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 avedominusnox wrote:
So whips of agony can't be taken by anything. As mentioned it is exalted aluress only and can be take only by a model that can buy an exalted reward. So not even her can take it since she can buy only lesser and greater. Cool. I think the nurgle instrument is the best relic in there.

Where's "exalted" reward specified? The Slaanesh artifact page only specifies Daemons of Slaanesh that have the option to take "Daemonic Rewards", while each artifact specifies who can take them.

I may need to start a nurgle/slannesh themed army. Perhaps The syphilis cavalcade?

 Sersi wrote:

 avedominusnox wrote:
So whips of agony can't be taken by anything. As mentioned it is exalted aluress only and can be take only by a model that can buy an exalted reward. So not even her can take it since she can buy only lesser and greater. Cool. I think the nurgle instrument is the best relic in there.

Where's "exalted" reward specified? The Slaanesh artifact page only specifies Daemons of Slaanesh that have the option to take "Daemonic Rewards", while each artifact specifies who can take them.

Yeah sorry you are right, though someone on the posts on spikey bits and faeit mentioned that relics are specific to the model that can buy exalted rewards. But damn you are right. Each one says who can take it.

Samii wrote:
This may have been posted already, if so apologies, but do the new Hellforged Artefacts replace those from the main Chaos Daemons book? It seems odd to have two types of Hellforged Artefact; one that you swap an Exalted Reward for (i.e. The Grimoire, Portaglyph, Doomstone etc.) and one that you can just purchase for a flat fee. As a model can only have one Hellforged Artefact it would follow that, if the Artefact is purchsed, then that model could not swap Exalted Rewards for the main Hellforged Artefacts; such as swapping for the Grimoire, for instance? I also noticed that the 'Warp Tether' power appears as both a Warlord Trait and as an Exalted Reward. Unless the new book has changed the way Exalted Rewards work, this would seem to create some confusion. Any advice? Thanks.

The artifact pages specifically say that the new artifacts are in addition to the old ones. The old rewards still function as before with either rolling and swapping. You may then choose to purchase the new artifacts dependent on the bearer.

Thanks a million.

Here's a flying circus idea I had:
Daemonic Incursion Detachment
Tallyband
(135) Herald of Nurgle: ML1, Palanquin, Greater Locus
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
(45) 3 Nurgling Swarms
Infernal Tetrad
(370) Daemon Prince of Nurgle: ML3, Wings, Armor, 2 Greater Rewards, 1 Lesser, Corruption
(355) Daemon Prince of Tzeentch: ML3, Wings, Armor, 2 Greater Rewards, 1 Lesser-Warlord
(340) Daemon Prince of Slaanesh: ML3, Wings, Armor, Exalted Reward, Greater Reward
(300) Daemon Prince of Khorne: Wings, Armor, 2 Greater Rewards, 1 Lesser, Skullreaper
Daemon Flock
(35) 5 Chaos Furies

I want to use either the Tzeentch or Nurgle warlord trait table to buff the whole Daemon Prince Squad. My only issue is whether it'd be better to use the Tzeentch Table (generate on a 3+, +1 to invuln, +1 to mastery level all are very good) or the Nurgle Table (Feel no Pain or buffed FnP, +1 wound, or the Snap shots within 7" one).

So excited to see the new list ideas coming out of the new book!

Anyone have ideas on how to reliably grant access to the 6 psychic power on the nurgle table? Seems really odd that you can only generate half of your powers from any given god's table (and this is a big deal if you're trying to roll that 6 with heralds - your odds are pretty bad (only 33 percent) if you have two nurgle heralds. If both heralds could roll twice on the table, you would have a 55 percent chance of getting that power, which I think I could (and would) roll for and live with if I didn't. But even that isn't great odds.

If GW decide to fix this and let the daemons roll all of their powers on the table for their respective gods, that would be great. Talk to me about a T8 squad of plague drones with FNP.

Where does it have this apparent restriction written? I've never seen it or played with it. I might have overlooked it I suppose.

AncientSkarbrand wrote:
Where does it have this apparent restriction written? I've never seen it or played with it. I might have overlooked it I suppose.

I think we all did because we never rolled on those awful tables before. Now that they're actually good (or can be in the right list), it's a thing. It's before the HQ section, in section that lists the disciplines, under the heading "Generating Psychic Powers". First paragraph.

I REALLY want to find a way around this to make the T8 plague drones a reliable thing, that I can get in say 60/70 percent of my games or more. If only there was a "knows all the plague discipline relic".....that would be hot.

Interested to know whether the new artefacts alter the consensus that the Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage is the only Bloodthirster worth taking. You can now get a standard, Unfettered Fury bloodthirster and give it the new D-on-a-6 weapon. This gives you two specialist weapons for +1 attack, which don't have unwieldy, and with a chance of D, for 5 pts more than a D-thirster, before rewards. Seems an equally good option, no?

Mushkin wrote:
Interested to know whether the new artefacts alter the consensus that the Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage is the only Bloodthirster worth taking. You can now get a standard, Unfettered Fury bloodthirster and give it the new D-on-a-6 weapon. This gives you two specialist weapons for +1 attack, which don't have unwieldy, and with a chance of D, for 5 pts more than a D-thirster, before rewards. Seems an equally good option, no?

I had the same thought, but you're still only going to get a hit or two that is D, on average. That's great - don't get me wrong. A lot of times, the D thirster is overkill. But when you NEED to 6 something on the D table, you also NEED the D thirster. Unwieldy is a problem - don't get me wrong. But that's why you make him durable enough to take the hits. When you are looking to maybe get lucky with MAYBE rolling a D and MAYBE rolling a 6, it's 1/36 attacks that that will happen, or roughly 1/6 combats (approximating - it's a little higher). But basically it'll happen once a game. I'd rather have it happen roughly once every time I charge. Just saying. I'll take unwieldy in exchange for that, like 10/10 times.

Well, I must say... feth that restriction. There's no reason my daemons who are but a splinter of their patron god would have restricted access to magic of that God.

Seriously, what the feth! Is that not completely absurd?

I'm sure my group will let me ignore it, but I'm fortunate with that. I feel bad for those who won't be allowed to ignore it. Maybe they omitted it from the new codex. My group knows my builds have been suffering lately mainly in the diversity category, and won't mind house ruling that.

Interesting to note - all of these hell forged artifacts can be taken on summoned units - the regular thirster can be summoned with 30 points of rewards IIRC. Can someone tell me why I think this haha? I don't see it in the rules lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:

AncientSkarbrand wrote:
Well, I must say... feth that restriction. There's no reason my daemons who are but a splinter of their patron god would have restricted access to magic of that God.

Seriously, what the feth! Is that not completely absurd?

I'm sure my group will let me ignore it, but I'm fortunate with that. I feel bad for those who won't be allowed to ignore it. Maybe they omitted it from the new codex. My group knows my builds have been suffering lately mainly in the diversity category, and won't mind house ruling that.

See mine wouldn't care either, but I like to play my army the same way as it would play if I took it to a big event, so as a rule, I wouldn't go for that. Maybe there's something in the campaign book that overrides it.

I also would play the way you described, if I didn't live 2.5 hours away from the nearest tournament venue!

The next closest is 4 hours from me, so my version of 40k is quite friendly, none of us will see a tournament we didn't organize. I am attempting to see if my group will let me tack relentless and gets hot on exalted flamers for a points bump. I'm surprised they didn't give it as an option and call it "fickle fyrewyrm" or something. Would make the warp flame host better. I'm going to try it without the house rule first, of course.

AncientSkarbrand wrote:
I also would play the way you described, if I didn't live 2.5 hours away from the nearest tournament venue!

The next closest is 4 hours from me, so my version of 40k is quite friendly, none of us will see a tournament we didn't organize. I am attempting to see if my group will let me tack relentless and gets hot on exalted flamers for a points bump. I'm surprised they didn't give it as an option and call it "fickle fyrewyrm" or something. Would make the warp flame host better. I'm going to try it without the house rule first, of course.

I'm just going to read the psychic section very carefully. The generation rules applied to an old version of the disciplines of change, plague and excess. It doesn't seem like a huge stretch to say that they are different tables, though they do have the same name, and so therefore maybe the half generation rules would no longer apply. For example, previously a ML3 psyker would not have to roll - he would simply know all of the powers on a given table. As is, a ML3 psyker would only be able to know half of the powers.

My thinking is that maybe GW's intent with the "half" rule was to keep an element of randomness and not allow the daemons to guarantee that they know an entire discipline every game (you know, because those disciplines were so OP OP). As it stands with what we know now from the rules, however, the RAW seems to lean the other way, and would be classified as ambiguous at best. Here's to hoping for some clarity with the official release!

 ThirstySpaceMan wrote:
I may need to start a nurgle/slannesh themed army. Perhaps The syphilis cavalcade?

Slaanesh doesn't exist anymore according to GW, silly billy. Didn't you see the new Acheron model?

 Harriticus wrote:

 ThirstySpaceMan wrote:
I may need to start a nurgle/slannesh themed army. Perhaps The syphilis cavalcade?

Slaanesh doesn't exist anymore according to GW, silly billy. Didn't you see the new Acheron model?

The Age of Sigmar fluff (which never says that Slaanesh no longer exists), has no effect on 40K.

 Harriticus wrote:

 ThirstySpaceMan wrote:
I may need to start a nurgle/slannesh themed army. Perhaps The syphilis cavalcade?

Slaanesh doesn't exist anymore according to GW, silly billy. Didn't you see the new Acheron model?

You mean that Archaon model with the symbol of Slannesh on it?

Mushkin wrote:
Interested to know whether the new artefacts alter the consensus that the Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage is the only Bloodthirster worth taking. You can now get a standard, Unfettered Fury bloodthirster and give it the new D-on-a-6 weapon. This gives you two specialist weapons for +1 attack, which don't have unwieldy, and with a chance of D, for 5 pts more than a D-thirster, before rewards. Seems an equally good option, no?

Why not both?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

AncientSkarbrand wrote:
Well, I must say... feth that restriction. There's no reason my daemons who are but a splinter of their patron god would have restricted access to magic of that God.

Seriously, what the feth! Is that not completely absurd?

I'm sure my group will let me ignore it, but I'm fortunate with that. I feel bad for those who won't be allowed to ignore it. Maybe they omitted it from the new codex. My group knows my builds have been suffering lately mainly in the diversity category, and won't mind house ruling that.

Its really just a relic of use having only a 1/2 lore in the book. Same with CSM. Imagine is will be FAQ'd in a year or so. Like when we get our new book...so yeah.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Harriticus wrote:

 ThirstySpaceMan wrote:
I may need to start a nurgle/slannesh themed army. Perhaps The syphilis cavalcade?

Slaanesh doesn't exist anymore according to GW, silly billy. Didn't you see the new Acheron model?

Trust and believe s/he will be back in a big way. I don't no why there so much hate for the coolest god/goddess. Player insecurity maybe. I mean come one man "Sex, drugs, and rock'n roll". If your not down with that you are to old.

Requizen wrote:

 Virules wrote:
It doesn't need a ruling. Reserve rolls only kick in from turn 2 onwards, at which point you can auto pass one per turn.

Too bad...I was hoping it was any reserves, and from turn 1 onward. Oh well.

That's really stupid considering you autopass on T4 anyway, so it's only useful for 2 turns.

Still, I guess it's only 10 points more than a regular disc, so you're at worst paying 10 points for one autopass, or if you fail one on T2 you get another free one on T3. That's... still not too bad, depending. If you're running CSM allied, that's 10 points to guarantee a Heldrake comes on T2, which is pretty ok.



A neat combo could be something like, Herald with the Oracular Disc, Tzeentch Prince with Everstave, CSM Prince with Burning Brand, and Heldrake. That's 3 Flyers with AP3 Flamers, guaranteed all to be on by T2 (unless you reserve the Princes, I suppose), one of which is Torrent, which basically guarantees blobs of dead models every turn. Could be pretty decent for a Flying Circus list, if you could manage the points.

IIRC, the Disc's rules stipulate you can only auto-pass a reserve roll for a unit with the 'Chaos Daemons' faction. So no using it to bring on CSM units, because feth Chaos getting any kind of real synergy!

Experiment 626 wrote:

Requizen wrote:

 Virules wrote:
It doesn't need a ruling. Reserve rolls only kick in from turn 2 onwards, at which point you can auto pass one per turn.

Too bad...I was hoping it was any reserves, and from turn 1 onward. Oh well.

That's really stupid considering you autopass on T4 anyway, so it's only useful for 2 turns.

Still, I guess it's only 10 points more than a regular disc, so you're at worst paying 10 points for one autopass, or if you fail one on T2 you get another free one on T3. That's... still not too bad, depending. If you're running CSM allied, that's 10 points to guarantee a Heldrake comes on T2, which is pretty ok.



A neat combo could be something like, Herald with the Oracular Disc, Tzeentch Prince with Everstave, CSM Prince with Burning Brand, and Heldrake. That's 3 Flyers with AP3 Flamers, guaranteed all to be on by T2 (unless you reserve the Princes, I suppose), one of which is Torrent, which basically guarantees blobs of dead models every turn. Could be pretty decent for a Flying Circus list, if you could manage the points.

IIRC, the Disc's rules stipulate you can only auto-pass a reserve roll for a unit with the 'Chaos Daemons' faction. So no using it to bring on CSM units, because feth Chaos getting any kind of real synergy!

...well poop.

I still stand by Everstave/Burning Brand/Heldrake AP3 Flamer Flying Circus being good, even if you can't guarantee the T2 reserve.

You can use Dais on FW Blight Drones you take though the Daemon codex

I'm pretty sure the Grimoir text is a typo, it does make little sens, no matters how many time i try to wrap my head around it.

Is Soulstealer potent enough on a KOS for her to just take a single greater reward for defense?

Unless you roll hellfire gaze or touch of uncreation, it might be enough. The moment you do roll that though... you're running around with nothing but a 5++. You could mitigate that however with the grimoire in your list or a little shrouding or invisibility. I'm always frightened to not take 2 greater rewards.

It's gonna take some games to see exactly how this changes things. But that sword has potential to drastically increase survivability, as long as you get in one combat with anything other than necron wraiths you're virtually guaranteed 2 wounds replaced. 10 pts gives you another attack in the form of an ether blade as well, giving you an even better chance to gain wounds.

Some of the slaanesh warlord traits would also synergize well with that relic. The new equipment at least is interesting indeed. I'm excited about it because I've gotten in a rut with my characters, they always have the same setup.

Oh God, i've just read the last fluff bit of the book that is leaked, i love this, hahahaha!, its freakin fantastic!!!

Oh Dear Dark Gods balls i cannot help myself!, when i imagine the face of our SW players in our LGC when they will read this!!!, its fething Priceless!!!

 Slayer le boucher wrote:
Oh God, i've just read the last fluff bit of the book that is leaked, i love this, hahahaha!, its freakin fantastic!!!

Oh Dear Dark Gods balls i cannot help myself!, when i imagine the face of our SW players in our LGC when they will read this!!!, its fething Priceless!!!

Do share with those of us who don't our book yet?!

As they said in the SW thread, the DA blew up Fenris with extreme prejudice. Dunno what's up with the Daemon's though.

Well sicne we're blowing it, The Changeling is aboard the Rock and relays the Orders from Azrael to Nuke Fenris after Asmodai confirmed that the whole systeme was over run by Daemons and that the Wulfen was not under the SW protection only, but that Wulfen are Mutated forms of SW, so they are defacto Mutants and need to be Purged.

You have the whole DA fleet Nuking Fenris out of the Sky while the Changeling is smiling.

Some Karmic justice here...