LValx wrote:
I'm not picking on TK, im genuinely curious.... I apologize as if I came off as badgering. I am all for hordes and changes to the meta, but unfortunately in my only game vs renegades we only got to turn 3... in fact, the only games in 7th ive faced hordes in have gone 4 turns or less. So if you can make it to 5 with this army, more power to you and I am not against using it in competitive play at all. But people who know they cannot play fast enough really should be courteous and not bring such lists. Horde armies fair better the shorter the game is, I know because I play a horde style army myself. That + the respawns can lead to some abuse with slowplay. Not that I think you'd be a person to do that as you've done well with a wide variety of armies!

Spoiler:

His turn one he tries to move his warp spiders forward but rolls poorly and elects to keep them back. His swooping hawks with the autarch jump away. He rolled to hold obj 1 and to hold objective 3... he isnt in range to get either.
I roll to score objective 3 and to score objective 2. I successfully put the grim on the knight for a potential beta strike. I advance up with the knight and a few squads to take the middle objective 2. I summon a unit of pink horrors but they mishap and go into ongoing reserves. I proceed to bubble wrap my own objectives and the horrors for future turns. I believe he may deep strike in with his wraithguard and kill off the horror and the herald in one fell swoop. I thought first strike was still active this round so i make an effort to kill his dark reapers with some dakka... However, the knight takes them out with his battle cannon alone as i roll two hits and he fails 5 of 6 4+ saves... I believe I have bubble wrapped my objectives well enough to hold them. We will see if he shoots me off of them and then moves to contest them.

Spoiler:

He fails to score either of his maelstrom objectives as I shot his dark reapers off of their objective the turn prior. He rolls Score objective 1 and to destroy a unit this turn.
The swooping hawks enter play behind the imperial knight in the center... his war walkers out flank in the back corner to also target the knight. The Archon with the wraithguard enter play in the center of the board right in front of the knight... he is going for the kill. He deepstrikes his raiders in with one landing next to the squad on my objective 3, Another raider comes in but mishaps and returns to reserves. He proceeds to fire everything at the CK. I put the 2+ against the flamers as all 3 do potential damage... i manage to make the saves and take no damage. The swooping hawks attempt some haywire shots into the CK and with a 3+ i save the one damage result... the warwalkers target the rear armor and actually manage 3 glances with S6 shooting... I only save 2 of them and take 1 HP of damage. His warriors in the raider dakka my guys on the objective and I take a lot of casualties but they hold. His mandrakes which outflanked on the far side fire into my closest squad and do a ton of damage as well. The squads are dwindling in size with my warlord in the middle blob. Luckily they all still hold.

For my turn 2:
I score both objectives as I had OBJ 2 secured at the bottom of the picture. I managed to maintain objective 3 in my deployment zone to score a 2 to 0 lead. I ate wendy's for lunch and have the bag at the lower left I roll my maelstrom objectives and get 4 & 5. I decide to go for 3 kill points. Im facings msu eldar... should be an easy job especially with the knight potentially killing 2 himself if I charge and wipe either the wraithguard of swooping hawks. I roll for my reserves and keep the nurglings in reserve as well as the Vet squad. The pink horrors from last turn come in again as I try to deepstrike them next to his raider on the far side... they scatter and mishap again and i roll a killing a unit for my opponent. I summon another unit of horrors and they mishap i get misalign and my opponent places them in the bottom right corner staring at his warp spiders. I begin to dakka his squads... multiple units target the raider as I perceive it as a soft target. It makes a ton of 3+ saves but finally goes down to weight of dice. (1KP) I dakka his swooping hawks and mandrakes to no avail as they survive. The CK with grim shoots the wraithguard and manages to kill 2 of them before charging... he kills only one in combat and his stomps fail to score a 6... I have only killed one unit this turn... however, i still have his turn to finish that squad.

Spoiler:

My opponent scores his two maelstrom objectives tying the game up... he rolls objective 1, 4. My opponent deepstrikes the last of his reserves too include both of his remaining raiders. One mishaps and I place it in the back corner facing the opposite direction. He moves his warp spiders down and shoots my pink horrors in the corner finishing them off. scoring kill a unit. His mandrakes move up and charge my outside unit on the far flank and wipe them in combat. His warwalkers move up and dakka my warlords squad. In the center his autarch separates from his unit and heads towards my warlords unit. The autarch charges in and rolls poorly. I actually score two wounds and manage to win combat by one and he flee's... I fail to sweep him though. I still have a chance to score 3 VP's if I can kill 2 units this turn. We roll the knight combat in the middle and i actually score 3 hits with the knight including a , he saves two of them on the archon before eating the D shot. I kill the archon but the 2 wraithguard and the swooping hawks are still alive.... i roll 2 stomps with potential to redeem myself... i place them both on the wraithguard and then proceed to roll and my opponent assault moves his warp spiders back towards his objective 1 in the center. His mandrakes consolidate towards my warlords squad.

I score 0 maelstrom points as I only managed to kill 2 units... We are now tied 2-2 on maelstrom although he has already killed a unit so im technically down 3-2. I roll my maelstrom and score destroy a unit twice again... I decide to try again to score 3 points and to put the game away. My nurglings come in and deepstrike getting a nice hit to contest his objective 1 in his deployment zone. My infantry squad that died the previous turn outflanks on objective 2 in the center to help secure the objective and still fire at his warwalkers. My plasma squads and melta squads take a number on his vehicles that are on the far side of the ruin. His autarch dies to weight of dice as squads dakka him to death from range. My plasma squad in the center moves up and kills a raider finishing off 2 units already. My pink horrors decide to become a lord of change and it succesfully deepstrikes behind my lines and moves towards his war walkers. My knight finishes off his wraithguard in the middle and remains locked in combat for his turn due to stomps missing the remaining units in combat. This turn i cripple his army practically irreparably. Even though i do not score until the end of his turn i already managed to kill 4 units this turn.

The 3 point objective and me contesting objective one has put me at a commanding 5 to 3 lead in maelstrom.

Spoiler:

With my opponent behind in maelstrom and scouring almost impossible for him to obtain he elects to try for my warlord before conceding. The mandrakes and the war walkers shoot my warlords squad and then charges in to finish the squad. The squad is killed all the way down to the warlord who fails his leadership and is sweeped killing him off. With that we call the game.

GrafWattenburg wrote:
Think the renegades should have this one. Looking forward to the report!

 Tomb King wrote:


Hell at adepticon I expect games to be over by the bottom of turn 2 thanks to the lack or restriction on ranged D and Wraithknights... I Have 7 unnerfed range D shots on turn one alone... It is going to get stupid fast.

jy2 wrote:Sorry, but not buying the drama. You probably beat your Eldar opponent by a landslide.

GrafWattenburg wrote:Agreed with Jy2. Your Knight is still alive, the Wraithguard are in a bad spot and with your massive horde of bodies his elite shooty units aren't all that scary. He simply doesn't have the shots to keep you down in the long run. If you clear out his Swooping hawks and the game doesn't end too early, I think the Renegades will outlast the space elves.

I think going for 3 points was a mistake, better play it safe until you're very certain you can kill 3 units. You risk not getting any points and the reward is one potential point extra? Not worth it in this battle, imo. But I haven't played the new ITC missions yet so I'm not speaking from experience

Budzerker wrote:

 Tomb King wrote:


Hell at adepticon I expect games to be over by the bottom of turn 2 thanks to the lack or restriction on ranged D and Wraithknights... I Have 7 unnerfed range D shots on turn one alone... It is going to get stupid fast.

How? Where are 7 ranged D shots coming from in a chaos list of any type?

 Tomb King wrote:

jy2 wrote:Sorry, but not buying the drama. You probably beat your Eldar opponent by a landslide.

Being able to score a chance to score 3 points in back to back turns was huge in this game... I only accomplished it once but it was still a real game changer. This format can really snowball a game fast. Previously it would of been a bit closer going down the stretch.

GrafWattenburg wrote:Agreed with Jy2. Your Knight is still alive, the Wraithguard are in a bad spot and with your massive horde of bodies his elite shooty units aren't all that scary. He simply doesn't have the shots to keep you down in the long run. If you clear out his Swooping hawks and the game doesn't end too early, I think the Renegades will outlast the space elves.

I think going for 3 points was a mistake, better play it safe until you're very certain you can kill 3 units. You risk not getting any points and the reward is one potential point extra? Not worth it in this battle, imo. But I haven't played the new ITC missions yet so I'm not speaking from experience

I think the 3 points is a game changer... if you roll kill a unit two turns in a row against a MSU army or even battle company than that can be a wrap early.

Budzerker wrote:

 Tomb King wrote:


Hell at adepticon I expect games to be over by the bottom of turn 2 thanks to the lack or restriction on ranged D and Wraithknights... I Have 7 unnerfed range D shots on turn one alone... It is going to get stupid fast.

How? Where are 7 ranged D shots coming from in a chaos list of any type?

Im taking eldar to adepticon... 2 shots from each of my wraithknights and 3 shots from my lynx... it will be brutal and a bit ridiculous.

 LValx wrote:

 Tomb King wrote:

jy2 wrote:Sorry, but not buying the drama. You probably beat your Eldar opponent by a landslide.

Being able to score a chance to score 3 points in back to back turns was huge in this game... I only accomplished it once but it was still a real game changer. This format can really snowball a game fast. Previously it would of been a bit closer going down the stretch.

GrafWattenburg wrote:Agreed with Jy2. Your Knight is still alive, the Wraithguard are in a bad spot and with your massive horde of bodies his elite shooty units aren't all that scary. He simply doesn't have the shots to keep you down in the long run. If you clear out his Swooping hawks and the game doesn't end too early, I think the Renegades will outlast the space elves.

I think going for 3 points was a mistake, better play it safe until you're very certain you can kill 3 units. You risk not getting any points and the reward is one potential point extra? Not worth it in this battle, imo. But I haven't played the new ITC missions yet so I'm not speaking from experience

I think the 3 points is a game changer... if you roll kill a unit two turns in a row against a MSU army or even battle company than that can be a wrap early.

Budzerker wrote:

 Tomb King wrote:


Hell at adepticon I expect games to be over by the bottom of turn 2 thanks to the lack or restriction on ranged D and Wraithknights... I Have 7 unnerfed range D shots on turn one alone... It is going to get stupid fast.

How? Where are 7 ranged D shots coming from in a chaos list of any type?

Im taking eldar to adepticon... 2 shots from each of my wraithknights and 3 shots from my lynx... it will be brutal and a bit ridiculous.

All that D will be sexy until you play vs Renegades, or any sort of Horde (Gladius cares so little about D shots...)

Spoiler:

I have never faced a stompa before... this will be a new experience for me. Having the ability to repair itself and having 12 HP's + free void shields is a little daunting. Not to mention he has a further 3 rechargable void shields from the generator. I have to admit im pretty concerned going into this game. My opponent has also taken the 10" template pie plates for the stompa... which is pretty amazing against my horde army. Any way i calculate it i believe my only way to kill the stompa is by hitting it in the face with foereaper... the knights close combat D weapon. He has the ability to move the same amount of distance as me and carries a solo D shot that can shoot from its eye. Basically what i am getting down too is the stompa needs to die for me to claim victory. If I can kill the knight then the rest of my army can decently handle orks on their own... worst case scenario is he kills off my squads and they all come in on one side of the board completely out of the fight. However, lets not get ahead of ourselves... I cant even hurt his stompa until i bring down the VSG which is a priority target as I can ill afford to hit void shields in every shooting phase. We will see how I hold up against a tough opponent with a tough army... P.S. i hate lobba;s as well.

Spoiler:

I roll objectives 1 and 6 for maelstrom. I advance and fire plasma into the void shields attempting to bring the shields down with my lowest strength shooting. It takes a few of my shooting but it finally crumbles to dakka. I take 3 void shields off of his stompa with similar dakka. I grim the knight but roll a he now has a 5++ and 6++ respectively... could of done without that... i decide to hide the knight behind the middle building. On the right flank i move up in the ruins and attempt to maximize my spacing for the ensuing lobba barrage.

He rolls maelstrom 1, and 4. He moves the stompa straight sideways and begins to shoot at my knight... he manages to get a pen with the S10 shooting and rolls a ... he rolls and gets 2 additional HP's.. on turn one im already at half strength for the Chaos Knight. This gives him the #4 maelstrom as well which is destroy a unit. He drops the lobba's on my pink horrors and i go to ground(i was on a disk i never used the entire event and misplayed this... it will be dropped for future builds. We catch this mistake in the next turn and i treat them as still going to ground... either way my saves are ridiculously good and i would not have lost more then one or 2 additional models. I had cast cursed earth with the squad for the save buff. His large pie plates do a number on my renegades as I lose loads of models around the chaos knight as well.

Spoiler:

I score both of my maelstrom objectives. I roll obj 2 and obj 4. I roll my reserves and get everything but my command squad. My nurglings deepstrike into ruins next to his objective to contest his home objective... on the left flank the melta squad that was moving up and running last turn is now in range of his VSG... they fire into the VSG along with the lower left hwt... the result is the vsg being destroyed and turning to ruins. His lobba;s have to take a pinning check and are pinned. I try the grim on the knight again and get the boost this time around. The knight advances up to attempt a long charge of his stompa. The rest of my army on the right flank shoots at his stompa and manages to strip the last void shields and cause 3 HP's of damage bringing it down to 9 remaining. The vets that deepstriked behind the stompa fire their melta but miss. My pink horrors cast cursed earth as my herald brings in another squad of pink horrors... they get a for their daemonology power for future fun. Finally the knight attempts the long charge and i roll a 9... falling two inches short.

My opponent scores 1 maelstrom from destroying a unit and i contest his objective with another clutch deepstrike by the nurglings. He rolls objective 2 and objective 4 for this coming turn. He brings in nearly every unit from reserves. Four of the deftkopta's enter from the right flank next to my blob of squads and the pink horrors with 1 of them contesting my objective 2. 1 deftkopta enters on the right flank next to the hill with the hwt's. on the right flank he moves and moves flat out with a boyzs squad and his megaknobs. Both units of tank busta's move on in range of my Chaos Knight. He moves the stompa over further on that flank and fires some of the shots at the knight and a big pie plate at my horrors in the back. With the knight having a 2++ on one flank and a 3++ on every other it survives unscathed with a few one's that are redeemed with good saves. His gretchin move on and target my vet squad in the back killing all but 2 of them and they flee.. he does a little more shooting but not much happens as he preps for a big next turn. His meks do manage to repair the stompa back up to 11 HP's .

Spoiler:

I score only one maelstrom objective. I roll objective 3 and 4 which is destroy a unit.. I decide to go for 3 kill points. I cast the grim on the knight and it succeeds again... the knight charges forward for an easy charge on the stompa. On the left flank i move a squad over to shoot his deftkopta and manage to dakka the kopta with las fire. 1 KP. On the right flank i shoot at his stompa some but my main target are the mega knobs that caused me so much pain in my previous game against orks... after an overwhelming amount of firepower the truck finally gets blown up and i kill all but one megaknob. 1 KP. I had no firepower left to target his deffkopta's on the right flank. I move the pink horros and the herald into the center of my infantry squads so they get a 3+ cover with no possibility of being charged. The pink horrors in the open become a lord of change I target and eliminate the tank busta's trukks as well. 2 KP. Finally the nurglings charge his lobba's and wipe them out in combat. 1 KP. My chaos knight charges into his stompa for a potential long lasting ordeal... i roll a on the D chart and take his stompa all the way down to 3 HP's in one assault phase . 2 KP. I easily double the required KP's needed for a 3 point turn.

My opponent failed to score either maelstrom objective. He rolls objectives 3 and 5. He decides its time to get this show rolling and declares a waghh! He brings in his last deftkopta on the right flank. His last boyz squad in their truck enter from reserves and head towards my lines as well. He sends a unit of tank busta's and the last mega knob with its chain fist into my knight. His boyz in the trukk on the right flank dismount and wipe a squad to the man in combat.. His deffkopta's attempt to get into the action.. one charges a squad on its own with the other 2 charging the back squad as he tries to chew his way through to the pink horrors. IN the center he has his other tank busta's squad move up and charge my melta squad that destroyed the VSG. The infantry squad kills his one deffkopta before it strikes as he fails both of his saves he is required to take. The other squad kills a deffkopta as well and actually manages to win combat and sweep the remaining deffkopta as the flying orks are taken down through sheer weight of numbers. His tank busta's in the center lose two before they strike and they roll poorly and lose the combat as well and once again the red hot renegades sweep them in combat The stompa in the center takes a few more hits and dies terribly. His mega knob gets through and finishes my knight in the same turn as both super heavies meet their end... the megaknob dies from the blast and the stomps.. 2 of the tank busta's similarly meet their end. What was suppose to be my opponents big comeback turn ended up being the final nail in the coffin.

Spoiler:

I gain 3 maelstrom points and my opponent is only set to gain one this coming turn... we elect to call the game early as it has undoubtedly become a one sided game. The renegades were just too much in this one... kind of surprised at their fighting prowess as they won nearly every combat.

GrafWattenburg wrote:
Didn't you lose to Orks in the last tournament report with the Unending Host? Hope you get them this time Can't get enough of the Renegades so I hope you'll find time to post the final battle soon.

GrafWattenburg wrote:
Congrats on the win and on taking revenge on the Greenskins I've been playing Renegades myself ever since IA:13 came out and it's really neat to see them slowly growing in popularity and the different builds people go for.

 LValx wrote:
I'm not picking on TK, im genuinely curious.... I apologize as if I came off as badgering. I am all for hordes and changes to the meta, but unfortunately in my only game vs renegades we only got to turn 3... in fact, the only games in 7th ive faced hordes in have gone 4 turns or less. So if you can make it to 5 with this army, more power to you and I am not against using it in competitive play at all. But people who know they cannot play fast enough really should be courteous and not bring such lists. Horde armies fair better the shorter the game is, I know because I play a horde style army myself. That + the respawns can lead to some abuse with slowplay. Not that I think you'd be a person to do that as you've done well with a wide variety of armies!

So that settles that argument for just about every event im participating in this year... I would check with your TO in not ITC events but for ITC events with the ITC FAQ it will be ruled as a Daemon of X God.