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I prefer the old necrons, really, precisely because any individuality and character they had was so low-key. It made them different from the other factions. That nobody knew much about them helped reinforce them being from millions and millions of years ago. Their theme of incomprehensibly advanced conquerors from before time who fought the very Old Ones themselves definitely brought something, ah, new to the setting. That they could look upon the Imperium and the orks and the constant struggles of all the mortal peoples that define 40k and see nothing relevant was refreshing. They simply wanted it all gone. Their one weakness being psychic power also nicely explained what the deal was with psykers and the warp in general as well as humanity's awakening as a psychic species.

That the necrons would then decide to sever the link between reality and the sea of souls, one of the most central aspects of the entire setting, goes to show just what they could be capable of and how alien they were to what was already established.

Ugh... Wardcrons are awful. I'll take the creepy, unrelatable Terminator-bots, which therefore come with a genuine sense of terror, over the "we'll destroy everything and take over just as soon as we decide which of our doomsday and/or time travel devices to use" Mary Sue space Egyptians.

Thanks for everyone who voted in the poll. It was very insightful to see the results.

At least with the Newcrons, I do think they have the misfortune to be basically introduced by Mat Ward, who to be frank, is a terrible writer reviled by 40k fans. I can read the 5th edition Necron book and kinda get how the Necrons come across as goofy and senile rather than scary or threatening. I can see how it would be quite the whiplash compared to the older lore concerning the Necrons.

Now having said that, I do think that the Newcron fluff tends to come across better when in the hands of writers that aren't Mat Ward. I really do prefer the 7th Edition Necron Codex in terms of describing the Necrons, which I think emphasizes the cold and pitiless aspects of the Necrons a bit more while scaling back some of the more goofy aspects of the Newcrons. One of my favorite parts of the 7th edition book was the little blurb about how a Overlord is fighting some Space Wolves and almost feels something akin to excitement and fear in a battle, but he quickly loses that feeling because he's a soulless machine who lost those emotions a long time ago.

Fantasy Flight Games, Black Library and Imperial Armour, I think, also handled aspects of the Newcron fluff better.

Fisheyes wrote:

My $0.02. I am suprised by the amount of Newcron lovers here...

I was quite surprised to. It's been roughly neck to neck so far as of the time of my post right now. I think (and I'm not trying to criticize your opinion at all) people critical of changes tend to be more vocal about it than people who just accept it and move on. There appears at least to be a silent constituency that's just not very vocal.

Oldcrons. The only reason they aren't my favourite is because of their crappy new lore.

Pre newcron my rankings were 1. Necrons 2. Tau and 3. Dark Eldar.

I was at some point planning to get a 40k army way back then and had my hopes set on them. Then the newcrons happened and now I think their lore is extremely stupid in comparison.

So 1. Tau 2. Dark Eldar and 3. Necrons.

I've got a small Dark Eldar army on the side. If it wasn't for that lore change or if it wasn't so bad and kept a bit more of the old lore I might have them at #2 spot.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Veteran Sergeant wrote:
Oldcrons.

Tooooomb Kiiiings innnnnn Spaaaaaaaaaace are dumb.

Being sinister, mysterious alien intelligences with motivations that humans didn't fully understand is much cooler than a bunch of grumpy sleepyheads.

Plus I hate that they went Grimdark+1 with them, suddenly expanding their numbers into the bajillions. Grimdark+1 has been one of the worst trends in 40K fluff, and Nucrons are just a part of that bad trend.

It's not really grimdark when you realize that the Silent King actually wants to keep humanity alive and forge an alliance with them, and were he able to reawaken and unite his race again for the first time since the War in Heaven, the largest and most powerful military force in the galaxy would be assembled once more to combat Chaos and the Tyranids.

Hell with modern Necron fluff you could even say that they are the real protagonists.

Okay, so an undying race of Sleeping Botties are the protagonists in a universe that wipes out all of humanity for good, and that's not Grimdark+1 because it kills off the other Grimdark+1 factions?

Nooooot sure that makes a lot of sense. I mean, it isn't grim and dark if you're a Nucron, I guess.

As far as what is or isn't "way better for narratives", it really just represents a shift. Oldcrons were too alien for some people, who wanted heroes and personalities. Nucrons just kinda dumbed down the faction to something more relatable. But it isn't necessarily "way better" because of it. I mean, Tyranids are terrible for narratives too, but that doesn't mean we need Tyranewds where the Swarmlord strikes a truce with Calgar so they can defeat the common threat of the Nucrons.

Uh, I think you're missing the point. Newcrons don't want to annihilate humanity. The Silent King wants to forge an alliance with mankind, and has plans of using us as a vassal race or something in the reforged Necron Empire. Szarekh even views Sanguinius as one of the greatest beings in the galaxy. Have to check though, I believe the two actually met, which was how Szarekh swayed Dante over to his side by presenting him with some recording of Sanguinius or something.

Also, Oldcrons needed to go because they really did lack character. All Oldcrons were is Chaos Androids 2.0 with vague lovecraft fluff slapped onto the tin.

Do they really want mankind alive? What the hell kind of stupid lore is that? I didn't even know this is lore but it makes me hate them even more now. Ugh. Like fan fiction tier level of lore. And then they become best of "friends" and do lots of special missions with each other down under. If you catch my drift.

Edit
If I ever do make a Necron army it will be an Oldcron style one.

While the race background for the Oldcrons was superior, the Newcrons gave us fan-fething-tastic Special Characters I just wouldn't want to be without at this point. Nemesor and Trazyn are plain gold.

I know I'm late to the party, but I've got to drop another vote for the oldcrons. There may not have been as much detail on individual characters, but they FELT different than other factions. A Necron story didn't feel the same way a Tyranid story felt. While Tyranids will always be your basic swarm of alien locusts, Necron stories were always shrouded in mystery.

They didn't just want to eat, like Tyranids. The C'tan had been messing around with human affairs since the dawn of mankind. Sure, they were a less personal, more distant enemy, but that also made them different than CSM, Dark Eldar, Orks, and all the other baddies. To them, the IoM aren't their arch rivals. Humanity is just livestock and potential tools, another civilization like the millions they've seen rise and fall. Their only real rival is the Warp, because it's the only thing that's close to the same age as they are.

And there was the technology. The way oldcron's technology was handled was creepy in itself. Particularly in Battlefleet Gothic. Again it was wrapped in mystery. None of Ward's "we have devices that can control time, and other super doomsday weapons, but we rarely use them and don't reproduce them because of reasons guyz." You'd just be living your life on a colony and a massive Necron warship just APPEARS in the sky, and it's harvest time. No advance warning. Nothing. FTL travel without going through another dimension (the Warp or the Webway) has been found to be literally impossible by every other sentient race, but the Necrons do it and no one knows how. Even Terra's defense systems failed to keep them out.

The Hive Fleets avoided Necron space, and it was left in the air whether this was just because of a lack of biomass, or if the Hive Mind was AFRAID of them. Basically, there was this sense that these guys just might be able to curb stomp every other faction, but they'd lost their masters and lacked the will to do it without them. And their masters were starting to get active again... They were more alien, scarier, and better because of it.

Newcrons are just humans, in shiny metal clothes with cool gadgets, and their coolest gadgets are basically just archeotech, since it's only in limited supply and they rarely use it (again, for no good reason). They're a bunch of mostly self-centered secular despots instead of religious fanatics, but they're not ancient aliens. And like every other faction except Tyranids and Tau, they're split into a bunch of bickering, feuding rival factions. There's no difference between these jokers and any number of Imperial, Chaos, and Eldar factions, even if their guns shoot different colored ammo and make different pew pew sounds.

PS- I think that some of the better newcron fluff could be added to the oldcron fluff without too much effort. Trazyn, for instance, works just fine as one of the more active Necron Lords, possibly a lackey of The Deceiver, maybe loyal, maybe plotting to supplant his master one day. Most of the newcron special characters aren't all that great though, honestly. We don't need more mad scientists or generic overlords in the setting. I trade a hundred Imhoteks for the Pariahs to come back.

 fallinq wrote:
I know I'm late to the party, but I've got to drop another vote for the oldcrons. There may not have been as much detail on individual characters, but they FELT different than other factions. A Necron story didn't feel the same way a Tyranid story felt. While Tyranids will always be your basic swarm of alien locusts, Necron stories were always shrouded in mystery.

They didn't just want to eat, like Tyranids. The C'tan had been messing around with human affairs since the dawn of mankind. Sure, they were a less personal, more distant enemy, but that also made them different than CSM, Dark Eldar, Orks, and all the other baddies. To them, the IoM aren't their arch rivals. Humanity is just livestock and potential tools, another civilization like the millions they've seen rise and fall. Their only real rival is the Warp, because it's the only thing that's close to the same age as they are.

And there was the technology. The way oldcron's technology was handled was creepy in itself. Particularly in Battlefleet Gothic. Again it was wrapped in mystery. None of Ward's "we have devices that can control time, and other super doomsday weapons, but we rarely use them and don't reproduce them because of reasons guyz." You'd just be living your life on a colony and a massive Necron warship just APPEARS in the sky, and it's harvest time. No advance warning. Nothing. FTL travel without going through another dimension (the Warp or the Webway) has been found to be literally impossible by every other sentient race, but the Necrons do it and no one knows how. Even Terra's defense systems failed to keep them out.

The Hive Fleets avoided Necron space, and it was left in the air whether this was just because of a lack of biomass, or if the Hive Mind was AFRAID of them. Basically, there was this sense that these guys just might be able to curb stomp every other faction, but they'd lost their masters and lacked the will to do it without them. And their masters were starting to get active again... They were more alien, scarier, and better because of it.

Newcrons are just humans, in shiny metal clothes with cool gadgets, and their coolest gadgets are basically just archeotech, since it's only in limited supply and they rarely use it (again, for no good reason). They're a bunch of mostly self-centered secular despots instead of religious fanatics, but they're not ancient aliens. And like every other faction except Tyranids and Tau, they're split into a bunch of bickering, feuding rival factions. There's no difference between these jokers and any number of Imperial, Chaos, and Eldar factions, even if their guns shoot different colored ammo and make different pew pew sounds.

Hear hear. Which is why I'm struggling to find a new faction I actually like. Necrons used to be more sci-fi/lovecraftian. Now they're more fantasy leaving us with a dearth of sci-fi related factions. While this is all "fantasy" some of it is more sci-fi and some more fantasy in how they come across. I would like to see a new interesting Xenos or robotic faction enter the game based off of more sci-fi tropes instead of just filling in fantasy niches. I like Tyranids a lot as well because they have more sci-fi to them. I'm not much of a fan of the Imperium or its many sub factions except the adeptus mechanicus/skitarrii.

Edit
I think it would be a great sub-faction of Necrons to release a new sub-faction of Necrons that are based on the old lore with unique formations they use and maybe even a model or two that is different alongside additional whatever necron relics are called for this new sub faction to use. There is clearly a large demand for a Necron faction to be like the old one. So why not make it so?

 Gamgee wrote:

I think it would be a great sub-faction of Necrons to release a new sub-faction of Necrons that are based on the old lore with unique formations they use and maybe even a model or two that is different alongside additional whatever necron relics are called for this new sub faction to use. There is clearly a large demand for a Necron faction to be like the old one. So why not make it so?

A C'tan loyalist faction? I could get behind that. Even if the fluff is handled clumsily (a lot of the new fluff doesn't do much for me) it'd be a good excuse to add the Pariahs back into the game.

At least you have the Genestealer Cults coming your way. For a 'nid player looking for more alien factions with a sci-fi feel, that seems like a nice addition.

I know but Nids aren't that cool. They are in my top 5 at #4 but I would prefer more robots please or Cthulhu style faction. Just something to shake things up a bit.

I'm kind of impressed how even it is.

I like Newcrons simply because Terminator ripoffs were soooo stale.

With the new fluff you can still have those... and you can have much more as well.

-Oh your Tomb World was corrupted and now they are deathbots? Cool with me.
-Your Tomb World is being controlled by a C'tan Shard? Cool with me.
-Your Tomb World is researching how to combat the Flayer Virus? Awesome.

Before there was nothing to be invested in, no goal. The one thing the Newcrons messed up doing was it explained the technological capabilities too much. If the embellishment of certain parts were held off a touch more they would still have the mystique they previously had.

 fallinq wrote:
I know I'm late to the party, but I've got to drop another vote for the oldcrons. There may not have been as much detail on individual characters, but they FELT different than other factions. A Necron story didn't feel the same way a Tyranid story felt. While Tyranids will always be your basic swarm of alien locusts, Necron stories were always shrouded in mystery.

They didn't just want to eat, like Tyranids. The C'tan had been messing around with human affairs since the dawn of mankind. Sure, they were a less personal, more distant enemy, but that also made them different than CSM, Dark Eldar, Orks, and all the other baddies. To them, the IoM aren't their arch rivals. Humanity is just livestock and potential tools, another civilization like the millions they've seen rise and fall. Their only real rival is the Warp, because it's the only thing that's close to the same age as they are.

And there was the technology. The way oldcron's technology was handled was creepy in itself. Particularly in Battlefleet Gothic. Again it was wrapped in mystery. None of Ward's "we have devices that can control time, and other super doomsday weapons, but we rarely use them and don't reproduce them because of reasons guyz." You'd just be living your life on a colony and a massive Necron warship just APPEARS in the sky, and it's harvest time. No advance warning. Nothing. FTL travel without going through another dimension (the Warp or the Webway) has been found to be literally impossible by every other sentient race, but the Necrons do it and no one knows how. Even Terra's defense systems failed to keep them out.

The Hive Fleets avoided Necron space, and it was left in the air whether this was just because of a lack of biomass, or if the Hive Mind was AFRAID of them. Basically, there was this sense that these guys just might be able to curb stomp every other faction, but they'd lost their masters and lacked the will to do it without them. And their masters were starting to get active again... They were more alien, scarier, and better because of it.

Newcrons are just humans, in shiny metal clothes with cool gadgets, and their coolest gadgets are basically just archeotech, since it's only in limited supply and they rarely use it (again, for no good reason). They're a bunch of mostly self-centered secular despots instead of religious fanatics, but they're not ancient aliens. And like every other faction except Tyranids and Tau, they're split into a bunch of bickering, feuding rival factions. There's no difference between these jokers and any number of Imperial, Chaos, and Eldar factions, even if their guns shoot different colored ammo and make different pew pew sounds.

PS- I think that some of the better newcron fluff could be added to the oldcron fluff without too much effort. Trazyn, for instance, works just fine as one of the more active Necron Lords, possibly a lackey of The Deceiver, maybe loyal, maybe plotting to supplant his master one day. Most of the newcron special characters aren't all that great though, honestly. We don't need more mad scientists or generic overlords in the setting. I trade a hundred Imhoteks for the Pariahs to come back.

Well said.

 Quickjager wrote:
I'm kind of impressed how even it is.

Necrons were very unpopular for a long time and the worst faction by a long shot. They got a lot of attention with the new codex, plus the new codex heavily caters to the Call of Duty / Transformers crowd which is a significantally bigger audience than the older one had. A lot of people don't like changes or different factions, they are happy with reskins of existing ones, and the NewCron codex is perfect for them. Less thinking, more ridiculously overblown crap.

If you actually want a good comparison, then the NewCron codex is Transformers 3. Very successful, lots of shiny stuff and explosions, but has as much soul as a Necron Warrior.

Oldcrons by a mile for me.
Whilst some of the newer characters are quirky and semi interesting, the feel of the old automated wall of death (without any known purpose which could be fathomed) was infinitely scarier than Trayzn and his musings.

The nice thing about the old necrons is that they made humanity embracing chaos and bring the full might of the warp against them seem like a good idea.

They made the central horror of the setting look like a necessary ally.

Oldcrons for certain.
Back then, a friend of mine started collecting them and I started reading the fluff in their codex while I was visiting one day.
They were so alien, and mysterious. I could not grasp where they were coming from why they pop in outta nowhere and silently butcher everything and vanish without a trace. That dex gave me goosebumps and not gonna lie- it freaking gave me nightmares that night.
I refused to play against his necrons simply because they creeped the hell outta me.

Necrons today. No mystery, they're imperfect, socially weak, self destructive and feel completely unthreatening to me.

I like aspects of both. If we could keep the vague Loftcraftian murder bot vibe and combine it with some of the new, more personable Necrons I think we'd be golden.

Zond wrote:
I like aspects of both. If we could keep the vague Loftcraftian murder bot vibe and combine it with some of the new, more personable Necrons I think we'd be golden.

I could be open to that. I have no idea why lords with personality couldn't be made by the Ctan. For example maybe the enhanced intellect given to the newly awakening Lords/Overlords/Whatever has caused sparks of their personality to manifest again since it is a side effect of giving them greater autonomy to conduct raids and increase their strategic capabilities. Then they could still be in service to the Ctan.


It just boggles me they threw out so much good lore bending over backward to get personalities into their lore when they had no need to devastate it like they did.

I prefer the oldcrons.

Not just because of the whole horror vibe, which has been discussed to death, but because their technology made more sense and seemed more consistent.

Like, ok the newcrons can manipulate time and space, and can create pocket dimensions...why the feth haven't they made a TARDIS yet? Why are they still hijacking the webway, like a bunch of Egyptian Space hobos?

If the Doomsday can be made into a destroying planet bomb, why don't the necrons just do that? I mean, robots don't need much room or resources, right? They could just glass a planet, move on.

Oh, and the celestial orrery is really stupid. Like, if the necrons could build something like that, how come they haven't won? They could subjugate even the IoM with that thing.
It's really convenient that such a weapon happens to be in the hands of pacifists, which is so contrived it hurts.

Why are the necron vehicles open? Is it to feel the air in their non existent hair? I get they were going for an Egyptian theme, but exposing the pilots like that is pretty stupid. I know that it has a force field, but tempting fate doesn't seem logical.

Tl;dr Basically Ward / modern GW writing.

On a side note, Trazyn in a TARDIS is either hilarious or scary. Probably both.
Coincidentally, Trazyn is also the only new Necron character who is actually somewhat interesting.

Implacable Terminator-bots led by Lovecraftian horrors all the way!!

Honestly, i could live with Newcrons (yes they turned up the Egyptian iconography, but again, i can live with that) if they weren't so damn mustache twirlingly evil!! Seriously, its like watching a Chaos Lord and a Sorcerer bickering while twirling mustaches half the time, its annoying.

So ya, give me my Flayed ones who are driven mad by an Eldar virus and led by the Aspect of Death Itself all supported by the slow and unstoppable Monolith.

SILVER LEGION FOREVER!!

 Grimmor wrote:

So ya, give me my Flayed ones who are driven mad by an Eldar virus and led by the Aspect of Death Itself all supported by the slow and unstoppable Monolith.

SILVER LEGION FOREVER!!

An Eldar virus? Excuse me?

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Grimmor wrote:

So ya, give me my Flayed ones who are driven mad by an Eldar virus and led by the Aspect of Death Itself all supported by the slow and unstoppable Monolith.

SILVER LEGION FOREVER!!

An Eldar virus? Excuse me?

Am i remembering wrong? Or are the Eldar taking credit for stuff they didnt do again.

 Grimmor wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Grimmor wrote:

So ya, give me my Flayed ones who are driven mad by an Eldar virus and led by the Aspect of Death Itself all supported by the slow and unstoppable Monolith.

SILVER LEGION FOREVER!!

An Eldar virus? Excuse me?

Am i remembering wrong? Or are the Eldar taking credit for stuff they didnt do again.

It was one of the C'tans (with a weird name I can't remember) that cursed the Necrons moments before he was sundered into shards. He was <Insert Name Here> the Flayer. Er, something of that gist.

 krodarklorr wrote:
It was one of the C'tans (with a weird name I can't remember) that cursed the Necrons moments before he was sundered into shards. He was <Insert Name Here> the Flayer. Er, something of that gist.

I found that one, thats the 5th ed fluff. I was horribly mis-rememebring the old fluff. 4th ed down Flayed ones where Necrons that somehow retained a small shard of their emotions, and as such went completely and utterly bat insane, probably from being alone and immobile for 60 million years. And they used to be really sadistic, like they would flay people before they were dead, instead of just murder the crap out them.

 Grimmor wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:
It was one of the C'tans (with a weird name I can't remember) that cursed the Necrons moments before he was sundered into shards. He was <Insert Name Here> the Flayer. Er, something of that gist.

I found that one, thats the 5th ed fluff. I was horribly mis-rememebring the old fluff. 4th ed down Flayed ones where Necrons that somehow retained a small shard of their emotions, and as such went completely and utterly bat insane, probably from being alone and immobile for 60 million years. And they used to be really sadistic, like they would flay people before they were dead, instead of just murder the crap out them.

Yup, sounds about right.

 Grimmor wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:
It was one of the C'tans (with a weird name I can't remember) that cursed the Necrons moments before he was sundered into shards. He was <Insert Name Here> the Flayer. Er, something of that gist.

I found that one, thats the 5th ed fluff. I was horribly mis-rememebring the old fluff. 4th ed down Flayed ones where Necrons that somehow retained a small shard of their emotions, and as such went completely and utterly bat insane, probably from being alone and immobile for 60 million years. And they used to be really sadistic, like they would flay people before they were dead, instead of just murder the crap out them.

I remember that. I think it was sensory deprivation that made them insane. Some kind of "bug in the system" so to speak, made them intelligent enough to be aware of it, and too sensitive to cope with it. That's why they put skin on themselves, in a futile attempt to physically feel again. As for skinning people alive, that was probably due to hatred born out of jealousy.

Well, looking at my copy of the 3rd edition Necron book, it just talks about how the Flayed Ones drape themselves in skin and terrify the enemy. There's nothing about any sort of Eldar virus or bug in the system. Index Xenos: Necrons doesn't mention anything deeper either.

The only mention about the Eldar and Flayed Ones come from some Newcron fluff about Craftworld Alaitoc infecting the Bone Kingdom with the flayer virus.

Interesting how close the poll is staying. Based on what I've read online, and based on the majority of the comments in this thread, I would have thought I was one of the few who actually prefers the new fluff.

Gree wrote:
Well, looking at my copy of the 3rd edition Necron book, it just talks about how the Flayed Ones drape themselves in skin and terrify the enemy. There's nothing about any sort of Eldar virus or bug in the system. Index Xenos: Necrons doesn't mention anything deeper either.

The only mention about the Eldar and Flayed Ones come from some Newcron fluff about Craftworld Alaitoc infecting the Bone Kingdom with the flayer virus.

Huh, that's odd.
My codex doesn't mention that either. I know that they talk about that somewhere, but I can't remember the source.
Was it xenology?

 EnTyme wrote:
Interesting how close the poll is staying. Based on what I've read online, and based on the majority of the comments in this thread, I would have thought I was one of the few who actually prefers the new fluff.

New fluff > Old fluff

 krodarklorr wrote:

 EnTyme wrote:
Interesting how close the poll is staying. Based on what I've read online, and based on the majority of the comments in this thread, I would have thought I was one of the few who actually prefers the new fluff.

New fluff > Old fluff

Theres stuff from the Newcrons i like, Lychguard are cool, Praetorans are neat, the Ghost ark is cool in concept but the model looks stupid. Cypteks are an awesome concept, mad scientist Necrons, but have gotten lamer in the new book.

I could get past the mustache twirling if they hadn't taken away Pariahs!!!