's good to wear it, with commanders being mere T4Sv3+)

 BoomWolf wrote:

 Grizzyzz wrote:
A question I do have, has anyone seen/heard/suspect, that the Mont'ka book will contain FSE relics and special rules from the supplement?

Will tau relics not be available to the dawn blade contingent?

The FSE supplement already existed, the Mont'ka just updates it. it will probably have exactly the same relics as the supplement (even same costs)

The Dawn Blade contingent is FSE only. meaning, you can never fit tau empire relics in it.

Not that its a problem, they empire relics are far superior in hunter contingent where you can coordinate firepower.

And at what world is warscrapper drone worth it? none of the FSE relics bar the ECPA, and MAYBE the talisman were worth a damn, (talisman too, despite being good, has nobody that's good to wear it, with commanders being mere T4Sv3+)

Except how I so want Earth Caste Pilot Array on a riptide and a talisman of moloch on my commander in my Hunter Contingent lol

Attach a drone controller commander with Warscaper to a unit of HYMP Broadsides with Missile Drones.

Laugh and laugh and laugh.

 BoomWolf wrote:
And at what world is warscrapper drone worth it? none of the FSE relics bar the ECPA, and MAYBE the talisman were worth a damn, (talisman too, despite being good, has nobody that's good to wear it, with commanders being mere T4Sv3+)

Warscaper drone grants outflank, acute senses, and move through cover, The dangerous bubble is meh. Previously, move through cover alone with a squad of crisis suits was awesome, allowing you to jump around freely with no dangerous tests. I know some very successful lists, that used the outflank/acute senses rule to flank a squad of broadsides behind enemy lines as well (now made better by the retaliation rules).

ECPA is the best hands down, no discussion needed. Everything else is really cool but doesn't translate well to the table (I am agreeing with you here on this =) )

A side note I wanted to add... The talisman has saved a riptide or two for me being within the 4+ deny bubble, but I find that you never have enough dice anyway (unless running eldar/harlequin or other allies). What I have done, is bought the talisman for a free slot 5++, allowing me to freely take another hard point option (rather then take up a slot for a shield generator)

 Verviedi wrote:

The Tau Empire is only bright if you're just poking the surface with a nerf dart. In actuality it's more a dystopia ruled by Ethereal slave drivers who are biologically capable of forcing the lower classes to do whatever the Ethereals want. Mind control (Vespids), mass sterilization and concentration camps (DOW), and a rigid, brutal caste system that forbids interbreeding is rampant throughout the Empire. Children are taken from their parents and raised by the Ethereal-controlled governments. The so-called "ally" races are third-class citizens, after the second-class citizens of the Tau and the first-class of the Ethereals. Any world they encounter either willingly enters this slavery, or is brutally subjucated by their fellows, the higher-class slaves of the Fire Caste.
And Farsight was ballsy enough to throw off his conditioning and found his own realm without Castes. He stood up for what he truly believed in, instead of submitting to the cancer of the Ethereals. He is immortal because he killed so many enemies in defense of this realm, a complete utopia by 40k standards. Not in ruthless expansion, but in pure defense. The Enclaves are not expanding. Farsight and his army defend them, because they believe that what they built is worth the constant war and bloodshed.
And that is why Farsight is a badass.

Aaaand this is exactly what I'm talking about.

I'm really not going into a fluff discussion (as this thread isn't the place for it), but from a meta perspective, the most interesting thing to me about the Tau was their moral ambiguity. The Greater Good as a concept is potentially quite terrifying, as it champions the good of the collective over the good of the individual, which may permit great evils to be done, as long as the ends justify them. Other aspects of the Greater Good, such as the unity of all intelligent species, made for an interesting philosophical underpinning for the Tau, and made them very distinct from the other Warhammer factions. Another fascinating feature of the Tau was the optimism and fanatical zeal with which they championed this ideal, working together to achieve the goals of their society. The Ethereals, though certainly mysterious and unsettling, being the undisputed philosopher kings of the empire, were evidently effective statesmen and leaders, turning a primitive species on the edge of self-inflicted extinction into one of the most technologically advanced empires in the galaxy. Governing through a sort of confucianism mixed with utilitarianism, they were presented as wise rulers who were concerned with the well-being of their subjects, but who were also prepared to make great sacrifices with seeming ease if the good outweighed the bad.

This is what makes the new Farsight fluff such a travesty. Tau society is transformed into Orwell's 1984 as interpreted by a 14-year old. The Greater Good, the religio-philosophical ideals that millions of Tau and others had died for and was the raison d'etre of the entire faction? It's just a hollow ruse by the Ethereals. And the Tau don't really believe it anyway. they're just being mind-controlled by the Ethereals (with pheromones? really?). The Ethereals? Saturday morning cartoon villains, who care nothing for their subjects. AND they've been keeping chaos a secret from their subjects, despite Tau having almost no warp presence! Whereas the Emperor kept it secret because of humanity's vulnerabilities to Chaos, the Ethereals do it because it would ruin the con they've got going on. AND they're pretty incompetent, their insidious mind-control powers apparently not being able to keep any new Earth Caste blueprints from falling into the hands of the defectors. This is in addition to a lot of other utter gak, such as PENs making commanders completely useless at dealing with psykers, since Puretide never encountered them. Nevermind that the Tau have warp sensitive species (Nicassar) serving as military auxilaries. Ugh.