Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So what is the general philosophy on drop pod modeling. Is it ok to model the pod with the harnesses but use it for a dreadnought? No harnesses and infantry? I am building my first pods and want to make sure they are ok to run in any setting. I don't play in tournaments at the moment, but may in the future.

The harnesses have no gameplay value in and of themselves except to provide just a little more Cover opportunities for Vehicles being shot through the doorways.

If WYSIWYG is important to your group or a tournament, discuss it with them.

Most people I see glue them with the doors shut anyway.

I always was on the fence about what way to go with mine, because i find the doors flapping about rather annoying to deal with on the table. But I also feel that gluing them shut is technically MFA due to the blocking LOS. After 5 years of mucking about with them, I decided to just lose the doors altogether. Infantry pods get harnesses, Dreadnoughts do not. This is just my personal preference/opinion, of course.

 DW wrote:
But I also feel that gluing them shut is technically MFA due to the blocking LOS. .

It's not. The kit is designed so that the doors can open or close, but there is no actual requirement to have them open on the table. So whether you choose to leave them closed for whatever reason, or glue them shut, it really makes no difference.

For what it's worth I have mine with doors glued shut, but play with my group that line of sight can be drawn through with cover granted.

Charistoph wrote:
The harnesses have no gameplay value in and of themselves except to provide just a little more Cover opportunities for Vehicles being shot through the doorways.

If WYSIWYG is important to your group or a tournament, discuss it with them.

You absolutely do not need to discuss with a TO whether or not to include harnesses in your drop pod! It comes with the kit, you can build it with them. Easy.

The door issue might be a little more involved, although I would lean towards what insaniak posted - however you built it, that's how you use it. A tournament will have to have a plan for this anyway, since many people glue the doors shut - either they'll do like Mr. Shine's group does (say you can draw LOS through it like cover) or they'll say play it as it's built.

I think it's kind of crazy to be opening the panels of a nicely painted vehicle model and placing models on them, personally... especially when you'd need to do this for many models (full drop pod armies) every single game. So, you have to know how you'll treat a closed drop pod, since that's how many players will have theirs modeled.

 DW wrote:
I always was on the fence about what way to go with mine, because i find the doors flapping about rather annoying to deal with on the table. But I also feel that gluing them shut is technically MFA due to the blocking LOS. After 5 years of mucking about with them, I decided to just lose the doors altogether. Infantry pods get harnesses, Dreadnoughts do not. This is just my personal preference/opinion, of course.

The last time I saw a poll on the subject, most respondents on Dakka thought the pods should be played as though they were open, even when the doors are glued shut. I think one of the major tournament FAQs rules it this way too. (ETC? ITC? NOVA? I forget.)

In any event, no matter how your group plays it, you should be able to model them however you like. I don't use mine for dreads, and I left all the harnesses out, just because I thought they made the thing look rubbish.

You could leave two adjacent "fins" unglued, so that you could pull them off. That would leave you space to remove the inner harness piece, if you were inclined to do so. It can just rest in the slots, without shifting around. Just be careful of the cables that connect to the fins.

The fins can push fit, if you assemble the model correctly, so you don't even need to magnetize.

 RiTides wrote:

Charistoph wrote:
The harnesses have no gameplay value in and of themselves except to provide just a little more Cover opportunities for Vehicles being shot through the doorways.

If WYSIWYG is important to your group or a tournament, discuss it with them.

You absolutely do not need to discuss with a TO whether or not to include harnesses in your drop pod! It comes with the kit, you can build it with them. Easy.

WYSIWYG is no longer part of the rules, so if the TO requires it, then you DO need to talk to them about it, since they are the ones who have the problem with it.

 RiTides wrote:
The door issue might be a little more involved, although I would lean towards what insaniak posted - however you built it, that's how you use it. A tournament will have to have a plan for this anyway, since many people glue the doors shut - either they'll do like Mr. Shine's group does (say you can draw LOS through it like cover) or they'll say play it as it's built.

I think it's kind of crazy to be opening the panels of a nicely painted vehicle model and placing models on them, personally... especially when you'd need to do this for many models (full drop pod armies) every single game. So, you have to know how you'll treat a closed drop pod, since that's how many players will have theirs modeled.

I agree that it's rough on the model. If I ever play Space Marines again and build Drop Pods, I will be one who doesn't put the doors on. It's just easier for everyone to do this.

Thanks for the response everyone. I am probably going to model them without the harnesses to save time then.

It's not difficult to magnetize the base of the pod allowing you to fit or remove the harnesses. All of mine are done this way and some also have deathstorm launchers that can be fitted.

I also leave the doors off, it's just less hassle than pretending to draw line of sight through a closed pod or messing with open doors that sometimes interfere with terrain.

 insaniak wrote:

 DW wrote:
But I also feel that gluing them shut is technically MFA due to the blocking LOS. .

It's not. The kit is designed so that the doors can open or close, but there is no actual requirement to have them open on the table. So whether you choose to leave them closed for whatever reason, or glue them shut, it really makes no difference.

How do you fire its weapon with the doors closed?

Naw wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

 DW wrote:
But I also feel that gluing them shut is technically MFA due to the blocking LOS. .

It's not. The kit is designed so that the doors can open or close, but there is no actual requirement to have them open on the table. So whether you choose to leave them closed for whatever reason, or glue them shut, it really makes no difference.

How do you fire its weapon with the doors closed?

You don't.

I would trade a storm bolter for line of sight blockers any day

Naw wrote:
How do you fire its weapon with the doors closed?

You can't.

That doesn't mean that the doors have to be open though. Just means that it's a bad idea to leave them closed if you want to be able to fire the weapon.

I am fairly certain the doors to not matter for drawing line of sight or for determining range. Glue them shut IMO it makes an already fragile model more stable.

die toten hosen wrote:
I am fairly certain the doors to not matter for drawing line of sight or for determining range. Glue them shut IMO it makes an already fragile model more stable.

Your statement is incorrect.

Why wouldn't the doors matter for Line of Sight?

Is there a rule stating that the drop pod doors do not count for Line of Sight?

If so can you cite a page and graph where this rule is located?

Can we please stop with the insistent "page and 'graph" wankery when someone is clearly giving their opinion on how the game should be played for ease and convenience rather than strictly the rules?

 insaniak wrote:

Naw wrote:
How do you fire its weapon with the doors closed?

You can't.

That doesn't mean that the doors have to be open though. Just means that it's a bad idea to leave them closed if you want to be able to fire the weapon.

I just noted that you wrote:"So whether you choose to leave them closed for whatever reason, or glue them shut, it really makes no difference."

And it does make a difference


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mr. Shine wrote:
Can we please stop with the insistent "page and 'graph" wankery when someone is clearly giving their opinion on how the game should be played for ease and convenience rather than strictly the rules?

That is how certain people tend to respond to anything, because them tenets says so. It doesn't really advance the conversations, though, because in the end people are hanging to their own interpretations.

Now thst it was established we are not told how the doors work, then it should be perfectly fine to keep specific LOS blocking doors closed and still retain the ability to shoot. Am I allowed to open or close the doors in my shooting phase and if not, why?

Naw wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Naw wrote:
How do you fire its weapon with the doors closed?

You can't.

That doesn't mean that the doors have to be open though. Just means that it's a bad idea to leave them closed if you want to be able to fire the weapon.

I just noted that you wrote:"So whether you choose to leave them closed for whatever reason, or glue them shut, it really makes no difference."

And it does make a difference

You misunderstood.

Whether the doors are closed because they are glued, or closed because you choose to leave them shut makes no difference to the fact that they are closed.

I wasn't saying that being closed has no impact on the game, just that the reason for them being closed doesn't matter.

Naw wrote:
Am I allowed to open or close the doors in my shooting phase and if not, why?

Is there a rule permitting you to change a model's configuration during the game?

Naw wrote:
That is how certain people tend to respond to anything, because them tenets says so. It doesn't really advance the conversations, though, because in the end people are hanging to their own interpretations.

The tenets say just as much to support your assertions as they say not to argue HIWPI with RAW. And yeah, it doesn't advance the discussion at all and we all know it's not done in any attempt to do so either - it's simple "omg I out-RAW you ur interpretation sux" crap.

 Scott-S6 wrote:

Naw wrote:
Am I allowed to open or close the doors in my shooting phase and if not, why?

Is there a rule permitting you to change a model's configuration during the game?

So my tank's or fortification's weapons cannot be moved during the game thus not being able to check LOS along the barrel? Good stuff!

I tried to look up "model's configuration" in the rules, too

 Scott-S6 wrote:

Naw wrote:
Am I allowed to open or close the doors in my shooting phase and if not, why?

Is there a rule permitting you to change a model's configuration during the game?

There are no real rules that I can think of impacting a model's configuration changes during a game. HOWEVER, the rules assume you are using Citadel miniatures, with the implication that you are using Citadel Miniatures that have been assembled using the included instructions. Many Citadel miniatures have moving parts when assembled correctly. I would argue that so long as you are using a Citadel miniature which has been assembled per the included instructions, you should feel free to move any moving parts during your own player turn.

For example, if I build a standard, no frills Space Marine Predator, I would be able to swivel the turret as desired before making a shooting attack.

This is obviously poorly documented in the rules, but I think you'll need to add a certain element of common sense and look at how the model is supposed to work in the "real world". Predator turrets are supposed to swivel. Drop Pod doors are supposed to open when the Pod lands. They are NOT ever supposed to close again until after the battle when a serf, servitor or Techmarine retrieves them.

If you want to constantly open and close a Drop Pod's doors to gain some sort of in game advantage, you're quickly going to be labelled as a poor sport and you'll find that you have fewer and fewer willing opponents over time.

Here is a question from a non marines player.

The drop pod lands, and the doors open. I get that.
What if the door cannot open all the way, say its blocked by a ruin or something else. Can the troops still disembark from that door?

 danpieri wrote:
Here is a question from a non marines player.

The drop pod lands, and the doors open. I get that.
What if the door cannot open all the way, say its blocked by a ruin or something else. Can the troops still disembark from that door?

Drop Pods are Open-Topped, so doors do not matter.

 danpieri wrote:
Here is a question from a non marines player.

The drop pod lands, and the doors open. I get that.
What if the door cannot open all the way, say its blocked by a ruin or something else. Can the troops still disembark from that door?

Why would an open door matter? The rules do not care if the model's door is open or closed.

They simply tell you to place the model in base contact with one of the vehicle’s Access Points then make a normal move.

It does not mention open or closed doors on a model at all.

 Mr. Shine wrote:
Can we please stop with the insistent "page and 'graph" wankery when someone is clearly giving their opinion on how the game should be played for ease and convenience rather than strictly the rules?

No we can not stop with the ""page and 'graph" wankery" as you call it. It is not "wankery" it is trying to validate a rule.

Because he made an assertation and I wanted to know where he got that rule from.

If he can not find the rule, he needs to mark the post How He Would Play It.

Naw wrote:

 Scott-S6 wrote:

Naw wrote:
Am I allowed to open or close the doors in my shooting phase and if not, why?

Is there a rule permitting you to change a model's configuration during the game?

So my tank's or fortification's weapons cannot be moved during the game thus not being able to check LOS along the barrel? Good stuff!

I tried to look up "model's configuration" in the rules, too

Yes, your weapons can be moved because there is a specific permission to do so. Is there a permission to open or close doors?

You are stuck up with the notion that there should be a rule on that. It's a perfectly legal model where closing and opening the doors is possible. Nowhere in the rules are we given any instructions regarding them, we are just told where to disembark/embark.

Why don't you tell me why I can't move the doors during my turn the way I want? Saying that I need a rule that says I can move the doors is not enough. However, if you said I would be TFG, that I will accept.