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So I'm not sure if this has been done before, but seeing as there's been a thread recently about modern day earth vs the armies of 40k, it got me thinking.

How would earth of today react if an Imperial expedition from the great crusade showed up and proclaimed they were rescuing us from the dark ages by bringing us into the Emperor's light. That we were the long lost branch of humanity and that we were going to be part of one great and vast empire, whether we want to or not. Religions would be banned, we would all have to comply with how the Imperium wants the Earth run.

Would the Earth accept this? Would we fall in line or rebel? How hard would it be for the Imperium to get us to compliance?

I imagine many would comply, but most would not(many people base their entire lives upon religion, after all)

Given the disparate nature of the world's governments it would have a variety of responses. A good deal would resist, I don't see the USA bending the knee lightly nor Russia. It depends if the Imperium decides to appoint a local Imperial Governor or have one of their own take over instead. If its the former there would be a race amongst the current powers to see who would be placed as Imperial Governor, in terms of the latter there'll definitely be a breakdown in diplomacy concerning some of the hardline stuff regarding Imperial tithe and the Imperial Truth. There'll definitely be a lot of Imperial collaborators but I don't see humanity as a whole giving into compliance.

Earth (which is actually Terra after all) would be a crap assignment for any governor or bureaucrat... much like Palestine was for Roman Imperial Governors.

"Earthlings. Always revolting, insisting on their own customs. Riots and protests against this 2%... Don't they appreciate that their betters are entitled to the benefits of power and privelege to compensate for the heavy burden of rule? Resisting tithes, and perpetually lateand under target. That whole monotheism thing... If only we could get them to equate Yaweh/God/Allah with the God-Emperor! Even though many of their own religious customs parallel the Ecclesiarchy's teachings they cling to their own superstitious practices. Stubborn barbarians."

"Some days I wish the Inquisition would just declare a Writ of Exterminatus and have done with it. But the thrice-damned Administratum says their manpower and resources are too valuable to waste..." <heavy sigh>

Once the Ecclesiarchy rolled in, it would only be a matter of time before all major world religions had been subsumed into its Emperor-worshipping style (seriously ass-chapping the Catholics, who had been doing this exact same thing with native populations across the world for centuries).

Those that didn't get with the program would either keep their mouths shut or disappear... only to show up on the television as the target of a state-sanctioned witch-burning.

No they wouldn't for the simple fact that we're talking about the Great Crusade, when there was no such thing as the Ecclesiarchy.

It depends on who is in charge of the Compliance, I suppose. SOme might be happy with simply suppressing worship and teaching of religion, and instituting a Compliant education curriculum to teach future generations not to be religious. Others might be more pro-active, and line the worshippers in St Paul's up along Fleet Street and machine-gun them all.

 Grimskul wrote:
, I don't see the USA bending the knee lightly nor Russia. .

This.

The imprium will demand immediate compliance and as the majority of the planet know there are no more stubborn groups of people then the us and Russia. They will say comply and America will be like "excuse me? who do you think you are?" Russia would just launce nukes at ships in space if they said "comply". Either way someone would feth it up and cause exterminatus

The imprium will demand immediate compliance and as the majority of the planet know there are no more stubborn groups of people then the us and Russia. They will say comply and America will be like "excuse me? who do you think you are?" Russia would just launce nukes at ships in space if they said "comply". Either way someone would feth it up and cause exterminatus

Haha, that's sure. So many governments would be too blind. I guess the main world powers would try to resist, even ally and let their rivalries behind...until the very moment they will understand the true nature of the Imperium and lost some cities to orbital strikes.

Or... if Imperial representatives are persuasive enough, they could convince one nation to help them take over the world in exchange of perpetual governance on behalf of the Imperium. I really see a modern ruler accept such an offer just to capture power for the millenias to come. And that would not be the stupidest thing to do regarding how the Imperium bring resisting societies under its aegis.

That would totally be a funny scenario to imagine. So many things to think about...

Depends on who showed up.

If a detachment of Ultramarines showed up, they would use their magical mary sue power to diplomatically assimilate us. Everyone would be singing kumbaya to the Emperor by sundown.

If the World Eaters showed up, they would just murder everyone into compliance.

And it's not as though modern earth could offer anything more than token resistance against the initial invasion - worst case, they could just bombard us from space until we are defeated. Whether we could offer up a credible underground resistance afterwards is an open question. We have lots of examples from our own history of effective resistances against technologically superior invaders, and the resentment can last generations. The invading force will quickly move on after the conquest, and so it will be up to whatever garrison forces are left behind to fight the resistance. I'm sure there's a certain level of low-level resistance that the imperial governor would consider "manageable", and otherwise just ignore and get on with ruling earth.

Once it became obvious that we couldn't win, most would comply. In the face of interstellar travel, teleportation, psykers, and advanced weaponry, the planet wouldn't stand a chance. Our primitive weapons, even nukes would be hilariously ineffective.

That is, unless the imperium uses an old form of IOS and Jeff Goldblum has access to a laptop. then we could probably handle it.

Independence Day, ftw....

I could easily see the Imperium subsuming the world, so long as it leaves the nations in charge, but in more of a New World Order-esque sort with the UN having true power, with the Planetary Governor at its head (maintaining the semblence of a Global Republic). It's not outside the realm of possibility (they left Fenris a rock covered in squabbling tribes, after all). IoM would provide us with insane levels of medical technology, farming tech, etc. (as evidenced by Descent of Angels), and any Imperial Governor left behind might even end up being a local (maybe Putin, since he seems to be the strongest modern world leader, imho), which would likely allow for most countries to maintain their current form of government, even if it is just a puppet government.
And, if we don't like the current Imperial Governor, we could always just overthrow him and purport to be supporters of the Imperium (while paying tithes, of course).

This topic shows up here and there but y'know I'm sort of leaning towards the compliance of Earth being a possibility. Pro's and cons go!

Pro:
We get access to Imperial technology. Medicine, cybernetics, production and litterature.
Wealthy or lucky (or criminal) Citizens will be able to travel space and see the stars.
New forms of Entertainment. Holo videos, stimulants, litterature and so on.
Peace on Earth.
Imperial gothic will be our new language.
We get access to starports and Imperial trade. Including foodstuffs and living conveniences we can't even imagine. (This might quite possibly eliminate World hunger as we know it)

Con:
Every major Company that produces new technology will be made obsolete, throwing our economony in dissaray.
A new social elite of rouge traders and nobles will be established, probably giving zero frags about our history, Culture or heroes.
We'll be seeing Black ships
We'll be forced to deliver Imperial thithes.
Imperail gothic will be our new language.
People and or nations that do not comply will be sentenced to mass slaughter.

It's not like we'd have a choice. We couldn't stand up to the Imperium in a military manner. The only question is would theese pros be enough to bring us in peacefully or would we be forced into a war that would set us back a few hundred years?

Considering that there are worlds in the Imperium that starve, I don't think we'll be getting the cure to world hunger. On the other hand, we may see massive depopulation with those groups that resist the take-over, so perhaps it will work itself out.

Nerak wrote:

We'll be seeing Black ships

This is definitely a pro, no more Derek Acorah, Psychic Sally or Uri Gellar. Unless they become Inquisitors or something, that would definitely be a con.

I'm not sure how much the Imperium would take over, they would probably want to find out if there is anything we have that they can use to integrate to their technology. If we have any STCs or the like. But using Nuceria as an example, before the World Eaters and Word Bearers wiped the planet out, it still seemed to be using it's own levels of technology and left much to its own devices. They hadn't heard from the Imperium for a hundred years and were struggling with their own inter nation wars.

I guess in the early years it would be a big deal with massive intervention from the Imperium to ensure compliance.But after awhile, and so long as earth paid it's necessary tithes, things would go back to normal. So long as we didn't try to throw off the Imperial shackles, just with a different religion and higher levels of technology and maybe Hive cities?

It would come down to what the Imperium wants and what it offers.

I'm going to more assume it's a 40k assimilation than a 30k one, just because I gave up on the HH books a long time ago.

As others said, a savy Imperial rep could show up, talk about rejuvination drugs that let us live for centuries, limitless power through 'plasma reactors', interstellar trade etc. Then play down what the Imperium wants. Don't talk about a governer, talk about a senior Imperial Representative, don't talk about tithes of manpower, talk about exciting off world resettlement opportunities. Pay for whatever resources the Imperium wants with drugs, tech or gold. The 80s V miniseries has a great example of soft conquest.

Meanwhile have Imperial missionaries start schools, bureaucrats embed themselves in governments, scholars work into universities. Subvert our history and religion "obviously these religious figures were guided by the Emperor's psychic powers" and over the course of a century or two Earth could be brought in line.

Sure there'd be trouble with extremists, there'd be protests, bombings, assassinations, but those would be minor compared to a global conquest. In fact the Imperium might welcome them, since they would allow the Imperium to justify putting troops on Earth, maybe overthrowing some of the more troublesome governments.

Something no one's mentioned though are psykers. In the 40k universe psykers are growing and real threat and only the Imperium has the tools to train, contain or eliminate them. A few Akira type psykers tearing up cities or greater demon possessions might make the world eager and grateful to see Inquisitors and Black Ships.

A very savy Imperial official might make sure this happens and spend a decade or two engineering disasters which would make most Earthlings rush into the Emperor's arms.

The Imperium's great advantage is time. They have all the time they want to learn about our world and can reveal themselves when the circumstances are best

But what if slow and soft is not an option?

Maybe the Imperium needs the several million soldiers Earth can provide right, right, now. What if they need Earth to Imperialized as soon as possible to secure it against an oncoming Ork Waaaaagh or if the official in charge is just greedy, what then?

It depends on the definition of victory.

If they want everyone speaking Gothic, worshiping the Emperor and ratting out their neighbors to the Inquisition, then no. Not for decades, not for centuries. If they just want some bases, recruits for the IG and access to oil fields, they can probably do it by subverting/conquiring a large centralized state (Russia or China come to mind) and using it as their base while trying soft tactics for the rest of the world.

I think the USA, China and Russia would be pragmatic enough to understand that waging war against people who arrive in space ships with genetically modified super-humans, Titan war machines and the ability to destroy planets would be irrational, and probably try bargaining for a deal where they're still powerful, but under Imperial compliance.

South America, most of Africa and oriental Asia would also probably comply.

Large parts of the Islamic world would most likely resist the 30k Imperium's forced atheism, but would a bunch of Space Marines drop podding down onto the Kaaba break their morale or inspire world-wide insurgency?

Europe's leaders would complain too loudly about the Imperium's many violations of human rights They will get Comissar'd and Imperial propaganda will soon make the people comply.

Australians will be recruited en-masse as a specialist force shipped off to Murder to fight the Megarachnids.

Against a superior force rolling to earth in world destroying ships, the resistance would be limited to just a few radicals. Especially if it were other humans from across the starts, which I think would be more easily digested by the world today. Nation states would be dissolved pretty quickly.

... 30K Imperium wasn't an atheist state. There were cults worshipping the Emperor, billions strong, on Terra while he was walking around there.

 Psienesis wrote:
... 30K Imperium wasn't an atheist state. There were cults worshipping the Emperor, billions strong, on Terra while he was walking around there.

Well. There are scientologists in the US, but the US isn't a scientologist state.

We aren't an atheist state, either.

 Psienesis wrote:
We aren't an atheist state, either.

No but we are a secular one. The difference isn't that we don't deny the existence of a higher power, we just choose not to pick one specific flavor over the others.

Bringing it back to 40K, the GC-era Imperium was not an atheist state. The Emperor claimed he wasn't a god, but never stopped people from venerating him as one. The fallout between him and Lorgar was not, specifically, that Lorgar was worshipping him, but that he was spending way too much time building temples and such on the worlds the Word Bearers were sent to conquer. The Emperor needed a crusader to take large swaths of space, not waste time building churches and bringing worlds into compliance. *That* was the real point of contention, the temples and worshipping was just symptomatic. Lorgar could have been spending his time building atheist societies, the results would have been the same: he was taking too long in doing so.

riburn3 wrote:
Against a superior force rolling to earth in world destroying ships, the resistance would be limited to just a few radicals. Especially if it were other humans from across the starts, which I think would be more easily digested by the world today. Nation states would be dissolved pretty quickly.

I dunno. The last 15 years or so kind of show the opposite.

The US and NATO have a lot of firepower, including nuclear weapons, but have pretty completely failed to bring Iraq and Afghanistan into compliance.

One reason is our definition of victory (stable, democratic, friendly countries) is not something we can achieve through firepower. If our goal had been 'everyone dies' then yeah, sure.

So an Imperial official sent to secure out little backwater world would have something similar. They can nuke city after city but in so doing they'd be killing millions of potential Imperial subjects and devestating the biosphere that makes this world inhabitable. And even them you'd never eliminate the people looking to fight guerilla war.

If this was a planet full of orks, sure, but I think in this scenario the Imperium wants Earth and wants it relatively intact.

Historically it is possible to force countries into compliance through superior firepower, Japan at the end of WWII is the best example. But that required years of war, a strong unitary state and obedient population that would accept surrender, and a 10 year occupation. The Imperium might be able to force a country or two to surrender and accept the vast sweeping changes Imperial compliance requires, but all of Earth? Or even most of it?

Nah, they'd need a century or two and have to tread very lightly.

 Psienesis wrote:
Bringing it back to 40K, the GC-era Imperium was not an atheist state.

Descent of Angels, Fallen Angels, Fear to Tread, Mechanicum, Fulgrim, Horus Rising, False Gods, and Unremembered Empire beg to differ.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Psienesis wrote:
... 30K Imperium wasn't an atheist state. There were cults worshipping the Emperor, billions strong, on Terra while he was walking around there.

Yes, and they were all unofficial, and villified by the Emperor. In False Gods, being caught preaching from the Lectitio Divinitatus was tantamount to treason. In Descent of Angels, whne Zahariel suggests that the Emperor might be a God (while he's still a Supplicant) a Librarian almost has a seizure over it. The atheism is so extreme that, when Daemons start attacking for the first time, the Blood Angels are afraid to actually call them Daemons for fear of sounding religious (Fear to Tread)

 Psienesis wrote:
Bringing it back to 40K, the GC-era Imperium was not an atheist state. The Emperor claimed he wasn't a god, but never stopped people from venerating him as one. The fallout between him and Lorgar was not, specifically, that Lorgar was worshipping him, but that he was spending way too much time building temples and such on the worlds the Word Bearers were sent to conquer. The Emperor needed a crusader to take large swaths of space, not waste time building churches and bringing worlds into compliance. *That* was the real point of contention, the temples and worshipping was just symptomatic. Lorgar could have been spending his time building atheist societies, the results would have been the same: he was taking too long in doing so.

Nope, the Emperor actually went out of hist way to prevent his worship and outlawed it. His plan was to starve chaos and reform it. There's a great many instances in the HH books where it's specifically stated that the worship was outlawed, it was rarely enforced by the arbites however.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

riburn3 wrote:
Against a superior force rolling to earth in world destroying ships, the resistance would be limited to just a few radicals. Especially if it were other humans from across the starts, which I think would be more easily digested by the world today. Nation states would be dissolved pretty quickly.

I dunno. The last 15 years or so kind of show the opposite.

The US and NATO have a lot of firepower, including nuclear weapons, but have pretty completely failed to bring Iraq and Afghanistan into compliance.

One reason is our definition of victory (stable, democratic, friendly countries) is not something we can achieve through firepower. If our goal had been 'everyone dies' then yeah, sure.

So an Imperial official sent to secure out little backwater world would have something similar. They can nuke city after city but in so doing they'd be killing millions of potential Imperial subjects and devestating the biosphere that makes this world inhabitable. And even them you'd never eliminate the people looking to fight guerilla war.

If this was a planet full of orks, sure, but I think in this scenario the Imperium wants Earth and wants it relatively intact.

Historically it is possible to force countries into compliance through superior firepower, Japan at the end of WWII is the best example. But that required years of war, a strong unitary state and obedient population that would accept surrender, and a 10 year occupation. The Imperium might be able to force a country or two to surrender and accept the vast sweeping changes Imperial compliance requires, but all of Earth? Or even most of it?

Nah, they'd need a century or two and have to tread very lightly.

I don't think it's really possible to compare politics and history of today's world to a hypothetical imperial cruiser about to bring us into the imperial fold. It's impossible to measure the reaction of humans being told they're not alone in the universe and ALSO that "hey...you're just a lost segment of humanity". I can't imagine most rationale humans putting up a fight, and the irrational ones would be taken care of quickly.

 dusara217 wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Bringing it back to 40K, the GC-era Imperium was not an atheist state.

Descent of Angels, Fallen Angels, Fear to Tread, Mechanicum, Fulgrim, Horus Rising, False Gods, and Unremembered Empire beg to differ.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Psienesis wrote:
... 30K Imperium wasn't an atheist state. There were cults worshipping the Emperor, billions strong, on Terra while he was walking around there.

Yes, and they were all unofficial, and villified by the Emperor. In False Gods, being caught preaching from the Lectitio Divinitatus was tantamount to treason. In Descent of Angels, whne Zahariel suggests that the Emperor might be a God (while he's still a Supplicant) a Librarian almost has a seizure over it. The atheism is so extreme that, when Daemons start attacking for the first time, the Blood Angels are afraid to actually call them Daemons for fear of sounding religious (Fear to Tread)

I could not give less of a gak what the gak-level writing of the Horus Heresy series says.

 Psienesis wrote:

 dusara217 wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Bringing it back to 40K, the GC-era Imperium was not an atheist state.

Descent of Angels, Fallen Angels, Fear to Tread, Mechanicum, Fulgrim, Horus Rising, False Gods, and Unremembered Empire beg to differ.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Psienesis wrote:
... 30K Imperium wasn't an atheist state. There were cults worshipping the Emperor, billions strong, on Terra while he was walking around there.

Yes, and they were all unofficial, and villified by the Emperor. In False Gods, being caught preaching from the Lectitio Divinitatus was tantamount to treason. In Descent of Angels, whne Zahariel suggests that the Emperor might be a God (while he's still a Supplicant) a Librarian almost has a seizure over it. The atheism is so extreme that, when Daemons start attacking for the first time, the Blood Angels are afraid to actually call them Daemons for fear of sounding religious (Fear to Tread)

I could not give less of a gak what the gak-level writing of the Horus Heresy series says.

Ahhh the last argument of a desperate mind... "I don't like what this canon book says, so I will ignore it."

*sarcastic applause*

GrafWattenburg wrote:

South America, most of Africa and oriental Asia would also probably comply.

Africa wouldn't comply.
They don't even comply with their own governments.
Or basic human rights.
Outside of maybe 4 countries, but that's either fear of execution, or a populous drugged so hard Brave New World is telling them to calm down.

IG would be used as initial command structure to take over the planet, Planetary Governor established, Adeptus Arbites instilled, Architecture would be irrevocably altered. Congratulations Earth on your addition to the Imperium. All hail holy Terra.

What would be interesting is if Earth (our planet) was named after Terra post Iron Men.
As if the earth's history was just Terra stories told orally that we assumed applied to us.

Anybody with half a functioning brain would instantly realize that it's a good idea to immediately surrender when a fleet of ships each the size of a city is point a great deal of cannons at you that you have no way of defending yourself from. Even America and Russia should be intelligent enough to swallow their pride.

The only people I see refusing are those simply to dumb to live (ISIS) or too idealistic (again many middle eastern nations or warlords).