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 koooaei wrote:

 Matthew wrote:


Also, implement some sort of Chaos Mark system

Mark of Gork - gives you 'ere We Go and Furious Charge
Mark of Mork - gives you Furious Charge and 'ere We Go

Don't give GW ideas. They might actually implement this.

 Jancoran wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:

 Jancoran wrote:
That was kinda rude.

Also as an aside: It was Hammer and Anvil and I did table this fellow. Just saying. His Battle Company and all his free stuff couldn't save him. His Whirlwinds couldn't save him. He would be the first to tell you that codex's don't win Champinships. Orks win championships. Hehehe..

In all serous, orks are a tougher one to win with but it can be done and it will be done. =)

Ah yes, who could forget all those times Orks won LVO and BAO? Yeah it can be done, but that doesn't mean A) you have to be extremely lucky and B) it's not hard as hell.

Anyone winning the BAO had to be lucky. its a dice game.

And it being harder...I think...was pretty clearly acknowledged so i dont know why you're bothering to say so.

But sure.

Right you have to be lucky to win major 40k Tournaments. Thats why its the same people keep topping the same tournaments over and over

Oh wait...

 koooaei wrote:
Mark of Gork - gives you 'ere We Go and Furious Charge
Mark of Mork - gives you Furious Charge and 'ere We Go

I.,.. LoL'd...HARD

my two(4) cents:

1) its not only that orks are pretty weak they are TEDIOUS to play... a single freaking pen on a trukk can take foreever to resolve... its test after rerolled test after random allocation after test after rerolled test after random allocation....just streamline the whole thing.

2) mob rule... roll a d3 1: too bad, you failed 2: if char alive or 10+ boyz, you passed, take d3 wounds (saves allowed) 3: same as 2 but no casulties... DONE. its fast, easy, fair and effective.

3) how to fix trukks? make em cheaper. 150pts for 12 boyz (200pts if you want a 4+ armour)...is just plain ridiculous. also trukkboyz need to get back to only receiving s3 hits when the trukk explodes and need to auto pass the following ld check. also EVERY mob should get a mek as an upgrade option (lets face it... he will eat up exactly ONE challenge before beeing smushed into green tidy bits)

4) i actually like the idea of orks having no invul saves... its kinda unique and orky... just give every ork a flat 6+ FnP. dokz and other shenenigans should only modify the FnP. so big ork chars(Warbosses) can get a 4+ FnP (under certain circumstances... cybork body and painboy in the squad)

5) make useful formations... the ghaz formation is great and all but it costs a minimum of freakish 1000 points... we need stuff like the eldar aspect host... small useful semi effective things... like: field 3x30 boyz and they'll get fearless or take 3 spezialist mobs (meganobz, burnaz, lootaz, tankbustaz etc) and they get an random special rule each phase (tankhunter, preffered enemy or whatever)

EDIT:

 Vitali Advenil wrote:
I don't find mob rule all that terrible, actually. It's not bad for smaller squads. I'm not as familiar with the old mob rule, but it apparently screwed over small squads even worse than the current one. Sure, it hurts when my boyz die due to a failed morale test but at least my MANz or small tankbusta squads won't just run if they fail their morale.

Can't comment on ramshackle, though. I have literally no idea what it used to do.

ramshackle:

mob rule:
orks can always substitute their LD value for number of boyz left in mob (should have been wounds), 10+ orkmobs are fearless.
Bosspole lets you reroll moraletest after inflicting ONE wound on the mob



its not so much that the old rules were better (well, they WERE better, especially when you consider the powerlevel of the meta game back then) but it was fast and easy...
also on a similar note... orks used to double their initiative when attacking (old whaagh rule) which was later replaced by the OLD furious charge special rule (+1 strength AND +1 Initiative )

RedNoak wrote:
3) how to fix trukks? make em cheaper. 150pts for 12 boyz (200pts if you want a 4+ armour)...is just plain ridiculous. also trukkboyz need to get back to only receiving s3 hits when the trukk explodes and need to auto pass the following ld check. also EVERY mob should get a mek as an upgrade option (lets face it... he will eat up exactly ONE challenge before beeing smushed into green tidy bits)

12 boyz in a trukk is 102, 150 with armor.

 JimOnMars wrote:
12 boyz in a trukk is 102, 150 with armor.

so you play without nobs? without any upgrades?

12 boyz
nob, BP, PK
trukk, ram
-----> 147pts
with armour: 195pts
with armour and mek: 200pts

RedNoak wrote:

 JimOnMars wrote:
12 boyz in a trukk is 102, 150 with armor.

so you play without nobs? without any upgrades?

12 boyz
nob, BP, PK
trukk, ram
-----> 147pts
with armour: 195pts
with armour and mek: 200pts

Quite often I do. 12 choppas, trukk & ram at a clean 107 can hack through a lot of smaller units. If they don't, sometimes they can stay in combat and prevent a round of enemy shooting or charging. Often the trukk lives to score a maelstrom point somewhere. not great, but any unit that can do that a lot of the time, at 107, is usually worth it's points. Competitive? No, but in friendly games this can be enough. IMHO.

I actually was thinking this weekend on how to fix the issue of low I ork nobz being sort of made useless by challenge rules ... special rule "I'm the meanest and the greenest" when a challenge is issued an ork boy can accept rather than a character, if the ork boy wins the challenge replace the boy with a slug/choppa nob. one of the big current issues is the nob gets challenged, usually beaten by what did the challenge before ever getting to swing that claw, or if he does not accept cannot ever attack. A proper nob would send in the ladz to make sure they was fighting in before jumping in himself.

I love the idea. It's like a field promotion...watch the boy grow before your eyes!

Probably waaaaay too cool and fluffy for GW ever to give it to us.

It makes plenty of sense. I mean, the chances of a standard boy surviving a challenge is piss-poor, but hey, it keeps our nobs safe and it's even a chance to get another nob! Though I think to keep it balanced this should only work in a squad without any independent characters. Since boss nobs are only normal characters it would work great for them.

The problem is that, to GW eyes, they already did a great job with the last insulting suplement .

So they will no make a new ork codex on at least 2 years. specially since on the last fest announced a lot of gak to 30k and imperial titans, and imperial marines, and imperial robots from mechanicum, and imperial new ships, and imperial new dreads, and a bit tau



GW really fethed orks on 7th (and chaos too, but that is a different topic xD)

Cheaper trukkz don't fix the problem though, because unfortunately they tend to inflict more casualties on the passengers then enemy shooting does.

Honestly the biggest problem I see for Orks at the moment is that there isn't a whole lot you can do for them in the current meta because historically we are a horde army. Our only troop options are a horde of boyz or a horde of gretchen.

The biggest buff that needs to happen is increasing the durability of boyz. 6+ FNP across the board would be good, or give every unit the option of spending 15-20pts for a Painboy to be added to the unit, also every unit should be able to take a Mek or have some mechanic in place where the nob doesn't get splattered in the 1st round of combat due to a challenge.

Also I think a minor buff such as +1S would be VERY useful to help boyz become more playable. Honesty if you play orks and you don't win combat in the 1st round your in trouble, A lot of people will jump on board the band wagon and say something like "Well then don't charge that unit, use tactics" well that is kind of hard to do when the only real tactic an ork player has is tie up the shooty stuff with your choppy stuff.

Anyway back to buffing Orks in general. I think a number of units could use a significant price reduction, the worst offenders being Nobz in all their forms (Mega, regular, Biker). I think that Bikes should be cheaper across the board for orks. Every vehicle in the ork army is over priced horribly. Killa Kanz for how useless they are should be 30pts at the most, not 50. Deff dreads need a 20pt reduction and lower costs to buy more PKs.

Battlewagonz need a 20point reduction in price, or come standard with 4 Big Shootas/Rokkitz and a Kannon that can be upgraded.

Mork/Gork need to be completely reworked, as do the walker rules in general. They are to slow to get into CC, They are to big of a point sink, they are way to easy to kill with a single shot (AP1-2) and they HAVE NO DAKKA! The Gorkanaut is the worst offender but the KMK on the Morkanaut isn't that much better.

And finally Stompa....take 300pts off that bad boy and it becomes an actual choice instead of a gimmicky POS.