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Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws





Which Codex: Chaos Space Marine Unit is best for countering flyers? Winged Prince? Flakk Havocs? Heldrakes?

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Fireknife Shas'el





United States

I've heard good things about Lash Princes and the Wrath of Khorne Bloodthirster. The Heldrake is simply an excellent unit. Flakk Havocs could do the trick, but they can be expensive. It might be in your best interest to take some allies that have better AA, or bring in a fortification with a turret.
   
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Fire Raptors are nice.

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 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

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ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
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Tunneling Trygon






In the codex you have nothing worth dedicating. Best case, take some Autocannons on Havocs and swing for the fences. Atleast then you have a purpose to bring them to games without birds.

But outside of the codex, Fortifications have their merits. I prefer the Hell Blade though from IA:13. Nippy little bird with good guns for 115pts. The issue is that it takes up a very valuable FA slot, but you can make do with a Gorepack for Bikes and leave the CSM FA slots in the CAD just for actual flyers like twin Blades and a Drake. Khorne up the Bikes and run with it.

Another option if the Fire Raptor. Loyalist, Heretic, 30k, 40k, it has a lot of friggin firepower no matter what and would be worth the pickup.
   
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Unrelenting Rubric Terminator of Tzeentch





The heldrake will manage d3 str 7 AP2 ignores cover hits, and you're already taking at least 1. As others have mentioned, havoks with autocannons are passable considering that the meta has moved away from fliers and 8 autocannon shots for 115 points still has a use even without fliers. Obliterators can also do a decent job at AA, since they've got twin linked melta and plasma along with shear volume of fire in their assault cannons. Flak havoks are terrible for the points, I'd avoid them like the plague.

But yeah, gakky codex is gakky, and if you run into something like cron air, you're fairly boned.

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Hell Blade with Helstorm Autocannons upgrade is by far their best anti-air option. It is a flimsy fighter so take more than one for redundancy.
   
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 Intercessor wrote:
Hell Blade with Helstorm Autocannons upgrade is by far their best anti-air option. It is a flimsy fighter so take more than one for redundancy.


This thing is a beast. It also gets to re-roll 1s to wound/armor pen against a flyer/FMC you choose at the start of the game. And it has a special move before it moves, D6+2 in any direction. It can help a lot, as sometimes you can roll high, move straight back, then forward your 18" effectively only having to move 16-10 forward in a direction. Really awesome flier for the points. Not to mention it also gets an invul, but isn't a daemon.

   
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Bodt

I like using the Forgefiend for anti-air. With Daemonforge I once used it to take down a Caestus Assault Ram in a single turn.

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 dusara217 wrote:
Which Codex: Chaos Space Marine Unit is best for countering flyers? Winged Prince? Flakk Havocs? Heldrakes?

None of the units you listed actually work as anti-air from CSM codex.

If you want anti-air you'll have to go to FW and get a chaos fighter plane (like the Fire Raptor or Hell Blade)
   
Made in us
Furious Raptor




Heldrakes and Lash Princes make decent supporting AA. Havocs with Autocannons aren't great alone, but if you ally in some heralds (or run CSM:CS to get the Balestar) to get prescience you hit flyers about 30% of the time or about 2.5 hits on a flyer. It's a decent band aid.

Aegis with Quad Gun can go to anyone, and weirdly, bloodletters have BS 5, so put a cheap squad of letters on the Quadgun for and bury those birds in irony.

Fire Raptor has been mentioned cause it's great. Hell blades will die to 10 marines firing bolters inside rapid fire range 50% of the time. Thats a little thin for my taste.

Chaos Anti-Air battery
5 Havocs with 4 Autocannons
10 Bloodletters
Aegis with Quad Gun
Herald of Tz with Prescience.

360 pts. 8 snapshots with re roll to hit, 4 BS 5 skyfire shots, all at str 7, and everyone gets a 4++. You can take the Icarus cannon for the same points to get some str 9 in there if you think you need to.

EDIT: everyone can take a Firestorm thing. It's fortification with several independently firing Icarus Cannons, but I don't recall the points. 200-250 I think, but it may also be a cheaper option.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/12/14 19:45:42


 
   
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cod3x wrote:
Hell blades will die to 10 marines firing bolters inside rapid fire range 50% of the time. Thats a little thin for my taste.

No they don't. In that Scenario the SMs only have a 5% chance of dealing the 2 HPs needed to kill a Hell Blade. Heck its onlt 30% to deal any Hullpoints at all.
   
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Blood letters on a quad gun for the win lols!
   
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Fire Raptor, hands down. It can shoot three flyers every turn due to the turrets firing independently.


 
   
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On paper fire raptor. On tabletop Hell Blade.
   
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Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control




Southampton, New Jersey

Fire Raptors are so scary as a Tyranid players. It can shoot and reliable wound 4 Flyrants the turn it shoots its missiles (note: to reliably wound with the TL Heavy Stubbers you need the War of Murder upgrade for Monster Hunters).

I played against a Fire Raptor and it caused 4 of my Flyrants to take grounding checks and Tiggy casted Invisibility on it the following turn to protect it against return fire. You won't have Tiggy, but Sorcerers, Daemon Princes, etc, could roll it up.

Edit: I'm not sure how many point Hell Blades are, but Fire Raptors have 4 Hull points and are 225 pts base (+40 for War of Murder) with a slew of special rules. If you compare that to a SM Stormraven with 3 Hull points and 200 pts base, it's a steal. You're paying for transport capacity I'd imagine, but come on, that's not really the point of a stormraven.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/12/16 15:55:28


 
   
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 dusara217 wrote:
Which Codex: Chaos Space Marine Unit is best for countering flyers? Winged Prince? Flakk Havocs? Heldrakes?


Well D3 STR 7 hits on a flyer as you cruise by is pretty good. The Heldrake isn't better than an Aegis Defense line gun for anti-air, but given that you will certainly already have a Heldrake in a winning list, it does beg the question as to whether yet another Heldrake wouldn't be a better idea than 100 points spent on an Aegis Defense line gun.

I am quite enamoured with the Heldrakes. really good.

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Southampton, New Jersey

As an Imperial player, mostly, I think the Fire Raptor is amazing. For it's points, nothing really beats it imo. The Chaos Raptor is just as good and has additional rules IIRC. (I already posted why above)

I'm going to have to agree with Jancoran though. My friend I play with on a regular basis runs 2 Heldrakes and 3-4 oblits in his lists and consistently does well at major GTs. He hasn't won any yet but usually places top16 with a CSM/Daemons list with only 5-7 warp charges. It's far from min/max but he makes it work.
   
 
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