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Looks like Miniature Market is backing down, and has raised their prices on PP stuff.

Hmm, thankfully I got most of my stuff from them before that I guess

Well that didn't last long

We need a new thread name. May I suggest.

Privateer Press beats miniature market with a Stick.

OP here. Might as well stick to the title of the article: PRIVATEER AXES OFFENDING ONLINE RETAILERS

So much for that lol
Luckily for me PP never made anything I wanted to buy anyway.

Power to the people.

Looking forward for PP turning into a GW mess and the fanboil having online meltdowns.

I think this is a good thing for PP in the long run, should help get more players into the game. I guess we can see how they fair this time next year. I'm optimistic about it.

Ugh... I'm seeing several local game stores having "celebratory Steamrollers" today, to celebrate specifically Miniatures Market backing down.

One of those stores is great, and puts the "f" in "FLGS", but the others are some miserable places that have always been all but belligerent to miniatures gamers.

Looking forward to people voting with their wallet. I hope that PP gets in financial trouble after this move.

Just got the Blackhide Wrastler plastic kit in the mail from Doc's. It shall be my last WMH purchase, ever.

On the plus side, it raises the resale value of all of my armies. That I bought for 30-50% off from various sales. Anyone want one at 15% off? At that discount level, it's a STEAL

Gonna run out of miniature games to buy with that attitude because it's currently the growing trend for companies to move to.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Ugh... I'm seeing several local game stores having "celebratory Steamrollers" today, to celebrate specifically Miniatures Market backing down.

However that's dumb. I mean that's too short of notice to even have a chance to advertise an event even if the reason wasn't stupid.

 AduroT wrote:
Gonna run out of miniature games to buy with that attitude because it's currently the growing trend for companies to move to.

That's fine, don't have time to paint them all and I already have 4 armies. Many others will still be turning to the used market. New releases will still likely be snapped up at Cons and pre-release events where there weren't discounts to be had.

They cannot have price elasticity? Well, just switch to hobby that can. I hear them video games have sales routinely.

But in reality, it just creates the opportunity now for a company to come in and do it better, faster, cheaper. Just like GW beget PP, if PP gets stodgy like the rest, they will all beget new up and comers with new strategies. And FLGS will still fail.

 AduroT wrote:
Gonna run out of miniature games to buy with that attitude because it's currently the growing trend for companies to move to.

Privateer Press just told me I was a parasite for buying from online retailers who offer discounts. So feth them.

 judgedoug wrote:

 AduroT wrote:
Gonna run out of miniature games to buy with that attitude because it's currently the growing trend for companies to move to.

Privateer Press just told me I was a parasite for buying from online retailers who offer discounts. So feth them.

Proof or it didn't happen

 Chute82 wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:

 AduroT wrote:
Gonna run out of miniature games to buy with that attitude because it's currently the growing trend for companies to move to.

Privateer Press just told me I was a parasite for buying from online retailers who offer discounts. So feth them.

Proof or it didn't happen

He means the policy that this whole thread is about.

I will be honest this almost makes me want to play Warhammer again because at least with GW it's the devil I know and I know they are trying to cheat me. I really think that this is going to backfire on PP with the bad publicity.

 ImAGeek wrote:

 Chute82 wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:

 AduroT wrote:
Gonna run out of miniature games to buy with that attitude because it's currently the growing trend for companies to move to.

Privateer Press just told me I was a parasite for buying from online retailers who offer discounts. So feth them.

Proof or it didn't happen

He means the policy that this whole thread is about.

PP Said parasite buisness practice... Not people buying online are parasites. To much drama

WayneTheGame wrote:
I will be honest this almost makes me want to play Warhammer again because at least with GW it's the devil I know and I know they are trying to cheat me. I really think that this is going to backfire on PP with the bad publicity.

At least this was a good vector check to see you, I, or anyone else wasn't just a new blind fan of something. It definitely sours my taste on the company, the game is still good. I will likely move away from larger games after Warmachine unless there's one that create large scale at lower cost (historicals?).

Thimn wrote:
I think this is a good thing for PP in the long run, should help get more players into the game. I guess we can see how they fair this time next year. I'm optimistic about it.

How so? Seems to me that what they have done is polarized the community and reduced the amount of people they can reach. Guess we will see.

I think its a good thing because stores are more likely to carry PP product now. People can see the game and buy it right away. I have already told the story of the Cleveland area and how the shops stopped carrying it because of online discounters and yet the game is still popular. I don't see anyone locally here ditching the game over this, and it will give more people the opportunity to buy in, as opposed to going to a nebulous online website that a new person wouldn't know about to begin with.

So no, I don't view it as less people getting reached, its more as far as I can see it. Other game companies have a similar policy, like Hawk for example. That is not stopping the game from growing because there are no deep discounts.

Time will tell whether this was a good move for PP, I wish they had done it 2 years ago, but next April I think the game will have more players as a result of this.

Thimn wrote:
I think its a good thing because stores are more likely to carry PP product now. People can see the game and buy it right away. I have already told the story of the Cleveland area and how the shops stopped carrying it because of online discounters and yet the game is still popular. I don't see anyone locally here ditching the game over this, and it will give more people the opportunity to buy in, as opposed to going to a nebulous online website that a new person wouldn't know about to begin with.

So no, I don't view it as less people getting reached, its more as far as I can see it. Other game companies have a similar policy, like Hawk for example. That is not stopping the game from growing because there are no deep discounts.

Time will tell whether this was a good move for PP, I wish they had done it 2 years ago, but next April I think the game will have more players as a result of this.

Every store I have ever been to is an unprofessional mess, and I've been to stores in multiple states (all anecdotal I know). They wear no uniforms, they don't engage customers (not that I've met many staff members of stores that had any salesmanship skills anyway), they don't run demos, and usually you have to be part of the in club to be treated like a human being. I have never gotten into a game thanks to a B&M, never. I've been introduced to all my games through friends. Not to mention these days I can usually read the rule book online for free as provided by the company. So maybe I'm jaded, or maybe this just makes no sense because no other market would be better off from this kind of move.

You mentioned Hawk but DZC is 20% off at MM, compared to 12% for PP now, so that doesn't seem to support your point. In fact the main company we can look to that has had a similar long standing policy is GW. GW by contrast is not growing, their sales are shrinking and 40k dropped to number 2 on the best selling mini game list. Now of course all that's anecdotal and correlation doesn't equal causation. But still I have to wonder what makes people think that gaming should operate any different than any other business. Fact is online sales increase customer base in all other businesses. People love to throw out that niche market tag like it means something. But what's interesting is the hobby market has grown exponentially since the rise of online sales. Again I know correlation doesn't equal causation, but one at least has to wonder if the two things are related.

 Chute82 wrote:
PP Said parasite buisness practice... Not people buying online are parasites. To much drama

And the hundreds and hundreds of bucks I have spent on my Circle, Minions, and Menoth armies (to the tune of five Battlefoam D-Box and Stacker boxes full of minis along with a large Target storage crate full of unbuilt minis) from online discounters are meaningless? PP still made their distributor bucks. Meanwhile, I don't play WMH in stores, so I see no reason to pay this extra "tax" to punish me for buying from an online "parasitic" discounter. I can get virtually every other manufacturer's models at a greater discount now than PP - including GW, DZC, Mantic, et al. I'll still play the occasional WMH game at home w/ my buddies but there's no incentive now to purchase any new product.

I'm still unconvinced that this policy will actually do that much to affect online prices. GW has much more infamously strict rules and yet you can get Deathwatch Overkill for 25% off from eBay sellers.

 judgedoug wrote:

 Chute82 wrote:
PP Said parasite buisness practice... Not people buying online are parasites. To much drama

And the hundreds and hundreds of bucks I have spent on my Circle, Minions, and Menoth armies (to the tune of five Battlefoam D-Box and Stacker boxes full of minis along with a large Target storage crate full of unbuilt minis) from online discounters are meaningless? PP still made their distributor bucks. Meanwhile, I don't play WMH in stores, so I see no reason to pay this extra "tax" to punish me for buying from an online "parasitic" discounter. I can get virtually every other manufacturer's models at a greater discount now than PP - including GW, DZC, Mantic, et al. I'll still play the occasional WMH game at home w/ my buddies but there's no incentive now to purchase any new product.

Still PP don't call you a parasite... Which is what you claimed and I pointed it out to be false. I personally don't agree with PP policy and never posted I did. Just pointed out that PP never called you personally a parasite like you claimed.

Hilarious. .. big bad miniaturemarket is gonna stand up and teach them a lesson.
You see how that worked, lol.
If they really wanted to teach them a lesson they would drop the line and have others do the same. As usual all bark and no bite.

 Chute82 wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:

 Chute82 wrote:
PP Said parasite buisness practice... Not people buying online are parasites. To much drama

And the hundreds and hundreds of bucks I have spent on my Circle, Minions, and Menoth armies (to the tune of five Battlefoam D-Box and Stacker boxes full of minis along with a large Target storage crate full of unbuilt minis) from online discounters are meaningless? PP still made their distributor bucks. Meanwhile, I don't play WMH in stores, so I see no reason to pay this extra "tax" to punish me for buying from an online "parasitic" discounter. I can get virtually every other manufacturer's models at a greater discount now than PP - including GW, DZC, Mantic, et al. I'll still play the occasional WMH game at home w/ my buddies but there's no incentive now to purchase any new product.

Still PP don't call you a parasite... Which is what you claimed and I pointed it out to be false. I personally don't agree with PP policy and never posted I did. Just pointed out that PP never called you personally a parasite like you claimed.

It would seem though that their position implies that he is a less valuable customer to them.

 DrNo172000 wrote:

Thimn wrote:
I think its a good thing because stores are more likely to carry PP product now. People can see the game and buy it right away. I have already told the story of the Cleveland area and how the shops stopped carrying it because of online discounters and yet the game is still popular. I don't see anyone locally here ditching the game over this, and it will give more people the opportunity to buy in, as opposed to going to a nebulous online website that a new person wouldn't know about to begin with.

So no, I don't view it as less people getting reached, its more as far as I can see it. Other game companies have a similar policy, like Hawk for example. That is not stopping the game from growing because there are no deep discounts.

Time will tell whether this was a good move for PP, I wish they had done it 2 years ago, but next April I think the game will have more players as a result of this.

Every store I have ever been to is an unprofessional mess, and I've been to stores in multiple states (all anecdotal I know). They wear no uniforms, they don't engage customers (not that I've met many staff members of stores that had any salesmanship skills anyway), they don't run demos, and usually you have to be part of the in club to be treated like a human being. I have never gotten into a game thanks to a B&M, never. I've been introduced to all my games through friends. Not to mention these days I can usually read the rule book online for free as provided by the company. So maybe I'm jaded, or maybe this just makes no sense because no other market would be better off from this kind of move.

You mentioned Hawk but DZC is 20% off at MM, compared to 12% for PP now, so that doesn't seem to support your point. In fact the main company we can look to that has had a similar long standing policy is GW. GW by contrast is not growing, their sales are shrinking and 40k dropped to number 2 on the best selling mini game list. Now of course all that's anecdotal and correlation doesn't equal causation. But still I have to wonder what makes people think that gaming should operate any different than any other business. Fact is online sales increase customer base in all other businesses. People love to throw out that niche market tag like it means something. But what's interesting is the hobby market has grown exponentially since the rise of online sales. Again I know correlation doesn't equal causation, but one at least has to wonder if the two things are related.

Dr.No, maybe you don't understand, but MM abides by the Hawk Trade policy, they aren't deep discounting as far as Hawk is concerned.

So PP has a similar policy now, that's it. Yes it will cost more to order online, and PP sees not a dime of that money. This is about keeping PP product in local game stores where it can attract new customers. I fully understand people who don't play at a flgs being upset by this.

My take away, if you really cared for the health of the game you just need to acknowledge what PP is trying to do. Obviously they see a problem, and this policy they put out doesn't make them more money (unless you count the new potential customers buying more from either flgs or online). This is truly something that should have been addressed years ago. Now we have a player base expecting 30% off to be the norm.

Will be curious to see if MM's prices go up slightly more yet, or if DGI and others go down slightly again, as currently MM is doing 13% vs the others' 10%, but PP hasn't actually said what the exact % they're allowed to get away with is, so it's kind of a guess and see.

Assuming wholesale cost vs RRP follows normal retail (wholesale cost is often approx half RRP before taxes across a lot of products) I'd assume somewhere ~10% would be a logical place to peg a "sustainable" discount for brick and mortar stores and online stores alike. Quibbling over 3% from a large retailer is probably too petty, given the situation.