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Ouroboros0977 wrote:
Imperial guard, 4 players at my flgs, one list common between them all, they all run a pask punisher gun line using as many tanks as possible, psykers and tech priests to support them and as little infantry as possible. They also INSIST upon kill points only games and uniformly refuse to play my daemons because of their reliance on invulns.

I wouldn't count it as a loss in my life.

Is that list good or bad for kill points? My friend has an IG list that's similar and usually gets destroyed by me easily. Granted I do play Tau.

He won't even play me anymore even with his Imperial Knights.

To be honest one thing that surprised me was how FAST the meta changed to be able to handle Imperial Knights.

You hardly hear about them anymore.

All it took was a fairly-priced GC with a pair of ranged S(D) guns...

 Gamgee wrote:
Is that list good or bad for kill points? My friend has an IG list that's similar and usually gets destroyed by me easily. Granted I do play Tau.

He won't even play me anymore even with his Imperial Knights.

That should probably be an indication that something is very broken...

 Quickjager wrote:
To be honest one thing that surprised me was how FAST the meta changed to be able to handle Imperial Knights.

You hardly hear about them anymore.

Most events don't allow you to take lots of them, that's a big (probably the biggest) reason why. Another reason is that the firepower available to a couple of armies can knock them out of contention relatively easily, even if the Knights curbstomp everything else.

Ah I've destroyed that list with just Firewarriors, crisis teams, and pathfinders at one point a very inefficient list. I even had a few Railgun Broadsides (which are terribad one of our worst units).

Hell one time I fought it I charged my Riptide up center field and let it be shot without using nova reactor on shields and still won that game despite letting him have the Riptide. I even "forgot" my Riptide had an invuln save all game too. I won by victory points that time. I realized when I won against this list with Kroot and terribly inefficient builds there was nothing he could do to beat me so ever since then I just destroy him. Now he wont even try and play me. I mean if he couldn't beat my worst lists (6e Tau) whats hope does he have? The Tyranids player still challenges me, but always tries to win the objective point game since his army can't compete.

I even won a game with no markerlights once by the skin of my teeth. Tyranid player took initiative and mangaed to take my two Pathfinder teams out. Farsight managed to get me a few more points of kills (it was a kill point game way back when I was just starting 40k and I won by like 3 points. My third game I played too). By the end though all I had left was Farsight and I think half a squad of firewarriors, and one Broadside. My Riptide was destroyed that game too. Good times. He had a flying Hive Tyrant and a ground one too so it wasn't no slouch of an army.

The last time I lost 40k was about two years ago. My one friend played an ork list with help from the Nids player and this was his first game playing with a lot of help from the Nids player. This was my second game and first against orks. It was a low points game it I didn't register he was taking so much heavy armored orks and I was taking the machien gun of death build. Ethereal + Cadre Fireblade Firewarrior spam list. I almost won through sheer weight of fire but he had one squad left with heavy armor who got in my lines and his warboss. It was a total massacre. Fun times though and I'll never make that mistake again. Hahah.

Loyalist Space Marines (whatever the codex)

They complained about my Sisters or Oldcron having 3+ armour.

They moan about their ICs *almost* losing in assault to mine.

They get the hump if Genestealers kill D3vs or Tac marines in Assault...even if they kill most of the 'stealers and keep them busy for three or four turns.

 Souleater wrote:
Loyalist Space Marines (whatever the codex)

They complained about my Sisters or Oldcron having 3+ armour.

They moan about their ICs *almost* losing in assault to mine.

They get the hump if Genestealers kill D3vs or Tac marines in Assault...even if they kill most of the 'stealers and keep them busy for three or four turns.

Ah yes, I remember with my 5th edition codex, all the Smashfether players would complain that my MSS made him possibly attack himself. Oh no! My only defense in CC is actually kind of good against your cheesy character! Suck it up.

 krodarklorr wrote:


Ah yes, I remember with my 5th edition codex, all the Smashfether players would complain that my MSS made him possibly attack himself. Oh no! My only defense in CC is actually kind of good against your cheesy character! Suck it up.

Oh no you don't, MSS was evil incarnate and I praise almighty GeeDubs for removing them from the game and would gladly play against a thousand decurions than play against that again

*Shivers

 Torus wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:


Ah yes, I remember with my 5th edition codex, all the Smashfether players would complain that my MSS made him possibly attack himself. Oh no! My only defense in CC is actually kind of good against your cheesy character! Suck it up.

Oh no you don't, MSS was evil incarnate and I praise almighty GeeDubs for removing them from the game and would gladly play against a thousand decurions than play against that again

*Shivers

Well, considering our Overlords are now actually kind of scary, even without MSS, I'm fine with it. But in the old Codex? Our super awesome leaders had the same fighting capability as a Tac Marine. So yeah, we needed them.

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Souleater wrote:
Loyalist Space Marines (whatever the codex)

They complained about my Sisters or Oldcron having 3+ armour.

They moan about their ICs *almost* losing in assault to mine.

They get the hump if Genestealers kill D3vs or Tac marines in Assault...even if they kill most of the 'stealers and keep them busy for three or four turns.

Ah yes, I remember with my 5th edition codex, all the Smashfether players would complain that my MSS made him possibly attack himself. Oh no! My only defense in CC is actually kind of good against your cheesy character! Suck it up.

the only defense aside from being able to sport a 2+/3++sv on T5 with RP and multiple S7 AP1 Warscythe attacks

They werent so bad off that MSS was necessary for them to function, and went wayyy too far the opposite way, far too often guaranteeing a one sided curbstomping when a 3d6 LD roll would fail on average on even the highest LD characters.

 Vaktathi wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Souleater wrote:
Loyalist Space Marines (whatever the codex)

They complained about my Sisters or Oldcron having 3+ armour.

They moan about their ICs *almost* losing in assault to mine.

They get the hump if Genestealers kill D3vs or Tac marines in Assault...even if they kill most of the 'stealers and keep them busy for three or four turns.

Ah yes, I remember with my 5th edition codex, all the Smashfether players would complain that my MSS made him possibly attack himself. Oh no! My only defense in CC is actually kind of good against your cheesy character! Suck it up.

the only defense aside from being able to sport a 2+/3++sv on T5 with RP and multiple S7 AP1 Warscythe attacks

They werent so bad off that MSS was necessary for them to function, and went wayyy too far the opposite way, far too often guaranteeing a one sided curbstomping when a 3d6 LD roll would fail on average on even the highest LD characters.

Well, RP wasn't as good back then, so against a decent CC character, Overlords would have a 3++. Which is good, sure. But then 3 attacks at I2 with WS4 isn't impressive for a ~200 point character.

Sure RP wasnt what it is now, but it was definitley something, and T5 with great saves made them dramatically tougher than most 200pt equivalents aside from something like Lysander (who I think is 230...and strikes at I1), particularly once 6th hit about six months later and anything that could break the 2+ was hitting at I1 and that I2 Warscythe got to strike first.

Or even worse...the chariot where you got to choose either the chariot or the character to take the hit...

 Vaktathi wrote:
Sure RP wasnt what it is now, but it was definitley something, and T5 with great saves made them dramatically tougher than most 200pt equivalents aside from something like Lysander (who I think is 230...and strikes at I1), particularly once 6th hit about six months later and anything that could break the 2+ was hitting at I1 and that I2 Warscythe got to strike first.

Or even worse...the chariot where you got to choose either the chariot or the character to take the hit...

I think in 6th the Chariot took the hit from shooting, and in melee the attacker got to decide. It wasn't until 7th when Chariots became ridiculous.

I still loved my Overlord, but without MSS, he would typically fail to do much against another CC character most of the time. Heck, my Overlord failed to do much damage against Tac marines most of the time.

I think you're right in on the allocation bit being 7th, its increasingly a haze to me

That said, Necron Lords really were never intended to go toe to toe with the beastliest combat characters around, but to be a hard fist supporting (and protected by) something else, which they did very well. MSS wasnt needed to be successful in that role, particularly on a 3d6 Ld test. If it really were, it would have just been included in the Lord's inherent wargear/special rules.

Tau, 100% Tau... oh look a gun line, oh look another gun line... will I be surprised and see transports and croot outflanking and the mobile stuff in their codex... nope another gun line every time I see tau it is either a farsight bomb backed by 1-3 riptides, 2-3 units of broadsides spewing gak-tons of missiles, and a few fire warrior squads all augmented by 3 units of pathfinders. there might be an ethereal to grant buffs too. I like variety... I own tau and love playing them mobile sure I win less that way but I enjoy the match and get actual movement and playing for objectives.

 G00fySmiley wrote:
Tau, 100% Tau... oh look a gun line, oh look another gun line... will I be surprised and see transports and croot outflanking and the mobile stuff in their codex... nope another gun line every time I see tau it is either a farsight bomb backed by 1-3 riptides, 2-3 units of broadsides spewing gak-tons of missiles, and a few fire warrior squads all augmented by 3 units of pathfinders. there might be an ethereal to grant buffs too. I like variety... I own tau and love playing them mobile sure I win less that way but I enjoy the match and get actual movement and playing for objectives.

Mech "fish of fury" Tau or a Hammer and Anvil strategy can be a lot of fun to play and interesting enough to play against. Mobile Suit Gundam and Turtle Gunline Tau makes me want to throw up in disgust. Sadly GW seems to encourage big mechs and gunline style of play far more than they encourage mobile units.

 Vankraken wrote:

 G00fySmiley wrote:
Tau, 100% Tau... oh look a gun line, oh look another gun line... will I be surprised and see transports and croot outflanking and the mobile stuff in their codex... nope another gun line every time I see tau it is either a farsight bomb backed by 1-3 riptides, 2-3 units of broadsides spewing gak-tons of missiles, and a few fire warrior squads all augmented by 3 units of pathfinders. there might be an ethereal to grant buffs too. I like variety... I own tau and love playing them mobile sure I win less that way but I enjoy the match and get actual movement and playing for objectives.

Mech "fish of fury" Tau or a Hammer and Anvil strategy can be a lot of fun to play and interesting enough to play against. Mobile Suit Gundam and Turtle Gunline Tau makes me want to throw up in disgust. Sadly GW seems to encourage big mechs and gunline style of play far more than they encourage mobile units.

How is "drive by" strategy fun to play against? It's just DE but better. They roll up, jump out, rapid fire, hop back in next turn, and leave. How is that fun?

I like playing against every type of faction/list except one: footslogging hordes.

Be it ork or nids (IG doesn't usually move) time just flies by

 G00fySmiley wrote:
Tau, 100% Tau... oh look a gun line, oh look another gun line... will I be surprised and see transports and croot outflanking and the mobile stuff in their codex... nope another gun line every time I see tau it is either a farsight bomb backed by 1-3 riptides, 2-3 units of broadsides spewing gak-tons of missiles, and a few fire warrior squads all augmented by 3 units of pathfinders. there might be an ethereal to grant buffs too. I like variety... I own tau and love playing them mobile sure I win less that way but I enjoy the match and get actual movement and playing for objectives.

I know, right? Luckily the co-worker I just got into the game is playing Tau, but he's using things like Pathfinders with Ion/Rail rifles, Devilfish, Ethereals (plans on getting Aun'va), and a bunch of Strike teams/Breachers. It's very refreshing and fun to play against.

 Gamgee wrote:
The last time I lost 40k was about two years ago.

Then either you are the Miyamoto Musashi of 40k, or you need to get out and play new people.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
The last time I lost 40k was about two years ago.

Then either you are the Miyamoto Musashi of 40k, or you need to get out and play new people.

HAH! The last time I lost was three days ago! Does that make me the Braxton Bragg of 40?

 jreilly89 wrote:

 Vankraken wrote:

 G00fySmiley wrote:
Tau, 100% Tau... oh look a gun line, oh look another gun line... will I be surprised and see transports and croot outflanking and the mobile stuff in their codex... nope another gun line every time I see tau it is either a farsight bomb backed by 1-3 riptides, 2-3 units of broadsides spewing gak-tons of missiles, and a few fire warrior squads all augmented by 3 units of pathfinders. there might be an ethereal to grant buffs too. I like variety... I own tau and love playing them mobile sure I win less that way but I enjoy the match and get actual movement and playing for objectives.

Mech "fish of fury" Tau or a Hammer and Anvil strategy can be a lot of fun to play and interesting enough to play against. Mobile Suit Gundam and Turtle Gunline Tau makes me want to throw up in disgust. Sadly GW seems to encourage big mechs and gunline style of play far more than they encourage mobile units.

How is "drive by" strategy fun to play against? It's just DE but better. They roll up, jump out, rapid fire, hop back in next turn, and leave. How is that fun?

Most armies can perform drive bys so if you don't like a mechanized list using transports without fire ports then that is more than just a Tau problem. Tau getting into the fight and attempting to move on the board is engaging unlike turtling in the corner trying to wipe the board before stepping out of their deployment zone. 12 Fire Warriors in a 70+ point transport is hardly the most point efficient mechanized unit. In that process you described the Fire Warrior unit is shooting in 1 out of 2-3 turns (turn 1 to move up, turn 2 to unload and fire, turn 3 to load up and move out). Dark Eldar can be shooting from inside their transports on turn 1 and don't need to unload until their vehicle explodes or are going in for an assault.

Martel732 wrote:
HAH! The last time I lost was three days ago! Does that make me the Braxton Bragg of 40?

I would rather play with someone who will beat me than someone who is no challenge. I learn more when losing.

 labmouse42 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
HAH! The last time I lost was three days ago! Does that make me the Braxton Bragg of 40?

I would rather play with someone who will beat me than someone who is no challenge. I learn more when losing.

I learned that BA die real good to Tau. I already knew that.

Martel732 wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
HAH! The last time I lost was three days ago! Does that make me the Braxton Bragg of 40?

I would rather play with someone who will beat me than someone who is no challenge. I learn more when losing.

I learned that BA die real good to Tau. I already knew that.

TBF, everything dies really good to Tau

 Torus wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
HAH! The last time I lost was three days ago! Does that make me the Braxton Bragg of 40?

I would rather play with someone who will beat me than someone who is no challenge. I learn more when losing.

I learned that BA die real good to Tau. I already knew that.

TBF, everything dies really good to Tau

I disagree.

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Torus wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
HAH! The last time I lost was three days ago! Does that make me the Braxton Bragg of 40?

I would rather play with someone who will beat me than someone who is no challenge. I learn more when losing.

I learned that BA die real good to Tau. I already knew that.

TBF, everything dies really good to Tau

I disagree.

Facepalm all you want, they have every USR related to shooting and I've never seen a unit in the game that they haven't had a hard time ripping to pieces. They might not win every time but that firepower can murder ANYTHING

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
The last time I lost 40k was about two years ago.

Then either you are the Miyamoto Musashi of 40k, or you need to get out and play new people.

I suspect he's more the Kramer of the Dojo.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
The last time I lost 40k was about two years ago.

Then either you are the Miyamoto Musashi of 40k, or you need to get out and play new people.

Last Time I lost a game was in 6th, but I havent played a game since then due to work constraints