Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

My brother in law texted me last night and asked what I thought about the kickstarter. Both he and his wife are big TWD (TV) fans and he has a huge undead army, some of it was my old Vampire counts army, and he is also a big Mantic supporter. I gave him my reasons for dropping my EB pledge and he agreed that the value just isn't there, and that the models looked poor. I hope it does enough for it to pay off and keep the new people they hired on as Matt seems to be a great addition to the team, but I hope the total is low enough to grab their attention and get them back on track. When Mantic first came out they seemed to have a good pulse on the market, now they just seem to be going after the "Easy" cash grabs. I'm not in the know about their financials, but it does leave me to wonder how they are doing with them changing business partners (all the different resin manufacturers) and not having in house sculptors or a solid partner firm that does most of their designs. I'm not excited for Warpath, I have way too many space marines, I wish they could focus on Fantasy and KOW until that is well established.

Not having inhouse sculptors does not seem to be the problem for many if not most companies. The lack of art direction and quality control seems to be the problem at Mantic.
These renders look cheap and the minis are atrocious.
Speaking of AVP and like mantic games if they do not have a strong long therm plan to keep people interested in these games they will fade away regardless of license.

 NAVARRO wrote:
Not having inhouse sculptors does not seem to be the problem for many if not most companies. The lack of art direction and quality control seems to be the problem at Mantic.
These renders look cheap and the minis are atrocious.
Speaking of AVP and like mantic games if they do not have a strong long therm plan to keep people interested in these games they will fade away regardless of license.

This.

Mantic really needs to move on beyond their current attitude of "good enough" because what they're currently making really isn't.

I really find it odd how companies like GW and Mantic can draw almost cult-like followings of people who will throw money at whatever they produce, regardless of negative experiences and quality issues. That said, I never really understood people waiting in line for days to buy the newest iPhone either..

 warboss wrote:
I'm surprised that they ever did it (the license fees must have been dirt cheap!) and that it did as well as it did. Anything non-Mars Attack specific that they did they could have released without attaching it to the IP.

If I remember a Ronnie Storytime from a while back, it was the Mars Attack guys that approached Mantic. Basically, they were doing a big relaunch of the comic / card game etc and thought, "hey, doing a board game would be a neat tie in thing to do." They then basically invited pitches, I think and Mantic won.

So, with that sort of context behind it, I think Mars Attacks went fine. I mean, it's a fine product, not my kinda thing (I am a bit of a fan of my giant stompy robot from the crazy box, myself) but yeah, I don't think any other company (even CoolMiniOrNot) would have done anything drastically different with the situation.

 RiTides wrote:
I'm not saying I'm in love with the offerings here (it's actually not for me at all) but comparing it to the absolute board gaming juggernaut of CMON and in particular Zombicide probably isn't fair.

If Mantic didn't want to be compared with Zombicide, they should have stayed out of Zombicide's turf. Whether they like it or not, their zombie survival miniatures game is going to be compared to other zombie survival miniatures games on the market. And when the competition has such an obvious advantage as being able to buy it and at least one of its expansions right now while All Out War is a preorder six months out, you need to make sure you have advantages in other areas that make up for it.

Geek And Sundry wrote an article on The Walking Dead tabletop game tonight, which should get a little more interest.

Admittedly, they could have done with mentioning the kickstarter, instead of just the newsletter.

I don't think it's awful, I'm just kinda zombied out. If this came around before Zombicide, I would have been all over it. And I may still get a gang, after trying my friend's copy. But picking it up now? Nah, it's funded, which I'm happy about because I only want success for Mantic. It's just not what I'm looking for as a game, for the time being.

Now if Mantic wants to do that Project Pandora rework that got spitballed around during the Warpath KS rather than zombies, they may be able to pry some monies out of me again...

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Now if Mantic wants to do that Project Pandora rework that got spitballed around during the Warpath KS rather than zombies, they may be able to pry some monies out of me again...

That got spitballed around in Deadzone and Dungeon Saga too, so don't hold your breath...

 Compel wrote:
Geek And Sundry wrote an article on The Walking Dead tabletop game tonight, which should get a little more interest.

Yep! Very interested!



Meanwhile, Mantic keeps hitting 'em out of the ballpark.

 Compel wrote:

 warboss wrote:
I'm surprised that they ever did it (the license fees must have been dirt cheap!) and that it did as well as it did. Anything non-Mars Attack specific that they did they could have released without attaching it to the IP.

If I remember a Ronnie Storytime from a while back, it was the Mars Attack guys that approached Mantic. Basically, they were doing a big relaunch of the comic / card game etc and thought, "hey, doing a board game would be a neat tie in thing to do." They then basically invited pitches, I think and Mantic won.

So, with that sort of context behind it, I think Mars Attacks went fine. I mean, it's a fine product, not my kinda thing (I am a bit of a fan of my giant stompy robot from the crazy box, myself) but yeah, I don't think any other company (even CoolMiniOrNot) would have done anything drastically different with the situation.

Mars Attacks was great, rules are very fun and very bloody, it as pretty much everything that Deadzone should have been from the start.

Also, Mantic were practically given the license (presumably the renewal fees were more, hence why it goes OOP this year), whereas I get the feeling TWD will be taking at least 20% royalties.

Still wavering on this one, will have to see where it ends, although the sculpts really aren't up to much for $3 each at the time of writing. 48 minis and a rough cost of $150 once shipping is factored in. Also, at current exchange rates, the base pledge of $125 is £90(!) before shipping.

$40 for a booster with 10 minis in it is also a big nope, not looking forward to seeing what the retail price on that will be. I can buy a Dungeon Saga expansion for the same price with 27 minis, and even more in the way of cardstock.

The scenery booster is at least pretty good for $40 now, with 2 mats and the cars in there. The barricades, loot counters and cars will be useful long after the IP has expired.

This is the one KS where I'd really like a rules/counters only pledge, and it's the one KS that doesn't have it due to everything being tied to the collectible equipment cards. I am wondering if requiring rules to be tied to purchases of the official minis was a requirement for the license,

I am almost positive that the BGG crowd will put together an "character/equipment compendium" listing all of the cards and stats, if only because if they are even more sensitive to missing out on content in any way, shape or form!

Giving cards with the models is much more likely to shift copies of those models at a higher pricepoint, and doesn't lock Mantic into either writing a load of characters up front that may never get miniatures, so I can definitely see why it's attractive to them. I just think that in most other cases where I've seen this model (mostly FFG stuff - Tannhauser, IA, X-Wing, Armada) you get a lot more non-model stuff in the box - chits, sliders, thick cardstock character boards, scenarios.

The simplicity of the Walking Dead stuff here might ultimately work against it, because it doesn't actually need a pile of supplementary gubbins for each mini-expansion, but therefore feels light on content.

The other thing that's a bit strange when it comes to this "X-Wing" model is that there is no reason to ever buy more than one copy of each survivor, other than for the cards. Presumably, Rick won't come with four versions of himself, three of which are 'cheaper' but not actually Rick..

"Rick","Sheriff O'Grady","Hatless Survivor","Axe Thug".

I wouldn't have a problem with that, actually! Certainly was genius on the part of FFG, both utilising the license but placing no cap on purchasing.

Equally, I think Mantic would be *delighted* if you bought only one copy of each expansion. I really think the cards are only in there to increase the perceived value of what are essentially 4-miniature blister packs, not so that people buy 5 copies of each just to outfit everyone with Katanas to remain competitive in a hypothetical tournament scene.

Another thing that isn't helping perception of value is all of the placeholder art. If Mantic could sell the idea of "look at all of these beautiful card components/detailed mats" it would make the package look at least better value, if not *good* value by the standards of previous Kickstarters. Keeping everything as "you'll get generic booklets/tokens/markers/sheets" makes you completely dismiss them as having *any* value.

 Nostromodamus wrote:

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Now if Mantic wants to do that Project Pandora rework that got spitballed around during the Warpath KS rather than zombies, they may be able to pry some monies out of me again...

That got spitballed around in Deadzone and Dungeon Saga too, so don't hold your breath...

Sounds like Firefight which has also apparently been in spitball mode for ages..

Still in it ($115)

But nothings making me go yes I want to stay in.

I've backed everything with them so far with the exception of Deadzone Infestation.

And I still feel burned from Dungeon Saga as the Quality control was awful. (for me at least)

The renders for WD characters is really doing themselves no favors either

I suspect i'll be backing out in the final hour at this moment in time

I think I will end up staying in for this one (have pledged for original Deadzone and Mars Attacks previously but pulled out due to spiralling cost of getting everything). Will leave my pledge at $115 but grab the proper expansions in the pledge manager (and the scenery expansion if they add a second one for the remaining 3 deluxe mats).

Staying in as i'm a fan of the comics and feel that the sculpts just about do the comic designs justice (with a few exceptions although the unpainted Rick looks a lot more like the comic version than the painted sample they have). Also think it's the first wargame I can get my other half to play as she is a big fan of the show.

Due to the number of unique sculpts it has now been pushed over to a good value in my eyes and hopefully they can fill in a few of the more obvious gaps before the campaign ends next week.

Just noticed this - interesting that it's limited and also that the numbers are so small on it.

$75 or more
Limited (902 of 1000 remaining)
MARCH TO WAR

They only added that pledge level due to demand in the comments section and said if they sold out they would add more (not sure why they bothered to make limited in first place though).

Yep, I'm aware that they added that level due to the comments and feedback. I just find the fact that it's limited and the limited numbers to be quite telling in regard to their expectations for this KS campaign - and the actual takers to be just as telling in terms of actual response from the KSing public.

Well, it's also quite telling in how small a vocal minority in the comments can be.

I wonder if there's any chance of them updating the shipping estimates before the campaign closes based on everything unlocked to date? Because after seeing what happened for WarPath....

 Azazelx wrote:
I wonder if there's any chance of them updating the shipping estimates before the campaign closes based on everything unlocked to date? Because after seeing what happened for WarPath....

You so funny. Mantic proactive?!?!?!

It's more about the choice to be short-sighted (a more accurate shipping estimate could potentially cost them backers and $$ in this campaign) versus being long-sighted (a nasty shipping surprise won't help them or their rep for the next campaign - remember this was supposed to be a multi-million dollar, one pledge level, no-add-ons campaign - but with lots of people still feeling burned by KoWII & DS feth ups, WP shipping costs...

Oboy. At $480,000, they're gonna add Bandit #2, who didn't even last one issue against Rick and Co.

http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/The_Marauders

Bandit #2 is totally my favorite guy.

 Azazelx wrote:
It's more about the choice to be short-sighted (a more accurate shipping estimate could potentially cost them backers and $$ in this campaign) versus being long-sighted (a nasty shipping surprise won't help them or their rep for the next campaign - remember this was supposed to be a multi-million dollar, one pledge level, no-add-ons campaign - but with lots of people still feeling burned by KoWII & DS fuckups, WP shipping costs...

What happened with warpath shipping? Also, I haven't followed this one closely since the big reveail of TWD; do you have a link to where that said that one pledge level no add on part? I'm curious about that and when it changed.

Who the feth is Craig? Wheres the feth is the Governor and Negan?

the one pledge level and no add ons info was from a whole bunch of interviews/podcasts and leaks from Ronnie

Warpath shipping was the perennial company provides estimates that prove to be far too low (but only after the campaign closed). Some regions like AUS got clobbered particularly badly

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Well, it's also quite telling in how small a vocal minority in the comments can be.

Well.. I think the vocal majority can't comment on this in the comment section because we're not backing it.. just saying..