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This is something that sparked my curiosity after my last thread on the Necrons. As many know, the Necrons received a significant reboot in the 5th edition in terms of lore and background, with the C'tan no longer being the masters of the Necrons and the Necrons instead more ''Tomb Kings in Space''. How many enjoy this new approach to the fluff that has been the current lore surrounding the Necrons and how many prefer the old fluff with the C'tan as masters of the Necrons?

Deffinatly the new ones as the army now has more than the one dimension of kill everything to feed a intergalatic vampire. Now they can argue with each other scheme and plot against themselves and others, some now like to treat others as vermin to be destroyed aka old style others like to bargain and still others give ultamatiums, the various characters have there own motivations and alliances.
There just so much more than they were.

Newcrons. Mainly because the new Necrons actually have things like character and depth whereas oldcrons were a one dimensional NPC race with less character than the damn Nids. NIDS.

This is my thread!

TruCrons all the way. Still holding up the record for the most misunderstood and misinterpretated fluff in the entirety of 40k ("Necrons = metal Tyranids").

TruCrons represent the incredibly sad story of a race that was first cursed by fate, forced to die at a young age, then "helped" by gods, only to be cursed again, this time by their own greed or hate, betrayed by the very beings they trusted their future in, made extinct and disappear from existence. The Necrontyr basically committed suicide to achieve immortality, yet lost everything they were, effectively becoming mindless slaves to the mightiest corporeal beings in the universe of 40k, the C'tan, unexplicable beings surpassing everything else in power, even The Emperor (if the Void Dragon hasn't been weakened).

TruCrons represent the perfect army - led by gods, the nigh-endless masses of mindless robots, being devoid of anything but hate for life and the protocols they follow, they truly march immortal. They don't need food, they have no emotions, they are immune to shock and most of all, they are nigh-immortal, ever teleporting back to their Tomb World to be repaired in short time, with the only counter mechanism being the total destruction of the Tomb World itself. Their insane techonological advance, granted by the C'Tan, allows the Necron army to even bypass the most secure fortifications and teleport an army right into the enemy's heart.

This kind of lore is just something a lot of people could not understand or, rather, get behind. The mere concept of an army that wants to do nothing but kill and destroy without remorse or weakness was too bland for a lot of people who absolutely need an army's fluff to never derive from the generic "we haz a base and we wantz to conquer ze universe" content, i.e. IoM 101. In a foolish attempt, Matt Ward tried to publish a bunch of Imperial lies as "new lore", but fortunately failed to only blind a bunch of fools, willing to buy into everything they are told.

"I like ze new fluff, it's easy and I like easy."

"I like when other races are similar to my race, easy to understand!"

- Newcron "lore" lovers

This, of course, neatly blends in into the actual Necron fluff and is the best that could happen to them: with their enemies greatly underestimating their strength, the C'tan army keeps awakening and with the IoM being too focused on Chaos, Orks and Tyranids and the Eldar being weakened and not being listened to, it's only a matter of time before another scoring takes place and life in the entire universe will be on the brink of extinction once again - just as the Necrontyr were so long ago. Or maybe this time, the C'Tan decide to finish it off at last and the last thing the universe will witness is The Nightbringer's dark laughter...

Deal with it, haters!

Oldcrons because they are truly alien and tell a tragic stroy.
Newcrons are just skinny but durable space marines.

OldCrons all the way.

I much prefer the Necrontyr having short lives, envying the Old Ones for having long lives by comparison and making a deal with the devil to overcome their short lives, which in turn cursed them to a life of immortality with nothing but hate for organic beings, strung along by the C'tan.

All I could gather from NewCron fluff was that they had an empire, went to sleep now want their empire back. Snagged a few cosmic beings too, just because reasons.

As for Necrons = Metal Tyranids, well OldCrons are Evil Order, Tyranids are Evil Chaos.

Newcrons, hands down. They finally have personality, and C'Tan make for really crappy Great Old Ones. If you want to go Lovecraft-in-Space, Oldcrons are not the way to do it, because if the stars are right, then Azathoth stirs, Rl'yeh rises, Cthulhu wakes and reality ends.... they don't use robo-skeletons to kill people off piecemeal.

Newcrons. Oldcrons were one dimensional and kind of boring.

Oldcrons.

It'll always be better to be a relatively obscure and mysterious faction, even if the playable army needs some fleshing out, than be rebooted by The Ward.

Some people say Oldcrons were "bland". Yup, because the Wardcrons and their Lords and Overlords with incredibly stupid names (Szarekh, really?) are not blandness incarnated nor anything.

Also I look at the "fleshed up" Newcrons "with personality" and I only see a bunch of boring stereotypes, for the most part.

Oldcrons. Anybody who thinks that they were bland should read the old Xenology book.

Im new to the game but Oldcrons all the way. (I even went and bought a bunch of the old fluff stuff for them, itsss good.)

Oldcron x 1000. When the 5th ed book dropped, I was reading through the internet about the Newcron fluff and thought it was a hoax. Why did they need ANOTHER faction that was the exact same as the IoM. Just another bunch of space kings running their space peasants at each other.

Before we had a distinct faction that was "mysterious". Sure, they were slightly like Nids, but only in the way that they wouldent talk to humans. Do you know what else doesnt try to reason with humans? Every other animal on our planet. Why would space animals (or space robots in this case) be acting exactly like us?

The old fluff even explained why all the races were humanoid. The Old Ones created all life, which is why all the major races look the same (heads, arms, eyes, etc). In reality, any living space organism is more likely to be a gas cloud than have working vocal cords.

My $0.02. I am suprised by the amount of Newcron lovers here...

Definitely oldcrons.

The Newcrons might have character, but most of those characters are cliched and/or recycled from Tomb Kings (Imotekh is basically Settra as a robot without the chariot, except Settra flipped off Nagash AND the Chaos Gods whereas Imotekh is confounded by Orks).

Oldcrons were the very embodiment of horror; a lost civilization so vast that it dwarfs anything in the current setting, their numbers were truly undying, their nebulous masters conducted horrible genetic experiments that we see today (which got retconned out), and, most of all, their Gods weren't some figure to be discussed or debated, but actual, tangible forces leading them from the front. The Oldcrons may have lacked individual character, but they were a force of nature, immutable as the laws of the universe they inhabited, and so utterly alien to all the other races that they cannot conceive of their technologies.

But we got essentially "Imperium of Tomb Kings" instead, with the same bickering and incompetence we see in the other armies while our units became "necronfied" versions of Marines. Newcrons technically have individual character now, but I say we took a step back as none of the characters are original, or arguably even fit the Necron's style (Trollzyn in particular feels more like an Ork character than a Necron one, and more than one Creed Joke has been made about Zahndrekh and Obyron).

Oldcrons.

Anyone who thinks oldcrons didn't have personality needs to - as stated above - read Xenology. Oldcron Lords had plenty of personality. Arguably just as much as now, it just wasn't something that was focused on in the fluff like Nemesor Zandrekh being stuck in the past mentally or Imotekh's hand fetish or Anrakyr's *pukes a bit in own mouth* honor and all these other faulty gimmicks and quirks.

And lets not forget that there was also a craving then for a return to bodies of flesh and blood, hence the flayed ones. Instead of robot 28 days later zombies we have now.

And Pariahs. I would like my pariahs back.

And did we really need another Imperialistic faction? We already have the Imperium, the Tau, elements of chaos trying to conquer and rule the galaxy. I actually enjoyed the idea that the Necrons weren't a force trying to rule the galaxy. It added on to the unrelatable aspect of being something truly alien.

There's almost no difference, as far as actual Necrons go.

The newer fluff is better written for actually focusing on the noble ranks and their actions instead of just vaguely mentioning they still have free will, and I like the addition of a sort of middle class in the form of Immortals who have better awareness and function without the full independence of their masters.

The big change is the C'tan retcon. For that, I'd prefer if they'd treaded a little lighter. Kept the big four named C'tan from before active, but had shards of the others floating about.

changemod wrote:

The big change is the C'tan retcon. For that, I'd prefer if they'd treaded a little lighter. Kept the big four named C'tan from before active, but had shards of the others floating about.

This would have been a good idea, as it could easily fit the Necron fluff, i.e. The Deceiver being reponsible for the shattering of all other C'tan besides the major ones. This would also explain the most likely biggest plot hole in the 40k universe, aka Necrons suddenly being able to shatter the most powerful beings in the corporeal universe yet unable to win against the Old Ones on their own - The Deceiver simply helped them and played a major role into shattering them, following his own agenda, maybe manipulating The Outsider to help him.

That would have required a good writer, though, and sadly, Necrons got Matt Ward.

 Sigvatr wrote:

changemod wrote:

The big change is the C'tan retcon. For that, I'd prefer if they'd treaded a little lighter. Kept the big four named C'tan from before active, but had shards of the others floating about.

This would also explain the most likely biggest plot hole in the 40k universe, aka Necrons suddenly being able to shatter the most powerful beings in the corporeal universe yet unable to win against the Old Ones on their own - The Deceiver simply helped them and played a major role into shattering them, following his own agenda, maybe manipulating The Outsider to help him.

That would have required a good writer, though, and sadly, Necrons got Matt Ward.

That and how the necrontyr had a galaxy spanning empire but no ftl travel at the time were probably some of the greatest wtf?! moments in the Necron fluff after Ward had his way with them.

I read Xenology, and played Dark Crusade. I prefer Newcrons overall, though I do miss the whole "Pariah Gene" subplot. Underneath the flamboyance of the Necron character personalities, there's still the old layers of horror and tragedy about the fate of the rank-and-file, especially the description of the basic Warriors, those that weren't fortunate to be given good-quality bodies in the first place. Whether their loss of free will was accidental or by design, it's hard to tell which is a more horrifying reason for their fate.

Oldcrons are fairly amazing, but there are quite a few bits I like out of the newcrons as well. Realistically, I don't have a strong oppinion since I don't really play necrons (I did for a bit back after the 5th 'dex dropped)

I like that their special characters make for good stories and rather funny moments (Trollzyn for lyfe!), but beyond that, newcrons don't have much going for them. Oldcrons had that menace to them, and the mystery, but beyond that nothing much (be it by design or not)

I miss the Oldcron mystery. One of the coolest things about them is how alien they where and how little we knew about them. Additionally Xenology was one of my favorite stories showing just how sinister and powerful the Necrons are. They still had character and could do things like speak, gloat, and plan but everything wasn't out in the open. I'm not a fan of them being another squabbling faction that is fractured.

Newcrons for me.


Even as currently written, their backstory isn't any less tragic.


And the Tyranids have taken the role of the mindless killer horde controlled by a higher being(s).

Oldcrons.

Tooooomb Kiiiings innnnnn Spaaaaaaaaaace are dumb.

Being sinister, mysterious alien intelligences with motivations that humans didn't fully understand is much cooler than a bunch of grumpy sleepyheads.

Plus I hate that they went Grimdark+1 with them, suddenly expanding their numbers into the bajillions. Grimdark+1 has been one of the worst trends in 40K fluff, and Nucrons are just a part of that bad trend.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Oldcrons.

Tooooomb Kiiiings innnnnn Spaaaaaaaaaace are dumb.

Being sinister, mysterious alien intelligences with motivations that humans didn't fully understand is much cooler than a bunch of grumpy sleepyheads.

Plus I hate that they went Grimdark+1 with them, suddenly expanding their numbers into the bajillions. Grimdark+1 has been one of the worst trends in 40K fluff, and Nucrons are just a part of that bad trend.

It's not really grimdark when you realize that the Silent King actually wants to keep humanity alive and forge an alliance with them, and were he able to reawaken and unite his race again for the first time since the War in Heaven, the largest and most powerful military force in the galaxy would be assembled once more to combat Chaos and the Tyranids.

Hell with modern Necron fluff you could even say that they are the real protagonists.

TruCron fluff poses the C'tan as the protagonists as they hold the ultimate power. Even the Chaos Gods are depending on them as the power to annihilate all life in the universe means Chaos losing its power as well. Everything is depending on the C'tan's will and they could easily reforce the rest of the universe at a whim if it just as well pleases them - and with The Void Dragon corrupting mankind from the inside, they are far more influential than one might suggest.

"New"crons without a doubt.
Oldcrons were so dull and one dimensional, and were really just tools for the Crap'tan. People like to bang on about the "mystery" of them, but we already knew everything about them.

Necrons now are way better for narratives and customisation. They make much better antagonists and even protagonists

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Oldcrons.

Tooooomb Kiiiings innnnnn Spaaaaaaaaaace are dumb.

Being sinister, mysterious alien intelligences with motivations that humans didn't fully understand is much cooler than a bunch of grumpy sleepyheads.

Plus I hate that they went Grimdark+1 with them, suddenly expanding their numbers into the bajillions. Grimdark+1 has been one of the worst trends in 40K fluff, and Nucrons are just a part of that bad trend.

It's not really grimdark when you realize that the Silent King actually wants to keep humanity alive and forge an alliance with them, and were he able to reawaken and unite his race again for the first time since the War in Heaven, the largest and most powerful military force in the galaxy would be assembled once more to combat Chaos and the Tyranids.

Hell with modern Necron fluff you could even say that they are the real protagonists.

Okay, so an undying race of Sleeping Botties are the protagonists in a universe that wipes out all of humanity for good, and that's not Grimdark+1 because it kills off the other Grimdark+1 factions?

Nooooot sure that makes a lot of sense. I mean, it isn't grim and dark if you're a Nucron, I guess.

As far as what is or isn't "way better for narratives", it really just represents a shift. Oldcrons were too alien for some people, who wanted heroes and personalities. Nucrons just kinda dumbed down the faction to something more relatable. But it isn't necessarily "way better" because of it. I mean, Tyranids are terrible for narratives too, but that doesn't mean we need Tyranewds where the Swarmlord strikes a truce with Calgar so they can defeat the common threat of the Nucrons.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
As far as what is or isn't "way better for narratives", it really just represents a shift. Oldcrons were too alien for some people, who wanted heroes and personalities. Nucrons just kinda dumbed down the faction to something more relatable.

Oldcrons were hardly alien. In fact they were motivated by entirely human emotion, as simplistic and stunted as it may have been. While Necrons are much more relatable than oldcrons, it is because they were smartened up rather than dumbed down. Oldcrons were simplistic in the extreme, while the current Necrons have more depth and breadth to them.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Oldcrons.

Tooooomb Kiiiings innnnnn Spaaaaaaaaaace are dumb.

Being sinister, mysterious alien intelligences with motivations that humans didn't fully understand is much cooler than a bunch of grumpy sleepyheads.

Plus I hate that they went Grimdark+1 with them, suddenly expanding their numbers into the bajillions. Grimdark+1 has been one of the worst trends in 40K fluff, and Nucrons are just a part of that bad trend.

It's not really grimdark when you realize that the Silent King actually wants to keep humanity alive and forge an alliance with them, and were he able to reawaken and unite his race again for the first time since the War in Heaven, the largest and most powerful military force in the galaxy would be assembled once more to combat Chaos and the Tyranids.

Hell with modern Necron fluff you could even say that they are the real protagonists.

Okay, so an undying race of Sleeping Botties are the protagonists in a universe that wipes out all of humanity for good, and that's not Grimdark+1 because it kills off the other Grimdark+1 factions?

Nooooot sure that makes a lot of sense. I mean, it isn't grim and dark if you're a Nucron, I guess.

As far as what is or isn't "way better for narratives", it really just represents a shift. Oldcrons were too alien for some people, who wanted heroes and personalities. Nucrons just kinda dumbed down the faction to something more relatable. But it isn't necessarily "way better" because of it. I mean, Tyranids are terrible for narratives too, but that doesn't mean we need Tyranewds where the Swarmlord strikes a truce with Calgar so they can defeat the common threat of the Nucrons.

That is a terrifying thought... Just imagine, eventually everyone realizes they just want what's in the best interest of the galaxy and their survival and so join hands and use love and compassion to make the chaos gods realize that they don't need to have people die while playing the great game. Furthermore, in a quest of self discovery, the chaos gods discover that their negative aspects are simply just parts of themselves they need to overcome and so everyone becomes friends. Instead of waaaghhh!'ing, orks playfully wrestle with the likes of Kharn the Befriender to see who's strongest. Dark Angels finally come out to the galaxy revealing what they really are and begin a beautiful friendship with the Dark Eldar. Necrons and eldar now engage in battles of wits over chessboards and publish inspirational books of timeless wisdom for the galaxy at large. The narcissistic image centric twits of Slaanesh teach the Tyranid hive mind the importance of not gorging one's self every time one feels the munchies coming on. Orikan the diviner uses his time traveling abilities to retrieve pieces of lost technology for the adeptus mechanicus... The galaxy would be the largest kumbayah circle in existence...

Except the Hrud. Feth the Hrud.

Oldcron were boring and dumb.
Newcron are boring and dumb but in a different way.

So I dislike both which is why I don't play necrons.

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Oldcrons.

Tooooomb Kiiiings innnnnn Spaaaaaaaaaace are dumb.

Being sinister, mysterious alien intelligences with motivations that humans didn't fully understand is much cooler than a bunch of grumpy sleepyheads.

Plus I hate that they went Grimdark+1 with them, suddenly expanding their numbers into the bajillions. Grimdark+1 has been one of the worst trends in 40K fluff, and Nucrons are just a part of that bad trend.

It's not really grimdark when you realize that the Silent King actually wants to keep humanity alive and forge an alliance with them, and were he able to reawaken and unite his race again for the first time since the War in Heaven, the largest and most powerful military force in the galaxy would be assembled once more to combat Chaos and the Tyranids.

Hell with modern Necron fluff you could even say that they are the real protagonists.

Okay, so an undying race of Sleeping Botties are the protagonists in a universe that wipes out all of humanity for good, and that's not Grimdark+1 because it kills off the other Grimdark+1 factions?

Nooooot sure that makes a lot of sense. I mean, it isn't grim and dark if you're a Nucron, I guess.

As far as what is or isn't "way better for narratives", it really just represents a shift. Oldcrons were too alien for some people, who wanted heroes and personalities. Nucrons just kinda dumbed down the faction to something more relatable. But it isn't necessarily "way better" because of it. I mean, Tyranids are terrible for narratives too, but that doesn't mean we need Tyranewds where the Swarmlord strikes a truce with Calgar so they can defeat the common threat of the Nucrons.

Uh, I think you're missing the point. Newcrons don't want to annihilate humanity. The Silent King wants to forge an alliance with mankind, and has plans of using us as a vassal race or something in the reforged Necron Empire. Szarekh even views Sanguinius as one of the greatest beings in the galaxy. Have to check though, I believe the two actually met, which was how Szarekh swayed Dante over to his side by presenting him with some recording of Sanguinius or something.

Also, Oldcrons needed to go because they really did lack character. All Oldcrons were is Chaos Androids 2.0 with vague lovecraft fluff slapped onto the tin.