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Made in us
Brigadier General






Chicago

Last night was our first try at Dragon Rampant. I did use Lion Rampant unit profiles since that was the book I had borrowed the week before, but it didn't seem to affect the game negatively.

It seems to take bits from Saga, Song of Blades and maybe even HOTT and distill them down into a slick ruleset. Neither of us had tried Rampant before but we finished 2 games in under 3 hours including setup. I've been looking for a platoon'ish ruleset for some time that would fill the gap between my favorite warband skirmish ruleset Song of Blades and my preferred Company level game Kings of War. I think I may have found it!

Two batreps and my review/observations here:
http://www.chicagoskirmishwargames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=108&p=671#p671
And of course some pics to entice you to visit...






Chicago Skirmish Wargames club. Join us for some friendly, casual gaming in the Windy City.
http://chicagoskirmishwargames.com/blog/


My Project Log, mostly revolving around custom "Toybashed" terrain.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/651712.page

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Made in au
Unstoppable Bloodthirster of Khorne





Melbourne .au

Looks great. Come over here this evening and teach me the rules. I'll supply the models.

   
Made in us
Brigadier General






Chicago

On my way!
Let me just call my pilot...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/02/27 03:54:50


Chicago Skirmish Wargames club. Join us for some friendly, casual gaming in the Windy City.
http://chicagoskirmishwargames.com/blog/


My Project Log, mostly revolving around custom "Toybashed" terrain.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/651712.page

Visit the Chicago Valley Railroad!
https://chicagovalleyrailroad.blogspot.com 
   
Made in us
Battlefield Tourist




MN (Currently in WY)

Mind if I add a brief review of my own to this thread?

Edit; I was thinking of using Skylanders in this ruleset for a game with my kid.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/03/03 16:08:52


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Made in us
Brigadier General






Chicago

 Easy E wrote:
Mind if I add a brief review of my own to this thread?

Edit; I was thinking of using Skylanders in this ruleset for a game with my kid.


I'd love to read your review. Post away!

Skylanders is an interesting idea and probably would work well. These simple rulesets lend themselves well to toy-gaming for kids, especially since they tend to have good core mechanics that play well even when you leave out some of the special and more advanced rules. I've had a great time playing Song of Blades with LEGO bricks and minifigs.

Chicago Skirmish Wargames club. Join us for some friendly, casual gaming in the Windy City.
http://chicagoskirmishwargames.com/blog/


My Project Log, mostly revolving around custom "Toybashed" terrain.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/651712.page

Visit the Chicago Valley Railroad!
https://chicagovalleyrailroad.blogspot.com 
   
Made in us
Battlefield Tourist




MN (Currently in WY)

Dragon Rampant- Osprey Publishing

I recently finished reading and reviewing the Lion Rampant rules. That game focused on medieval knights and their retinues in skirmish combat. Scenarios like cattle rustling, plundering, pillaging, and general raiding. Supposedly, such incidents were endemic during the time period and mostly ignored by history books. Instead, Siege was the decisive engagement of the day. You can read the review on Page 2 of this thread:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/650999.page

Anyway, the same author decided to take the Lion Rampant rules and port them over into a Fantasy setting. Therefore, many of the “What I Liked” and other such topics were covered in that Lion Rampant review. However, there are a few key differences that I want to talk a bit about.

Like all Osprey books, the game’s Intro spends some time laying out the design goals. These were mostly around allowing army building away from a single mini source, use Lion Rampant as a base, and allow flexible and fun 80’s style gaming. Did the game succeed?

What’s the Difference
There are three differences between this and Lion Rampant. The big one is the bolt-on fantasy elements. Next is leaders, and the third is the use of Strength Points.

Let’s start with the last point first. In Lion Rampant, all units are either 6 or 12 models large. There is no variation, and the number of dice rolled for attacking and defending depended on that unit size. In Dragon Rampant, there is no set Unit size. Instead, they have 6 or 12 Strength Points. That means you can have units with a differing amount of model in the unit. You can use the broad categories in the army builder to create a custom unit and add as many (or as few) models into as you have. However, the Unit strength is still either 6 or 12. As these points are reduced, so is the effectiveness of the unit. A single model of Spyro the Dragon can have 12 Strength Points, while a unit of 24 goblin archers could have 6 strength points. This system allows for maximum flexibility in list building, with few on table drawbacks that I could see.

Next, in Lion Rampant your leader was part of a unit and could be killed by a Lucky Blow. This does not seem to exist in Dragon Rampant. The Lucky Blows have been removed. The reason is the more “fantasy” nature of the game, the heroes always make it to the end. In addition, the Duel mechanic has been removed from Dragon Rampant. Other than that, Leaders work just like in Lion Rampant. They can have a unique skill and are part of a unit. However, with the use of Strength Points for units your leader could be a single model, a small retinue, or a regular size unit of troops that he happens to stand with. Heck, your leader could be a 12 Strength point pudding for all the rules care.

Finally, the big difference is the bolt-on fantasy elements. Each unit has a base points cost for the broad troop type it is. These are very similar to the ones in Lion Rampant with a few add-ons for warbeasts, magic-users, and more foot types. Again, they are pretty broad categories for maximum list flexibility. However, these base units all cost points, with the standard battle set at 24. The Bolt-on add-ons are also similarly broad and creative use of the rules to represent what you want on the table is encouraged by the author. Of course, where there are points people will quibble about the costing and what is and isn’t a good deal. Overall, it is pretty straight forward and covers most of the genre elements you would expect with a broad brush. This section will be what makes or breaks the game for most folks. I happen to think it works well based on the design goals.

One other unexpected delight is that almost all the scenarios are unique to Dragon rampant from Lion Rampant. Of course, you can easily port them over from one to the other, and again the author encourages it.

Final Thoughts
If this had been a $40 dollar rulebook, I would have been upset since the entire Battle rules section is a straight lift from Lion Rampant. However, since it was $15 dollars or so and it is a stand-alone game I am pretty pleased with it. Obviously, if you do not like the mechanics from Lion Rampant (Activation tests, Failed activation turn play over to your opponent, 3” Control Zones, Glory and Boasts etc.) than you will not like Dragon Rampant either.

I think the rules do a good job of matching up with the design goals laid out by the author. This is a pretty elegant, simple, and very flexible set of rules that is completely stand-alone from Lion Rampant. You do not need one to play the other. This looks like a great way to get a wide range of fantasy models on the table, and I can see a great time linking Frostgrave and Dragon Rampant for some epic campaigns! Now, Mr. Mersey needs to work on a fantasy game of Big battles possibly riffing off his Dux Bellorum rules? However, I know he is working on a Colonial game instead.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/03/03 18:03:33


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Made in us
Brigadier General






Chicago

Nice review.
I only briefly looked over the Lion Rampant scenarios. If I buy Dragon Rampant, do you think it's worthwhile to purchase Lion Rampant just for the scenarios?

A colonial ruleset in this vein seems like it might lend itself well to fast-play steampunk battles of a larger scope than In Her Majesty's Name.

Chicago Skirmish Wargames club. Join us for some friendly, casual gaming in the Windy City.
http://chicagoskirmishwargames.com/blog/


My Project Log, mostly revolving around custom "Toybashed" terrain.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/651712.page

Visit the Chicago Valley Railroad!
https://chicagovalleyrailroad.blogspot.com 
   
Made in gb
Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant





Teesside

Dragon Rampant is fantastic. Must have had about a dozen games of it with my son since I got it for him for Xmas, which is good going since I've had not much more than a dozen days hanging out with him since then. Picked up my own copy too.

There's a lot of depth to it, yet it's super easy to learn. I ran a 5-player game of it, with 3 new players, the youngest of whom was 6... they all sussed it out really rapidly, but felt like they had interesting choices.

My painting & modelling blog: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/699224.page

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Made in us
Battlefield Tourist




MN (Currently in WY)

 Eilif wrote:
Nice review.
I only briefly looked over the Lion Rampant scenarios. If I buy Dragon Rampant, do you think it's worthwhile to purchase Lion Rampant just for the scenarios?

A colonial ruleset in this vein seems like it might lend itself well to fast-play steampunk battles of a larger scope than In Her Majesty's Name.


I don't think you need to buy Lion Rampant for the Scenarios. Sure, it is relatively cheap, but I think most somewhat experienced wargamers can come up with some decent scenarios on their own. Now, if you plan on playing some Medieval Historical Knight style games AND want the scenarios then i would recommend it.

If I recall, you guys played "Of Gods and Mortals", what was your thoughts on that compared to dragon Rampant? You touched on it on the blog, but was curious to learn more.

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Made in us
Brigadier General






Chicago

At first try I enjoyed OGAM. At the time it seemed like just the thing to fill the slot for a platoon sized fantasy warband game. The supplied army official lists (in the book and online) were big enough to encompass/proxy most any fantasy trope. We were very familiar with SBH and it was our first try at the SBH reaction system that is now in Advanced SBH. However, after a second try it felt a bit like we were trying to make the game something it wasn't. For "Mythic" settings or if you want a fantasy game where gods play an active roll it's a great game, but I think we are looking more for a traditional fantasy game.

I will of course have to play a few more games, but as I say in the review, I really do think that Dragon Rampant may complete my triumvirate of Warband/Platoon/Company fantasy games now consisting of SBH, KoW and Rampant respectively.

Chicago Skirmish Wargames club. Join us for some friendly, casual gaming in the Windy City.
http://chicagoskirmishwargames.com/blog/


My Project Log, mostly revolving around custom "Toybashed" terrain.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/651712.page

Visit the Chicago Valley Railroad!
https://chicagovalleyrailroad.blogspot.com 
   
 
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