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As the title suggests, are the SM battle standards always carried?


Personally I'm looking to build a cheap Melta Drop CS and don't exactly want someone carrying a giant banner but.... is this Codex Compliant?

Company standards can be lost and it is now the main goal of that company to find the enemies who stole it and get it back. There are many examples in novels of Chaos lords displaying a defaced standard they won in battle. Its also a big character back story of the protagonist in the novel Legion of the Damned.
This also ties into the Roman mythology as they would really hate losing their standards in battle and would seek for years to recover them

 Nightlord1987 wrote:
Personally I'm looking to build a cheap Melta Drop CS and don't exactly want someone carrying a giant banner but.... is this Codex Compliant?

Is the banner an optional upgrade for the squad? If it is then they don't have to take it out for every battle (especially not one where they'll be dropping into the midst of the enemy and an almost certain death).

As for the Codex and such fluff it is IMO most certainly not appropriate for the guardians of the banner to risk it needlessly.

I have never seen anything indicating they must always take their standards into battle, it's up to you. If I was an SM commander going on a mission that was almost certain to end in death (ala: suicide pod) I'd probably leave the banner behind even if it was traditionally carried.

The standard is an optional upgrade for the Command Squad.

The standard is an optional upgrade in the game, but I'm concerned with the actual fluff composition.

Isnt there always a honorary titled Standard Bearer in every Company Command Squad?

I would figure there is always an Apothecary also, but in the game it is just an option too.

Just like there is supposed to be a Company Champion for every Command Squad.

So, in the Organizational background of a Codex Compliant Space Marine chapter, do they always bring out a banner? (They do have several).

Or could a Command Squad instead be made from Veterans who haven't been stuck into Sternguard or Vanguard service, and therefore lack the Traditional composition?

This is one of the places where there's a disconnect between the rules & fluff.

Rulewise they are optional upgrades to a command squad.
Fluffwise the individual roles are a *mandatory* part of company structure - whilst their bodyguard (the squad) is the optional part.

The standard bearer does not have to carry the standard into battle - he's the standard bearer whether he's holding the stick or not, and to the Marines, who love their cults-of-personality, he's the important part either way.

One thing to help bridge the gap between fluff and rules would be to kitbash a furled banner. A roll of cloth, folded/telescoping pole, etc. So that way you could have you banner bearer, with the colors, just not flying them. Laurels or other honorifics would help pick him out.

IIRC marines who are shamed/morning/repenting/defeated will often be denied the rights to fly their colors until they do something to cleanse their honor. A suicide melta drop would be a great thing to set things right. If they live, they can proudly unfurl their banner over the smoking ruin of their foe.

Game mechanics, you don’t pay the points, and don’t get the benefits. No different then a pouch or purity seal. Fluff you have every thing you need for a command squad.

Who said a standard has to be a banner?

Well Codex Astartes states that a Standard can only be carried by a Marine who has been award the Imperial Laurel, and a captain is free to choose his command squad. If his squad doesn't have an Imperial Laurel in the squad he can't have a banner. Likewise the engagement might not call for an Apothecary.

There's supposed to be an apothecary deployed for every action to ensure that any fallen marines are properly harvested, if they can't be recovered outright.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
There's supposed to be an apothecary deployed for every action to ensure that any fallen marines are properly harvested, if they can't be recovered outright.

Not if its a suicide mission. If there's extremely low chances of survival, they might not send an Apothecary due to how vital he is. They would probably wait until afterwards if they win, if not they can't recover it.

Space Marines are also supposed not to do suicide missions, for similar reasons - you can't retrieve the geneseed from a suicide mission because there's a reason it was suicide in the first place.

Of course, I suppose that doesn't stop them either.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Space Marines are also supposed not to do suicide missions, for similar reasons - you can't retrieve the geneseed from a suicide mission because there's a reason it was suicide in the first place.

Of course, I suppose that doesn't stop them either.

Suicide missions are Astartes speciality. Boarding ships, desperate last stands and insurmountable odds are right up SM's alley.

Deadshot, the whole point of using Marines is that they're supposed to make those kinds of things not suicidal to do.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Deadshot, the whole point of using Marines is that they're supposed to make those kinds of things not suicidal to do.

I disagree. They are still suicidal, but at least they have a chance of coming through. And Marines still do suicide level missions for even them. They'll do whatever is needed of them, even if that means a single squad against an army. Reading one of the Emperor's Champion's Lexicanum pages, one of the notable ECs, following the death of his Marshal, led his fellows back into the fray against a foe many times their number. Absolute suicide mission but they do it anyway. Marines think nothing of going full on "300" on enemies. I mean, they enter battle by being fired from orbit into the middle of the enemy. How much more suicidal can you get.

Suicidal, yes. I remember the description of marine boarding squads assaulting enemy space ships. Incredibly dangerous, low survival chances in the initial engagement but a fast track to glory and promotion if you pull through.

The fluff just makes marines look silly at times. They're hard to recruit, take a long time to train, use expensive and rare wargear - and then risk their lives for glory and honor? Losing even a single marine is a serious thing, losing many a disaster and losing their geneseed catastrophic.

 Nevelon wrote:
One thing to help bridge the gap between fluff and rules would be to kitbash a furled banner. A roll of cloth, folded/telescoping pole, etc. So that way you could have you banner bearer, with the colors, just not flying them. Laurels or other honorifics would help pick him out.

IIRC marines who are shamed/morning/repenting/defeated will often be denied the rights to fly their colors until they do something to cleanse their honor. A suicide melta drop would be a great thing to set things right. If they live, they can proudly unfurl their banner over the smoking ruin of their foe.

Game mechanics, you don’t pay the points, and don’t get the benefits. No different then a pouch or purity seal. Fluff you have every thing you need for a command squad.

I actually love the idea of this. It might just have gone on my list of future projects.