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 CragHack wrote:

But the teaser poster, featuring both new flyers is already up :( And the pictures from white dwarf already show what we're going to get. Do you really think they would hide something from players, just to make a surprise when they buy the supplement and see what's inside?

whatever it is we shall know in less than a week or two

 CragHack wrote:

 aracersss wrote:

 CragHack wrote:

IG ony have Valkyrie. Vendetta is not listed as a separate kit. So in theory, IG only have one flyer. And that makes 21 out of 23, leaving exactly two places to fit in Nid Harpy and Crone. At least that's my theory.

keep on dreaming ^^ ... as it is, the vendetta is listed in the codex

Well, then I would like to hear your theory what fills up those remaining spots

It is certainly possible for there to be another release of more flyers. This week saw two "new" flyers, perhaps next week will have them too. If so, hopefully for CSM and BA/GKs. Not counting on it. GW can't count. They said Angels of Death would have 14 formations, it included 12.

If necron doomscythe loses skyfire then the codex has one skyfire option only...

Ffyllotek wrote:
If necron doomscythe loses skyfire then the codex has one skyfire option only...

Better than losing your only source of Skyfire.

 aracersss wrote:

 CragHack wrote:


Well, then I would like to hear your theory what fills up that remaining spot

fixed that ... for me either a new flier or something else we haven't spoiled out yet from the new kits

Well it says updated datasheets. Perhaps the two new flyers aren't counted as being amongst them as they're not being updated; they're new entirely.

 Redemption wrote:

Well it says updated datasheets. Perhaps the two new flyers aren't counted as being among them as they're not being updated; they're new entirely.

yeah among everything nearly everything is updated ... you think they are gonna go more specific than that?

Obviously the last slot is the SoB flyer!....

Ok more seriously, the Valkyrie box offers no option to build a Vendetta IIRC, so it would be a good candidate for an updated box with additional sprue. And there would be enough space remaining on it to offer a third flyer option out of the kit.

That's pure random guess on my part here.

They should imo finally release a plastic Thunderhawk and show the enemy of mankind who's boss. It is annoying to get all these tiny wimpy spacecrafts when Space Marines (and their traitorous counterparts) could fly into battle with actual style. Calgar being the only Lord of War in the Marine book, how petty.



Yes, seriously, release that kit

you got FW

I wonder if the whole "Bombers losing skyfire" applies to the interceptor drones on the Tau Bomber. It specifically has skyfire while on most planes its given it from the BRB rules for flyers. Might make the Bomber still the better of the two for air to air combat

Too bad the bomber is a joke at actually bombing things.

 aracersss wrote:
you got FW

True, but I do miss the easier construction and preparation of the plastic kits. The FW one is way too overpriced imo. Also conversions

 Peregrine wrote:
So, bombers lose skyfire, which means that if you want to deal with enemy aircraft you now have to bring fighters of your own in addition to your bombers. More huge and awkward models on the table, more points spent on flyers instead of "normal" units. I guess we're going to have to move up to 5,000 points and a 10x6 table to hold all of this stuff? Or I suppose we could just ignore this pointless rules-bloat expansion and treat it as a couple of nice counts-as models for the existing C:SM and ork flyers.

Or you take more ground based Anti-air.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
So, bombers lose skyfire, which means that if you want to deal with enemy aircraft you now have to bring fighters of your own in addition to your bombers. More huge and awkward models on the table, more points spent on flyers instead of "normal" units. I guess we're going to have to move up to 5,000 points and a 10x6 table to hold all of this stuff? Or I suppose we could just ignore this pointless rules-bloat expansion and treat it as a couple of nice counts-as models for the existing C:SM and ork flyers.

Or you take more ground based Anti-air.

Gotta sell those Stalkers and Hydras! Armies without land-based AA need not apply.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
So, bombers lose skyfire, which means that if you want to deal with enemy aircraft you now have to bring fighters of your own in addition to your bombers. More huge and awkward models on the table, more points spent on flyers instead of "normal" units. I guess we're going to have to move up to 5,000 points and a 10x6 table to hold all of this stuff? Or I suppose we could just ignore this pointless rules-bloat expansion and treat it as a couple of nice counts-as models for the existing C:SM and ork flyers.

Or you take more ground based Anti-air.

Gotta sell those Stalkers and Hydras! Armies without land-based AA need not apply.

Yeah, armies that were not granted ground AA are kind of screwed :(
You'd think GW would give every faction some sort of AA unit by now, but nope.

Which fortifications have AA options?

Several, but I'd rather have a proper AA unit, rather than one I have to baby sit with another squad, that could be used against me.

The existence of fortifications does not change the fact that not every faction has their own AA options. Having to borrow them does not change that.

Yeah, it's back to early 6th with Fortifications everywhere as the main source of Skyfire.

I wonder if the upcoming supplement will also feature Forge World flyers.

Warhams-77 wrote:
Which fortifications have AA options?

Aegis Defense Line
Imperial Bastion
Imperial Bunker
Firestorm Redoubt
Vengeance Weapon Battery
Fortress of Redemption
Macro-Cannon Aquila Strongpoint (Quake Shells)

But armies with ground-based AA get these as well. And most ground-based AA is cheaper and better. I wonder if GW realizes that they would make a boat load more money if they gave the atypical Space Marine factions access to stuff like the Stormtalon/Stormhawk and the Stalker/Hunter. I can understand why they won't give them to CSM (they are post-Heresy tech), but why wouldn't BA/DA/GK/SW have them. I can kinda understand GK(these aren't really in their wheelhouse) and SW(they do their own thing with most everything anyway), but DA/BA are nominally Codex-adherent. Why wouldn't they have some of this tech?

And honestly, CSM aren't dumb. The Iron Warriors would have come up with something by now and it would have been disseminated by virtue of the Black Crusades.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BrookM wrote:
I wonder if the upcoming supplement will also feature Forge World flyers.

Why would it? No supplements have included FW stuff before.

That's not true. Besides Apocalypse being the obvious supplement with FW models, I remember the Thunderhawk featuring in the Battle Missions book.

But yeah, as they list only 23 updated datasheets, don't count on any FW this time around.

Oh bollocks, so much for that then. :(

 TedNugent wrote:
Soooo....
Do dark angels/Orks get an air superiority fighter yet?

I mentioned earlier, as they have Ravening pilots, they 'should' get on the elite end of pursuit and agility stats, so the Nephilim may actually be quite the fighter.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
I mentioned earlier, as they have Ravening pilots, they 'should' get on the elite end of pursuit and agility stats, so the Nephilim may actually be quite the fighter.

Let's hope not. Space marines shouldn't be the best at everything. If they have to get a fighter I guess I can live with it, but it should be a low-tier unit that you only take because you don't want to have allies. The Imperial Navy should get the best fighters, the ones you take when you want a serious air superiority option.

One dataslate left. I wonder who gets the new aircraft. Please be Tau Barricuda.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:
Soooo....
Do dark angels/Orks get an air superiority fighter yet?

I mentioned earlier, as they have Ravening pilots, they 'should' get on the elite end of pursuit and agility stats, so the Nephilim may actually be quite the fighter.

So the Nephilim is probably going to end up an Attack Flyer or Fighter (probably a Fighter since it is literally in its name) and the Dark Talon is going to be a Bomber. I imagine for C:SM the Stormraven and Stormtalon will both be Attack Flyers, while the new Stormhawk is a Fighter. The Stormwolf is probably an Attack Flyer and the Stormfang is probably a Bomber. My criteria for Attack v. Bomber tends to be if the main weapons are regular Shooting vs. Blast/Template weapons. I could see the Stormfang as an Attack Flyer as well.

So of the Space Marine flyers, we have the following:
Attack Flyer - Stormraven, Stormtalon, Stormwolf
Fighter - Nephilim Jetfighter, Stormhawk
Bomber - Dark Talon, Stormfang

Other known roles are the following:
Crimson Hunter, Dakkajet - Fighter
Heldrake, Doomscythe - Attack Flyer
Voidraven, Blitza-Bommer, Sunshark - Bomber



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gamgee wrote:
One dataslate left. I wonder who gets the new aircraft. Please be Tau Barricuda.

I would much rather see another Chaos Space Marines flyer. Tau aren't exactly hurting in the flyer department.

No our flyers are the worst in the game. I'll trade you our Sunshark AND the other dumb flyer for your hell turkey any day of the week.

So you see we don't have flyers.

@casvalremdeikun: You forgot the Valkyrie / Vendetta.

Gamgee wrote:No our flyers are the worst in the game. I'll trade you our Sunshark AND the other dumb flyer for your hell turkey any day of the week.

So you see we don't have flyers.

Oh poor Tau, what ever will they do for Skyfire? Count your blessings, you have options outside your crappy flyers. Some armies have almost none.

BrookM wrote:@casvalremdeikun: You forgot the Valkyrie / Vendetta.

I guess I never saw those pop up. What roles did they have?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

BrookM wrote:@casvalremdeikun: You forgot the Valkyrie / Vendetta.

I guess I never saw those pop up. What roles did they have?

They're both transports, so I'd say attack flyers, as they can do gak against other flyers.

 BrookM wrote:
Oh bollocks, so much for that then. :(

I expect them to put in those rules up later anyway. Especially if the new rules will be any form of common use. They want to sell models so don't want to have unworking rules hindering that.